Gaelic football is crap- and needs to change ASAP

[Cavan19]

That's the bit that doesn't stack up. You've people saying football was much more enjoyable in the 90's with no crowded defences and skillfull players who could score from anywhere. Yet you wonder what they were doing because there is as many scores now in games as ever.

Nowadays players are much better at shooting from what I can see.

That's because they are only taking on shots at the end off a move of about 20 fists passes when they are in a position that their manager allows them to shoot.

[trueblue1234]

I watched 10 minutes of Monaghan and Tyrone and switched it over. Genuinely couldn't be arsed watching Monaghans slow build up, passing the ball across the pitch and back, constantly afraid or unable to slice a pass into the forwards. The outcome looked inevitable within minutes, Tyrone with everyone back, then breaking up field when Monaghan give it away and nick a score.  Boring predictable shite .

Football has become a game that is very difficult to attract a neutral, I struggle to watch games that ive no dog in the fight and anyone I talk to seems to be the same. Hurling still has the appeal that you can watch a game between 2 top teams and it keeps you interested, football not so much.

I'm getting the same way too. You watch a game, and head down to throw the laundry in the dryer, and three or four minutes later you come back and maybe, just maybe, there's been a point scored. Leaving aside our current predicament, I'm even close to giving up on watching Donegal, such is the lack of enjoyment to be had from watching them. I said it in the thread for last year's Ulster Final, a game in which we were very competitive and could have won, that it would have been a hollow victory, so grim was the fare that was served up (think I said the same in the '16 final when Tyrone nicked it right at the end). We had some promising, fast moving football under Bonner in 18 and 19, but its been utterly dreadful since then and unfortunately the vast majority of the other teams are the same. Even watching Dublin go about their methodical, systematic, possession-based takedown of the opposition towards the end of the six in a row period was as dull as watching paint dry.

Apart from David Clifford and Shane Walsh and the runners of Mayo and your county loyalty, there just isn't much to attract spectators in gaelic football these days.

You'd wonder how that's different to games 20 years ago when scorelines are broadly the same?

Plenty of reasons, more frees now a days, a lot more scores come from dead balls now than did in the early 00s for example, id love to see the free counts from games in the 00s compared to now, forwards are told to go down like they've been shot if touched inside the 45 as its a free hit for a score, again down to the stats. Less wides, teams are now instructed not to shoot outside 'scoring zone' and 'give it to the shooters' you end up with similar scores but far less entertainment, teams holding the ball rather than shooting a wide and giving up possession.

its a different game now, the days of players/ teams being man for man is pretty much gone unfortunately, I often look and think how would a Peter canavan or a Mulligan get by today?

The game is now dictated by analysis and GPS. players are given stats a after a game and there are teams that if the players stats aren't good he's dropped, no wonder players are robotic.

The more frees now is definitely an issue. In the 80's you'd have to take a limb off half the time to get a free. Too much diving and conning of the ref. The rules have all been tinkered to suit the forward in the hope this will make creative football. The adverse effect of that is that teams know one on one, 9 times out of 10, the forward will either get past the defender or win a free. Therefore the next logical step is to prevent 1 on 1's. Make it easier to defend, enforce the steps more, allow that bit more contact in the tackle and you'd see defenders might be more confident 1 on 1. Until then, logic will always make the least risky option the most favourable. And that means packed defences and breaking at speed to get a score or free in a good position.

[J70]

I watched 10 minutes of Monaghan and Tyrone and switched it over. Genuinely couldn't be arsed watching Monaghans slow build up, passing the ball across the pitch and back, constantly afraid or unable to slice a pass into the forwards. The outcome looked inevitable within minutes, Tyrone with everyone back, then breaking up field when Monaghan give it away and nick a score.  Boring predictable shite .

Football has become a game that is very difficult to attract a neutral, I struggle to watch games that ive no dog in the fight and anyone I talk to seems to be the same. Hurling still has the appeal that you can watch a game between 2 top teams and it keeps you interested, football not so much.

