Casement Park in line for major overhaul - 40,000 all seater Stadium.

[Rossfan]

No one will want to be in that end of the ground!

Will ye get anyone in any end at all?
500 at the NFL game v Ros and 300 of them were from Ros .

Is there anywhere to park a car within miles of the place?

Anyway best of luck with it  - and could ye send us a few € or £s even to buy a digital scoreboard.

[snatter]

What is the point in having open end open, is that side terraced?

In a nutshell, the reason is that the site is too small.

This was meant to be a 40k fully covered stadium, but the site hasn't the width to accommodate enough people in the two main stands either side of the pitch. This is where you want them to be, because that is where more people get the best possible views of the pitch (see Optimum Viewing Circle definition [1]).

To get the capacity up to 38k (still short of the original 40k), more people have to be shoved behind the goals the A'town Road, regardless of the fact that most of these people will, for a modern stadium, have a dreadful viewing experience. Again, read the Optimum Viewing Circle link below.

To compound things, to put a roof over this A'town rd stand would block out the daylight to residents in the apartments opposite, who complained strongly, and the planned roof was dropped in response to their complaints. (look at http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1563744 to see the  original rough plans with the roof over teh A'town Rd end.)

So we end up with this awful A'town Rd stand with a crap view and no roof. An awful mistake and one that can never be rectified.

Far better to pick a big enough site and start again. £75 Million should deliver the full 40k fully covered, all with an optimal view on any site big enough.


[1]For full details on Optimum Viewing Circles, read this stadium design book and have a look at the diagrams of the Emirates Stadium to see how it should be done. 

http://www.scribd.com/doc/55405252/57/Viewing-distances

[rodney trotter]

When are they due to begin the redevelopment, September is it? The Antrim - Monaghan game is in Casement
And when do they expect to have it complete. It looks fairly impressive. All Ulster Finals will be in Casement when it's done I think?

[Walter Cronc]

What is the point in having open end open, is that side terraced?

In a nutshell, the reason is that the site is too small.

This was meant to be a 40k fully covered stadium, but the site hasn't the width to accommodate enough people in the two main stands either side of the pitch. This is where you want them to be, because that is where more people get the best possible views of the pitch (see Optimum Viewing Circle definition [1]).

To get the capacity up to 38k (still short of the original 40k), more people have to be shoved behind the goals the A'town Road, regardless of the fact that most of these people will, for a modern stadium, have a dreadful viewing experience. Again, read the Optimum Viewing Circle link below.

To compound things, to put a roof over this A'town rd stand would block out the daylight to residents in the apartments opposite, who complained strongly, and the planned roof was dropped in response to their complaints. (look at http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1563744 to see the  original rough plans with the roof over teh A'town Rd end.)

So we end up with this awful A'town Rd stand with a crap view and no roof. An awful mistake and one that can never be rectified.

Far better to pick a big enough site and start again. £75 Million should deliver the full 40k fully covered, all with an optimal view on any site big enough.


[1]For full details on Optimum Viewing Circles, read this stadium design book and have a look at the diagrams of the Emirates Stadium to se how it should be done. 

http://www.scribd.com/doc/55405252/57/Viewing-distances

So if the reason behind the uncovered end is due to daylight reducution then how come it passed on the other 3 sides?? If anything I would have thought the houses at the rear of the current stand lie closer to the proposed development than those on the Andytown road!!

[snatter]

It looks fairly impressive.

There's nothing impressive about it.

It's a joke - no-one builds a house with 3/4 of a roof when they've enough money to build it right.

Hopefully planning permission won't be granted on the basis that a main arterial route (potentially with bus expressway) will have to be closed for several hours each event day.

The best site is 200m away, in Musgrave Park.

[snatter]

So if the reason behind the uncovered end is due to daylight reducution then how come it passed on the other 3 sides?? If anything I would have thought the houses at the rear of the current stand lie closer to the proposed development than those on the Andytown road!!

The stand roof would had to have been much higher than the others, because (unbelievably for a new stadium) the A'town Rd stand behind the goals would be much deeper than the others.

The GAA confirmed that the roof had been dropped in order to appease objecting residents ( go back a page in this thread for proof ).

[NAG1]

It looks fairly impressive.

There's nothing impressive about it.

It's a joke - no-one builds a house with 3/4 of a roof when they've enough money to build it right.

Hopefully planning permission won't be granted on the basis that a main arterial route (potentially with bus expressway) will have to be closed for several hours each event day.

The best site is 200m away, in Musgrave Park.

Would like to have you as an estimator 200m 

The plan is to go ahead on the casement site, end of.

[rodney trotter]

It looks fairly impressive.

There's nothing impressive about it.

It's a joke - no-one builds a house with 3/4 of a roof when they've enough money to build it right.

Hopefully planning permission won't be granted on the basis that a main arterial route (potentially with bus expressway) will have to be closed for several hours each event day.

The best site is 200m away, in Musgrave Park.

Fair enough, you know more about it then me

[snatter]

It looks fairly impressive.

There's nothing impressive about it.

It's a joke - no-one builds a house with 3/4 of a roof when they've enough money to build it right.

Hopefully planning permission won't be granted on the basis that a main arterial route (potentially with bus expressway) will have to be closed for several hours each event day.

The best site is 200m away, in Musgrave Park.

Would like to have you as an estimator 200m 

The plan is to go ahead on the casement site, end of.

fair enough, I measured it on google maps and came up with 329.966 m

[snatter]

I'm not sure that's right about the residents of the apartments, snatter. The only resident complaints I've heard have come from MORA who are as far as I'm aware, really only interested in the other 3 sides.

