The Offical Glasgow Celtic thread

[Nigel White]

Cowards bring up what a man does when working for someone they do not know, you sir are a hypocrite and a coward!
This is a Gaelic games forum, for you to bring up a man's employer into the equation because you disagree with his stance is disgusting at best, and I find you a coward you odious piece of Crap.

Classic. This is a Gaelic games forum you say on a thread entitled The Official Glasgow Celtic Thread. I've got to hand it to you though, you've got a great way with words. Just to clarify, I do know who his employer is. I have absolutely no intention of saying anything to them, all I'm saying is he, at his age, should have the sense to be careful about what he's posting on social media. I said earlier that I don't want to continue discussing this with you but I take that back, bring it on. I'm keen to see what other insults you have up your sleeve.

[MoChara]

I find it kind of odd for GAA people to be arguing that sports and politics should never mix when you consider the constitution of the GAA and its history.

[tonto1888]

https://www.commonspace.scot/articles/9106/yvonne-ridley-celtic-fans-echo-dylan-display-courage-palestine

It's Blowing Píssing in the Wind

Friday 19 August 2016 16.30CET
UEFA

Disciplinary proceedings have been opened following the UEFA Champions League play-offs, first leg, between Celtic FC and H. Beer-Sheva FC (5-2), played on 17 August in Glasgow (Scotland).
Charges against Celtic FC:
Illicit Banner – Art. 16 (2) of the UEFA Disciplinary Regulations
This case will be dealt with by the UEFA Control, Ethics and Disciplinary Body on 22 September.

http://celtsarehere.com/match-the-fine-for-palestine/

cough up a few quid main street. sometimes a fine is worth it for the right thing. Flying the flag of Palestine should not be deemed an illicit banner irrespective of what UEFA say. No issue with a tricolour, the star of David, the saltire, the union jack or red hand of ulster flags so why a Palestinian flag, a country recognised by the UN.

It's not the one particular issue, it's all political issues are banned from football grounds and I agree with the Uefa zero tolerance approach, whether it be directed against anti fascist or pro nazi gestures of support being made by fans.
The tricolour is a symbol of Irish ethnicity with Celtic fans, Uefa don't have an issue with that, neither  do they have an issue with Rangers and  the UJ  or Barca fans and their Catalan ethnicity. There is a distinction made between ethnic expression and political gestures.

When Robbie Fowler was fined for his gesture in support of the dockers, I think the FA made a point that regardless of anyone's sympathy with the cause,  such gestures of support are not tolerated on the football pitch, same goes to some player making a sly gesture to support fascists or in Di Canio's case in Rome, a blatantly obvious gesture.

UEFA don't have a zero tolerance approach. They pick and choose when to apply it as can be seen by not fining Barca regardless of what you say above. Also Bilbao have had displays in the past demanding freedom. That not political? Don't give me the ethnicity argument as it doesn't hold.

On another note the gofundme campaign is around 80k. Truly magnificent and makes me proud to be a Celtic supporter

[uimhr ocht]

Anyway massive game tonight with our away record in europe not powerful im hoping for an away goal to ease the pressure if not it could be difficult this evening,going forward we look good but defensively im a bit worried sviatchenko maybe should come back in.

[straightred]

Anyway massive game tonight with our away record in europe not powerful im hoping for an away goal to ease the pressure if not it could be difficult this evening,going forward we look good but defensively im a bit worried sviatchenko maybe should come back in.

I think we'll score. Hopefully early enough to knock back any confidence they might have taken from their 2 away goals. No doubt they will have their good spell but I can't see us losing by 3.

