A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.

Started by winghalfback, May 27, 2015, 03:16:23 PM

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Franko

Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:09:19 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 11:03:33 AM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 08:54:55 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on November 21, 2015, 07:15:37 AM
Franko's summary isn't far out at all. Dev made the situation worse by allowing the church have too much influence in everything.

Really?

You are happy to be one of these:

"those treacherous cowards who said 'ya know what, I'm sick of fighting the Brits, let's shaft these poor cnuts in the north and we'll get what we're after'."

Between Fearon's insistence on a homophobic Ireland and the constant abuse from eternal victims like Franko, my head is beginning to question my heart on the issue of a UI.

PS, I'm not sure if you meant it or not but the part in bold is brilliantly ironic.  ;D ;D

Thank you. It was quite deliberate.

And as for the ad hominem, are you also being ironic, unless 'treacherous cowards' was meant as a compliment.  ;D

Yeah, sure it was!  ;)

The treacherous cowards comment obviously doesn't apply to everyone in the 26. There were, after all, a huge portion of decent people who had the backbone and principles to say no to the Brits' plan.  But if the cap fits...

muppet

Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:15:46 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:09:19 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 11:03:33 AM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 08:54:55 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on November 21, 2015, 07:15:37 AM
Franko's summary isn't far out at all. Dev made the situation worse by allowing the church have too much influence in everything.

Really?

You are happy to be one of these:

"those treacherous cowards who said 'ya know what, I'm sick of fighting the Brits, let's shaft these poor cnuts in the north and we'll get what we're after'."

Between Fearon's insistence on a homophobic Ireland and the constant abuse from eternal victims like Franko, my head is beginning to question my heart on the issue of a UI.

PS, I'm not sure if you meant it or not but the part in bold is brilliantly ironic.  ;D ;D

Thank you. It was quite deliberate.

And as for the ad hominem, are you also being ironic, unless 'treacherous cowards' was meant as a compliment.  ;D

Yeah, sure it was!  ;)

The treacherous cowards comment obviously doesn't apply to everyone in the 26. There were, after all, a huge portion of decent people who had the backbone and principles to say no to the Brits' plan.  But if the cap fits...

Not everyone?

What is the criteria to be one or the other? Should they have wanted to die for you?
MWWSI 2017

Franko

Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:23:33 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:15:46 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:09:19 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 11:03:33 AM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 08:54:55 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on November 21, 2015, 07:15:37 AM
Franko's summary isn't far out at all. Dev made the situation worse by allowing the church have too much influence in everything.

Really?

You are happy to be one of these:

"those treacherous cowards who said 'ya know what, I'm sick of fighting the Brits, let's shaft these poor cnuts in the north and we'll get what we're after'."

Between Fearon's insistence on a homophobic Ireland and the constant abuse from eternal victims like Franko, my head is beginning to question my heart on the issue of a UI.

PS, I'm not sure if you meant it or not but the part in bold is brilliantly ironic.  ;D ;D

Thank you. It was quite deliberate.

And as for the ad hominem, are you also being ironic, unless 'treacherous cowards' was meant as a compliment.  ;D

Yeah, sure it was!  ;)

The treacherous cowards comment obviously doesn't apply to everyone in the 26. There were, after all, a huge portion of decent people who had the backbone and principles to say no to the Brits' plan.  But if the cap fits...

Not everyone?

What is the criteria to be one or the other? Should they have wanted to die for you?

Nope, not die. Just tick a box.

muppet

Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:39:54 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:23:33 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:15:46 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:09:19 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 11:03:33 AM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 08:54:55 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on November 21, 2015, 07:15:37 AM
Franko's summary isn't far out at all. Dev made the situation worse by allowing the church have too much influence in everything.

Really?

You are happy to be one of these:

"those treacherous cowards who said 'ya know what, I'm sick of fighting the Brits, let's shaft these poor cnuts in the north and we'll get what we're after'."

Between Fearon's insistence on a homophobic Ireland and the constant abuse from eternal victims like Franko, my head is beginning to question my heart on the issue of a UI.

PS, I'm not sure if you meant it or not but the part in bold is brilliantly ironic.  ;D ;D

Thank you. It was quite deliberate.

And as for the ad hominem, are you also being ironic, unless 'treacherous cowards' was meant as a compliment.  ;D

Yeah, sure it was!  ;)

The treacherous cowards comment obviously doesn't apply to everyone in the 26. There were, after all, a huge portion of decent people who had the backbone and principles to say no to the Brits' plan.  But if the cap fits...

Not everyone?

What is the criteria to be one or the other? Should they have wanted to die for you?

