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This entire thread was a Trojan horse advanced to get us to the basic equation - homosexuality = paedophilia.

Which is an atrocious, bigoted, not to mention factually discredited argument.

Ireland becomes more and more like the USA every day, and I'm not talking about gay marriage or increasing liberalisation. I'm talking about right wing nuts, terrified about a perceived shift in power and doing everything in their power to demonise their "opponents".

Iceman, if you worry about the world your children are going to grow up in, how about working towards a world governed by Jesus' own precepts - love your neighbour as you would yourself and judge not lest ye be judged.

You can't go wrong with those.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qh2sWSVRrmo

Lord spare us from moral panics!

Lads, if you look hard enough you'll find something that'll convince you that the world is coming to an end. No problem with that in itself, but please try and realise that every generation since Eve was in the Garden has had their own chicken lickens, crying that the sky is coming down.

It's a bit much to worry about the decline and collapse of civilisation because of Facebook's gender policy, at the same time as we are seeing real climate change and weather disasters, an apparent resumption of the Cold War (with an option for hot, if needed), and income inequality not seen since the end of the 19th century.

These are real problems for people of all genders.

and BTW if you're interested in the subject, Jeffrey Eugenides book "Middlesex" is absolutely brilliant, one the best reads of the past ten years IMHO

Inuits have 50 words for snow - but it's still cold, tricky to walk on and good for making snow men. There might be 51 genders but we all still bleed red, think we're right when we're wrong and have the capacity to surprise ourselves when we least thought we could. Here's to humans, the virus with shoes (copy right the late lamented Bill Hicks)

Only getting that now SS

Thanks muppet - well worth reading - it looks like, at the very least, a terrible culture of complacency and cover-up in the Guards.

Basic misconception on what tolerance is - you do not believe in abortion, you are entitled to live your life that way, ask your family to do the same, try to influence your friends etc. What you are not allowed to do is limit anyone elses right to live to different values.

I grant you that abortion is more complex, given that the traditional religious belief is that the feotus is a viable life fro  conception and by limiting abortion you are upholding the basic right to life of that foetus.

But the last I heard, in the Republic abortion is not freely available, as it is the democratic will of the people to have limited access to it, and the people have been asked on numerous occasions. As for NI, if you disagree with the staus quo, you have the democratic right to work for change. That does not entitle you to block clinics, threaten medical staff or in the most extreme cases in America, kill doctors.

The attitude you display in your posts is one of persecution - which as i said above is a classic conservative trick - you are (I assume) a heterosexual Catholic, who is free to practice his religion, free to marry whatever woman you wish, free to adopt children if you wish. free to send them to a school with a religous ethos if you wish, free to hold hands on a night out with the person you love without wondering if someone is going to smash your head in because of it.

Perhaps when we've finished getting justice for people who truly need it in our society, we can look at the needs of people whose idea of discrimination is not being free to discriminate.

He also directed Groundhog Day - brilliant film.

[thinking]

You have the right to practice your religious beliefs in whatever way they dictate,as long as those practices do not infringe the basic human rights of other members of society. So you can work in the local shop all day, thinking that you disapprove of the gay couple up the road as much as you want. However, the minute you try to implement your beliefs by refusing to serve them because of their lifestyle, you have violated the the social contact that binds us all as citizens in a modern democracy, and you lose my support immediately.

On the other hand, if you truly tolerated them (look up the definiton - to permit without repugnance was one good one) then you wouldn't be bothered either way, and you also wouldn't ask the following

I have not oppressed or discriminated against anyone. Would you stand up for discrimination against me and my religious beliefs and the right to practice them?

So in a country that is still overwhelmingly Christian/Catholic, you're asking who will defend your Catholic/Christian view? Classic conservative three card trick.

Unfortunately, it is not only a question of economic ideologies. To take the Irish example, some really think they are Russian and some have lost any real sense of being different from Russians as we have west British people here. Also some of those who do not want to be Russian do not necessarily oppose government control of the economy, so like Sinn Féin many of those who want independence haven't the economic policies to make it work.

Which is why the useful fudge of a pan-European identity is the best thing for the situation. We slag off the EU all the time, and with good reason at times, but its basic function was to create a continental entity which we could all own, and in doing so, avoid the bloodbaths of the two world wars.

Ukraine, like Poland is one of those terribly unfortunate countries, fated by geography to be a battleground for competing ideologies - during the Second World War it was where some of the bitterest atrocities between Nazism and Communism took place.

And after the war the internecine savagery was possibly even worse. Savage Continent is one of the most eye-opening (and depressing) histories I've read.

It's getting worrying now with the Russians describing events in Kiev as a coup, talk of "fraternal assistance" for Ukraine - the phrase the USSR used for its "assistance" to Czechoslovakia in 1968 - and even unconfirmed rumours of troop movements.

Just read this morning that Moscow recalled their ambassador. At this stage a return of the Cold War looks like the best of bad bunch of options.

I think the protesters who originally went to Maidan Square were genuinely fearful of a move backwards to Russian dominance when Yanukovich scuppered the EU agreement. Ukraine, like Poland is one of those terribly unfortunate countries, fated by geography to be a battleground for competing ideologies - during the Second World War it was where some of the bitterest atrocities between Nazism and Communism took place. Now it is caught in a battle between Western free market neo-cons and ex- Soviet controlled economy Russians.

Interesting thing is how the Americans thought they were going to cut the EU out of the equation as evidenced by the transcript of the conversation involving the senior US diplomats to the area ("F**k the EU and we'll put pur own government in"). Seems like the US and the Russians have been reading too much John Le Carre and are acting like it is the the 70's all over again. The new Ukrainian President has pivoted quite decisively back to the EU and i genuinely think, for all its faults, a partnership with the EU, sidelining both Russia and the US, is the best result for the Ukranian people - if it can be achieved peacefully.

Haven't been following this very closely, but I was shocked by Callinan's performance in front of the PAC a couple of weeks ago - I think in the long run that will go down as his Pee Flynn moment - his arrogance and disregard for the committee was so blatant that it is actually scary to think what more could be going on within the force. A fish rots from the head down, and if Callinan is anyway indicative of senior officers' attitudes towards normal democratic oversight and the importance of holding institutions to account, then things could get very smelly indeed.

Is it any wonder that practically no one in institutional power in the history of the state has been held responsible in a court of law for their abuses of that power?

"Panic on the streets of dublin  !

I remember going down to the Feile when they staged it in Pairc Ui Chaoimh rather than Thurles, to see the Roses - and it was a far more sedate affair than the carnage in Tipp. It was all contained around the venue, people dispersed fairly quickly to pubs, clubs, campsites, bus/train stations etc

Cities and their environs absorb the crowds far better than places like Thurles or Punchestown - it won't get as bad as Oxegen, or even some of the concerts in the Park.

I think if you're a resident of the area, at some stage you've made a choice to be there - the development of the stadium was incremental, everyone knew these kind of gigs were a possibility (though I'd be happy enough if they limited it to three nights in a row, as a compromise). Croke Park falls over themselves to compensate them - the threat of injunction is just the first move in the negotiations.

AZ i think you're more upset that the St. Pats Jersey has taken the place of the Faithful - turning up in places you wouldn't expect. Didn't we have a thread on this a few years ago?

As for Frazier, somewhere a villiage is missing its idiot.

I'd say Japan's relative closeness to NZ made a difference as well. What's the problem with Axel lads? There was a lot of grumbling when Penney was appointed that they weren't giving him a chance. Has his stock fallen in thomond? Will they give O'Sullivan an interview this time?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xiWw5dwngc

I feel the same....