[Main Street]

https://www.commonspace.scot/articles/9106/yvonne-ridley-celtic-fans-echo-dylan-display-courage-palestine

It's Blowing Píssing in the Wind

Friday 19 August 2016 16.30CET
UEFA

Disciplinary proceedings have been opened following the UEFA Champions League play-offs, first leg, between Celtic FC and H. Beer-Sheva FC (5-2), played on 17 August in Glasgow (Scotland).
Charges against Celtic FC:
Illicit Banner – Art. 16 (2) of the UEFA Disciplinary Regulations
This case will be dealt with by the UEFA Control, Ethics and Disciplinary Body on 22 September.

http://celtsarehere.com/match-the-fine-for-palestine/

cough up a few quid main street. sometimes a fine is worth it for the right thing. Flying the flag of Palestine should not be deemed an illicit banner irrespective of what UEFA say. No issue with a tricolour, the star of David, the saltire, the union jack or red hand of ulster flags so why a Palestinian flag, a country recognised by the UN.

It's not the one particular issue, it's all political issues are banned from football grounds and I agree with the Uefa zero tolerance approach, whether it be directed against anti fascist or pro nazi gestures of support being made by fans.
The tricolour is a symbol of Irish ethnicity with Celtic fans, Uefa don't have an issue with that, neither  do they have an issue with Rangers and  the UJ  or Barca fans and their Catalan ethnicity. There is a distinction made between ethnic expression and political gestures.

When Robbie Fowler was fined for his gesture in support of the dockers, I think the FA made a point that regardless of anyone's sympathy with the cause,  such gestures of support are not tolerated on the football pitch, same goes to some player making a sly gesture to support fascists or in Di Canio's case in Rome, a blatantly obvious gesture.

UEFA don't have a zero tolerance approach. They pick and choose when to apply it as can be seen by not fining Barca regardless of what you say above. Also Bilbao have had displays in the past demanding freedom. That not political? Don't give me the ethnicity argument as it doesn't hold.

On another note the gofundme campaign is around 80k. Truly magnificent and makes me proud to be a Celtic supporter

Where do you find this pick and chose issues by Uefa? Where is the evidence?
What Celtic fans do out side the stadium, raising money for this and that cause is a different issue, but going out of their way  to make a political protest inside the stadium is not allowed.  I see Uefa have taken issue with the flying of the catalan flag by Barca fans. Barca had successfully appealed in the spanish courts, a ban to fly the catalan flag at games controlled by the spanish FA.
If Athletic Bilbao fans and club fly flags at spanish games then that's a matter for the spanish fa.  I don't know what Athletic fans do at uefa games or what Uefa's attitude is to them. Personally I don't see that as a political protest as such, Basques have some self rule and have a clear seperate ethnic identity.

By your logic, all fans everywhere should be able to do what they want.  Fascist fans of one club can make their protest against immigrants etc and fans of the same club who oppose those fascists will be allowed to make their counter protest. And of course it will all be so peacefull and honourable
Some years ago after the qualifier play off victory against Iceland, one Croat player took the mike and shouted ultra fascist slogans to the crowd who responded in kind, he was suspended for 8 or 10 games. However, by your reckoning it's okay for thousands of Croat fans to chant slogans in favour of the Ustase, an ultra fascist movement who made the Gestapo look like boy scouts.  Or do you want Uefa just to select causes that you happen to support and ban  what you consider to be the morally and socially repugnant causes? Which is it?

Or is your argument that because Uefa are not absolutely perfect in prosecuting all political demonstrations at every uefa game, then they should allow an open and blatant organised political protest by Celtic fans to go unpunished?

[stew]

I'm not talking about what he's posting on this thread specifically I'm talking about what he posts in general.  We are constantly telling young people to be careful  about they post on social media as employers and potential employers now look at social media sites like FB etc to build profiles of job applicants yet this guy seems confident to post what he wants, when he wants and I don't see that as being right.

So you are offended the man thinks and posts what he thinks without worrying about the consequences? Get yourself a life man.

Yes indeed.  When he insults people from the ROI by referring to them as 'freestaters' and makes insulting comments about elected representatives and hasn't the sense to think about the consequences then he proves that he is unfit to do the job he's doing. But look, I don't want to get involved in a debate with a person like yourself who doesn't have the ability to conduct a discussion without throwing in personal insults so let's just leave it there

Why bring in his employer? There is no good reason to do so, I find that reprehensible and cowardly to be honest.

