Northern Ireland The Centenary of OWC

[general_lee]

I have long held the view that had unionists recognised two cultures and administered the state fairly then we wouldn't have had the discord of the last 99 years.

I think the ultimate aim of the head honchos of unionism (and London) was a sort of ethnic cleansing, post partition. Treat Catholics so bad that they could no longer put up with things, and piss off over the border. So, basically, we had the discord of the last 99 years because all Catholics didn't piss off over the border.

Didn't Thatcher once suggest that they should re-draw the border to place areas like South Armagh in the Republic. That was the mentality.

The thing is, the more staunch Ulster gentlemen still hold these views, they still think that if people don't aspire to the continuing partition of this country that they should "fúck off back to Ireland". You have men in their 50s who have barely left Belfast their entire lives, bar maybe to visit Glasgow or Benidorm, who form their views on places like south Armagh based on the likes of the deceased  Willie Fraser.

They think the indigenous culture is not worth preserving, they think the language is little more than a hobby (except of course when being weaponised by "SFIRA"). They think the GAA hall doubles up as a weapons dump for the local IRA brigade.  Even your more moderate  "Unionist" would probably prefer if the Irish language died on its hole, such is the furore any time an ILA is brought up.

Meanwhile, your rates and taxes are paying for the annual clean up across the north after the 11th and 12th, the fire brigade to be on standby incase the houses catch fire, the council workers to come and board up houses to stop the windows from melting, even the contractors on the westlink to cover the gantry to prevent fire damage! You're paying for the police to do nothing (maybe hold the ladder) while loyalist flags are strategically placed to cause maximum offence, you're paying for their overtime when they police parades.

100 year of "cultural supremacy" will hopefully mark the beginning of the end.

You did grow up here during the troubles? The amount of bombs that went off in Belfast alone which caused huge damage and clean up, more than your 11th and 12th days currently, the rate hikes would have the same i'd assume

I was addressing the point applesisapples made about Unionists not recognising Irish culture while they ran our wee colony, while they no longer call the shots, the old attitudes remain. I'd also argue the whole point of bombs going off in Belfast was to cause economic havoc.

[johnnycool]

f**king hell, the dissies would be wetting themselves at the thought of the entire Tory Cabinet in Belfast...

Jim lives in some Utopian place that really only exists in his head.

[6th sam]

I'm surprised that nobody has posted Jim Allister's grand plan for the centerary....

In a meeting with NIO Minister of State, Robin Walker MP, Jim Allister set out his party's vision and expectations for the centenary in 2021 of the creation of Northern Ireland.

Among the proposals put by TUV were the following:
•   Since the centenary marks not just the creation of Northern Ireland but the U.K. as presently constituted, this must be a national celebration;
•   A visit by Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II and royal address to the Northern Ireland Assembly and large scale Garden Party;
•   The flying of the national flag on all public buildings on each key date;
•   An additional public holiday in or about 3rd May;
•   A Red Arrows fly past and visit of leading Royal Navy vessels;
•   A special Royal Mail stamp collection;
•   A specially minted commemorative coin, with presentation to every schoolchild and centenary specific classroom materials;
•   A specially commissioned logo to brand and promote all events;
•   A U.K. Government cabinet meeting in Belfast to mark the centenary with Prime Ministerial promotional visits to key tourist attractions;
•   An exhibition in the National Portrait Gallery in London of key NI figures in sports, military, arts, politics etc over our first 100 years, which would then tour the rest of the U.K.;
•   Promotion of Northern Ireland industry, including our food and drink products;
•   Special honour and remembrance of all security personnel who gave their lives in defence of Northern Ireland, with a particular focus at the 2021 Remembrance Event in the Royal Albert Hall.


Mr Allister stressed to the Government that it must take control of the organising of the celebrations because if left to the Stormont Executive they would be neutered by the pernicious Sinn Fein veto.

Mr Allister also stressed that these events were about celebrating Northern Ireland and the United Kingdom and, therefore, they were not an occasion to be muddied by Dublin involvement.

