Antrim Hurling

[glensgael]

Look no one is denyimg the pitch was soft as you've stated on a few posts the match was stopped on 7 occasions and probably isn't acceptable but my first point is if Antrim aren't prepared to invest in the infrastructure they just have to make do. Maybe they'll find a spare £100k this season and get changing rooms at Dunsilly.

With reference to management decisions there are two things, 1. In the first half of the match why did Antrim play a sweeper when Chrissy was able to puck the ball into the forward line. 2. We seem to be playing players who are backs for their clubs in the forward line and leaving forwards on the bench

Everyone has different opinions and the above is mine, it would be boring if everyone just nodded their head and agreed with everyone else.

[theskull1]

Stating the obvious.....Its one thing having good pitche(s) and facilities. You also need an ability for a decent crowd  to watch the game as well as have good parking arrangements and access to the ground. Doesn't Dunsilly fail on all of those? Its a training facility only isnt it? ...and will never be suitable for official senior county games?

[Na Glinntí Glasa]

The reality is quiet simple. Antrim have three new pitches at Dunsilly and cannot use them because they have no welfare facilities yet. Last season Antrin increased their team expenditure by £100k due to managers wanting larger panels, I'm no architect but surely £100k could build four changing rooms and a meeting room rather than the ludicrous £1.2m Antrim say they need even if it's to get Dunsilly up and running.. Until such times as Antrim and Ulster council extract the digit and get the Casement disaster sorted Antrim have to go to club grounds to play their matches. Antrim do not contribute towards the clubs hosting the county games or days they train on them which in my opinion is a disgrace. I'm sure the groundmen in Ballycastle did not like to see their pitches cut up ( warm up done on the second pitch) but at the end of the day both teams had to play on it.

If Kevin Ryan is trying to blame a pitch he needs a reality check, the reason Antrim are competing and then falling away in the last quarter of matches is down to poor decision making from the sideline.

i am an architect and £100k wouldnt build you half of what you have listed there. Im currently regenerating an existing public structure and at £1.5 million were falling short of what needs done.

The amount of cash needed to get everything done at dunsilly is realistic, sad thing is that the entrance bridge under the railway will cost the same again!

Went to the game on sunday and at half time i thought we had matched them pretty well. They tackled and harashed limerick and never gave them a snuff on goal. I was worried that we had put serious effort in that half and couldnt maintain it in the second.

I didnt like being right but after we scored the goal it kicked Limerick into life and they never looked like losing after they went in front.

Our forwards didnt do enough to win the ball. it was turned over far too easily and the number of balls wasted by either dropping short or wide was poor.

Also our half fowards let limericks half backs get involved with the play too much. they were pushing up and providing an outlet for a pass and we never cut it out.

Disappointing but were slowly getting there. It looks like its the usual of having to try and beat Laois and Offaly again this season!

[hurlingstick]

Great to see a variety of opinions on here and being done in a respectful manner. Feeling positive about the season. Limerick are one of the best teams in Ireland and we matched them right up to the 45th minute.

[All seeing I]

Great to see a variety of opinions on here and being done in a respectful manner. Feeling positive about the season. Limerick are one of the best teams in Ireland and we matched them right up to the 45th minute.

Agreed - and some positivity too!!
Some facts to keep in mind before waffling about the calibre of our players.
Limerick : 2013 Munster champions. All Ireland Semi Finalists - beaten by AI Champions Clare by 7 points.
Limerick : 2014 Munster finalists. All Ireland Semi Finalists - beaten by AI Champions Kilkenny by two points.

[north_antrim_hound]

Agreed DR they did seem to go up a gear when we got the goal
Tiredness did play a part in Limerick enjoying more space to take scores and maybe fatuige played its part on the sloppy fowling last  third
Add up our wides and shorts balls In the first half, the frees conceded in the second half and the loss of one of our most effective players
Limerick tanked us last year and got out with an 8 point win this year

I know no one likes to hear the progress word but they do seem to be running good teams closer
Maybe the conditions evened things up its hard to say
I stylish hard to mark ball wining forward woukd be some addition like what danny Sutcliffe is doing for Dublin

[btdtgtt]

Great to see a variety of opinions on here and being done in a respectful manner. Feeling positive about the season. Limerick are one of the best teams in Ireland and we matched them right up to the 45th minute.

Agreed - and some positivity too!!
Some facts to keep in mind before waffling about the calibre of our players.
Limerick : 2013 Munster champions. All Ireland Semi Finalists - beaten by AI Champions Clare by 7 points.
Limerick : 2014 Munster finalists. All Ireland Semi Finalists - beaten by AI Champions Kilkenny by two points.

