The Many Faces of US Politics...

[AZOffaly]

How many Black or Hispanic police officers have shot and killed black (or hispanic) suspects/perps?

[AZOffaly]

By the way, I thought this was interesting, and it was a thought that crossed my mind as well. Unless you are a pure sack of racist filth, it's probably a much bigger deal to actually shoot a black suspect because you will have to handle the fall out. You'd think they'd be 100% that that was the only option.

Never heard of the 'Journal of Experimental Criminology' before, but it seems to have contributors from recognised Universities in the US.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/jan/5/police-officers-more-hesitant-to-shoot-black-suspe/

caveat, the author of the study, while an academic, is an ex-cop.

[LeoMc]

How many Black or Hispanic police officers have shot and killed black (or hispanic) suspects/perps?

An interesting question and it got me searching. Apparently there is no data base of Officer involved shootings though estimates are around 1100 people shot and killed by Cops every year.
In context there are approximately 40-45 cops killed in the line of duty and a population of 320m.

The only official log is compiled by the FBI. it is self reporting (requires police departments to log such killings), voluntary (not all departments participate) and it not audited. It tracks around 400 killings and is generally accepted as under-reporting.

There are a few attempts to collate this data unofficially, the most quoted one is FallenEncounters.org
The below visualisation gives a breakdown of logged deaths by state and by race but is does not track the ethnicity of the police.

http://www.fatalencounters.org/visualizations-2/

Victims: 34% white, 26% black, 24% not recorded, 12% Latino; 4% other.

Population 72% (White or Hispanic), 20% Black or mixed, 8% other

Interestingly 21% of shootings were in the Pacific states.

[AZOffaly]

Why is the pacific states one interesting? LA and San Francisco would be big enough cities, so I'd imagine they'd account for quite a few. That's a good site though Leo, fair play for finding it.

That (probably biased) link I posted from the ex-cop academic cites anecdotal evidence in Saint Louis of black SWAT team members (comprising 30% of the force) effecting 30% of the killings of black suspects. He says that is commensurate with other studies, but I have no way of knowing if that's right or not. If it were correct, it would lend weight to the claim that this is not a 'racial' issue, but rather a question of policing. Effectively, are all of these shootings necessary?

This is the paragraph.

"So why are blacks shot more often by police? While the FBI's national database has been widely criticized as incomplete, data compiled by Mr. Klinger in St. Louis over the past decade shows that 90 percent of police shootings involve blacks, even though they only make up 49 percent of the city's population.

At the same time, he said, that figure is commensurate with the percentage of blacks involved in violent crime. Roughly 90 percent of those killed each year in St. Louis are black, and 90 percent of them are shot by other blacks, he said.

What's more, he said, black SWAT officers make up about one-third of the St. Louis force — and they commit on average about one-third of the shootings each year.

"And this is consistent with every other study that's ever been done," said Mr. Klinger, who, as a rookie officer in Los Angeles, fatally shot a black man armed with a knife who had stabbed his partner, Dennis Azevedo, in the chest.

"Once you start looking at levels of violence, levels of threat, blacks are not shot in manners that are disproportionate to their involvement in illegal activity," he said. "And it doesn't matter if the cop is black, white or Hispanic, police officers presented with deadly threats use deadly force. Period, paragraph, end of story."

[whitey]

How many Black or Hispanic police officers have shot and killed black (or hispanic) suspects/perps?

An interesting question and it got me searching. Apparently there is no data base of Officer involved shootings though estimates are around 1100 people shot and killed by Cops every year.
In context there are approximately 40-45 cops killed in the line of duty and a population of 320m.

The only official log is compiled by the FBI. it is self reporting (requires police departments to log such killings), voluntary (not all departments participate) and it not audited. It tracks around 400 killings and is generally accepted as under-reporting.

There are a few attempts to collate this data unofficially, the most quoted one is FallenEncounters.org
The below visualisation gives a breakdown of logged deaths by state and by race but is does not track the ethnicity of the police.

http://www.fatalencounters.org/visualizations-2/

Victims: 34% white, 26% black, 24% not recorded, 12% Latino; 4% other.

Population 72% (White or Hispanic), 20% Black or mixed, 8% other

Interestingly 21% of shootings were in the Pacific states.

Statistics can be very misleading and open to manipulation

Im guessing most police wear some type of body armor, so the mortality rate should be significantly lower than that of the general population.

Also, the police would be trained marksmen giving them an edge in any confrontation with an armed civilian suspect

Wonder how many of the fatalities were "suicide by cop"?

[LeoMc]

How many Black or Hispanic police officers have shot and killed black (or hispanic) suspects/perps?

An interesting question and it got me searching. Apparently there is no data base of Officer involved shootings though estimates are around 1100 people shot and killed by Cops every year.
In context there are approximately 40-45 cops killed in the line of duty and a population of 320m.

The only official log is compiled by the FBI. it is self reporting (requires police departments to log such killings), voluntary (not all departments participate) and it not audited. It tracks around 400 killings and is generally accepted as under-reporting.

There are a few attempts to collate this data unofficially, the most quoted one is FallenEncounters.org
The below visualisation gives a breakdown of logged deaths by state and by race but is does not track the ethnicity of the police.

http://www.fatalencounters.org/visualizations-2/

Victims: 34% white, 26% black, 24% not recorded, 12% Latino; 4% other.

