Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.

[LeoMc]

It's hard to know where to start answering some of the points made, but in no particular order:
Slab Murphy has been found guilty of tax evasion and must pay the price imo. Adams and McGuinness are entitled to laude his contribution to the peace process but that does not take away from his illegal activity. They would be best to say nothing again imo.
I never fail to be taken aback by the hypocrisy of some posters who view the IRA campaign of the '70's and '80's as some how different from the activities of the old IRA in the early years of the last century. There is no difference. Catholics were discriminated against in the North, left in poverty denied houses and jobs some took up protest and were brutalised by the Unionist Government and the RUC some took up arms. Now you can debate the rights and wrongs of this situation but if you do so you must apply some balance. Rossfan's arguments are lost in the vehemence of his totally anti SF agenda and whitewashing of history. As with all conflicts bad things were done and not just by the Provos and not just in the '70's and '80's. I recommend you read Bonfires on the Hillsides by the late James Kelly, it will open some eyes here that are welded shut. If Slab rightly goes down so to must the assorted bankers and charlatans who collapsed the Irish economy with there brown bags and gombeenism.

Anybody want to outline Slab's contribution to the peace process?

I think it was covered here already. He took over as head of PIRA Army council at at the time of the RIRA breakaway and managed to keep South Armagh on board with the ceasefire. A not inconsiderable achievement, though it does not excuse racketeering.

[smelmoth]

My opinion and that of anyone I've spoken to about it this week.

We all have opinions. However if you want to look at the evidence, they got 10% in the last election in the south, 6% in the election before that and will probably get 15-16% in the next election. That decent growth is happening all around the country in area where SF have no real foundations or presence while constantly under attack from what passes as MSM in the south. Those aren't opinions they're the facts of SF progression in the south under Adams. They point to him doing a good job and there's no evidence that I can see of them doing better under anyone else. For example, how would Pearse or Mary Lou taking over affect the Party support in the north or have you factored that into your considerations?

SF will be fine in the next election and will double their seats I think.

They want to beat Ff and effectively lead the opposition.  That is fine and dandy.  Then what ?? More populist promises and maybe government . 

Then what   Then they will realise you will have to call in the promises .  This means the next election will be carnage .

Maybe they will enforce change. Maybe the first thing they will do if they got into power is to drastically reduce the salaries and expenses of TDs and cap what they can earn and claim.

Will go down well the public for a week or two. That's hardly going to result in a budget surplus though!
A few hundred grand is meaningless in the overall economy.
Maybe the change they will enforce will be to disband the special criminal court? Then perhaps give special status to 'volunteers' so they can't be prosecuted for any misdemeanour's due to their service history?

Leaders lead by example and the first place they should look to reform is TDs and their extortionate salaries and expenses. Irish TDs are some of the highest paid politicians in the world and earn more than their equivalents from the biggest economies in the world. It's something they refuse to tackle.

Maybe the Blueshirts will come out and aplogise for Ballyseedy? Maybe Fianna Fail will come out and apologise for their brutal executions of Republicans?

To my mind you can portray those 'volunteers' whatever way you want, but they were willing to risk their lives, be it in prison, in a coffin or on the run for reform in the society they believe badly necessitated reform. The TDs from the big parties are the most cynical greedy and immoral people in the country. Could you imagine asking that vile, heinous simpleton Kenny to give something up for what he believed to be the good of society?

I Son't have to portray the "Volunteers" any particular way. I grew up with and live among them. Blackguards with high propensity for crimiality (and invariably the sort of criminality that lined their own pockets) is what I witessed throughout the 70s, 80s and 90s. They also had a appetite for hatred but minimal interest i politic (still less an understanding of polotics). Simplistic political sloguneerig was a means of gettig eyes to turn the other way.

This is not to deny unionist mis-rule and a discriminatory regime. It also does not deny the existence of some volunteers who were motivated by a deep love of their country

[smelmoth]

It's like Christmas advertising.

People will say SF have gone too far this time. They'll never recover from this.

They always come out smelling of roses in terms of support.

You are spot on ,  the SF vote in next Southern election won't care a great deal about the current furore.

