Armagh v Galway AIQF

[seafoid]

15 minutes of highlights

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwPv66E0jMU

[general_lee]

Its all in the coaching and team culture built up over a number of years. If anyone thinks that McKLeever and McGeeneys 'style' isnt all over that team then they need their heads read.
Monkey see monkey do.
Its premeditated not to ever actually strike. Becasue thats a sending off offence. So lads, no striking whatever you do.
But make sure you grapple, wrestle, grab, twist and hold onto him like your life depends on it and dont ever back down or let go first. Thats a sign of weakness and we cant have that, because after all, we're all big men and we like to flex how big we are.

Whilst there is alot to admire about Armagh's journey and football theyve played, they still get involved too much, indulge in thuggish shite and foul too easily. Their obsession with chest beating macho bull shit and insistence in turning every game into a dick-measuring contest was always gonna bite them at some stage.
Theyve lost this particular dick-measuring contest and its gonna hurt for a while.

I've read some shite on here (mostly Tyrone and Derry people, ironically) chastising Armagh for yesterdays handbags. I'm not sure Armagh are coached to do anything specifically in terms of dark arts but the only criticism I'll accept is that the management clearly haven't learned anything this year in terms of other teams riling them up.

I've asked it before but what exactly do Armagh, or any team for that matter, have to gain by starting a melee? There is literally nothing to be achieved from a premeditated melee.  Fair criticism of McGeeney/McKeever would be that their players fall for this shite too much: happened with Donegal, it happened with Tyrone and it happened again yesterday. TK deserves a hefty ban and if the powers that be make an example of him, so be it; moronic behaviour from him and something he shouldn't have involved himself with.

Youve asked so ill answer (even though id thought the answer pretty obvious).
Teams/players will engage in nonsense and start into other players (usually the star men) because if you can get a psychological advantage at all by putting your opponent off his game so much that he might lash out or take his eye off the ball or his own game, then its worthwhile and can help your own team that extra 1%. We all know it goes on and our games, rules and officials facilitate it. Its usually the inferior footballer, the technically weaker player who has to rely on starting shite with his opponent becasue he's simply not good enough to go toe-to-toe with his direct opponent.
Cant believe this needs explaining

I can't believe you actually think a team playing in Croke park would pre-meditate something like this with the whole of the country watching. Given how Armagh have (stupidly) been involved in shite like this before earlier in the year, with absolutely zero impact on the outcome of those respective games (if anything added hassle and distractions) it's astounding that you think that any team, let alone an intercounty team in an AI QF, would use such behaviour as a vehicle to psychologically gain some sort of advantage when the game is in the melting pot. Only a colossal moron would think there is anything to be gained from starting a melee.

[smort]

Come off it general_lee, are you actually serious here? Must be a WUM

[yellowcard]

Theyve been at it before Donaghy arrived on the ticket.
Im not referring to the gouging because thats a separate thing thats unexplainable.
Open your eyes man. James Morgan and Greg McCabe are card magnets and dont help themselves or the team with their nonsense.
There are a few others who are a shoe-in for cards every game. Armagh are a betting man's dream when it comes to cards.

You are a bullshitter. Morgan has in the past been rash and card prone. Over the last 10 or 12 years Armagh have not been involved a lot of this stuff as you suggest. This year they have been involved in 3 instances which is too much, but this happening the length and breadth of the country at club and county level your allegation that Armagh are some how world leaders at it does not stack.

So we're into personal insults now because you disagree strongly with an opinion.
Classy. Then again i shouldnt be surprised.

Just enjoy thier loss Brick. Still buzzing.

Lol be a while before you lot get a run out at Croke park. Maybe one of your refs will you can all go and support him

You know you're at rock bottom whenever you get your kicks out of other teams losing.

[Applesisapples]

Theyve been at it before Donaghy arrived on the ticket.
Im not referring to the gouging because thats a separate thing thats unexplainable.
Open your eyes man. James Morgan and Greg McCabe are card magnets and dont help themselves or the team with their nonsense.
There are a few others who are a shoe-in for cards every game. Armagh are a betting man's dream when it comes to cards.

