Author Topic: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes  (Read 2303 times)

Syferus

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Re: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes
« Reply #15 on: November 22, 2017, 10:27:06 PM »
I know I shouldn't also but should FF be in a position to be the senior partner in a majority coalition government with SF after the next election, I think discussions about the politics and morality of the use of the gun in the recent war v all the forces that supported the planters, will conveniently be put on the back burner.

MM has already said he's not going to go into government with SF. The political damage for going against the will of the people and his own words would literally end his political career. Try again.

Syferus, you generally make a lot of good posts. However I feel you need to have lived in the north before making comments like you did earlier.
Growing up in the 70s & 80s, Catholics were 2nd Class citizens. That has now changed and whether we like it or not, it was people like Martin McGuiness that dragged us to where we are today.

McGuiness dragged Ireland backwards before he took a step forward. He can be commended for being more honest than Adams in his IRA role and trying his best to make amends in his later years but it's people like John Hume who never took up the gun that are the real heroes of the north.

SF over-taking the more reasonable nationalist parties in the north was something that set back the north in many ways. The two main unionist and republican parties now are both born of insular extremism. That is never the way forward for anything.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2017, 10:40:17 PM by Syferus »

trueblue1234

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Re: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes
« Reply #16 on: November 22, 2017, 10:30:29 PM »
Can you answer my questions?
Grammar: the difference between knowing your shit

Leonardo

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Re: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes
« Reply #17 on: November 22, 2017, 10:39:16 PM »
Agree with what you are saying about the 2 extreme parties in our current situation.
However, if you go back 20-30years, we wouldn’t have got to where we are now without McGuiness / Adams.
Its to our eternal shame that lives were lost throughout this conflict, and some horrendous acts were carried out, but I go back to my original point, unless you lived through what was going on here, you probably won’t understand that people did what needed to be done in order to give nationalists a voice. I think that reflects worse on the Unionists that treated us in the manner they did

foxcommander

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Re: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes
« Reply #18 on: November 22, 2017, 10:40:19 PM »
McGuiness dragged Ireland backwards before he took a step forward. He can be commended for being more honest than Adams in his IRA role and trying his best to make amends in his later years but it's people like John Hume who never took up the gun that are the real heroes of the north.

SF over-taking the more reasonable nationalist parties in the north was something that set back the north in many ways. The two main unionist and republican parties now are both bore of insular extremism. That is never the way forward for anything.

F**k me. That's a copy and paste job of the narrative given by all the free state newspapers.

The brainwashing succeeded.
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red hander

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Re: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes
« Reply #19 on: November 22, 2017, 11:13:52 PM »
Honoring McGuiness is as turgid and regressive as honoring Paisley. Both are best forgotten.
How does it feel basking in the freedom won for you by Irish republicans who killed people to achieve that freedom. Michael Collins no different to Martin McGuinness, a bullet in the head in 1919 is no different to a bullet in the head in 1986

Main Street

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Re: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes
« Reply #20 on: November 22, 2017, 11:15:48 PM »
I know I shouldn't also but should FF be in a position to be the senior partner in a majority coalition government with SF after the next election, I think discussions about the politics and morality of the use of the gun in the recent war v all the forces that supported the planters, will conveniently be put on the back burner.

MM has already said he's not going to go into government with SF. The political damage for going against the will of the people and his own words would literally end his political career. Try again.
And you are the person who would believe the word of a politician ;D

If after the next election, where the FF party decide to turn down an option to lead a coalition government because of their principled objection  not to entertain a partnership with SF, then I'll take their 'principled' objection seriously. Until that time  it's just guff.

AZOffaly

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Re: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes
« Reply #21 on: November 22, 2017, 11:27:06 PM »
MM would resign to allow that happen.

Rossfan

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Re: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes
« Reply #22 on: November 22, 2017, 11:30:55 PM »
If after the next election  we have FF and FG with about 50 seats each and SF with 30-35........
Syfīn needs to read up on the history of the 6 Cos prior to 1971.
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Syferus

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Re: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes
« Reply #23 on: November 22, 2017, 11:49:03 PM »
If after the next election  we have FF and FG with about 50 seats each and SF with 30-35........
Syfīn needs to read up on the history of the 6 Cos prior to 1971.

When FF propping up an FG government is preferable to both parties in lieu of dealing with SF you have your answer what will happen. You could do with reading up on your recent history rather than suggesting others do so.

SF are nailed on to lose seats with an ever-improving economy and someone as unsuitable and disliked as Mary Lou at the helm. This is the woman who was thrown out of the Dail a few weeks ago ffs. They are and will remain toxic to transfers.

Labour will hopefully hoover up enough of the votes from the independents and left-leaning voters departing SF to form a government with FG.

The less said about the drunken scrawl on the back of a napkin that was SF’s bailout and giveaway policies at the last two elections the better.

Rossfan

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Re: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes
« Reply #24 on: November 22, 2017, 11:53:32 PM »
Do you really believe the Auctioneers and Builders party are going to shore up the Blueshirts after the next election?
And when are you going to read the history of the 6 Cos between  1922 and 1971?
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Syferus

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Re: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes
« Reply #25 on: November 22, 2017, 11:59:44 PM »
Do you really believe the Auctioneers and Builders party are going to shore up the Blueshirts after the next election?
And when are you going to read the history of the 6 Cos between  1922 and 1971?

They will do a deal again if needs be, even though policywise they make perfect government partners history and a lack of humility on FF’s part prevents them from forming a government.

That they were more willing to cut a deal with each other than even explore coalition options with SF tells you how little their legacy has been normalised.

If FF and FG get as many votes as you suggest the will of the people is overwhelmingly for a center-right government, not the mad policies of SF and that’s before you get to their role as the political wing of a terrorist organization.

Anyone entertaining thoughts of SF being in the next government is living in a fantasy land. That goes for you, Main Street and anyone else contemplating those notions.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2017, 12:01:43 AM by Syferus »

Il Bomber Destro

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Re: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes
« Reply #26 on: November 23, 2017, 12:00:45 AM »
If after the next election  we have FF and FG with about 50 seats each and SF with 30-35........
Syfīn needs to read up on the history of the 6 Cos prior to 1971.

When FF propping up an FG government is preferable to both parties in lieu of dealing with SF you have your answer what will happen. You could do with reading up on your recent history rather than suggesting others do so.

SF are nailed on to lose seats with an ever-improving economy and someone as unsuitable and disliked as Mary Lou at the helm. This is the woman who was thrown out of the Dail a few weeks ago ffs. They are and will remain toxic to transfers.

Labour will hopefully hoover up enough of the votes from the independents and left-leaning voters departing SF to form a government with FG.

The less said about the drunken scrawl on the back of a napkin that was SF’s bailout and giveaway policies at the last two elections the better.

Syferus was all for the sectarian murder of Protestants down in Cork in the 1920s and the murder of RIC officers and civilians by Republicans during the War of Independence. Most free staters seem to be of the opinion that murder and violence was OK so that they could have their own freedom but were quite happy to stand idly by and watch a pogrom taking place 50 years later across the border, subsequently wringing their hands and screaming when the persecuted community had the temerity to stand up for themselves when nobody else would. That's what it all boils down to, sadly.

History will remember Martin McGuinness very fondly, it will remember his courage, sacrifice and selflessness - a life devoted to the betterment of his community.


Itchy

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Re: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes
« Reply #27 on: November 23, 2017, 12:03:15 AM »
I assume syphilis has similar opinions on founders of all political parties in Ireland? All founded with the gun, all unapologetic for it. Another stupid post.

Syferus

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Re: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes
« Reply #28 on: November 23, 2017, 12:09:37 AM »
I assume syphilis has similar opinions on founders of all political parties in Ireland? All founded with the gun, all unapologetic for it. Another stupid post.

Apples and oranges, as always some wish that 1916 is easily mappable to 1986 but sadly it isn’t. There’s a reason Dev and Collins left SF and the IRA behind.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2017, 12:30:25 AM by Syferus »

Il Bomber Destro

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Re: Terrorist Glorification versus Honouring Fallen Heroes
« Reply #29 on: November 23, 2017, 12:10:24 AM »
I know I shouldn't also but should FF be in a position to be the senior partner in a majority coalition government with SF after the next election, I think discussions about the politics and morality of the use of the gun in the recent war v all the forces that supported the planters, will conveniently be put on the back burner.

MM has already said he's not going to go into government with SF. The political damage for going against the will of the people and his own words would literally end his political career. Try again.

Syferus, you generally make a lot of good posts. However I feel you need to have lived in the north before making comments like you did earlier.
Growing up in the 70s & 80s, Catholics were 2nd Class citizens. That has now changed and whether we like it or not, it was people like Martin McGuiness that dragged us to where we are today.

McGuiness dragged Ireland backwards before he took a step forward. He can be commended for being more honest than Adams in his IRA role and trying his best to make amends in his later years but it's people like John Hume who never took up the gun that are the real heroes of the north.

SF over-taking the more reasonable nationalist parties in the north was something that set back the north in many ways. The two main unionist and republican parties now are both born of insular extremism. That is never the way forward for anything.

Hume endorsed the jailing of nationalists without cause or trial. John Hume is the poster boy for free staters, for people who have absolutely no idea about the brutality of the British regime on the nationalists in the North.

If ever a poster could have done with a spell under the Brits in Occupied Ulster, it would have been you.