I prefer to call this devil's advocate rather than being negative - postivity for the sake of it is basically propaganda.
The fact is that playing Limerick in Ballycastle in February is just not comparable to Thurles in July. That's the same for all counties. The old league is league and championship is championship.
Much less the issue that we were still beaten off the park in the last quarter of the game.
Particularly when many of their top players are absent while preparing for Ballyhale.

Thats said - wins against Laois & Offaly should regain our Division 2 status - and we should accpt we've quite simply got no place in Division 1. I'm fine with that - not a criticism. Division 2 survival and a few wins is not a negative for me at all.
In terms of championship when the the real judgement comes - I would love to see us pick up a scalp there rather than the annual procession of results against the same teams.

[north_antrim_hound]

Great to see a variety of opinions on here and being done in a respectful manner. Feeling positive about the season. Limerick are one of the best teams in Ireland and we matched them right up to the 45th minute.

Agreed - and some positivity too!!
Some facts to keep in mind before waffling about the calibre of our players.
Limerick : 2013 Munster champions. All Ireland Semi Finalists - beaten by AI Champions Clare by 7 points.
Limerick : 2014 Munster finalists. All Ireland Semi Finalists - beaten by AI Champions Kilkenny by two points.

I prefer to call this devil's advocate rather than being negative - postivity for the sake of it is basically propaganda.
The fact is that playing Limerick in Ballycastle in February is just not comparable to Thurles in July. That's the same for all counties. The old league is league and championship is championship.
Much less the issue that we were still beaten off the park in the last quarter of the game.
Particularly when many of their top players are absent while preparing for Ballyhale.

Thats said - wins against Laois & Offaly should regain our Division 2 status - and we should accpt we've quite simply got no place in Division 1. I'm fine with that - not a criticism. Division 2 survival and a few wins is not a negative for me at all.
In terms of championship when the the real judgement comes - I would love to see us pick up a scalp there rather than the annual procession of results against the same teams.

It's not called division 2 but division 1b
We are are playing some of the best teams in the country
Clare plied there trade there the year they won the all Ireland and the team they beat played in it last year. Limerick are in it and beat tipp in Munster last year and ran kilkenny to 2 points in the semi
If we are capable of finishing In the top three of 1b then I see no reason to fear anyone

[theskull1]

I prefer to call this devil's advocate rather than being negative - postivity for the sake of it is basically propaganda.
The fact is that playing Limerick in Ballycastle in February is just not comparable to Thurles in July. That's the same for all counties. The old league is league and championship is championship.
Much less the issue that we were still beaten off the park in the last quarter of the game.
Particularly when many of their top players are absent while preparing for Ballyhale.

Thats said - wins against Laois & Offaly should regain our Division 2 status - and we should accpt we've quite simply got no place in Division 1. I'm fine with that - not a criticism. Division 2 survival and a few wins is not a negative for me at all.
In terms of championship when the the real judgement comes - I would love to see us pick up a scalp there rather than the annual procession of results against the same teams.

Some guidance for you btdtgtt if you want to play the role
http://changeyourteam.com/devils-advocate/

[btdtgtt]

I prefer to call this devil's advocate rather than being negative - postivity for the sake of it is basically propaganda.
The fact is that playing Limerick in Ballycastle in February is just not comparable to Thurles in July. That's the same for all counties. The old league is league and championship is championship.
Much less the issue that we were still beaten off the park in the last quarter of the game.
Particularly when many of their top players are absent while preparing for Ballyhale.

Thats said - wins against Laois & Offaly should regain our Division 2 status - and we should accpt we've quite simply got no place in Division 1. I'm fine with that - not a criticism. Division 2 survival and a few wins is not a negative for me at all.
In terms of championship when the the real judgement comes - I would love to see us pick up a scalp there rather than the annual procession of results against the same teams.

Some guidance for you btdtgtt if you want to play the role
http://changeyourteam.com/devils-advocate/

Very Good skull
The points outlined by NAH prove my point - when we start returning those results in Championship like other teams - then I will be happier.

At the minute I see an 8 point loss at home in the second tier, to a weakened side.
And that's just a fact. The bookies gave us a 5 point handicap - and Limerick beat that!
Being optimistic for the sake of it won't change that!

But again, I'm not being negative, maybe realistic sounds better than devil's advocate if you like!

Onwards to the next games(s) and let's hope for win(s)!
A stong standing to bring us in to when it matters in the Summer.

[All seeing I]

Great to see a variety of opinions on here and being done in a respectful manner. Feeling positive about the season. Limerick are one of the best teams in Ireland and we matched them right up to the 45th minute.