You are a bullshitter. Morgan has in the past been rash and card prone. Over the last 10 or 12 years Armagh have not been involved a lot of this stuff as you suggest. This year they have been involved in 3 instances which is too much, but this happening the length and breadth of the country at club and county level your allegation that Armagh are some how world leaders at it does not stack.

So we're into personal insults now because you disagree strongly with an opinion.
Classy. Then again i shouldnt be surprised.

Its not personal, you are bullshitting and labelling a whole county and its players as perennial thugs based on zero evidence.

You personally insulted me. Its black n white.
Where did i label a whole county and its players as perennial thugs. Those are your own words not mine. Be careful.
Theres plenty of evidence to suggest that Armagh have several players with issues when it comes to controlling aggression, breaking playing rules, getting themselves carded.

I actually think Armagh folk are a great bunch. Have had many a positive interaction with them on and off the pitch for last 30 years and count them as good friends.
Im actually a fan of the football they play. How could you not be.
Im not sure where all this hate and anger comes from today.

No hate, no anger read my take on yesterday, but suggesting that Armagh were wholly to blame and have been at it for years is just errant nonsense. If you are insulted that I believe that you are bullshitting there is nothing I can do for that, just my opinion of your musings and nothing personal.

[general_lee]

Come off it general_lee, are you actually serious here? Must be a WUM

Nah you're right, Armagh are to blame for Comer (rightly or wrongly) going at James Morgan which was the spark that ignited the melee. They knew what they were at all along

[seafoid]

Armagh and Derry brought a lot to this year's championship. Hopefully the progress can be maintained next year.

[Armamike]

There is actually a case to be made for throwing Armagh out of next years Championship. Derrytresk got 5 years for similar behaviour. Albeit they are a Tyrone team and the GAA use the Tyrone rule book when it comes to disciplinary proceedings involving the county.

Doesn't help matters when your supporters get stuck in as well!

[Taylor]

Come off it general_lee, are you actually serious here? Must be a WUM

Nah you're right, Armagh are to blame for Comer (rightly or wrongly) going at James Morgan which was the spark that ignited the melee. They knew what they were at all along

Comer went for Morgan after Morgan had ran through the back of him. That is a fact

[clarshack]

There is actually a case to be made for throwing Armagh out of next years Championship. Derrytresk got 5 years for similar behaviour. Albeit they are a Tyrone team and the GAA use the Tyrone rule book when it comes to disciplinary proceedings involving the county.

There needs to be more punishment that's for sure as Armagh have got away with the previous 2 melees they've been involved in this year.
If they keep getting away with it they are going to keep doing it.

[trailer]

Absolutely loving this thread. Armagh people losing their minds. Great stuff altogether. Watching them get beat, on penalties, in the rain. Priceless. Weekend probably cost them a fortune as well. Superb.

[Keyboard Warrior]

End of the day managers attitude is alot to blame especially McGeeney Attitude. Dublin were the masters of goading to Pat Kilroy came onboard and cut it out over night. Armagh been involved in 3 pile on this year. Bad one few yrs ago against Cavan, and the worst one was a U-21 game with Tyrone a few yrs bck. It doesn't happen in soccer/Rugby cause they issues punishments for such. And the general attitude is there's nothing wrong with it. No wonder children now aday grow up  with attitude of its someone else fault. And on the row, the initial instigator was Morgan not Comer, who shouldn't been on the field after blindsiding Walsh earlier.

The "row" was mostly pushing and holding (with the obvious, much discussed, exception). This used to be known as Handbags. In non-professional rugby and soccer, these rows also happen.

As for your Helen Lovejoy "won't somebody please think of the children" line, that gave me a laugh.

Hopefully the CCCC don't loose the run of themselves due to wailing on twitter and Galway will be at full strength for the Semi-Final.

[Ed Ricketts]

Still feeling drained after that, so can't imagine what the players must feel like today.