I'm getting the same way too. You watch a game, and head down to throw the laundry in the dryer, and three or four minutes later you come back and maybe, just maybe, there's been a point scored. Leaving aside our current predicament, I'm even close to giving up on watching Donegal, such is the lack of enjoyment to be had from watching them. I said it in the thread for last year's Ulster Final, a game in which we were very competitive and could have won, that it would have been a hollow victory, so grim was the fare that was served up (think I said the same in the '16 final when Tyrone nicked it right at the end). We had some promising, fast moving football under Bonner in 18 and 19, but its been utterly dreadful since then and unfortunately the vast majority of the other teams are the same. Even watching Dublin go about their methodical, systematic, possession-based takedown of the opposition towards the end of the six in a row period was as dull as watching paint dry.

Apart from David Clifford and Shane Walsh and the runners of Mayo and your county loyalty, there just isn't much to attract spectators in gaelic football these days.

You'd wonder how that's different to games 20 years ago when scorelines are broadly the same?

20 years ago, those three or four minutes might have had a couple of one on one duels at either end of the field where defenders came out on top or a team hit a wide. These days it's more likely that one of the teams spent two of those minutes arsing about hand-passing across the field 60m from the goal.

There was still one point scored in the 3/4 minutes you missed though.

The game has got less exciting but still plenty of goods bit's to games too. The all round skill level of players across the team is far higher than that of 20/30 years. The game had moved on from the Jim McGuiness era in recent seasons with much more pressing of kickouts etc. But there has been a worrying trend of increased negativity in this years league - hoping the trend doesn't continue into the championship.

But it's not about the scoring alone.

And I don't know if the skill level is higher.

It's not like teams are fielding with six Peter Canavans up front or two Daragh O'Ses in midfield these days.

Fitness, athleticism, team coordination, rehearsed plays and tactical discipline are certainly on a whole other plane, but the overall game is for the most part dull and risk averse and individual flare and skill and creativity expressed far less than they used to be.

As someone said earlier, how would Canavan and Mulligan fare today? Trevor Giles or Greg Blaney?

What would Michael Murphy have done had he arrived 10 years earlier?

Just my opinion.

[seafoid]

Kicking and catching will become more prominent. The Dubs are struggling to adapt.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWJbVOsMxmY&t=1215s

[Milltown Row2]

Antrim in the 40's and 50's revolutionized the hand pass and made it their signature play, a sweeping movement right down the field, demoralising many sides. But the hand pass was abolished in 1950 at congress. And guess who proposed the motion? Yes, Antrim.

When was it brought back in?

[tc_manchester]

The game keeps changing. When I was a cub in the 70s all the oul boys complained that the game had changed into Basketball, now that I'm an oul boy I'm complaining that the game has turned into soccer.

[twohands!!!]

I watched 10 minutes of Monaghan and Tyrone and switched it over. Genuinely couldn't be arsed watching Monaghans slow build up, passing the ball across the pitch and back, constantly afraid or unable to slice a pass into the forwards. The outcome looked inevitable within minutes, Tyrone with everyone back, then breaking up field when Monaghan give it away and nick a score.  Boring predictable shite .

Football has become a game that is very difficult to attract a neutral, I struggle to watch games that ive no dog in the fight and anyone I talk to seems to be the same. Hurling still has the appeal that you can watch a game between 2 top teams and it keeps you interested, football not so much.

I'm getting the same way too. You watch a game, and head down to throw the laundry in the dryer, and three or four minutes later you come back and maybe, just maybe, there's been a point scored. Leaving aside our current predicament, I'm even close to giving up on watching Donegal, such is the lack of enjoyment to be had from watching them. I said it in the thread for last year's Ulster Final, a game in which we were very competitive and could have won, that it would have been a hollow victory, so grim was the fare that was served up (think I said the same in the '16 final when Tyrone nicked it right at the end). We had some promising, fast moving football under Bonner in 18 and 19, but its been utterly dreadful since then and unfortunately the vast majority of the other teams are the same. Even watching Dublin go about their methodical, systematic, possession-based takedown of the opposition towards the end of the six in a row period was as dull as watching paint dry.

Apart from David Clifford and Shane Walsh and the runners of Mayo and your county loyalty, there just isn't much to attract spectators in gaelic football these days.

You'd wonder how that's different to games 20 years ago when scorelines are broadly the same?