Agreed - and some positivity too!!
Some facts to keep in mind before waffling about the calibre of our players.
Limerick : 2013 Munster champions. All Ireland Semi Finalists - beaten by AI Champions Clare by 7 points.
Limerick : 2014 Munster finalists. All Ireland Semi Finalists - beaten by AI Champions Kilkenny by two points.

I prefer to call this devil's advocate rather than being negative - postivity for the sake of it is basically propaganda.
The fact is that playing Limerick in Ballycastle in February is just not comparable to Thurles in July. That's the same for all counties. The old league is league and championship is championship.
Much less the issue that we were still beaten off the park in the last quarter of the game.
Particularly when many of their top players are absent while preparing for Ballyhale.

Thats said - wins against Laois & Offaly should regain our Division 2 status - and we should accpt we've quite simply got no place in Division 1. I'm fine with that - not a criticism. Division 2 survival and a few wins is not a negative for me at all.
In terms of championship when the the real judgement comes - I would love to see us pick up a scalp there rather than the annual procession of results against the same teams.

Propaganda is info of a biased or misleading nature being used to promote a cause. I gave you facts about Limerick and to be honest, i really wouldnt be too fussed about promoting the Limerick cause.
Those facts show just where Limerick hurling is at present.
I have used these facts to maybe shed some light on how Antrim are fairing in Division 1B. A one point loss in Wexford Park and toe to toe with Limerick for 60 mins.
What has Thurles in July got to do with this arguement? Both teams had to play in Ballycastle yesterday! And given this new brand of Antrim hurler, Antrim were probably at a greater disadvantage than Limerick yesterday! That's a very old arguement. About as old as league is league and championship is championship. Do you think Antrim will still only be a league side come championship this year?
"Many of their top players were missing" - How many were they missing from Kilmallock?

Limerick only pulled away when Antrim lost their midfield pairing who, to that point, were dominating their opposite numbers. Add that to the fact that at least two Antrim sure starters were on the line yesterday with injuries. Two men who would make a massive difference. When it came to the crunch - both panels were SLIGHTLY depleted yesterday.

I've got a bit carried away on this one, apologies. We've become too accustomed to progressive debates of late. I just wouldnt want to slip back into the dark ways - like the southern managers and their "keep up the good work up there" sh!te.

You're 100% right though about the championship. That is where we all want to see the big win!! I hope we do get one. But for now - if we win our last three games we'll definitely make the league knock out stages and not just be seen as survivalists!
Wouldn't that be a great basis to launch your championship campaign??

[north_antrim_hound]

Dublin  beat us by ten in the walsh cup
They just chinned kilkenny yesterday by 5
We are no world beaters I know but things are better
There's an argument fir both sides here
If someone said we matched them for 40 odd minutes but tired in the last third you coulnt argue
Or you could say we hung on to their coat tales for a while before they broke free that holds some water as well
KR said he is not interested in moral victories and wants some points
Straight talking and long overdue
If that mindset exist in the camp and they keep working on the stuff they failed at yesterday then what else can you ask for
and we do need to start making a jump in our standards from leauge to championship like the big guns do

[theskull1]

When you're building from a relatively low base, you look for positives that are there and see if you can build on them. Positives exist

Antrim fought toe to toe with Limerick for 45 minutes. They should take massive heart from that and see if they can work on sustaining that belief for longer. Its obvious to me that, mentally we're just not at the point YET where we've 15 harden up players who got the ego to feel we're good enough to beat these team. Alot of the wides and fluffed shots came from that mindset. I could be wrong.  Rather than Limerick up their game, I thought we dropped our workrate and collective organisation and Limerick stood on our throat when the gaps opened up. If we'd have kept up the demeanor from the first half Limerick would've had plenty to worry about. 

[All seeing I]

Brilliant points Skull + NAH. I have wondered for years what could be done to address a lack of mental steel. I have believed for a long time it's part of the problem. A major part. I hope these group of players can see the progress being mad and how far they've come. That'll feed into our minors, u16s, 14s, 12s etc.
It's nice to be in a place where we know that, finally, every time we go to watch our county play we are guaranteed to get a performance and be in with a shout, no matter who we play!

[Na Glinntí Glasa]

devloping a strong winning mentality is so important. As a player you dont believe you can get beat and the players around all believe it you are hard to beat or put away.

Aaron Graffins miss was a bad one at an important time of the game, had it one over maybe we would have hung in their a bit more in the game. We had one shot on goal on game also which was disappointing.

The full forward line didnt get into the game and was highlighted with matty and PJ coming off. They couldnt get going at all.