Casement Park in line for major overhaul - 40,000 all seater Stadium.

[DuffleKing]

I want to know what these residents were doing living in the social club. This economic hardship has deeper roots in west belfast than most places by the sound of it

[snatter]

I would venture to suggest that there's no site outwith West Belfast, that would be safe for the construction of a major GAA stadium in the City. Incidentally to-day's Irish News reports suggest that residents would be happy to let the Casement development proceed subject to them receiving £20k each in terms of compensation, which means they are effectively prostitutes, and renders obsolete all arguments in support of them, on this thread and elsewhere

You're not looking too hard, or reading my posts.

Musgrave Park, 329 metres away from Casement.


As for the residents looking for money - if they get it now, they'd always be asking for it.

Why tie ourselves into long term blackmail opportunities every time we want to hold any concert or event there?

And it mightn't stop with just immediately adjoining residents either. How much compensation would the GAA be asked for when some mother can't get to see her sick child at the Royal because the Andytown Rd is closed for several hours to accommodate a match and there is gridlock.  The GAA would be walking into a PR disaster.

Far better to build on a bigger site, far enough away from residents and not be vulnerable to blackmail.

Like Musgrave Park.

[snatter]

Jarlath Burns remedy for economic deprivation in belfast is to build a stadium that the locals clearly dont want . While at the same time taking a major economic benefit from a deprived rural community. I look forward to his future articles about rural decline and its impact on Gaa clubs.

It's in the GAA's interests to build any new stadium closest to large centres of population in order to reduce the long-term running costs of the stadium.
Events like concerts and conferences are vital to get the money in. That's why stadii generally do best when located in cities, not in the middle of nowhere.

The marketing / profile rasing benefits are also much higher by putting it in Belfast.

The only thing they've got wrong is in picking a site that is too small and constrained. Admittedly, they were given a bum steer by some anonymous consultancy report in 2010, but surely they can see the sense in moving on to a bigger site Plan B.

A more politically neutral site like Musgrave Park would also raise more money for long term running costs, as it would be likely to get more conferences, events, etc from the Belfast business community who (rightly or wrongly) wouldn't consider the A'town Rd, a mere 329 metres away.

[rrhf]

will it change your mind?

[Jeepers Creepers]

The article says Crossey "isn't aware " when asked about certain residents dropping their opposition for 20k

[snatter]

Has anyone allegedly offered the residents 20k, or is this
a. some residents chancing their arm, or
b. an attempt to smear the residents

[qubdub]

First off I can't see why Jarlath Burns has been brought into this, other than a GAA member giving his opinion, I don't see the need to brand him a 'ball licker'? Other than some personal gripe against the man.

I actually disagree with him and other proponents of the redevelopment. The residents are getting a raw deal should these plans go ahead.

The Ulster Council are also getting bad press but it is worth remembering the political pressure being put on them. Hard to see a solution of this that will satisfy all parties.

[Bingo]

Have a local election/ballot, simple Yes or No, majority wins.

[Walter Cronc]

First off I can't see why Jarlath Burns has been brought into this, other than a GAA member giving his opinion, I don't see the need to brand him a 'ball licker'? Other than some personal gripe against the man.

I actually disagree with him and other proponents of the redevelopment. The residents are getting a raw deal should these plans go ahead.

The Ulster Council are also getting bad press but it is worth remembering the political pressure being put on them. Hard to see a solution of this that will satisfy all parties.

Could a solution not be a single tier. 25k of higher spec (i.e fully covered) with the additional saving from a lower capacity you could incorporate a centre that would cater for arts, adult learning etc. To me it seems the GAA havent thought this through.

[Applesisapples]

I would venture to suggest that there's no site outwith West Belfast, that would be safe for the construction of a major GAA stadium in the City. Incidentally to-day's Irish News reports suggest that residents would be happy to let the Casement development proceed subject to them receiving £20k each in terms of compensation, which means they are effectively prostitutes, and renders obsolete all arguments in support of them, on this thread and elsewhere

Tony, not quite, what the article reports is that John Crossey is not aware of individuals reportedly willing to stop opposition for £20k.

[snatter]

I actually disagree with him and other proponents of the redevelopment. The residents are getting a raw deal should these plans go ahead.

