Ulster club championship

[Throw ball]

Calls for an all star for Rian O'Neill this year were wide of the mark I thought and cemented by his performance last night for Cross.
He's undoubtedly a talent but has a tendency to drift out in games when it matters. He's young and it will come for him eventually though as he has size, pace and accuracy off either peg.
Armagh club football is bang average at the minute as well.

Talk that O'Neill was an injury doubt before the game yesterday. Perhaps this was a factor in his performance.

Armagh club football is probably worse than average at the minute. Structures are good and run well enough, but there's little depth of talent developing across the club scene.

The fact he spend so long in full forward line may support that.

[bennydorano]

Armagh club football is not strong, made the point numerous times on threads about the County team - McGeeney has done a fantastic job building a side from what's available.

[Wildweasel74]

What's the population of Crossmaglen, its large village sized, so I say there's a fair bit more of a population than Ballybay

[brokencrossbar1]

What's the population of Crossmaglen, its large village sized, so I say there's a fair bit more of a population than Ballybay

Ballybay has about 1250, Cross 1600. You don't necessarily know the populations in the hinterlands around both areas to compare but there's not a massive difference between either place.

The key factor over the weekend was that the experienced players for Ballybay were widespread. Maybe not in Ulster Club but lads who have played years for Monaghan. We had 5 starters under 20 who had no experience of playing in Ulster. There's plenty of years ahead for us. The expectation was not huge this year so we can build for next year now

[tonto1888]

What's the population of Crossmaglen, its large village sized, so I say there's a fair bit more of a population than Ballybay

Ballybay has about 1250, Cross 1600. You don't necessarily know the populations in the hinterlands around both areas to compare but there's not a massive difference between either place.

The key factor over the weekend was that the experienced players for Ballybay were widespread. Maybe not in Ulster Club but lads who have played years for Monaghan. We had 5 starters under 20 who had no experience of playing in Ulster. There's plenty of years ahead for us. The expectation was not huge this year so we can build for next year now

Any word on AK? A lot of people thinking that was his last game for Cross

[Truth hurts]

What's the population of Crossmaglen, its large village sized, so I say there's a fair bit more of a population than Ballybay

Ballybay has about 1250, Cross 1600. You don't necessarily know the populations in the hinterlands around both areas to compare but there's not a massive difference between either place.

The key factor over the weekend was that the experienced players for Ballybay were widespread. Maybe not in Ulster Club but lads who have played years for Monaghan. We had 5 starters under 20 who had no experience of playing in Ulster. There's plenty of years ahead for us. The expectation was not huge this year so we can build for next year now

BCB1 will Cross continue with the brand of football or wil they get a manager who shuts up shop more, you wont win an Ulster playing that way anymore. Too many well set up sides.

[Armagh18]

What's the population of Crossmaglen, its large village sized, so I say there's a fair bit more of a population than Ballybay

Ballybay has about 1250, Cross 1600. You don't necessarily know the populations in the hinterlands around both areas to compare but there's not a massive difference between either place.

The key factor over the weekend was that the experienced players for Ballybay were widespread. Maybe not in Ulster Club but lads who have played years for Monaghan. We had 5 starters under 20 who had no experience of playing in Ulster. There's plenty of years ahead for us. The expectation was not huge this year so we can build for next year now

Any word on AK? A lot of people thinking that was his last game for Cross

Looking at him after Saturday he definitely looked like a man who was retiring. Sincerely hope not as football in general will be poorer for it. An absolute class act.

[brokencrossbar1]

Don't know about AK. Big decisions are best made in the cold nights of winter so I'd say a few weeks recuperating and then you'll find out.

As for the style of football, don't think it will change much. Maybe tweak it a bit but nah, the game wasn't lost because of the style of football. It was lost because of the tactics at key times. There's a difference. Game management was the key factor not the style of football.

[thewobbler]

What's the population of Crossmaglen, its large village sized, so I say there's a fair bit more of a population than Ballybay

Ballybay has about 1250, Cross 1600. You don't necessarily know the populations in the hinterlands around both areas to compare but there's not a massive difference between either place.