Nope, not die. Just tick a box.

So people who don't vote as you want them to are 'treacherous cowards'?
MWWSI 2017

Franko

Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:49:31 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:39:54 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:23:33 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:15:46 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:09:19 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 11:03:33 AM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 08:54:55 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on November 21, 2015, 07:15:37 AM
Franko's summary isn't far out at all. Dev made the situation worse by allowing the church have too much influence in everything.

Really?

You are happy to be one of these:

"those treacherous cowards who said 'ya know what, I'm sick of fighting the Brits, let's shaft these poor cnuts in the north and we'll get what we're after'."

Between Fearon's insistence on a homophobic Ireland and the constant abuse from eternal victims like Franko, my head is beginning to question my heart on the issue of a UI.

PS, I'm not sure if you meant it or not but the part in bold is brilliantly ironic.  ;D ;D

Thank you. It was quite deliberate.

And as for the ad hominem, are you also being ironic, unless 'treacherous cowards' was meant as a compliment.  ;D

Yeah, sure it was!  ;)

The treacherous cowards comment obviously doesn't apply to everyone in the 26. There were, after all, a huge portion of decent people who had the backbone and principles to say no to the Brits' plan.  But if the cap fits...

Not everyone?

What is the criteria to be one or the other? Should they have wanted to die for you?

Nope, not die. Just tick a box.

So people who don't vote as you want them to are 'treacherous cowards'?

No, no. The treacherous cowards comment was reserved for those who voted to cut their fellow Irishmen loose to achieve their own aims. Yep, that was treachery and cowardice.

muppet

Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:53:42 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:49:31 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:39:54 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:23:33 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:15:46 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:09:19 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 11:03:33 AM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 08:54:55 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on November 21, 2015, 07:15:37 AM
Franko's summary isn't far out at all. Dev made the situation worse by allowing the church have too much influence in everything.

Really?

You are happy to be one of these:

"those treacherous cowards who said 'ya know what, I'm sick of fighting the Brits, let's shaft these poor cnuts in the north and we'll get what we're after'."

Between Fearon's insistence on a homophobic Ireland and the constant abuse from eternal victims like Franko, my head is beginning to question my heart on the issue of a UI.

PS, I'm not sure if you meant it or not but the part in bold is brilliantly ironic.  ;D ;D

Thank you. It was quite deliberate.

And as for the ad hominem, are you also being ironic, unless 'treacherous cowards' was meant as a compliment.  ;D

Yeah, sure it was!  ;)

The treacherous cowards comment obviously doesn't apply to everyone in the 26. There were, after all, a huge portion of decent people who had the backbone and principles to say no to the Brits' plan.  But if the cap fits...

Not everyone?

What is the criteria to be one or the other? Should they have wanted to die for you?

Nope, not die. Just tick a box.

So people who don't vote as you want them to are 'treacherous cowards'?

No, no. The treacherous cowards comment was reserved for those who voted to cut their fellow Irishmen loose to achieve their own aims. Yep, that was treachery and cowardice.

This is the problem with democracy. When you lose, you have to accept it. Or else you find a way to win the next vote. You could of course try to shoot and bomb your way to what you want. But then you are no better than your oppressors. In fact I think you would be even worse, as you are killing your own.

The anti-treaty people didn't even show up for the next vote, ceremonial as it may have been. But with the original vote so tight, surely it was worth trying to persuade the 4 TDs necessary to reverse their votes?

MWWSI 2017

seafoid

a united Ireland would bring advantages of scale and the cross exchange of ideas would bring efficiencies. the only problem would be the status of Unionists . Given the GFA which gave a role for the 26 counties in NI it's hard to see how the Brits would give up their role entirely.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Rossfan

Obviously the former Unionists ( probably then be known as the " Ulster British") will have to have the option of British citizenship as well as Irish in the new All Ireland entity.
Davy's given us a dream to cling to
We're going to bring home the SAM

Franko

Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 01:01:56 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:53:42 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:49:31 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:39:54 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:23:33 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:15:46 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:09:19 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 11:03:33 AM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 08:54:55 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on November 21, 2015, 07:15:37 AM
Franko's summary isn't far out at all. Dev made the situation worse by allowing the church have too much influence in everything.

Really?

You are happy to be one of these:

"those treacherous cowards who said 'ya know what, I'm sick of fighting the Brits, let's shaft these poor cnuts in the north and we'll get what we're after'."

Between Fearon's insistence on a homophobic Ireland and the constant abuse from eternal victims like Franko, my head is beginning to question my heart on the issue of a UI.

PS, I'm not sure if you meant it or not but the part in bold is brilliantly ironic.  ;D ;D

Thank you. It was quite deliberate.