Finally, the TUV leader reminded Minister Walker the current government was elected on a pledge to "never be neutral on the Union". (Conservative Election Manifesto 2019). 2021 should, therefore, be one of celebration for Northern Ireland and a year when the rest of the country is reminded that the UK is – in the words of the Tory manifesto – "stronger and richer for Northern Ireland being part of it"

😂😂Those small number of posters from the 26 , who lack empathy towards Northern nationalists , should read and digest the above. It gives a clear view of the aggressive, conflict seeking, self serving bigotry we've had to put up with. Those that peddle the narrative that SF and Extreme unionism are two sides of the same coin, should reflect that if SF had taken the same approach to 1916 celebrations they'd be rightly pilloried. Extreme unionism is usually generated from within unionist strongholds( north Antrim in Jim's case) where the nonsense above is enough to get these Vindictive unneighbourly rabble rousers re-elected with ease . Unionists who live in more balanced areas , don't have the same anti-Irish viewpoint , And are embarrassed by the above, as they know it offends their friends, neighbours.

Sadly Jim is a very able man, and though he appears inherently bigoted , his hard line views make no sense, unless Of course, he's exploiting the electorate for an ongoing meal ticket.

Embarrassing but also hilariously deluded, does he really think those on his "mainland" will be excited  by NI 100? The only celebrations across the water will be when a future government in Westminster decides they've had enough , and waves goodbye to his " province " . They did this in '21, got rid of the "disloyal rabble" and bankrolled a sectarian NI , but Jim and generations of Unionist politicians couldn't even score that penalty kick. They've had 100 years to make a go of it, but they still don't get it.

[Taylor]

Thats absolutely hilarious. Classic Jim. They would need to be starting the planning soon if he's expecting all that! 

Will take the holiday but he can keep the rest

Exactly what I thought reading the list

[red hander]

I would never refer to the place I live as NI, why should we acknowledge a failed, sectarian statelet, purposely set up to discriminate and gerrymander with an inbuilt Unionist majority, a Protestant state for a Protestant people .... guess what, 2021 is expected to show a clear nationalist majority in the north.  Our unionist community can at least be assured that they will receive equality in a new Ireland, and be treated a hell of a lot better than they treated Catholics in the first 50 years of their unionist dream state. The first 100 years of this place will also be the last 100 ... I hope I live to see that day.

This.

The failed putrid statelet is in its death throes, English nationalism and Scottish independence will help put it out of its misery. Unionists will need to get over their Stockholm syndrome and realise the Brits don't give a flying fiddler's fcuk about them.

And will you except their traditions when there is a UI?

They and their traditions will be treated a hell of a lot better after reunification of our country than the native Irish people and their traditions were treated under the Stormont apartheid regime.

[Milltown Row2]

I have long held the view that had unionists recognised two cultures and administered the state fairly then we wouldn't have had the discord of the last 99 years.

I think the ultimate aim of the head honchos of unionism (and London) was a sort of ethnic cleansing, post partition. Treat Catholics so bad that they could no longer put up with things, and piss off over the border. So, basically, we had the discord of the last 99 years because all Catholics didn't piss off over the border.

Didn't Thatcher once suggest that they should re-draw the border to place areas like South Armagh in the Republic. That was the mentality.

The thing is, the more staunch Ulster gentlemen still hold these views, they still think that if people don't aspire to the continuing partition of this country that they should "fúck off back to Ireland". You have men in their 50s who have barely left Belfast their entire lives, bar maybe to visit Glasgow or Benidorm, who form their views on places like south Armagh based on the likes of the deceased  Willie Fraser.

They think the indigenous culture is not worth preserving, they think the language is little more than a hobby (except of course when being weaponised by "SFIRA"). They think the GAA hall doubles up as a weapons dump for the local IRA brigade.  Even your more moderate  "Unionist" would probably prefer if the Irish language died on its hole, such is the furore any time an ILA is brought up.