Such an incredible rollercoaster of emotions for Armagh supporters over those two or three hours. In fact, the last four weeks or so have been a rollercoaster, from the doom and gloom in advance of the Tyrone game through to the colour and noise and expectation on Sunday. Such a shame, a disgrace really, that things ended with a penalty shootout. It's unnatural, anti-climactic, perfunctory. It doesn't belong in the GAA - I hope the rule makers realise this before any other county is disenfranchised. Striking the ball from the ground is a fundamental skill in soccer, it is not a fundamental skill in Gaelic football. This is why penalty shootouts do not belong in the GAA.

The game in normal time was conventional enough. Armagh started well and then faded. Galway were the better team overall, and had they run out 4 or 5 point winners it would have been merited. They are a very good team that have been motoring well all year. I can see them taking care of Derry, and giving a good account of themselves in an AI final. Need to sort out that problem with high balls in and around their goals, though.

I thought I could see some heavy legs out there on the Armagh side, and it's maybe no coincidence that some of the older lads - Murnin, Forker, Grugan, - didn't make it to the end of extra time. Armagh have had a tougher road than Galway over the last month.

Galway were also more clinical, I think the wide count at the end of normal time was something like 8-3. Some of Armagh's shot selection was off at clutch moments - unfortunately this came back to haunt them at the death too. McCabe's red didn't help either - Galway hit four in a row after that and looked to have killed the game off. The red was harsh for me. There's no malice there, it's just a fractionally mistimed hit. Yellow would've done and no one would've complained.

Then that mad 8 or 9 minutes. First off, fair play to Coldrick for adding the time. Galway were at the fake head injury stuff all second half to kill time, so 8 minutes was the least that was justified. A stop clock is the solution to this messing. Both goals were scrappy, but they're the type of goals you get when you want them enough. O'Neill's free to tie it up was something else, but there was never a doubt he'd nail it.

Extra time is a blur to me. I'll have to watch back when I have the stomach. I thought Armagh had it at two stages - after the third goal, and after Hall's point. It was always going to be tricky to hold on against an opponent like Galway, but maybe Armagh could have done one or two things differently and held out. McDaid's point to tie it up was exceptional, though.

The penalties are a nonsense and you couldn't hold it against either of the two lads that missed for Armagh. But if this team ever finds itself in the position again then I'd hope lessons can be learnt from yesterday. GAA keepers are not at the same shot stopping standard as top level soccer keepers. Just hit the target with enough power and you usually score in Gaelic football. This is what Galway managed, but a couple of the Armagh penalties looked to try to be too precise, too close to the top corner.

The row was bad. And Armagh more than played their part in it. That's three in 11 games this year, Armagh can't keep crying that they're just being picked on. In fact, in interviews afterwards, McGeeney more or less said that the lads have been encouraged to get on like this. To not take a step back, to get under the skin of the big boys and let them know you mean business. I get that this cocky upstart thing is an energy that the team feeds off, but for me it begins to become counterproductive after a time. In the short term you lose players and you lose focus. Longer term there is a loss of reputation, which kills you slowly as you find refs gunning for you more and more regularly. Armagh need to clean themselves up.

Tiernan Kelly in particular let himself down, and I'm sure he knows that. He should be contrite, take whatever punishment comes his way, and quietly go about working his way back into the team. He still has a fantastic football career ahead of him. It's difficult to make excuses for something like that, but I suppose he is young and the blood was up in the moment. It looked like one of those things that takes a second to happen, but that you regret for much, much longer. The witch hunt online and in the media is pathetic, though. Hysterical squeals for lifetime bans. A lot of sanctimonious gobshites that just live for whinging about things. Luckily, the storm will move on to a different target by the middle of the week - hopefully TK keeps his head clear of the noise in the meantime.

