All Ireland Final Replay 1st October 2016 Dublin vs Mayo

[Jinxy]

Keegan was definitely done on his black card, a yellow is what is was and Connolly knew what he was at and exacted a little bit of revenge.

Lee Keegan can have little complaints though, he has came out on the right side of wrong decisions an awful lot more than he has been sinned against. The law of averages said he had rode his fair share up until now.

I actually really like Keegan, he's my player of the Championship this season, he's a super player and I thought it was very classy of him last year in being one of the few Mayo players who refrained from throwing their management team under the bus. If Mayo had more guys like him they'd have a couple of All Irelands over the past few years. My only issue is the inconsistent treatment the media give to the likes of Keegan in contrast to other players - primarily Donegal and Tyrone.

I found it quite amusing some Mayo people were throwing a strop at Dublin figures singling him out for the referee to clamp down on him. You should be grateful he was allowed to get away with his actions (in big games, on big opponents) for so long without intense media scrutiny.

That literally is your only issue.

[ballinaman]

At the start of the season the management would have picked their number 1 keeper. There is very little between them as shot stoppers, Clarke is probably better coming off his line, but Hennelly is a lot better with his kicks.

Hennelly was then dropped for a couple of bad kickout towards the end of the Galway game, one crucial kick led to the goal. I always felt this was very harsh and would undermine Hennelly's confidence.

Clarke was then put in. Clarke had some very good big moments in games, but made errors that he wasn't making in years past. In the drawn game he made some daft decisions and was very lucky to get away with them. He also kicked poorly.

Many of us were debating the keeper switch in the days between the two matches. Personally I felt that the switch was to late in the season, as it would be hard to know where Hennelly's form was after Beijing dropped and not having played, and that by undermining Clarke at this late stage of the season, we could go from to great keepers to two keepers badly out of form.

However, Rochford and the management had the benefit of seeing both players in training and were in a far better position to assess confidence, form, kickouts etc, than bullshit artists like Joe Brolly. 

It coulldn't have been anticipated that Hennelly would have his worst performance from the tee and generally, in his entire Mayo career.

So in my opinion the switch was no big surprise after Clarke's performance in the drawn game, but with hindsight we all know better now.

I'm not going to list Hennellys mistakes during big games down through the years but I'm sure Mayo lads can easily think of the majority of them. It's quite a long list for lads who don't know BTW.
This history combined without having kicked a ball since May makes the decision a kamikaze one.
He could have been flawless in training but repeated mistakes in big games shouldn't have been overlooked.

[Halfquarter]

Keegan was definitely done on his black card, a yellow is what is was and Connolly knew what he was at and exacted a little bit of revenge.

Lee Keegan can have little complaints though, he has came out on the right side of wrong decisions an awful lot more than he has been sinned against. The law of averages said he had rode his fair share up until now.

I actually really like Keegan, he's my player of the Championship this season, he's a super player and I thought it was very classy of him last year in being one of the few Mayo players who refrained from throwing their management team under the bus. If Mayo had more guys like him they'd have a couple of All Irelands over the past few years. My only issue is the inconsistent treatment the media give to the likes of Keegan in contrast to other players - primarily Donegal and Tyrone.

I found it quite amusing some Mayo people were throwing a strop at Dublin figures singling him out for the referee to clamp down on him. You should be grateful he was allowed to get away with his actions (in big games, on big opponents) for so long without intense media scrutiny.

Yes,maybe we should do away with the refs and let the Dublin media figures referee the games  !!

[Gael85]

Anyone else think McCarthy's collision with Vaughan wasn't the complete accident the commentators made it out to be?

Think Seamus O'Shea gave McCarthy a slight push.

[Crete Boom]

Keegan was definitely done on his black card, a yellow is what is was and Connolly knew what he was at and exacted a little bit of revenge.

Lee Keegan can have little complaints though, he has came out on the right side of wrong decisions an awful lot more than he has been sinned against. The law of averages said he had rode his fair share up until now.

I actually really like Keegan, he's my player of the Championship this season, he's a super player and I thought it was very classy of him last year in being one of the few Mayo players who refrained from throwing their management team under the bus. If Mayo had more guys like him they'd have a couple of All Irelands over the past few years. My only issue is the inconsistent treatment the media give to the likes of Keegan in contrast to other players - primarily Donegal and Tyrone.

I found it quite amusing some Mayo people were throwing a strop at Dublin figures singling him out for the referee to clamp down on him. You should be grateful he was allowed to get away with his actions (in big games, on big opponents) for so long without intense media scrutiny.

He could very well have been classy enough , as you put it , to not vote H & C out but only Lee knows that himself if he did , I don't , you don't and certainly the Connacht Telegraph and our esteemed former Co Chairman don't either.

[criostlinn]

I wonder how Stephen Coen will deal with the intense media pressure that he will come under after him taking Diarmuid Connolly out of Lee Keegans pocket with the black card and placing him firmly into his own. Cant be at that Stephen. This lad has to be able express himself. So was it pulling and dragging or can Connolly actually be marked

[Cunny Funt]

At the start of the season the management would have picked their number 1 keeper. There is very little between them as shot stoppers, Clarke is probably better coming off his line, but Hennelly is a lot better with his kicks.