[tonto1888]

https://www.commonspace.scot/articles/9106/yvonne-ridley-celtic-fans-echo-dylan-display-courage-palestine

It's Blowing Píssing in the Wind

Friday 19 August 2016 16.30CET
UEFA

Disciplinary proceedings have been opened following the UEFA Champions League play-offs, first leg, between Celtic FC and H. Beer-Sheva FC (5-2), played on 17 August in Glasgow (Scotland).
Charges against Celtic FC:
Illicit Banner – Art. 16 (2) of the UEFA Disciplinary Regulations
This case will be dealt with by the UEFA Control, Ethics and Disciplinary Body on 22 September.

http://celtsarehere.com/match-the-fine-for-palestine/

cough up a few quid main street. sometimes a fine is worth it for the right thing. Flying the flag of Palestine should not be deemed an illicit banner irrespective of what UEFA say. No issue with a tricolour, the star of David, the saltire, the union jack or red hand of ulster flags so why a Palestinian flag, a country recognised by the UN.

It's not the one particular issue, it's all political issues are banned from football grounds and I agree with the Uefa zero tolerance approach, whether it be directed against anti fascist or pro nazi gestures of support being made by fans.
The tricolour is a symbol of Irish ethnicity with Celtic fans, Uefa don't have an issue with that, neither  do they have an issue with Rangers and  the UJ  or Barca fans and their Catalan ethnicity. There is a distinction made between ethnic expression and political gestures.

When Robbie Fowler was fined for his gesture in support of the dockers, I think the FA made a point that regardless of anyone's sympathy with the cause,  such gestures of support are not tolerated on the football pitch, same goes to some player making a sly gesture to support fascists or in Di Canio's case in Rome, a blatantly obvious gesture.

UEFA don't have a zero tolerance approach. They pick and choose when to apply it as can be seen by not fining Barca regardless of what you say above. Also Bilbao have had displays in the past demanding freedom. That not political? Don't give me the ethnicity argument as it doesn't hold.

On another note the gofundme campaign is around 80k. Truly magnificent and makes me proud to be a Celtic supporter

Where do you find this pick and chose issues by Uefa? Where is the evidence?
What Celtic fans do out side the stadium, raising money for this and that cause is a different issue, but going out of their way  to make a political protest inside the stadium is not allowed.  I see Uefa have taken issue with the flying of the catalan flag by Barca fans. Barca had successfully appealed in the spanish courts, a ban to fly the catalan flag at games controlled by the spanish FA.
If Athletic Bilbao fans and club fly flags at spanish games then that's a matter for the spanish fa.  I don't know what Athletic fans do at uefa games or what Uefa's attitude is to them. Personally I don't see that as a political protest as such, Basques have some self rule and have a clear seperate ethnic identity.

By your logic, all fans everywhere should be able to do what they want.  Fascist fans of one club can make their protest against immigrants etc and fans of the same club who oppose those fascists will be allowed to make their counter protest. And of course it will all be so peacefull and honourable
Some years ago after the qualifier play off victory against Iceland, one Croat player took the mike and shouted ultra fascist slogans to the crowd who responded in kind, he was suspended for 8 or 10 games. However, by your reckoning it's okay for thousands of Croat fans to chant slogans in favour of the Ustase, an ultra fascist movement who made the Gestapo look like boy scouts.  Or do you want Uefa just to select causes that you happen to support and ban  what you consider to be the morally and socially repugnant causes? Which is it?

Or is your argument that because Uefa are not absolutely perfect in prosecuting all political demonstrations at every uefa game, then they should allow an open and blatant organised political protest by Celtic fans to go unpunished?

1. I was wrong about Barca. Just learned they were fined for that display as it was a CL game. They complained but did pay up.
2. Again, I didn't make it clear the Bilbao one was an EL game so under UEFA jurisdiction. Can't find anywhere wher they were fined.
3. Regarding picking and choosing. Having a minutes silence for Mandela was political. Their no to racism campaign is political.
4. I get what you're saying about clubs with fascist fans and their ideologies. It's a hard one that and the truth is I don't know to answer that one tho I see it as very different to being fined for flying the flag of a country even when it is a show of support and as such political.
5. I want UEFA to be fair and consistent.