Plenty of reasons, more frees now a days, a lot more scores come from dead balls now than did in the early 00s for example, id love to see the free counts from games in the 00s compared to now, forwards are told to go down like they've been shot if touched inside the 45 as its a free hit for a score, again down to the stats. Less wides, teams are now instructed not to shoot outside 'scoring zone' and 'give it to the shooters' you end up with similar scores but far less entertainment, teams holding the ball rather than shooting a wide and giving up possession.

its a different game now, the days of players/ teams being man for man is pretty much gone unfortunately, I often look and think how would a Peter canavan or a Mulligan get by today?

The game is now dictated by analysis and GPS. players are given stats a after a game and there are teams that if the players stats aren't good he's dropped, no wonder players are robotic.

The more frees now is definitely an issue. In the 80's you'd have to take a limb off half the time to get a free. Too much diving and conning of the ref. The rules have all been tinkered to suit the forward in the hope this will make creative football. The adverse effect of that is that teams know one on one, 9 times out of 10, the forward will either get past the defender or win a free. Therefore the next logical step is to prevent 1 on 1's. Make it easier to defend, enforce the steps more, allow that bit more contact in the tackle and you'd see defenders might be more confident 1 on 1. Until then, logic will always make the least risky option the most favourable. And that means packed defences and breaking at speed to get a score or free in a good position.

The problem is that teams have worked out that it makes sense to foul a lot of the time.

While there is some diving and conning of the ref, it is only a tiny percentage of the time- well over 95% of the time a free is awarded it is because of foul playe by the defender

I think a large part of the problem is that the punishment for conceding a foul isn't harsh enough.

If there was adequate punishment for committing foul play/cheating the amount of frees conceded would drop instantly.

[Laois Rising]

The most important foul in Gaelic football is the one where the opposing team is coming out of their defence with the ball, especially after they have executed a turn over, and you commit a foul to break their momentum and to buy your team a couple of seconds to get back in their defensive shape. Kerry probably the best team in the country at executing this foul. As it is usually a simple tug of the jersey or leaving the arm in challenge it will rarely or ever punished with a yellow card. It really does suck the energy out of a game and stops a game building up any real  flow or momentum.   

[trueblue1234]

I watched 10 minutes of Monaghan and Tyrone and switched it over. Genuinely couldn't be arsed watching Monaghans slow build up, passing the ball across the pitch and back, constantly afraid or unable to slice a pass into the forwards. The outcome looked inevitable within minutes, Tyrone with everyone back, then breaking up field when Monaghan give it away and nick a score.  Boring predictable shite .

Football has become a game that is very difficult to attract a neutral, I struggle to watch games that ive no dog in the fight and anyone I talk to seems to be the same. Hurling still has the appeal that you can watch a game between 2 top teams and it keeps you interested, football not so much.

I'm getting the same way too. You watch a game, and head down to throw the laundry in the dryer, and three or four minutes later you come back and maybe, just maybe, there's been a point scored. Leaving aside our current predicament, I'm even close to giving up on watching Donegal, such is the lack of enjoyment to be had from watching them. I said it in the thread for last year's Ulster Final, a game in which we were very competitive and could have won, that it would have been a hollow victory, so grim was the fare that was served up (think I said the same in the '16 final when Tyrone nicked it right at the end). We had some promising, fast moving football under Bonner in 18 and 19, but its been utterly dreadful since then and unfortunately the vast majority of the other teams are the same. Even watching Dublin go about their methodical, systematic, possession-based takedown of the opposition towards the end of the six in a row period was as dull as watching paint dry.

Apart from David Clifford and Shane Walsh and the runners of Mayo and your county loyalty, there just isn't much to attract spectators in gaelic football these days.

You'd wonder how that's different to games 20 years ago when scorelines are broadly the same?

Plenty of reasons, more frees now a days, a lot more scores come from dead balls now than did in the early 00s for example, id love to see the free counts from games in the 00s compared to now, forwards are told to go down like they've been shot if touched inside the 45 as its a free hit for a score, again down to the stats. Less wides, teams are now instructed not to shoot outside 'scoring zone' and 'give it to the shooters' you end up with similar scores but far less entertainment, teams holding the ball rather than shooting a wide and giving up possession.

its a different game now, the days of players/ teams being man for man is pretty much gone unfortunately, I often look and think how would a Peter canavan or a Mulligan get by today?

The game is now dictated by analysis and GPS. players are given stats a after a game and there are teams that if the players stats aren't good he's dropped, no wonder players are robotic.