The key factor over the weekend was that the experienced players for Ballybay were widespread. Maybe not in Ulster Club but lads who have played years for Monaghan. We had 5 starters under 20 who had no experience of playing in Ulster. There's plenty of years ahead for us. The expectation was not huge this year so we can build for next year now

BCB1 will Cross continue with the brand of football or wil they get a manager who shuts up shop more, you wont win an Ulster playing that way anymore. Too many well set up sides.

I keep reading comments like this Truth, and I don't know what to make of it.

Here's things that I saw the other evening:

1. Ballybay played exceptionally well, with a negligible amount of personal errors despite moving the ball quickly.

2. Ballybay were very fortunate to gain an early penalty, which minimised Cross's ability to build up a big lead with the breeze.

3. Ballybay's seam of county players revelled in the fact that few of them were directly facing county-standard players.

4. Ballybay made a statement of confidence as much as tactics when they blitzed Crossmaglen during the black card period at the start of the second half.

----

Does this mean Cross were not "tactically naive"? No it doesn't. They really should have sat on the ball for the first 10 mins of the second half. But this then brings on a fifth point, in that they're so used to powering past teams in Armagh, that they seemed to underestimate Ballybay's ability to push back.

Anyhow, long way of saying that Cross perhaps could have turned this one into guerrilla warfare, and delivered an unwatchable game of football. But Ballybay would seem to have slightly better players, and on the night, all those slightly better players delivered in spades, which is usually enough to win a game of attritional football too.

[Brick Tamlin]

Whilst laudible to an extent, Cross persistance to kick the ball at every opportunity allied with fact they refuse to play sweepers etc, shows a level of stubborness bordering on arrogance at this point. Hats off to them for sticking to principles and playing game they way they think it should be played but when you refuse to mix things up and show a flexibility in how your team plays for periods of the game then for me it smacks of arrogance or incompetence or maybe both. The situation is exasperated all the more when you have a ropey defence that features a small, young goalkeeper(s), no settled No3 and 3 guys the wrong side of 30. Their full-back line has been crying out for more protection for a long time now and it looks like they havent done anything about it.

As for O'Neill performance. Why is it when a marquee player doesnt perform as expected that 'they were most likely carrying an injury'. It seems to be the first thing that rolled out all the time to excuse them. Maybe, just maybe he was bested by his opponents and they were better than him. Or maybe, blasphemous and outrageous as this might sound to some, he just isnt as good as you think he is.

[Armagh18]

Don't know about AK. Big decisions are best made in the cold nights of winter so I'd say a few weeks recuperating and then you'll find out.

As for the style of football, don't think it will change much. Maybe tweak it a bit but nah, the game wasn't lost because of the style of football. It was lost because of the tactics at key times. There's a difference. Game management was the key factor not the style of football.

Finlay's run dragging 3 or 4 defenders and then no one bothering to mark the number 11 was terrible defending. Naivety and inexperience cost Cross big time the other night. Game management during the black card period just after half time was non existent from Cross. 

[imtommygunn]

No one is mentioning it but the black card was absolutely needless. They got crucified during that period and the black card was absolutely needless - no threat or danger from anything.

[Armagh18]

No one is mentioning it but the black card was absolutely needless. They got crucified during that period and the black card was absolutely needless - no threat or danger from anything.

Harsh call too. Yer man went down like a bag of shite

[brokencrossbar1]

We will win more than we will lose through the way we play. This group may not have the physical approach that we had when I played,  which was a huge factor in Autumn football, but they are technically better footballers. As was said above if Ballybay don't get the lucky penalty early on the game may pan out differently. If we didn't lose our regular goalkeeper during the week before the game the game may pan out differently, if Rian O Neill is not carrying an injury(which he was) the game may pan out differently, but all of the above didn't on out that way. The reality is Ballybay played better than us and we have to learn from this.

There is an extraordinary external expectation on every Cross team that wins a county championship nevermind an internal pressure, albeit not from the club men this year. Every year we win,  irrespective of how bad or good we are, people expect us to win Ulster at least irrespective of how strong we are. Our jersey only pulls us so far. Our history can't kick points. Give us 2-3 years of domination in Armagh and then maybe you could argue that point but not at this stage. This is a young team in transition. Let's see where we are in 2-3 years time focusing on kicking the ball and not playing sweepers....

[Truth hurts]

Cross lost the previous 2 county championships as you could drive a bus through their defense. I admire the style and tradition but its madness sometimes. Horses for courses.