[passedit]

Are English teams allowed to wear poppies on their shirts in EUFA games?

Anyways decent article on celtic/palestine here.

http://www.thenational.scot/comment/cat-boyd-you-cannot-keep-politics-out-of-sport-uefas-ban-on-the-palestinian-flag-is-hyper-political.21485

Cat Boyd: You cannot keep politics out of sport ... Uefa's ban on the Palestinian flag is hyper political
August 23rd, 2016 - 12:36 am Cat Boyd


THE Palestine flag is apparently an "illicit banner", according to Uefa, who will most likely be fining Celtic after a wall of fans raised the colours during the 5-2 trashing of Hapoel Beer-Sheva. Most onlookers recognise Uefa's position as more than a little hypocritical, and I've heard lots of support for Celtic online, even from unlikely sources. Still, people with otherwise good politics sometimes stick to the blanket principle of "keep politics out of sport". It's one of those slogans that's rhetorically convincing. Except it's wrong; because Uefa's stance is hyper political.

You see, for Palestinians, you can't keep politics out of sport. Israel not only polices all Palestinian borders, it also controls movement inside the Occupied Territories – the small strips where Palestinians are still permitted to scrape out a meagre existence – through roadblocks and military checkpoints. The Israeli army thus regularly restricts travel to matches. They deny Palestinians the right to import football equipment. And individual footballers are killed, detained or denied travel, making a football career next to impossible.

It might sound like I'm exaggerating: I'm not. Take Ahed Zaquout, considered the greatest ever Palestinian footballer. After retiring, Ahed became a football coach in Gaza and hosted a sports show on TV. That was until August 2014, when an Israeli bomb killed him while he slept.

Ahed died during the 2014 conflict known as Operation Protective Edge. In this Israeli "operation" another 2,030 Palestinians died, according to the United Nations, including 501 children and 257 women. Of the 71 Israelis who died in fighting, 66 were soldiers. You can't always measure human tragedy in numbers, and every unnecessary death of a person – including soldiers – in war is a tragedy to their friends and family. But sometimes, the numbers should make you stop and think. Here is an elaborate inequality of force.

Several current senior Palestinian players died that year at Israeli hands. But perhaps the most tragic football-related casualty of that war was on July 16, 2014, when Israeli warships killed four young boys aged between nine and eleven who were playing football on a beach.

Imagine an occupying army came north, stormed Edinburgh, massacred some of our most promising national players, and slaughtered fresh-faced youngsters having a kickabout with jumpers or ginger bottles for goalposts. Would we be saying, "keep politics out of sport" then?

Since Israel's apartheid regime and regular occupations make football in Palestine next to impossible, the Palestinian Football Association has appealed to Fifa to ban Israel from competitions. Fifa, after all, has promised "zero tolerance and strict punishments" for racism in football.

Celtic Fans triple Palestine fund target after Uefa fine

South Africa was banned from Fifa from the 1960s until 1992. That ruling had nothing to do with sport. It was all about politics: football took a stand against apartheid.

Is the Palestinian situation comparable, and could we thus take a similar stand towards Israel? Yes, says Desmond Tutu, the first black archbishop of Cape Town. "I have witnessed the systematic humiliation of Palestinian men, women and children by members of the Israeli security services," he said. "Their humiliation is familiar to all black South Africans who were corralled and harassed and insulted by the security forces of the apartheid government.

"In South Africa, we could not have achieved our democracy without the help of people around the world, who through the use of non-violent means, such as boycotts and divestment, encouraged their governments and other corporate actors to reverse decades-long support for the apartheid regime.

"Those who turn a blind eye to injustice actually perpetuate injustice. If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor."

Indeed, even some Israeli politicians have described their state's policies in apartheid terms. "This is how apartheid looks, there is no nicer way of putting it," said Zahava Gal-On, leader of the Meretz party, after the defence ministry imposed separate buses for Palestinian day labourers.