But what is "the SF vote"? Is it the vote they have, or the vote they want?

On the moey there.

SF cannot wi electoral gains but just appealing to the voter they already have.

2016 is a huge electoral test for the shinners. There is a mass movement in europe away from established parties. I electoral terms SF still have that newness about them. There is a movement to the left. SF expouse that. There is a move to anti-establishment parties. SF have that. There is an anti-ferderal move. SF have that. Every motive force is in their directio. Any short of a landshift in their direction and they will have under-performed against their direct comparitors. If that happens then we can discuss what might be wrong with brand SF

[smelmoth]

My opinion and that of anyone I've spoken to about it this week.

We all have opinions. However if you want to look at the evidence, they got 10% in the last election in the south, 6% in the election before that and will probably get 15-16% in the next election. That decent growth is happening all around the country in area where SF have no real foundations or presence while constantly under attack from what passes as MSM in the south. Those aren't opinions they're the facts of SF progression in the south under Adams. They point to him doing a good job and there's no evidence that I can see of them doing better under anyone else. For example, how would Pearse or Mary Lou taking over affect the Party support in the north or have you factored that into your considerations?

SF will be fine in the next election and will double their seats I think.

They want to beat Ff and effectively lead the opposition.  That is fine and dandy.  Then what ?? More populist promises and maybe government . 

Then what   Then they will realise you will have to call in the promises .  This means the next election will be carnage .

Maybe they will enforce change. Maybe the first thing they will do if they got into power is to drastically reduce the salaries and expenses of TDs and cap what they can earn and claim.

Yes, because it's not like they accepted an increase in MLA pay in the current Assembly term, paid their Special Advisors more than a TD salary, or were exposed on expenses... oh, wait...

These are all important issues and in recognition of that SF wll have set out their position on them somewhere? Possibly a time capsule. Hopefully they can remember who have buried it.

[smelmoth]

It's hard to know where to start answering some of the points made, but in no particular order:
Slab Murphy has been found guilty of tax evasion and must pay the price imo. Adams and McGuinness are entitled to laude his contribution to the peace process but that does not take away from his illegal activity. They would be best to say nothing again imo.
I never fail to be taken aback by the hypocrisy of some posters who view the IRA campaign of the '70's and '80's as some how different from the activities of the old IRA in the early years of the last century. There is no difference. Catholics were discriminated against in the North, left in poverty denied houses and jobs some took up protest and were brutalised by the Unionist Government and the RUC some took up arms. Now you can debate the rights and wrongs of this situation but if you do so you must apply some balance. Rossfan's arguments are lost in the vehemence of his totally anti SF agenda and whitewashing of history. As with all conflicts bad things were done and not just by the Provos and not just in the '70's and '80's. I recommend you read Bonfires on the Hillsides by the late James Kelly, it will open some eyes here that are welded shut. If Slab rightly goes down so to must the assorted bankers and charlatans who collapsed the Irish economy with there brown bags and gombeenism.

Anybody want to outline Slab's contribution to the peace process?

I think it was covered here already. He took over as head of PIRA Army council at at the time of the RIRA breakaway and managed to keep South Armagh on board with the ceasefire. A not inconsiderable achievement, though it does not excuse racketeering.

Phew. For a moment I though he was some terrorist involve in murders. I now see he is mediator and post conflict guru.

He is a nasty shit. Prision is the place for him.

[johnneycool]

It's hard to know where to start answering some of the points made, but in no particular order:
Slab Murphy has been found guilty of tax evasion and must pay the price imo. Adams and McGuinness are entitled to laude his contribution to the peace process but that does not take away from his illegal activity. They would be best to say nothing again imo.
I never fail to be taken aback by the hypocrisy of some posters who view the IRA campaign of the '70's and '80's as some how different from the activities of the old IRA in the early years of the last century. There is no difference. Catholics were discriminated against in the North, left in poverty denied houses and jobs some took up protest and were brutalised by the Unionist Government and the RUC some took up arms. Now you can debate the rights and wrongs of this situation but if you do so you must apply some balance. Rossfan's arguments are lost in the vehemence of his totally anti SF agenda and whitewashing of history. As with all conflicts bad things were done and not just by the Provos and not just in the '70's and '80's. I recommend you read Bonfires on the Hillsides by the late James Kelly, it will open some eyes here that are welded shut. If Slab rightly goes down so to must the assorted bankers and charlatans who collapsed the Irish economy with there brown bags and gombeenism.