And as for the ad hominem, are you also being ironic, unless 'treacherous cowards' was meant as a compliment.  ;D

Yeah, sure it was!  ;)

The treacherous cowards comment obviously doesn't apply to everyone in the 26. There were, after all, a huge portion of decent people who had the backbone and principles to say no to the Brits' plan.  But if the cap fits...

Not everyone?

What is the criteria to be one or the other? Should they have wanted to die for you?

Nope, not die. Just tick a box.

So people who don't vote as you want them to are 'treacherous cowards'?

No, no. The treacherous cowards comment was reserved for those who voted to cut their fellow Irishmen loose to achieve their own aims. Yep, that was treachery and cowardice.

This is the problem with democracy. When you lose, you have to accept it. Or else you find a way to win the next vote. You could of course try to shoot and bomb your way to what you want. But then you are no better than your oppressors. In fact I think you would be even worse, as you are killing your own.

The anti-treaty people didn't even show up for the next vote, ceremonial as it may have been. But with the original vote so tight, surely it was worth trying to persuade the 4 TDs necessary to reverse their votes?

Oh, the vote was accepted, the blueshirts and the Brits joined forces to make sure of that.  As for the north, feck them, sure we're alright.

muppet

Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 02:20:43 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 01:01:56 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:53:42 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:49:31 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:39:54 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:23:33 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:15:46 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:09:19 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 11:03:33 AM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 08:54:55 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on November 21, 2015, 07:15:37 AM
Franko's summary isn't far out at all. Dev made the situation worse by allowing the church have too much influence in everything.

Really?

You are happy to be one of these:

"those treacherous cowards who said 'ya know what, I'm sick of fighting the Brits, let's shaft these poor cnuts in the north and we'll get what we're after'."

Between Fearon's insistence on a homophobic Ireland and the constant abuse from eternal victims like Franko, my head is beginning to question my heart on the issue of a UI.

PS, I'm not sure if you meant it or not but the part in bold is brilliantly ironic.  ;D ;D

Thank you. It was quite deliberate.

And as for the ad hominem, are you also being ironic, unless 'treacherous cowards' was meant as a compliment.  ;D

Yeah, sure it was!  ;)

The treacherous cowards comment obviously doesn't apply to everyone in the 26. There were, after all, a huge portion of decent people who had the backbone and principles to say no to the Brits' plan.  But if the cap fits...

Not everyone?

What is the criteria to be one or the other? Should they have wanted to die for you?

Nope, not die. Just tick a box.

So people who don't vote as you want them to are 'treacherous cowards'?

No, no. The treacherous cowards comment was reserved for those who voted to cut their fellow Irishmen loose to achieve their own aims. Yep, that was treachery and cowardice.

This is the problem with democracy. When you lose, you have to accept it. Or else you find a way to win the next vote. You could of course try to shoot and bomb your way to what you want. But then you are no better than your oppressors. In fact I think you would be even worse, as you are killing your own.

The anti-treaty people didn't even show up for the next vote, ceremonial as it may have been. But with the original vote so tight, surely it was worth trying to persuade the 4 TDs necessary to reverse their votes?

Oh, the vote was accepted, the blueshirts and the Brits joined forces to make sure of that.  As for the north, feck them, sure we're alright.

Why didn't you fight?

The Anti-Treaty people would surely have joined you. Why didn't they fight in the 6 counties anyway?
MWWSI 2017

Franko

Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 02:28:58 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 02:20:43 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 01:01:56 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:53:42 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:49:31 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:39:54 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:23:33 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:15:46 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:09:19 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 11:03:33 AM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 08:54:55 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on November 21, 2015, 07:15:37 AM
Franko's summary isn't far out at all. Dev made the situation worse by allowing the church have too much influence in everything.

Really?

You are happy to be one of these:

"those treacherous cowards who said 'ya know what, I'm sick of fighting the Brits, let's shaft these poor cnuts in the north and we'll get what we're after'."

Between Fearon's insistence on a homophobic Ireland and the constant abuse from eternal victims like Franko, my head is beginning to question my heart on the issue of a UI.

PS, I'm not sure if you meant it or not but the part in bold is brilliantly ironic.  ;D ;D

Thank you. It was quite deliberate.

And as for the ad hominem, are you also being ironic, unless 'treacherous cowards' was meant as a compliment.  ;D

Yeah, sure it was!  ;)

The treacherous cowards comment obviously doesn't apply to everyone in the 26. There were, after all, a huge portion of decent people who had the backbone and principles to say no to the Brits' plan.  But if the cap fits...