They're now only interested in the other 3 sides because the GAA has capitulated already over the A'town rd end.

I got a tweeted confirmation from the A'town News sports reporter about two months ago.

And two weeks ago, the GAA said it had changed the orignal plans for a roof over the A'town Rd end to appease residents

"the project team have substantially changed the design of the stadium concept by reducing the capacity from 40,000 to 38,000 to reduce the height. We have also developed a truss system, again to lower the height of the building substantially."

"We have changed the Andersonstown Road section of the stadium to leave it uncovered......"

full article: http://belfastmediagroup.com/gaa-rejects-claims-theyre-not-engaging/

[Walter Cronc]

So if the reason behind the uncovered end is due to daylight reducution then how come it passed on the other 3 sides?? If anything I would have thought the houses at the rear of the current stand lie closer to the proposed development than those on the Andytown road!!

The stand roof would had to have been much higher than the others, because (unbelievably for a new stadium) the A'town Rd stand behind the goals would be much deeper than the others.

The GAA confirmed that the roof had been dropped in order to appease objecting residents ( go back a page in this thread for proof ).

As I previously said if they had along the lines of the Aviva and put one covered tier along the Andytown road that would have been visually much better. As for Musgrave Park. Is that in the West Belfast or South Belfast district? I couldn't see too many South Belfast Unionists voting for a Gaelic stadium on their back door!!

[snatter]

Sure the first ever photo they put out (months ago) didn't have a roof at the Andytown Road end.

Go to the first post in this link to view the original renders, published many months before  that clearly show the A'town Rd stand, complete with roof.

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1563744

and then read the article at http://belfastmediagroup.com/gaa-rejects-claims-theyre-not-engaging/

It couldn't be any clearer - straight from the GAA's mouth - they dropped the A'town Rd stand to appease residents' objections.

"the project team have substantially changed the design of the stadium concept by reducing the capacity from 40,000 to 38,000 to reduce the height. We have also developed a truss system, again to lower the height of the building substantially."

"We have changed the Andersonstown Road section of the stadium to leave it uncovered......"

[snatter]

As I previously said if they had along the lines of the Aviva and put one covered tier along the Andytown road that would have been visually much better.

Completely agree, and I guess most people would rather sit in a covered stand behind the goals, on a seat not too far away form the pitch, than stand in the rain further back with a crap view.

But then that would reduce capacity and they'd be even shorter of the design goal of 40k fully covered that they were aiming for.

The site is simply too small. Start again.

[NAG1]

That's not what that bit in green says. In fact, it doesn't mention residents at all.

The picture I posted came out before any meeting with residents occured.

+1

[snatter]

That's not what that bit in green says. In fact, it doesn't mention residents at all.

The picture I posted came out before any meeting with residents occured.

The Skyscraper render ( post 1 at http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1563744), complete with roof,  was published at a Community Consultation Event held in November 2012.
Look at the date of the posting: November 19th, 2012

The first photos, minus the roof, came out in Feb 2013.

Between Nov 2012 and feb 2013, the GAA had decided to drop the A'town Rd roof, in order to appease residents.

This was confirmed in the following article, published on 23 April 2013.



Full Article: http://belfastmediagroup.com/gaa-rejects-claims-theyre-not-engaging/

THE Casement Park Stadium Project Board (CPSPB) have rejected claims by the Mooreland and Owenvarragh Residents' Association (MORA) that they have been ignoring their concerns, stating they have been engaging with them and other stakeholders since April last year.

A CPSPB spokesman said the  process has been led by a senior Ulster GAA official who has met with the MORA group on a monthly basis and provided the group with ongoing information in relation to the design concept.

"The design team for the stadium was appointed in September 2012 and the team held its first meeting with MORA on the day of its appointment," he said. "Since then we have listened to all the concerns tabled by the residents' group and other stakeholders  and as a result the project team have substantially changed the design of the stadium concept by reducing the capacity from 40,000 to 38,000 to reduce the height. We have also developed a truss system, again to lower the height of the building substantially.

"We have changed the Andersonstown Road section of the stadium to leave it uncovered and we have also ensured that the stadium cloud is made of a translucent material.

"The GAA has also held five open night events in Belfast, three of which were in held in the Andersonstown Leisure Centre, and additionally the project team conducted a door-knock exercise with 280 homes on Saturday, April 13 to get direct feedback and input from residents neighbouring Casement Park.

"We have also attended two open residents meetings organised by MORA to provide updates on the project and get feedback on their concerns."

And the spokesman revealed the GAA  are planning further consultation events in the coming weeks.

"Ulster GAA continues to be in constant contact with the local residents, political representatives, community groups and other relevant stakeholders regarding the design of this project," he added.

"Regarding traffic management, these proposals are in draft form at present and we have already offered the MORA group representation on the event management team which will develop the proposals for match days.

"Any proposal for traffic control will be developed in partnership with the local residents and the statutory authorities.

"At the centre of this plan will be to ensure that residents are not adversely impacted by match day traffic.

"A full environmental statement will be submitted with the planning application and we have already conducted several studies on-site and the local area as part of the environmental statement.

"Ulster GAA will ensure that Casement Park is a significant social and economic driver for the entire province of Ulster, the city of Belfast and in particular West Belfast and we will continue to consult and engage with the local residents to ensure that this new development has a positive impact on them and their locality.

"The new Casement project will potentially bring £15 million a year to the local economy and will also see a £76.4 million boost for the local construction industry.

"Ulster GAA remains committed to the development of GAA in Ireland's second city and the promotion of economic and social regeneration in the city through the development of our games and activities," he added.