The Ulster Council are also getting bad press but it is worth remembering the political pressure being put on them. Hard to see a solution of this that will satisfy all parties.

I do see an easy solution.

Get talking to the Alliance, Sinn Fein and SDLP on Belfast City Council.

Tell them that we'd like to develop a genuine exemplar landmark 40k, fully covered stadium in Musgrave Park.
If necesary, the development could be on some sort of partnership basis.

Inform them that if the council can't provide the site on agreeable terms, then we will take our stadium development elsewhere, eg Dungannon.

Emphasise the economic gains that having such a stadium would have for Belfast, eg GAA events, International Rules, Concerts, Conferences and the Rugby World Cup.

If Alliance/Belfast City Council don't co-operate, then run a beauty contest amongst locations that would like the investment. See what we can get in return, eg sites, infrastructure, facilitating development, etc.

[Applesisapples]

The bottom line is this money is available to the GAA for a one off Stadium build. It is not available for Clones so therefore Jarlath Burns arguments are not necessarily anti Clones or anti rural development. But if the GAA doesn't take the money for the stadium it will end up elsewhere. There needs to be an accomodation with residents but they can't hold the association to ransom. If there is loss of amenity on behalf of residents which devalues their houses then they should be compensated sufficiently to allow them to either move or stay as they see fit.

[snatter]

The bottom line is this money is available to the GAA for a one off Stadium build. It is not available for Clones so therefore Jarlath Burns arguments are not necessarily anti Clones or anti rural development. But if the GAA doesn't take the money for the stadium it will end up elsewhere. There needs to be an accomodation with residents but they can't hold the association to ransom. If there is loss of amenity on behalf of residents which devalues their houses then they should be compensated sufficiently to allow them to either move or stay as they see fit.

or, more sensibly, start again on a different site.

Take the money and build on a site where

• you have enough room to build to the original 40k capacity that was tendered for
• you have enough room to build a roof over the stands of your £75M stadium. It's Ireland ffs. It rains.
• you don't need to build practically on top of residents
• you don't have to close the main arterial route through SW Belfast for several hours just to let people enter and exit the stadium.
• you don't have to waste millions building concrete bunkers for car parking and ancillary services

[ONeill]

Can the redevelopment go ahead without the residents' acceptance or are you talking about months and years of court cases?

If it can't be lowered to suit the residents then it shouldn't be built.

I can't believe all this wasn't discussed before Casement was even mentioned. (Unless the plans were radically changed in the meantime)

Bring her to Dungannon.

[qubdub]

I actually disagree with him and other proponents of the redevelopment. The residents are getting a raw deal should these plans go ahead.

The Ulster Council are also getting bad press but it is worth remembering the political pressure being put on them. Hard to see a solution of this that will satisfy all parties.

I do see an easy solution.

Get talking to the Alliance, Sinn Fein and SDLP on Belfast City Council.

Tell them that we'd like to develop a genuine exemplar landmark 40k, fully covered stadium in Musgrave Park.
If necesary, the development could be on some sort of partnership basis.

Inform them that if the council can't provide the site on agreeable terms, then we will take our stadium development elsewhere, eg Dungannon.

Emphasise the economic gains that having such a stadium would have for Belfast, eg GAA events, International Rules, Concerts, Conferences and the Rugby World Cup.

If Alliance/Belfast City Council don't co-operate, then run a beauty contest amongst locations that would like the investment. See what we can get in return, eg sites, infrastructure, facilitating development, etc.

Of course there is a lot of common sense in that post which is why I disagree with it!

My impression is that the money has to be spent in Belfast, or as close as possible. I also have a feeling that there is one eye being kept on the potential for concerts being held in the stadium (which is ridiculous). Hence it staying in Belfast.

Bearing in mind the GAA already have the site and are entitled to (apply to) develop it in whatever way they wish. I can't see Musgrave Park being a runner - there's also the added complications of bringing in another stakeholder i.e. BCC.

There are economic gains to be had hence the big push for it, but how these gains are benefited by the residents who would have to live in the shadow remains to be seen.

At the end of the day Stormont is providing the doe so they have the last say, I feel that Casement will be the site in some shape or another, more's the pity because it's such an ill-though out proposal!