Anybody want to outline Slab's contribution to the peace process?

I think it was covered here already. He took over as head of PIRA Army council at at the time of the RIRA breakaway and managed to keep South Armagh on board with the ceasefire. A not inconsiderable achievement, though it does not excuse racketeering.

Phew. For a moment I though he was some terrorist involve in murders. I now see he is mediator and post conflict guru.

He is a nasty shit. Prision is the place for him.

Who is he accused of murdering?

[smelmoth]

It's hard to know where to start answering some of the points made, but in no particular order:
Slab Murphy has been found guilty of tax evasion and must pay the price imo. Adams and McGuinness are entitled to laude his contribution to the peace process but that does not take away from his illegal activity. They would be best to say nothing again imo.
I never fail to be taken aback by the hypocrisy of some posters who view the IRA campaign of the '70's and '80's as some how different from the activities of the old IRA in the early years of the last century. There is no difference. Catholics were discriminated against in the North, left in poverty denied houses and jobs some took up protest and were brutalised by the Unionist Government and the RUC some took up arms. Now you can debate the rights and wrongs of this situation but if you do so you must apply some balance. Rossfan's arguments are lost in the vehemence of his totally anti SF agenda and whitewashing of history. As with all conflicts bad things were done and not just by the Provos and not just in the '70's and '80's. I recommend you read Bonfires on the Hillsides by the late James Kelly, it will open some eyes here that are welded shut. If Slab rightly goes down so to must the assorted bankers and charlatans who collapsed the Irish economy with there brown bags and gombeenism.

Anybody want to outline Slab's contribution to the peace process?

I think it was covered here already. He took over as head of PIRA Army council at at the time of the RIRA breakaway and managed to keep South Armagh on board with the ceasefire. A not inconsiderable achievement, though it does not excuse racketeering.

Phew. For a moment I though he was some terrorist involve in murders. I now see he is mediator and post conflict guru.

He is a nasty shit. Prision is the place for him.

Who is he accused of murdering?

Who has accused him of murdering people?

[heffo]

It's hard to know where to start answering some of the points made, but in no particular order:
Slab Murphy has been found guilty of tax evasion and must pay the price imo. Adams and McGuinness are entitled to laude his contribution to the peace process but that does not take away from his illegal activity. They would be best to say nothing again imo.
I never fail to be taken aback by the hypocrisy of some posters who view the IRA campaign of the '70's and '80's as some how different from the activities of the old IRA in the early years of the last century. There is no difference. Catholics were discriminated against in the North, left in poverty denied houses and jobs some took up protest and were brutalised by the Unionist Government and the RUC some took up arms. Now you can debate the rights and wrongs of this situation but if you do so you must apply some balance. Rossfan's arguments are lost in the vehemence of his totally anti SF agenda and whitewashing of history. As with all conflicts bad things were done and not just by the Provos and not just in the '70's and '80's. I recommend you read Bonfires on the Hillsides by the late James Kelly, it will open some eyes here that are welded shut. If Slab rightly goes down so to must the assorted bankers and charlatans who collapsed the Irish economy with there brown bags and gombeenism.

Anybody want to outline Slab's contribution to the peace process?

I think it was covered here already. He took over as head of PIRA Army council at at the time of the RIRA breakaway and managed to keep South Armagh on board with the ceasefire. A not inconsiderable achievement, though it does not excuse racketeering.

Phew. For a moment I though he was some terrorist involve in murders. I now see he is mediator and post conflict guru.

He is a nasty shit. Prision is the place for him.

Who is he accused of murdering?

Who has accused him of murdering people?

Testimony was heard during his trial that he decided who lived and died in the border region.