As an Armagh supporter I'm already looking forward to 2023. The league gave a hint of it, but it's the last three championship games that has confirmed it for me: we're back knocking about the top table. Some serious work, and improvement, and momentum has come together over the last 18 months. Good young players have come through, and some stalwarts have elevated themselves to standards I didn't think they had in them. The continuation of the management isn't in any doubt, and hopefully Donaghy stays onboard too - the boys seem to feed off his enthusiasm.

I don't think any players walk away just yet, and there's maybe two more years in the likes of Grugan, Campbell & Forker. I can see Turbitt starting more regularly, and return for Oisin O'Neill, Kelly, and Grimley. It'll also be great for squad depth to have lads like Paddy Burns, Niall Rowland, and the Mackins back to full fitness. Boys like Woods and Kieran came in yesterday and kicked on, and there's others like McQuillen, McConville, McCambridge, and Higgins still to really break through. The year will also stand to men who have just only got going in settled positions on the field - Rafferty, Og Burns, Conor O'Neill, Crealey & Duffy.

The talent of 20 years ago might not quite be there, but there's still a very strong and healthy mix. There's also an energy and togetherness and spirit that has taken time to foster, and which could still take them a long way. The unnecessary stuff aside, there's a team there that plays great football with great heart. Football has been boring for a decade or more, it's good for the game to have teams like Armagh bringing a bit of colour and noise to Croke Park again.

Good luck to Galway and Derry the next day out. Would love to see either win Sam.

[Brick Tamlin]

Theyve been at it before Donaghy arrived on the ticket.
Im not referring to the gouging because thats a separate thing thats unexplainable.
Open your eyes man. James Morgan and Greg McCabe are card magnets and dont help themselves or the team with their nonsense.
There are a few others who are a shoe-in for cards every game. Armagh are a betting man's dream when it comes to cards.

You are a bullshitter. Morgan has in the past been rash and card prone. Over the last 10 or 12 years Armagh have not been involved a lot of this stuff as you suggest. This year they have been involved in 3 instances which is too much, but this happening the length and breadth of the country at club and county level your allegation that Armagh are some how world leaders at it does not stack.

So we're into personal insults now because you disagree strongly with an opinion.
Classy. Then again i shouldnt be surprised.

Its not personal, you are bullshitting and labelling a whole county and its players as perennial thugs based on zero evidence.

You personally insulted me. Its black n white.
Where did i label a whole county and its players as perennial thugs. Those are your own words not mine. Be careful.
Theres plenty of evidence to suggest that Armagh have several players with issues when it comes to controlling aggression, breaking playing rules, getting themselves carded.

I actually think Armagh folk are a great bunch. Have had many a positive interaction with them on and off the pitch for last 30 years and count them as good friends.
Im actually a fan of the football they play. How could you not be.
Im not sure where all this hate and anger comes from today.

No hate, no anger read my take on yesterday, but suggesting that Armagh were wholly to blame and have been at it for years is just errant nonsense. If you are insulted that I believe that you are bullshitting there is nothing I can do for that, just my opinion of your musings and nothing personal.

I accept your apology, now that youve calmed down a little.
Let me be clear in case i wasnt before. Armagh are not solely to blame for yesterdays melee. It takes 2 to tango. I dont think anyone is suggesting otherwise.
Also im not suggesting that Armagh went out to start a pre-meditated melee at all. In fact i agree with you, no team does that as far as im aware.

However, what i was suggesting that in general the lesser footballer will often engage in nonsense to try gain that little edge over his clearly superior footballing opponent. In some cases many lesser footballers will round on the clearly superior footballer as a group and show of strength etc. Often times when there is a culture of chest beating and machismo in a group of players it will result in fracas, melees, set-tos, skullduggery. Sometimes it manifests itself as a box to the gut, other times it might be wrestling and grappling (which Armagh strangely seem to love)

[armaghniac]

Come off it general_lee, are you actually serious here? Must be a WUM

Nah you're right, Armagh are to blame for Comer (rightly or wrongly) going at James Morgan which was the spark that ignited the melee. They knew what they were at all along

Comer went for Morgan after Morgan had ran through the back of him. That is a fact

Who did what here is almost moot. Who was the third man in?