Not everyone?

What is the criteria to be one or the other? Should they have wanted to die for you?

Nope, not die. Just tick a box.

So people who don't vote as you want them to are 'treacherous cowards'?

No, no. The treacherous cowards comment was reserved for those who voted to cut their fellow Irishmen loose to achieve their own aims. Yep, that was treachery and cowardice.

This is the problem with democracy. When you lose, you have to accept it. Or else you find a way to win the next vote. You could of course try to shoot and bomb your way to what you want. But then you are no better than your oppressors. In fact I think you would be even worse, as you are killing your own.

The anti-treaty people didn't even show up for the next vote, ceremonial as it may have been. But with the original vote so tight, surely it was worth trying to persuade the 4 TDs necessary to reverse their votes?

Oh, the vote was accepted, the blueshirts and the Brits joined forces to make sure of that.  As for the north, feck them, sure we're alright.

Why didn't you fight?

The Anti-Treaty people would surely have joined you. Why didn't they fight in the 6 counties anyway?

I thought you weren't allowed to do that?  I though that made you "no better" than the oppressors?

The oppressors who, incidentally, your former comrades had joined forces with to ensure that the vote was embraced by the people.  This was the same empire who had ignored the democratic will of the people a few years previously and you are blustering about how this vote had to be accepted?  An outstanding bit of moral contortionism.

Oblige me here muppet, what way do you think you would have voted?

muppet

Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 02:37:08 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 02:28:58 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 02:20:43 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 01:01:56 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:53:42 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:49:31 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:39:54 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:23:33 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:15:46 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:09:19 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 11:03:33 AM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 08:54:55 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on November 21, 2015, 07:15:37 AM
Franko's summary isn't far out at all. Dev made the situation worse by allowing the church have too much influence in everything.

Really?

You are happy to be one of these:

"those treacherous cowards who said 'ya know what, I'm sick of fighting the Brits, let's shaft these poor cnuts in the north and we'll get what we're after'."

Between Fearon's insistence on a homophobic Ireland and the constant abuse from eternal victims like Franko, my head is beginning to question my heart on the issue of a UI.

PS, I'm not sure if you meant it or not but the part in bold is brilliantly ironic.  ;D ;D

Thank you. It was quite deliberate.

And as for the ad hominem, are you also being ironic, unless 'treacherous cowards' was meant as a compliment.  ;D

Yeah, sure it was!  ;)

The treacherous cowards comment obviously doesn't apply to everyone in the 26. There were, after all, a huge portion of decent people who had the backbone and principles to say no to the Brits' plan.  But if the cap fits...

Not everyone?

What is the criteria to be one or the other? Should they have wanted to die for you?

Nope, not die. Just tick a box.

So people who don't vote as you want them to are 'treacherous cowards'?

No, no. The treacherous cowards comment was reserved for those who voted to cut their fellow Irishmen loose to achieve their own aims. Yep, that was treachery and cowardice.

This is the problem with democracy. When you lose, you have to accept it. Or else you find a way to win the next vote. You could of course try to shoot and bomb your way to what you want. But then you are no better than your oppressors. In fact I think you would be even worse, as you are killing your own.

The anti-treaty people didn't even show up for the next vote, ceremonial as it may have been. But with the original vote so tight, surely it was worth trying to persuade the 4 TDs necessary to reverse their votes?

Oh, the vote was accepted, the blueshirts and the Brits joined forces to make sure of that.  As for the north, feck them, sure we're alright.

Why didn't you fight?

The Anti-Treaty people would surely have joined you. Why didn't they fight in the 6 counties anyway?

I thought you weren't allowed to do that?  I though that made you "no better" than the oppressors?

The oppressors who, incidentally, your former comrades had joined forces with to ensure that the vote was embraced by the people.  This was the same empire who had ignored the democratic will of the people a few years previously and you are blustering about how this vote had to be accepted?  An outstanding bit of moral contortionism.

Oblige me here muppet, what way do you think you would have voted?

I am asking you, the one who bravely calls dead people treacherous cowards, why your people didn't fight?

But I am glad you agree with me that Irish killing Irish are no better than Brits killing Irish. And possibly worse.


As for the vote, today, knowing what I know, I would have voted no. But who knows how I would have voted then.

I would probably have been struggling to survive in the poorest part of the poorest country in Ireland. I would have hated the country that put me in that situation, but the thought of going off any dying for people who might call me a treacherous coward, probably wouldn't have appealed to me much. I might have thought of emigrating to get the feck out of the place. Just like around half of my ancestors who had come west to escape the crap in Ulster. Of course it is easy to forget any of the context today.