The more frees now is definitely an issue. In the 80's you'd have to take a limb off half the time to get a free. Too much diving and conning of the ref. The rules have all been tinkered to suit the forward in the hope this will make creative football. The adverse effect of that is that teams know one on one, 9 times out of 10, the forward will either get past the defender or win a free. Therefore the next logical step is to prevent 1 on 1's. Make it easier to defend, enforce the steps more, allow that bit more contact in the tackle and you'd see defenders might be more confident 1 on 1. Until then, logic will always make the least risky option the most favourable. And that means packed defences and breaking at speed to get a score or free in a good position.

The problem is that teams have worked out that it makes sense to foul a lot of the time.

While there is some diving and conning of the ref, it is only a tiny percentage of the time- well over 95% of the time a free is awarded it is because of foul playe by the defender

I think a large part of the problem is that the punishment for conceding a foul isn't harsh enough.

If there was adequate punishment for committing foul play/cheating the amount of frees conceded would drop instantly.

It's hard to claim one way or another I suppose. But in my view, there's fouls now considered for minimal contact, which according to the text book could be identified as a foul. But should they be? I think given the nature of the game, we should tolerate a higher level of contact. But given the tackle is so loosely defined it's hard to say how that would be done. I think refs tend to err more on the side of caution now for fear of being overanalysed. How often hear in club games how a ref gets praised for letting the game flow. You see that less and less at county level imo.

[Milltown Row2]

Dammed if you do dammed if you don't !!

[twohands!!!]

I watched 10 minutes of Monaghan and Tyrone and switched it over. Genuinely couldn't be arsed watching Monaghans slow build up, passing the ball across the pitch and back, constantly afraid or unable to slice a pass into the forwards. The outcome looked inevitable within minutes, Tyrone with everyone back, then breaking up field when Monaghan give it away and nick a score.  Boring predictable shite .

Football has become a game that is very difficult to attract a neutral, I struggle to watch games that ive no dog in the fight and anyone I talk to seems to be the same. Hurling still has the appeal that you can watch a game between 2 top teams and it keeps you interested, football not so much.

I'm getting the same way too. You watch a game, and head down to throw the laundry in the dryer, and three or four minutes later you come back and maybe, just maybe, there's been a point scored. Leaving aside our current predicament, I'm even close to giving up on watching Donegal, such is the lack of enjoyment to be had from watching them. I said it in the thread for last year's Ulster Final, a game in which we were very competitive and could have won, that it would have been a hollow victory, so grim was the fare that was served up (think I said the same in the '16 final when Tyrone nicked it right at the end). We had some promising, fast moving football under Bonner in 18 and 19, but its been utterly dreadful since then and unfortunately the vast majority of the other teams are the same. Even watching Dublin go about their methodical, systematic, possession-based takedown of the opposition towards the end of the six in a row period was as dull as watching paint dry.

Apart from David Clifford and Shane Walsh and the runners of Mayo and your county loyalty, there just isn't much to attract spectators in gaelic football these days.

You'd wonder how that's different to games 20 years ago when scorelines are broadly the same?

Plenty of reasons, more frees now a days, a lot more scores come from dead balls now than did in the early 00s for example, id love to see the free counts from games in the 00s compared to now, forwards are told to go down like they've been shot if touched inside the 45 as its a free hit for a score, again down to the stats. Less wides, teams are now instructed not to shoot outside 'scoring zone' and 'give it to the shooters' you end up with similar scores but far less entertainment, teams holding the ball rather than shooting a wide and giving up possession.

its a different game now, the days of players/ teams being man for man is pretty much gone unfortunately, I often look and think how would a Peter canavan or a Mulligan get by today?

The game is now dictated by analysis and GPS. players are given stats a after a game and there are teams that if the players stats aren't good he's dropped, no wonder players are robotic.

The more frees now is definitely an issue. In the 80's you'd have to take a limb off half the time to get a free. Too much diving and conning of the ref. The rules have all been tinkered to suit the forward in the hope this will make creative football. The adverse effect of that is that teams know one on one, 9 times out of 10, the forward will either get past the defender or win a free. Therefore the next logical step is to prevent 1 on 1's. Make it easier to defend, enforce the steps more, allow that bit more contact in the tackle and you'd see defenders might be more confident 1 on 1. Until then, logic will always make the least risky option the most favourable. And that means packed defences and breaking at speed to get a score or free in a good position.