As alleged IRA chief of staff, those who crossed the IRA in the region didn't fair out too well - just ask Paul Quinn or Eamonn Collins

[heffo]

This exchange between John Mooney & Adams has to be fake

http://www.thejournal.ie/gerry-adams-slab-murphy-3-2516145-Dec2015/

[give her dixie]

SF MLA faces big bill after admitting libelling UUP MP

A Sinn Fein MLA has admitted that he seriously libelled an Ulster Unionist MP by wrongly claiming that he had shot people - and now the Sinn Fein man potentially faces an enormous legal bill.

Fermanagh and South Tyrone MLA Phil Flanagan made the comments on Twitter on May 1, 2014 in relation to former Ulster Unionist leader Tom Elliott

Today the matter was heard at the High Court in Belfast.

The defamatory tweet, which was read out in court this morning, said: "Tom Elliott speaks to Stephen Nolan about the past. I wonder if he will reveal how many people he harassed or shot as a member of the UDR."

Mr Elliott, who is now the MP for Fermanagh and South Tyrone, immediately got his solicitor to write to Mr Flanagan and then began legal proceedings.

After a delay in which Mr Flanagan made no substantive response, his lawyers eventually replied to accept that his tweet had been defamatory.

They admitted that the allegation had been "wholly without foundation" and "untrue". He has agreed to pay compensation, which will be set by the judge.

Both Mr Elliott and Mr Flanagan were in court this morning and Mr Elliott gave evidence that he believed the tweet endangered his life by making him more of a target for dissident republicans.

It also emerged in court that Mr Flanagan - who was deselected by Sinn Fein last month and so will end his term as an MLA in May - had hoped to avail of taxpayer-funded insurance which indemnifies MLAs from actions arising from defamatory comments which they make.

However, the insurer has refused - for reasons which were not made clear in court - to pay for his case.

Mr Flanagan is now suing the insurer in a separate case which has yet to come to court.

As things stand, he will have to pay compensation to Mr Elliott as well as the legal costs for both sides of the action.

http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/northern-ireland-news/sf-mla-faces-big-bill-after-admitting-libelling-uup-mp-1-7151520

[Saffrongael]

Flanagan never gets fed up making a dick of himself

[Tony Baloney]

The guy is a liability so no wonder he's headed for the Broom cupboard.

[LeoMc]

It's hard to know where to start answering some of the points made, but in no particular order:
Slab Murphy has been found guilty of tax evasion and must pay the price imo. Adams and McGuinness are entitled to laude his contribution to the peace process but that does not take away from his illegal activity. They would be best to say nothing again imo.
I never fail to be taken aback by the hypocrisy of some posters who view the IRA campaign of the '70's and '80's as some how different from the activities of the old IRA in the early years of the last century. There is no difference. Catholics were discriminated against in the North, left in poverty denied houses and jobs some took up protest and were brutalised by the Unionist Government and the RUC some took up arms. Now you can debate the rights and wrongs of this situation but if you do so you must apply some balance. Rossfan's arguments are lost in the vehemence of his totally anti SF agenda and whitewashing of history. As with all conflicts bad things were done and not just by the Provos and not just in the '70's and '80's. I recommend you read Bonfires on the Hillsides by the late James Kelly, it will open some eyes here that are welded shut. If Slab rightly goes down so to must the assorted bankers and charlatans who collapsed the Irish economy with there brown bags and gombeenism.

Anybody want to outline Slab's contribution to the peace process?

I think it was covered here already. He took over as head of PIRA Army council at at the time of the RIRA breakaway and managed to keep South Armagh on board with the ceasefire. A not inconsiderable achievement, though it does not excuse racketeering.

Phew. For a moment I though he was some terrorist involve in murders. I now see he is mediator and post conflict guru.

He is a nasty shit. Prision is the place for him.

Who is he accused of murdering?

Who has accused him of murdering people?

Testimony was heard during his trial that he decided who lived and died in the border region.

As alleged IRA chief of staff, those who crossed the IRA in the region didn't fair out too well - just ask Paul Quinn or Eamonn Collins

Not sure alleged is required there. He had the power to ensure a lot of hawks toed the line.

[Hardy]

Ger Canning's done well to survive 25 posts.

Here y'are, Ger.

[Rossfan]

Is Ger a Shinner?
Explains a lot.....