Hennelly was then dropped for a couple of bad kickout towards the end of the Galway game, one crucial kick led to the goal. I always felt this was very harsh and would undermine Hennelly's confidence.

Clarke was then put in. Clarke had some very good big moments in games, but made errors that he wasn't making in years past. In the drawn game he made some daft decisions and was very lucky to get away with them. He also kicked poorly.

Many of us were debating the keeper switch in the days between the two matches. Personally I felt that the switch was to late in the season, as it would be hard to know where Hennelly's form was after Beijing dropped and not having played, and that by undermining Clarke at this late stage of the season, we could go from to great keepers to two keepers badly out of form.

However, Rochford and the management had the benefit of seeing both players in training and were in a far better position to assess confidence, form, kickouts etc, than bullshit artists like Joe Brolly. 

It coulldn't have been anticipated that Hennelly would have his worst performance from the tee and generally, in his entire Mayo career.

So in my opinion the switch was no big surprise after Clarke's performance in the drawn game, but with hindsight we all know better now.

I think the main problem was that Rochford and his management never settled on a decision on who was number 1. From the FBD right though to last Saturday evening there was so much chopping and changing of the keeper. Both keepers had the experience of playing in AI finals before but in hindsight it was probably best to keep Clarke in goal for the replay.

[Jinxy]

Here is the Lee Keegan black card.

https://twitter.com/Sportstalkdotie/status/782258063302590464

Watch the Keegan incident and ignore him altogether.
Just watch Connolly.
He is not pulled down.
I'm not even all that sure he's being fouled, but the hand over the shoulder probably merits a free-in at most.
At no point does Keegan make contact with him below the shoulder.

That's only part of it. There was a fuller clip floating around that I can't find now, showing the few seconds just before this. Keegan reaches across with his left hand and grabs Connolly's jersey on the chest area, then swings around and we see the rest of the clip you've shown. The whole effect is of Connolly being pulled down. If it was the jersey grab alone, or the clip you show alone, then ok, it would seem harsh.

Even as it was he could well have gotten away with it, fair enough. But I don't see how you can get from there to saying it's definitely not a black card. He was all over Connolly and Connolly went down, he's at risk.

I'll explain it to you in greater detail so.
Connolly was not deliberately pulled down.
So either he got a black card for one of the other four listed offences, such as a deliberate trip, or Deegan was wrong.

[NetNitrate]

Net nitrate  and others need to read the oul black card section of the rule book.

I have read. They cover cynical fouls including "deliberately body collide with an opponent for the purpose of taking him out of movement of play."

Keegan was making no effort to be first to ball, and more intent of preventing a goal from disastrous kick out by taking Connolly out. It began with jersey grab, then left hand on shoulder, then around neck. No intent to play ball.

[Dubhaltach]

At the start of the season the management would have picked their number 1 keeper. There is very little between them as shot stoppers, Clarke is probably better coming off his line, but Hennelly is a lot better with his kicks.

Hennelly was then dropped for a couple of bad kickout towards the end of the Galway game, one crucial kick led to the goal. I always felt this was very harsh and would undermine Hennelly's confidence.

Clarke was then put in. Clarke had some very good big moments in games, but made errors that he wasn't making in years past. In the drawn game he made some daft decisions and was very lucky to get away with them. He also kicked poorly.

Many of us were debating the keeper switch in the days between the two matches. Personally I felt that the switch was to late in the season, as it would be hard to know where Hennelly's form was after Beijing dropped and not having played, and that by undermining Clarke at this late stage of the season, we could go from to great keepers to two keepers badly out of form.

However, Rochford and the management had the benefit of seeing both players in training and were in a far better position to assess confidence, form, kickouts etc, than bullshit artists like Joe Brolly. 

It coulldn't have been anticipated that Hennelly would have his worst performance from the tee and generally, in his entire Mayo career.

So in my opinion the switch was no big surprise after Clarke's performance in the drawn game, but with hindsight we all know better now.

I'm not going to list Hennellys mistakes during big games down through the years but I'm sure Mayo lads can easily think of the majority of them. It's quite a long list for lads who don't know BTW.
This history combined without having kicked a ball since May makes the decision a kamikaze one.
He could have been flawless in training but repeated mistakes in big games shouldn't have been overlooked.

+ 1 Ballinaman.

The other thing that doesn't add up here is the fact that the world and its mother had heard about the change before it was announced. Compare it with Dillon being named to start against Tyrone, that came as surprise to most. If management wanted the Hennelly change to be in the public domain, then why bother announcing the earlier dummy team? It's strange IMO, especially when you consider how tight knit the group had been all year.

[blast05]

Net nitrate  and others need to read the oul black card section of the rule book.

I have read. They cover cynical fouls including "deliberately body collide with an opponent for the purpose of taking him out of movement of play."

Keegan was making no effort to be first to ball, and more intent of preventing a goal from disastrous kick out by taking Connolly out. It began with jersey grab, then left hand on shoulder, then around neck. No intent to play ball.