Population 72% (White or Hispanic), 20% Black or mixed, 8% other

Interestingly 21% of shootings were in the Pacific states.

Statistics can be very misleading and open to manipulation

Im guessing most police wear some type of body armor, so the mortality rate should be significantly lower than that of the general population.

Also, the police would be trained marksmen giving them an edge in any confrontation with an armed civilian suspect

Wonder how many of the fatalities were "suicide by cop"?

Totally agree, just trying to find any info that is out there to let you all interpret as you see fit.

My first thoughts were that 45 cops killed per year as a percentage of the number of cops is a lot higher than percentage of the general population (1100 out of 320 million). This shows how dangerous the job is and why cops may tend to shoot first.

[LeoMc]

Why is the pacific states one interesting?

If it were correct, it would lend weight to the claim that this is not a 'racial' issue, but rather a question of policing. Effectively, are all of these shootings necessary?

I had forgot about LA which could explain much of it but had thought it was a significant in the context of the population distribution.

Part of the premise behind the Fatal encounters web-site is that if there were an accurate audited record it could identify trends to improve Police training and identify issues. They used the example from NY where Police were prohibited from firing at (or maybe from) moving vehicles and this resulted in a massive reduction.

[muppet]

AZ, is the significant issue here not the armed status of the victims coupled with the entnicity?

Personally if a cop shoots someone who pulls a gun on him, I am on the side of the cop regardless of the color of either.

The stats are slim as it is but they don't go into any detail such as whether the victim was armed or not. Shooting unarmed people is surely worthy of at least an investigation? Like I said, anyone who pulls a gun on a cop is fair game. If a cop shoots because he thought the victim was armed, and thus he genuinely thought life and others was in danger, then fine. But admit it was a terrible mistake and have the investigation.

Most reasonable people understand mistakes, but they hate one law for one and a different law for others.

[gallsman]

AZ, is the significant issue here not the armed status of the victims coupled with the entnicity?

Personally if a cop shoots someone who pulls a gun on him, I am on the side of the cop regardless of the color of either.

The stats are slim as it is but they don't go into any detail such as whether the victim was armed or not. Shooting unarmed people is surely worthy of at least an investigation? Like I said, anyone who pulls a gun on a cop is fair game. If a cop shoots because he thought the victim was armed, and thus he genuinely thought life and others was in danger, then fine. But admit it was a terrible mistake and have the investigation.

Most reasonable people understand mistakes, but they hate one law for one and a different law for others.

Not necessarily. If the investigation finds that there was no reasonable ground for suspecting so, is it still fine?

[muppet]

AZ, is the significant issue here not the armed status of the victims coupled with the entnicity?

Personally if a cop shoots someone who pulls a gun on him, I am on the side of the cop regardless of the color of either.

The stats are slim as it is but they don't go into any detail such as whether the victim was armed or not. Shooting unarmed people is surely worthy of at least an investigation? Like I said, anyone who pulls a gun on a cop is fair game. If a cop shoots because he thought the victim was armed, and thus he genuinely thought life and others was in danger, then fine. But admit it was a terrible mistake and have the investigation.

Most reasonable people understand mistakes, but they hate one law for one and a different law for others.

Not necessarily. If the investigation finds that there was no reasonable ground for suspecting so, is it still fine?

If it was found to be genuine I personally would accept it. It is hard to see how you could genuinely fear for you life without any reasonable ground to do so, but I am open to the possibility.

Either way there should be a proper investigation to learn from it and try to improve.

[gallsman]

AZ, is the significant issue here not the armed status of the victims coupled with the entnicity?

Personally if a cop shoots someone who pulls a gun on him, I am on the side of the cop regardless of the color of either.

The stats are slim as it is but they don't go into any detail such as whether the victim was armed or not. Shooting unarmed people is surely worthy of at least an investigation? Like I said, anyone who pulls a gun on a cop is fair game. If a cop shoots because he thought the victim was armed, and thus he genuinely thought life and others was in danger, then fine. But admit it was a terrible mistake and have the investigation.

Most reasonable people understand mistakes, but they hate one law for one and a different law for others.

Not necessarily. If the investigation finds that there was no reasonable ground for suspecting so, is it still fine?

If it was found to be genuine I personally would accept it. It is hard to see how you could genuinely fear for you life without any reasonable ground to do so, but I am open to the possibility.

Either way there should be a proper investigation to learn from it and try to improve.

Well that's the debate, isn't it? Some people, including cops, might genuinely fear for their life where others would not as a result of, for example, racial profiling or poor training.

In this instance, I don't think it's "fair enough".

[whitey]

http://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2014/05/04/2-suspected-burglars-shot-dead-by-homes-occupant/

Interesting one.

Burglars ended up being ages 14 and 16

[cadhlancian]

Have been and of this thread recently, mostly just reading comments. Was the Mike Brown , outside the apartment ever uploaded on this thread??

[whitey]

Have been and of this thread recently, mostly just reading comments. Was the Mike Brown , outside the apartment ever uploaded on this thread??

That was a fake

[cadhlancian]

A fake?? The one I saw wasn't a fake. It was him .