One contributor to Ha'aretz, the Israeli liberal newspaper, described their settlement programmes as being even worse than South Africa. "The system preserving this apartheid is more ruthless than that seen in South Africa, where the blacks were a labour force and could therefore also make a living," noted Yitzhak Laor. "It is equipped with the lie of being 'temporary'."

Indeed, Noam Chomsky, one of the world's most celebrated public intellectuals, goes further. "To call it apartheid is a gift to Israel," he says. "What's happening in the occupied territories is much worse."

I wish Celtic could refuse to play them. Yes, it would cost us millions in lost revenue. But compared to the plight of Palestinian footballers and football fans, this would be a pretty minimal price.

Of course, this would never happen, and I'm not pretending it would. Football is a brutally political business: political in the moneyed, capitalist sense.

There are English Premier Division teams owned by some of the richest oligarchs in the world. Call that "mere commerce" if you will; I call it High Politics. Money and power counts; and in that equation, Israel has plenty, and Palestinians have zero.

Will football organisations like Uefa take a humanitarian stance to stop a racist state choking to death a defenceless population? Sadly, for those who own and control footballing business it's too political to allow such a basic position.

Celtic fans, though, have distinguished themselves. They promised to match any Uefa fine by raising money for Palestine, and so far they've raised more than £30,000.

That show of basic dignity does them enormous credit. Maybe if fan controlled our clubs then football would be a different moral universe, which welcomed gestures of solidarity, rather than punished them.

Now over £100,000

[foxcommander]

3. Regarding picking and choosing. Having a minutes silence for Mandela was political. Their no to racism campaign is political.

Good point. When do they plan to stop preaching.

[Applesisapples]

I have some sympathy for UEFA, we are talking about desputed territory here with Countries aligned to European Football. I also think that Tony has a fair point to an extent regarding Celtic fans protesting about Palestine or the Basque Country. However it is silly to fine Barca for flying the Flag of the region to which they belong just to please Madrid. I can understand celtic fans remembering the famine or Bloody Sunday or singing the songs they sing because it is directly related to their origins and history. But given that they will and can do this complaining about the poppy on Celtic jerseys which in Britain is a symbol of help for war veterans many of whom are Celtic fans is a bit rich. So I guess the question is where do you draw the line? Which brings me back to UEFA, attempting to remove politics from football, good luck to them.

[T Fearon]

Politics and sport should be kept apart.The actions of Celtic fans last week have damaged the reputation of the club,incurred a fine and will have no doubt fired up the opponents and their fans for tonight's game.

A career defining game for our manager tonight.An implosion and failure to qualify would be of Mowbrayic proportions and would at best leave him as a lame duck manager for the rest of the season if he even lasts that long.

I have got a £5 free bet courtesy of Skybet but sadly do not have the trust in the manager to include Celtic in my selection.

[imtommygunn]

Every game is career defining for him in your eyes. *

* if he loses. Winning is irrelevant.

[tonto1888]

Politics and sport should be kept apart.The actions of Celtic fans last week have damaged the reputation of the club,incurred a fine and will have no doubt fired up the opponents and their fans for tonight's game.

A career defining game for our manager tonight.An implosion and failure to qualify would be of Mowbrayic proportions and would at best leave him as a lame duck manager for the rest of the season if he even lasts that long.

I have got a £5 free bet courtesy of Skybet but sadly do not have the trust in the manager to include Celtic in my selection.

Absolute nonsense. Celtic have had nothing but goodwill and last week. The reputation has only been damaged in the eyes of those who want to see it damaged.

Absolute nonsense.

[foxcommander]

So judging by their actions is the UEFA "RESPECT" campaign a load of bollox?

"The UEFA football and social responsibility programme is aimed at strengthening the health and integrity of both football and society as a whole, and the core pillar of Respect is integral to this.

This umbrella theme underpins all the elements of UEFA's social responsibility strategy, including the promotion of diversity, peace and reconciliation, football for all, health, respect for the environment and the campaign against discrimination, racism and violence"