The problem is that teams have worked out that it makes sense to foul a lot of the time.

While there is some diving and conning of the ref, it is only a tiny percentage of the time- well over 95% of the time a free is awarded it is because of foul playe by the defender

I think a large part of the problem is that the punishment for conceding a foul isn't harsh enough.

If there was adequate punishment for committing foul play/cheating the amount of frees conceded would drop instantly.

It's hard to claim one way or another I suppose. But in my view, there's fouls now considered for minimal contact, which according to the text book could be identified as a foul. But should they be? I think given the nature of the game, we should tolerate a higher level of contact. But given the tackle is so loosely defined it's hard to say how that would be done. I think refs tend to err more on the side of caution now for fear of being overanalysed. How often hear in club games how a ref gets praised for letting the game flow. You see that less and less at county level imo.

It's not that hard to see that under the current rules it makes sense for teams to go out and foul constantly.

If it didn't make sense to foul, teams wouldn't be doing it.

When's the last time there was a championsip game with no foul play/cheating ?

Anytime I hear any ref being praised for letting the game flow I just think it's a politically correct way of saying that the person is fine with allowing cheating if it makes the game more dramatic and that fairness isn't important to that individual.

Also the blame is never placed on players or management for a game not flowing/being stop-start when they have far more to do with it than a referee. I've yet to see a game where a referee was out there deliberately breaking the rules. The fact that as you go up the underage levels discipline gets worse and worse until you get to adult level is a pretty poor reflection on the GAA.

More physical contact adds pretty much nothing in my opinion. Requires little to no skill, just being willing to impose yourself/increase the risk of hurting your opponent. Just encourages lads to spend more time in the gym/less time practising skills/ punishes the smaller and weaker individual.

If people want to see a game where players bodies and welfare is put at risk for the sake of more physical contact there's plenty of rugby games to be found.

[From the Bunker]

Talked to a man in his 70's recently. He was saying he had not been to an underage club match in maybe 40 years and attended one recently. He was shocked at the level of everything. The gear, the warm up, the positional and tactical play, the skill level. (He was shocked at how professional it looked considering it was between two rural clubs).  He said what made football exciting in his day was that players made more mistakes, nothing was really tactical, game was man on man, everything was off the cuff.

[trueblue1234]

I watched 10 minutes of Monaghan and Tyrone and switched it over. Genuinely couldn't be arsed watching Monaghans slow build up, passing the ball across the pitch and back, constantly afraid or unable to slice a pass into the forwards. The outcome looked inevitable within minutes, Tyrone with everyone back, then breaking up field when Monaghan give it away and nick a score.  Boring predictable shite .

Football has become a game that is very difficult to attract a neutral, I struggle to watch games that ive no dog in the fight and anyone I talk to seems to be the same. Hurling still has the appeal that you can watch a game between 2 top teams and it keeps you interested, football not so much.

I'm getting the same way too. You watch a game, and head down to throw the laundry in the dryer, and three or four minutes later you come back and maybe, just maybe, there's been a point scored. Leaving aside our current predicament, I'm even close to giving up on watching Donegal, such is the lack of enjoyment to be had from watching them. I said it in the thread for last year's Ulster Final, a game in which we were very competitive and could have won, that it would have been a hollow victory, so grim was the fare that was served up (think I said the same in the '16 final when Tyrone nicked it right at the end). We had some promising, fast moving football under Bonner in 18 and 19, but its been utterly dreadful since then and unfortunately the vast majority of the other teams are the same. Even watching Dublin go about their methodical, systematic, possession-based takedown of the opposition towards the end of the six in a row period was as dull as watching paint dry.

Apart from David Clifford and Shane Walsh and the runners of Mayo and your county loyalty, there just isn't much to attract spectators in gaelic football these days.

You'd wonder how that's different to games 20 years ago when scorelines are broadly the same?

Plenty of reasons, more frees now a days, a lot more scores come from dead balls now than did in the early 00s for example, id love to see the free counts from games in the 00s compared to now, forwards are told to go down like they've been shot if touched inside the 45 as its a free hit for a score, again down to the stats. Less wides, teams are now instructed not to shoot outside 'scoring zone' and 'give it to the shooters' you end up with similar scores but far less entertainment, teams holding the ball rather than shooting a wide and giving up possession.

its a different game now, the days of players/ teams being man for man is pretty much gone unfortunately, I often look and think how would a Peter canavan or a Mulligan get by today?