MWWSI 2017

Franko

Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 02:54:34 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 02:37:08 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 02:28:58 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 02:20:43 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 01:01:56 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:53:42 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:49:31 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:39:54 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:23:33 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 12:15:46 PM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 12:09:19 PM
Quote from: Franko on November 21, 2015, 11:03:33 AM
Quote from: muppet on November 21, 2015, 08:54:55 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on November 21, 2015, 07:15:37 AM
Franko's summary isn't far out at all. Dev made the situation worse by allowing the church have too much influence in everything.

Really?

You are happy to be one of these:

"those treacherous cowards who said 'ya know what, I'm sick of fighting the Brits, let's shaft these poor cnuts in the north and we'll get what we're after'."

Between Fearon's insistence on a homophobic Ireland and the constant abuse from eternal victims like Franko, my head is beginning to question my heart on the issue of a UI.

PS, I'm not sure if you meant it or not but the part in bold is brilliantly ironic.  ;D ;D

Thank you. It was quite deliberate.

And as for the ad hominem, are you also being ironic, unless 'treacherous cowards' was meant as a compliment.  ;D

Yeah, sure it was!  ;)

The treacherous cowards comment obviously doesn't apply to everyone in the 26. There were, after all, a huge portion of decent people who had the backbone and principles to say no to the Brits' plan.  But if the cap fits...

Not everyone?

What is the criteria to be one or the other? Should they have wanted to die for you?

Nope, not die. Just tick a box.

So people who don't vote as you want them to are 'treacherous cowards'?

No, no. The treacherous cowards comment was reserved for those who voted to cut their fellow Irishmen loose to achieve their own aims. Yep, that was treachery and cowardice.

This is the problem with democracy. When you lose, you have to accept it. Or else you find a way to win the next vote. You could of course try to shoot and bomb your way to what you want. But then you are no better than your oppressors. In fact I think you would be even worse, as you are killing your own.

The anti-treaty people didn't even show up for the next vote, ceremonial as it may have been. But with the original vote so tight, surely it was worth trying to persuade the 4 TDs necessary to reverse their votes?

Oh, the vote was accepted, the blueshirts and the Brits joined forces to make sure of that.  As for the north, feck them, sure we're alright.

Why didn't you fight?

The Anti-Treaty people would surely have joined you. Why didn't they fight in the 6 counties anyway?

I thought you weren't allowed to do that?  I though that made you "no better" than the oppressors?

The oppressors who, incidentally, your former comrades had joined forces with to ensure that the vote was embraced by the people.  This was the same empire who had ignored the democratic will of the people a few years previously and you are blustering about how this vote had to be accepted?  An outstanding bit of moral contortionism.

Oblige me here muppet, what way do you think you would have voted?

I am asking you, the one who bravely calls dead people treacherous cowards, why your people didn't fight?

But I am glad you agree with me that Irish killing Irish are no better than Brits killing Irish. And possibly worse.


As for the vote, today, knowing what I know, I would have voted no. But who knows how I would have voted then.

I would probably have been struggling to survive in the poorest part of the poorest country in Ireland. I would have hated the country that put me in that situation, but the thought of going off any dying for people who might call me a treacherous coward, probably wouldn't have appealed to me much. I might have thought of emigrating to get the feck out of the place. Just like around half of my ancestors who had come west to escape the crap in Ulster. Of course it is easy to forget any of the context today.

You must think you know me muppet?  I don't believe we've been introduced.  I'm not going to start detailing the actions of my people on this board, but what I will say is that, unlike a lot, I'd be proud of the way they behaved.  And you can throw out whatever mumbling platitiudes you like about 'dead people', I stand by my comments.

And again, nobody asked you to go off and die.  All was asked was that you didn't vote to split your country.

muppet

And again, nobody asked you to go off and die.  All was asked was that you didn't vote to split your country.

If all that was asked, as you put it, was simply ' Just tick a box', one or the other presumably, then how could you be a 'treacherous coward'?

If ticking one box meant more war, then no matter you viewed it, it was hardly as simple as 'Just tick a box', was it?

Why always the over-simplification on one hand when it suits, and the hyperbole, 'treacherous cowards' on the other, again when it suits? It sounds like Paisleyite rhetoric that isn't supposed to be questioned, just followed.

MWWSI 2017

seafoid

I was in Belfast a while ago on the Falls and was looking at an IRA memorial with the names of dead IRA wallahs and the dates went from the early twenties via the odd one in between to another big contingent starting 1969. And what was striking was the ones who died in the early 20s, for a hopeless cause given the decisions made in London and accepted in Dublin. 
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU