Author Topic: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?  (Read 2453 times)

AZOffaly

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Re: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?
« Reply #15 on: November 24, 2017, 04:26:52 PM »
He's not engaging though. He comes across as a D4 head, and he hasn't reached the constituencies I think. I'm not sure anybody really pays any remarks to debate. In Ireland, as most places, politics is local but the man or woman at the top has to be somewhat popular.

Thereís a reason they stick up as many posters of the party leader as the local candidate in areas where itís a toss up, AZ. A leader that is seen as polished and competent (which is enough with the field we have at the minute) can bring home enough preferences to pull those candidates over the line. FF will likely be blamed for this election, so LV has an opportunity if he wants it.

The left wing parties like SF and the water charges are going to get a punch in the face if this goes to the polls.

That's what I just said. The man at the top has to be somewhat popular. I'm not sure Leo is. I think he comes across as a smug enough fella.

weareros

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Re: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?
« Reply #16 on: November 24, 2017, 04:27:04 PM »
He's not engaging though. He comes across as a D4 head, and he hasn't reached the constituencies I think. I'm not sure anybody really pays any remarks to debate. In Ireland, as most places, politics is local but the man or woman at the top has to be somewhat popular.

Opinion polls, for what they are worth,  still show him as the most popular leader. However, the opposition are a desperate bunch of has beens so that is not saying much. It would ruin Christmas to see any of their smug mugs nailed to a telegraph poll. The end result would hardly change much either. I doubt the country wants a FF/SF coalition which is the only realistic alternative.

AZOffaly

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Re: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?
« Reply #17 on: November 24, 2017, 04:30:01 PM »
He's not engaging though. He comes across as a D4 head, and he hasn't reached the constituencies I think. I'm not sure anybody really pays any remarks to debate. In Ireland, as most places, politics is local but the man or woman at the top has to be somewhat popular.

Opinion polls, for what they are worth,  still show him as the most popular leader. However, the opposition are a desperate bunch of has beens so that is not saying much. It would ruin Christmas to see any of their smug mugs nailed to a telegraph poll. The end result would hardly change much either. I doubt the country wants a FF/SF coalition which is the only realistic alternative.

I agree. For what it's worth, I think he's the best of a bad lot. But he needs to do something about his aloof profile.

I wouldn't be surprised to see FF and SF cosying up after any election, particularly if Micheal Martin decides to fall on his sword in order to pave the way. He cannot be seen to lead a coalition with SF at this stage, but there are plenty of FF people who wouldn't mind it. Especially when you think that the junior part in a coalition normally ends up getting toasted.

AZOffaly

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Re: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?
« Reply #18 on: November 24, 2017, 04:35:38 PM »
Either way, I think FF have badly misjudged the mood of the nation if they force this, so I can see some sort of behind the scenes mutual climbdown which will head it off.

Rossfan

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Re: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?
« Reply #19 on: November 24, 2017, 04:38:29 PM »
I think Varadkar is seen as toxic in rural ireland and have seen no proof yet as to his superior debating prowess...
Telling that the Blueshirt membership voted for Coveney in the leadership contest.
Present lot are bad but jaysus does anyone want to see Willie O'feckinD or Barry Bloody Cowen as Ministers?
I hope Frances Fitzgerald on " mature reflection and in the National Interest" decides to step down.
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Syferus

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Re: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?
« Reply #20 on: November 24, 2017, 04:41:58 PM »
Either way, I think FF have badly misjudged the mood of the nation if they force this, so I can see some sort of behind the scenes mutual climbdown which will head it off.

SF forced FFís hand by calling for the no confidence vote after MM deciding to try to talk out of both sides of his mouth by criticising Fitzgerald and not doing anything about it.

FG are about the only party who have a solid opportunity if this heads to the polls, as Iím betting the public couldnít give two fŻcks about Fitzgeraldís emails or even the weary excercise in politicking that has become the whole McCabe issue.

FF can be rightly blamed for putting party politics before the country, and the high watermark for far left groups is likely to subside in the face of a significantly better economy. If LV enters the holidays with a better mandate he better send Enda a Christmas card.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2017, 05:49:48 PM by Syferus »

seafoid

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Re: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?
« Reply #21 on: November 24, 2017, 04:56:36 PM »
I think Varadkar is seen as toxic in rural ireland and have seen no proof yet as to his superior debating prowess...
Is it not a bit early to draw such a conclusion?
 Minorit FG propped up.by remnant FF. It is very unstable. Government is serious. FF are not
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AZOffaly

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Re: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?
« Reply #22 on: November 24, 2017, 04:58:00 PM »
Seafoid, do you post in some sort of haiku?

vallankumous

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Re: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?
« Reply #23 on: November 24, 2017, 04:59:58 PM »

Don't know how it is reported in RoI but it appears that Varadkar is never out of the media in NI.  Perhaps he is more interested in his media image and travelling abroad than making any real contact outside the Dublin political bubble.  Not really a man of the people, gives the impression of being aloof.  However, he has given SF a fair working over in the Dail.  In the end, FG election prospects depend on reaching out well beyond their small core vote and I wouldn't be sure that Varadkar has managed to make that broad reach across the country.

I think he has crossed over to some who would never have voted for Enda Kenny but i do think he is losing his base. FGers are educated about how politics suits them, they want a stable politician with a stable leadership. Varadkar doesn't provide that. He wants to be a celebrity politician. That doesn't wash with traditional FGers. I think Simon Coveney is probably more popular in FGs base and he's capable too. He is the one they want in charge.
While Varadkar is swaning it on twitter, Coveney is doing real politic in the Irish Times , Financial Times , RTE debates, the Farmers Journal etc. This is where the FG audience is.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2017, 05:01:30 PM by vallankumous »

seafoid

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Re: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?
« Reply #24 on: November 24, 2017, 05:04:21 PM »
Seafoid, do you post in some sort of haiku?
Is it not too long for a Haiku? If Willie ‘ dea had been mentioned it could have been a limerick
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Syferus

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Re: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?
« Reply #25 on: November 24, 2017, 05:32:23 PM »

Don't know how it is reported in RoI but it appears that Varadkar is never out of the media in NI.  Perhaps he is more interested in his media image and travelling abroad than making any real contact outside the Dublin political bubble.  Not really a man of the people, gives the impression of being aloof.  However, he has given SF a fair working over in the Dail.  In the end, FG election prospects depend on reaching out well beyond their small core vote and I wouldn't be sure that Varadkar has managed to make that broad reach across the country.

I think he has crossed over to some who would never have voted for Enda Kenny but i do think he is losing his base. FGers are educated about how politics suits them, they want a stable politician with a stable leadership. Varadkar doesn't provide that. He wants to be a celebrity politician. That doesn't wash with traditional FGers. I think Simon Coveney is probably more popular in FGs base and he's capable too. He is the one they want in charge.
While Varadkar is swaning it on twitter, Coveney is doing real politic in the Irish Times , Financial Times , RTE debates, the Farmers Journal etc. This is where the FG audience is.

Elections are won and lost in urban areas, not the countryside. LV appeals to the people FG need to get on side to get a majority government.

Rural voters, particularly when it comes to FG and FF, still tend to vote along familial lines. Coveney would have just been preaching to the choir, something he can do from the front bench as effectively as the front seat.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2017, 05:49:28 PM by Syferus »

Farrandeelin

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Re: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?
« Reply #26 on: November 24, 2017, 05:32:41 PM »
He's not engaging though. He comes across as a D4 head, and he hasn't reached the constituencies I think. I'm not sure anybody really pays any remarks to debate. In Ireland, as most places, politics is local but the man or woman at the top has to be somewhat popular.

Thereís a reason they stick up as many posters of the party leader as the local candidate in areas where itís a toss up, AZ. A leader that is seen as polished and competent (which is enough with the field we have at the minute) can bring home enough preferences to pull those candidates over the line. FF will likely be blamed for this election, so LV has an opportunity if he wants it.

The left wing parties like SF and the water charges are going to get a punch in the face if this goes to the polls.

That's what I just said. The man at the top has to be somewhat popular. I'm not sure Leo is. I think he comes across as a smug enough fella.

Me too AZ. Covent might have been better for them.
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seafoid

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Re: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?
« Reply #27 on: November 24, 2017, 05:34:41 PM »
He's not engaging though. He comes across as a D4 head, and he hasn't reached the constituencies I think. I'm not sure anybody really pays any remarks to debate. In Ireland, as most places, politics is local but the man or woman at the top has to be somewhat popular.

Thereís a reason they stick up as many posters of the party leader as the local candidate in areas where itís a toss up, AZ. A leader that is seen as polished and competent (which is enough with the field we have at the minute) can bring home enough preferences to pull those candidates over the line. FF will likely be blamed for this election, so LV has an opportunity if he wants it.

The left wing parties like SF and the water charges are going to get a punch in the face if this goes to the polls.
Not sure about that. The electorate is volatile. FG badly misjudged the last election. How they would do is in their own hands. The message needs to resonate.
"you can try and intimidate us, but f**k youse, we're going to win an All-Ireland anyway"

Syferus

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Re: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?
« Reply #28 on: November 24, 2017, 05:37:48 PM »
He's not engaging though. He comes across as a D4 head, and he hasn't reached the constituencies I think. I'm not sure anybody really pays any remarks to debate. In Ireland, as most places, politics is local but the man or woman at the top has to be somewhat popular.

Thereís a reason they stick up as many posters of the party leader as the local candidate in areas where itís a toss up, AZ. A leader that is seen as polished and competent (which is enough with the field we have at the minute) can bring home enough preferences to pull those candidates over the line. FF will likely be blamed for this election, so LV has an opportunity if he wants it.

The left wing parties like SF and the water charges are going to get a punch in the face if this goes to the polls.
Not sure about that. The electorate is volatile. FG badly misjudged the last election. How they would do is in their own hands. The message needs to resonate.

They won the election.

Orchard park

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Re: Election for turkeys ? Will FG go for it?
« Reply #29 on: November 24, 2017, 05:41:58 PM »

Don't know how it is reported in RoI but it appears that Varadkar is never out of the media in NI.  Perhaps he is more interested in his media image and travelling abroad than making any real contact outside the Dublin political bubble.  Not really a man of the people, gives the impression of being aloof.  However, he has given SF a fair working over in the Dail.  In the end, FG election prospects depend on reaching out well beyond their small core vote and I wouldn't be sure that Varadkar has managed to make that broad reach across the country.

I think he has crossed over to some who would never have voted for Enda Kenny but i do think he is losing his base. FGers are educated about how politics suits them, they want a stable politician with a stable leadership. Varadkar doesn't provide that. He wants to be a celebrity politician. That doesn't wash with traditional FGers. I think Simon Coveney is probably more popular in FGs base and he's capable too. He is the one they want in charge.
While Varadkar is swaning it on twitter, Coveney is doing real politic in the Irish Times , Financial Times , RTE debates, the Farmers Journal etc. This is where the FG audience is.

Elections are won and lost in urban areas, not the countryside. LV appeals to the people FG need to get on side to get a majority government.

Rural voters, particularly when it comes to FG and FF, still tend to vote along familial lines. Covney would have just been preaching to the choir, something he can do from the front bench as effectively as the front seat.
[/quote

Ok toxic outside of Dublin in case the Syferus 1 thinks I meant non urban centres