Meanwhile, your rates and taxes are paying for the annual clean up across the north after the 11th and 12th, the fire brigade to be on standby incase the houses catch fire, the council workers to come and board up houses to stop the windows from melting, even the contractors on the westlink to cover the gantry to prevent fire damage! You're paying for the police to do nothing (maybe hold the ladder) while loyalist flags are strategically placed to cause maximum offence, you're paying for their overtime when they police parades.

100 year of "cultural supremacy" will hopefully mark the beginning of the end.

You did grow up here during the troubles? The amount of bombs that went off in Belfast alone which caused huge damage and clean up, more than your 11th and 12th days currently, the rate hikes would have the same i'd assume

I was addressing the point applesisapples made about Unionists not recognising Irish culture while they ran our wee colony, while they no longer call the shots, the old attitudes remain. I'd also argue the whole point of bombs going off in Belfast was to cause economic havoc.

But by bombing the economy, it was doing exactly what you were complaining about.. Cherry picking!

The bombing didn't bring about peace either

[Applesisapples]

To be fair you are most likely to hear Southern Irish people such as Rossfan either expressly or by insinuation suggest we in the North are somehow less than full citizens. I use Northern Ireland were appropriate but find it sticks in my teeth, I use the North and NI as well. Doesn't affect my view on a UI to accept that the state exists. It doesn't prevent me questioning the legitimacy of a breakaway state founded on violence and the threat of violence. I have long held the view that had unionists recognised two cultures and administered the state fairly then we wouldn't have had the discord of the last 99 years.

You're not less that full Irish citizens but your Irish citizenship is second class in NI. It is your British nationality which gives you equality in NI under the law. Instead of seeing the GFA as a place to move forward from, the strategy of DUP and their like is to stall or/and pull back on the advances made in the  GFA.  In fact the DUP understand that better than Irish nationals. Whereas the next step for NI  is to have the GFA identity paragraphs  and other stuff be brought into law. 

That for Irish nationals born in NI,  the Irish nationality alone is  treated equal under the law as  British Nationality.
That any NI born can chose now to discard their British nationality free of cost. that those born in the  future in NI are only automatically a British national if at least one of their parents is a British national. That for one born in NI  who has no parents who are a British national, still qualifies to obtain a British nationality should they so desire.

Sorry but I am not a British National, whatever you are the British might think. I believe Emma de Souza has sorted that legally as well.

[Eamonnca1]

Dear Applesisapples,
I do not think Irish people in the North arent * "full Irish citizens".
I am not a "Southern Irishman". Western maybe.


* like most Irish Citizens who reside outside the 26 ye can't vote in Dáil or Presidential Elections or Referenda on the Bunreacht.
That however is not down to my opinion.

At the risk of rising to the bait, are you no longer a full Irish citizen if you move from Dublin to London and lose your right to? What if you happen to be a J1er who goes to America for the summer and an election gets called?

[Rossfan]

Once your name is on the Voting Register you can vote.
But if your permanent address is outside the 26 Counties you're not entitled to be on the Reguster unless you're a Diplomat or a soldier on UN duty who can get postal votes.
But they obviously have to be on the voting Register in some Cobstituency first.
Doesn't lessen your citizenship but when you hear of Poles, Italians etc living in Ireland who can vote in Polish, Italian elections it's a bit annoying that Irish people from the 26 who've moved overseas can't vote in our elections.

[GiveItToTheShooters]

Once your name is on the Voting Register you can vote.
But if your permanent address is outside the 26 Counties you're not entitled to be on the Reguster unless you're a Diplomat or a soldier on UN duty who can get postal votes.
But they obviously have to be on the voting Register in some Cobstituency first.
Doesn't lessen your citizenship but when you hear of Poles, Italians etc living in Ireland who can vote in Polish, Italian elections it's a bit annoying that Irish people overseas can't vote in our elections.

Is that you Leo? The north isn't overseas.