Disingenuous there Net nitrate ??....
It looks to me like you are deliberately mis-quoting  section 5.12 to suit your argument, i.e.: you are leaving out the bit about having played the ball away.
So, can you point me to the section of the rule as below that justified Keegans black card ?
Ironically, by the letter of the law, the only rule that I can see as being broken was 5.13 ...... by Connolly (no, not for a second am I suggesting he should have got a black)


Category II Infractions – Cynical Behaviour
5.10 To deliberately pull down an opponent.
5.11 To deliberately trip an opponent with hand(s), arm, leg or foot.
5.12 To deliberately collide with an opponent after he has played the ball away or for the purpose of taking him out of the movement of play.
5.13 To remonstrate in an aggressive manner with a Match Official..

PENALTY FOR THE ABOVE FOULS -
(i) Order the offender off by showing him a Black Card.
(ii) Allow a replacement from within the substitutions permitted in Rule 2.4, Rules of Specification.
(iii) Free kick from where the foul occurred except as provided under Exceptions of Rule 2.2.
5.14 To threaten or to use abusive or provocative language or gestures to an opponent or teammate.

PENALTY FOR THE ABOVE FOULS -
(i) Order the offender off by showing him a Black Card.
(ii) Allow a replacement from within the substitutions permitted

[moysider]

Nobody I know heard until Sat. morning. In fact a few were taken by surprise when it was announced just before throw in.

Anyway what's done is done. Clarkie was back out this evening taking a training session in his old school like he often does when his job allows. A class act.

[moysider]

Net nitrate  and others need to read the oul black card section of the rule book.

I have read. They cover cynical fouls including "deliberately body collide with an opponent for the purpose of taking him out of movement of play."

Keegan was making no effort to be first to ball, and more intent of preventing a goal from disastrous kick out by taking Connolly out. It began with jersey grab, then left hand on shoulder, then around neck. No intent to play ball.

Disingenuous there Net nitrate ??....
It looks to me like you are deliberately mis-quoting  section 5.12 to suit your argument, i.e.: you are leaving out the bit about having played the ball away.
So, can you point me to the section of the rule as below that justified Keegans black card ?
Ironically, by the letter of the law, the only rule broken was 5.13 ...... by Connolly (no, not for a second am I suggesting he should have got a black)


Category II Infractions – Cynical Behaviour
5.10 To deliberately pull down an opponent.
5.11 To deliberately trip an opponent with hand(s), arm, leg or foot.
5.12 To deliberately collide with an opponent after he has played the ball away or for the purpose of taking him out of the movement of play.
5.13 To remonstrate in an aggressive manner with a Match Official..

PENALTY FOR THE ABOVE FOULS -
(i) Order the offender off by showing him a Black Card.
(ii) Allow a replacement from within the substitutions permitted in Rule 2.4, Rules of Specification.
(iii) Free kick from where the foul occurred except as provided under Exceptions of Rule 2.2.
5.14 To threaten or to use abusive or provocative language or gestures to an opponent or teammate.

PENALTY FOR THE ABOVE FOULS -
(i) Order the offender off by showing him a Black Card.
(ii) Allow a replacement from within the substitutions permitted

Look it wasn't a card of any description. A free-in and a ticking was the correct call. Nothing more.
The fact that it was a goal scoring chance is irrelevant. Deegan knows the rules so one of a few things happened.
1. Took advice from a linesman that changed his initial opinion of the challenge.
2. Is a homer as expected and was influenced by the protestations and reaction of the fans.
3. Had a preconceived idea of the Connolly/Keegan duel and probably influenced by the nonsense from former players. Must be impossible for refs. to isolate themselves from this shite.

[Hill16 Blues]

I wonder how Stephen Coen will deal with the intense media pressure that he will come under after him taking Diarmuid Connolly out of Lee Keegans pocket with the black card and placing him firmly into his own. Cant be at that Stephen. This lad has to be able express himself. So was it pulling and dragging or can Connolly actually be marked

Connolly has 4 all Ireland medals, four leagues etc etc. You can continue spouting boll0x all you want but Coen, Keegan et all are no nearer winning an all Ireland than they / you ever were. Suck it up stop talking sh1te and try to lose with a bit of graciousness. Who knows it might be the making of Mayo in years to come.

The haters will always hate. And fcuk me bar the odd exception this site is full of them. It does truly make our success all the sweeter.

Now I'm off to see where Sam will be later in the week for a further bit of celebrating a special team and special bunch of players. Good luck!

[Cat and Cage]

That's only part of it. There was a fuller clip floating around that I can't find now, showing the few seconds just before this. Keegan reaches across with his left hand and grabs Connolly's jersey on the chest area, then swings around and we see the rest of the clip you've shown. The whole effect is of Connolly being pulled down. If it was the jersey grab alone, or the clip you show alone, then ok, it would seem harsh.

Even as it was he could well have gotten away with it, fair enough. But I don't see how you can get from there to saying it's definitely not a black card. He was all over Connolly and Connolly went down, he's at risk.

I'll explain it to you in greater detail so.
Connolly was not deliberately pulled down.
So either he got a black card for one of the other four listed offences, such as a deliberate trip, or Deegan was wrong.

Sez you.