The game is now dictated by analysis and GPS. players are given stats a after a game and there are teams that if the players stats aren't good he's dropped, no wonder players are robotic.

The more frees now is definitely an issue. In the 80's you'd have to take a limb off half the time to get a free. Too much diving and conning of the ref. The rules have all been tinkered to suit the forward in the hope this will make creative football. The adverse effect of that is that teams know one on one, 9 times out of 10, the forward will either get past the defender or win a free. Therefore the next logical step is to prevent 1 on 1's. Make it easier to defend, enforce the steps more, allow that bit more contact in the tackle and you'd see defenders might be more confident 1 on 1. Until then, logic will always make the least risky option the most favourable. And that means packed defences and breaking at speed to get a score or free in a good position.

The problem is that teams have worked out that it makes sense to foul a lot of the time.

While there is some diving and conning of the ref, it is only a tiny percentage of the time- well over 95% of the time a free is awarded it is because of foul playe by the defender

I think a large part of the problem is that the punishment for conceding a foul isn't harsh enough.

If there was adequate punishment for committing foul play/cheating the amount of frees conceded would drop instantly.

It's hard to claim one way or another I suppose. But in my view, there's fouls now considered for minimal contact, which according to the text book could be identified as a foul. But should they be? I think given the nature of the game, we should tolerate a higher level of contact. But given the tackle is so loosely defined it's hard to say how that would be done. I think refs tend to err more on the side of caution now for fear of being overanalysed. How often hear in club games how a ref gets praised for letting the game flow. You see that less and less at county level imo.

It's not that hard to see that under the current rules it makes sense for teams to go out and foul constantly.

If it didn't make sense to foul, teams wouldn't be doing it.

When's the last time there was a championsip game with no foul play/cheating ?

Anytime I hear any ref being praised for letting the game flow I just think it's a politically correct way of saying that the person is fine with allowing cheating if it makes the game more dramatic and that fairness isn't important to that individual.

Also the blame is never placed on players or management for a game not flowing/being stop-start when they have far more to do with it than a referee. I've yet to see a game where a referee was out there deliberately breaking the rules. The fact that as you go up the underage levels discipline gets worse and worse until you get to adult level is a pretty poor reflection on the GAA.

More physical contact adds pretty much nothing in my opinion. Requires little to no skill, just being willing to impose yourself/increase the risk of hurting your opponent. Just encourages lads to spend more time in the gym/less time practising skills/ punishes the smaller and weaker individual.

If people want to see a game where players bodies and welfare is put at risk for the sake of more physical contact there's plenty of rugby games to be found.

More contact does not equate taking the heads of everyone at each opportunity. Contact is a sliding scale not an all or nothing equation. We're obviously looking at the issue from two different viewpoints.
I've no problem with punishing constant fouling. But I think what constitutes a foul is an issue. It's now got impossible to defend one on one as there is so much in favour of the forward. They get freedom on steps, the slightest contact is punished, the forward mark. The outcome of favouring the forward so much means teams defend more trying to reduce the risk. It's plain to see how that is impacting teams. It's got too easy for refs to blow a free to a forward because technically it could be viewed as a foul. My issue is with the level of contact. It's got so light touch now imo that this causes the stop start nature of the game.
Anyway, we're miles away on how we view the issues, but there's no doubt there are serious issues.
At no point was I blaming the refs. They have a nightmare job. I wouldn't be one for any amount of money.

[Brendan]

https://twitter.com/FrTedQOTD/status/1638927799477227521?t=DZ8cCQav2IRXkw4-9-O8Rg&s=19

More of this will make it more entertaining

[Mario]

As a Derry fan it's the most i've enjoyed football for 20 years  . People are quick to judge - we are still in winter, there has been record rainfall and pitches are heavy, let's see what the football is like in the Summer. Remember when Armagh and Tyrone broke through in the early 00s and we had the puke football comments from Spillane. Now we look back on it as a glorious period. I find pre 2000s football almost funny to watch now, there are so many errors and as someone rightly pointed out the score tallies haven't changed much. It's amazing people think that is a better game.