[Aaron Boone]

Once your name is on the Voting Register you can vote.
But if your permanent address is outside the 26 Counties you're not entitled to be on the Reguster unless you're a Diplomat or a soldier on UN duty who can get postal votes.
But they obviously have to be on the voting Register in some Cobstituency first.
Doesn't lessen your citizenship but when you hear of Poles, Italians etc living in Ireland who can vote in Polish, Italian elections it's a bit annoying that Irish people overseas can't vote in our elections.

Latest example was Belarus embassies very busy over the weekend with their ex-pats voting.
Counting them correctly in Belarus was a slightly different democratic matter.

[Main Street]

To be fair you are most likely to hear Southern Irish people such as Rossfan either expressly or by insinuation suggest we in the North are somehow less than full citizens. I use Northern Ireland were appropriate but find it sticks in my teeth, I use the North and NI as well. Doesn't affect my view on a UI to accept that the state exists. It doesn't prevent me questioning the legitimacy of a breakaway state founded on violence and the threat of violence. I have long held the view that had unionists recognised two cultures and administered the state fairly then we wouldn't have had the discord of the last 99 years.

You're not less that full Irish citizens but your Irish citizenship is second class in NI. It is your British nationality which gives you equality in NI under the law. Instead of seeing the GFA as a place to move forward from, the strategy of DUP and their like is to stall or/and pull back on the advances made in the  GFA.  In fact the DUP understand that better than Irish nationals. Whereas the next step for NI  is to have the GFA identity paragraphs  and other stuff be brought into law. 

That for Irish nationals born in NI,  the Irish nationality alone is  treated equal under the law as  British Nationality.
That any NI born can chose now to discard their British nationality free of cost. that those born in the  future in NI are only automatically a British national if at least one of their parents is a British national. That for one born in NI  who has no parents who are a British national, still qualifies to obtain a British nationality should they so desire.

Sorry but I am not a British National, whatever you are the British might think. I believe Emma de Souza has sorted that legally as well.

One of the absurd aspects of post GFA is that the DUP understand the import of nationality issues more clearly than most Irish nationals.

Ni born are british nationals  at birth, it is not removed unless you go through a legal process and if you actually read the temporary resolution to Emma's dilemma, nothing has changed  to the status of  British nationality being the first nationality imposed on all NI born and your Irish nationality is 2nd class.

It truly is absurd that Irish nationals born in NI do not understand British Nationality law and their status as Irish nationals  under that law.

[Rossfan]

Once your name is on the Voting Register you can vote.
But if your permanent address is outside the 26 Counties you're not entitled to be on the Reguster unless you're a Diplomat or a soldier on UN duty who can get postal votes.
But they obviously have to be on the voting Register in some Cobstituency first.
Doesn't lessen your citizenship but when you hear of Poles, Italians etc living in Ireland who can vote in Polish, Italian elections it's a bit annoying that Irish people overseas can't vote in our elections.

Is that you Leo? The north isn't overseas.

Post amended to take account of your sensitivities 

[BennyCake]

I would never refer to the place I live as NI, why should we acknowledge a failed, sectarian statelet, purposely set up to discriminate and gerrymander with an inbuilt Unionist majority, a Protestant state for a Protestant people .... guess what, 2021 is expected to show a clear nationalist majority in the north.  Our unionist community can at least be assured that they will receive equality in a new Ireland, and be treated a hell of a lot better than they treated Catholics in the first 50 years of their unionist dream state. The first 100 years of this place will also be the last 100 ... I hope I live to see that day.

This.

The failed putrid statelet is in its death throes, English nationalism and Scottish independence will help put it out of its misery. Unionists will need to get over their Stockholm syndrome and realise the Brits don't give a flying fiddler's fcuk about them.

And will you except their traditions when there is a UI?

They and their traditions will be treated a hell of a lot better after reunification of our country than the native Irish people and their traditions were treated under the Stormont apartheid regime.

Says who though? A nationalist or a unionist? No matter what is accommodated for unionism in a new Ireland, it still won't be enough. Unionists will never be content, you can be sure of that.

[Milltown Row2]

How were the Irish Prods treated in the south post 21?