Ulster Championship 2020

[Angelo]

The goal came from sloppy defending. You could trace most scores back to a point where a referee makes a mistake. There is no way Down should be able to work a score from that situation so easily so to blame the referee for that one is absolutely laughable.

What if a Down player kicked it straight to a Cavan player from the move and Cavan went and scored a goal? Would you have blamed the ref for that?

I know it came from sloppy defending, but you repeatedly miss the point, that sloppy defending wouldn't have happened like that if Cavan rightly got the ball. That goal came from the same possession within 10 seconds of that mark being kicked. A mark within the 45, which is obviously wrong. All I'm saying, is that if that was not a mark, but a sideline to Cavan, then that exact move would not have happened, and we can't say that goal would have happened. That's a big swing. You're over complicating the whole situation. The fact is that goal would not have happened if Cavan got the sideline ball. Jeez man...

I'm not the one completely missing the point, it's you is missing the point. If we apply your logic, you could trace most scores back to a refereeing mistake, if you look at the Cavan penalty you could probably argue a free that Down should have been awarded in the minute or two before it and argue that if that free had been awarded the goal wouldn't have been scored.

The bottom line is, the point that you keep missing is, that the award of the free is not the reason Down scored that goal, no team should be able to run the ball from their 45 yard line without having a glove laid on them and score a goal. That goal was not the referee's fault. If you want to attribute every minor error the ref makes to a score you could be there all day.

The difference between that mistake and the Reilly one is absolute night and day.

Ok, answer me this simply. Would that goal have been scored in that way, if Cavan got the sideline ball, and Down did not get the 45?

Quite possibly if that's the way Cavan were set up in the first half.

It was the wrong decision but it was not the reason for the goal. Allowing a team to run the ball from their own half without getting a glove on them is not the referee's fault.

So you think the exact same goal, with the exact same move would happen, even if Cavan got the ball. Please stop man  you're embarrassing yourself

They may well have scored a goal that half, but not that one, as both teams would have set up for the sideline ball differently, and Down would not have had the ball to attack a stretched Cavan defence. That is my point, just ridiculous you think they could have scored that goal if the decision went the other way.

It's very possible Down would have scored a similar goal yes. Down ran the ball from their 45 yard line without a Cavan player laying a glove on them.

You are fairly reaching to be putting the blame at the referee in that situation.

So you're finally admitting that Down would not have scored that goal if the ball went to Cavan? Glad you've seen the light. Finally. And if they could have scored similar goals, why didn't they? Fact is they benefitted from a bad referring decision. Luckily Cavan won, so it didn't matter so much in the grand scheme

Couldn't tell you.

What ifs aren't certain.

[Dreadnought]

It shouldn't be difficult to sort out a second tier championship.

Based on leagues Div 3/4 are in the B championship and Div 1/2 in Sam Maguire

Winners of the league move up and Winners of the second tier championship move up, two teams.

That means two teams drop out of the Sam Maguire, If the winners of the league and second tier championship are the same team then next in the league goes up.

Relegation playoff to decide who drops down based on league positions, so in the unlikely event that a team being relegated from Div 2 wins Sam Maguire then they stay up and its the next in the lowest position goes down..

Almost everything should be based on league standings. Getting to the final of your province should not be a means to keep you up

With respect, that last bit is rubbish. I still don't know why they are using the league mainly as the gauge here for championship. Should use championship for championship. That you say reaching a provincial final shouldn't matter vs league is nonsense. Any team that does well in championship should be rewarded more than only on a league in winter/spring. Imagine getting to a provincial final and they say nah, B championship for you due to your league placing 3 months ago...

Munster championship and Waterford get to a final as Cork and Kerry meet in the first round.. Waterford should be in the Sam Maguire even though they are Div 4?

They will likely still have to get past past Clare and Tipperary so yes. But that example is a long shot, when was the last time Waterford to to the MSFC final? But saying that, if they go on a run and get to the final, they absolutely deserve their chance

No they don't deserve it, they are Div 4 and that's that. When Kerry and Cork play on same side of draw it serves up a mismatch final usually. Clare were div4 two years ago. Tipp only recently making an impact but that'll fade.

Base it on the leagues, works well for the hurling and promotion produces teams that can compete and improve, Laois a great example as is Dublin, not that far back I remember Antrim always giving Dublin their fill of it, now they have stormed ahead and have managed to stay ...

If teams know their progression into Sam Maguire is based on league performance then they'll be putting big effort into their training and conditioning.

Again we'll all hold personal views on this based on where you actually see your own county.

So even though they do better in Championship than league (which is the point, you want to be better in championship) then you'd deny them further progress in the championship after reaching a final, based on league position from 3 months before? That's madness. And even the GAA know its madness hence why they have this failsafe built in. The whole point is a good championship run is rewarded sufficiently, and they can deal with this if it happens. But it will be rare

[Dreadnought]

The goal came from sloppy defending. You could trace most scores back to a point where a referee makes a mistake. There is no way Down should be able to work a score from that situation so easily so to blame the referee for that one is absolutely laughable.

What if a Down player kicked it straight to a Cavan player from the move and Cavan went and scored a goal? Would you have blamed the ref for that?

I know it came from sloppy defending, but you repeatedly miss the point, that sloppy defending wouldn't have happened like that if Cavan rightly got the ball. That goal came from the same possession within 10 seconds of that mark being kicked. A mark within the 45, which is obviously wrong. All I'm saying, is that if that was not a mark, but a sideline to Cavan, then that exact move would not have happened, and we can't say that goal would have happened. That's a big swing. You're over complicating the whole situation. The fact is that goal would not have happened if Cavan got the sideline ball. Jeez man...

I'm not the one completely missing the point, it's you is missing the point. If we apply your logic, you could trace most scores back to a refereeing mistake, if you look at the Cavan penalty you could probably argue a free that Down should have been awarded in the minute or two before it and argue that if that free had been awarded the goal wouldn't have been scored.

The bottom line is, the point that you keep missing is, that the award of the free is not the reason Down scored that goal, no team should be able to run the ball from their 45 yard line without having a glove laid on them and score a goal. That goal was not the referee's fault. If you want to attribute every minor error the ref makes to a score you could be there all day.

The difference between that mistake and the Reilly one is absolute night and day.

Ok, answer me this simply. Would that goal have been scored in that way, if Cavan got the sideline ball, and Down did not get the 45?

Quite possibly if that's the way Cavan were set up in the first half.

It was the wrong decision but it was not the reason for the goal. Allowing a team to run the ball from their own half without getting a glove on them is not the referee's fault.

So you think the exact same goal, with the exact same move would happen, even if Cavan got the ball. Please stop man  you're embarrassing yourself

They may well have scored a goal that half, but not that one, as both teams would have set up for the sideline ball differently, and Down would not have had the ball to attack a stretched Cavan defence. That is my point, just ridiculous you think they could have scored that goal if the decision went the other way.

It's very possible Down would have scored a similar goal yes. Down ran the ball from their 45 yard line without a Cavan player laying a glove on them.

You are fairly reaching to be putting the blame at the referee in that situation.

So you're finally admitting that Down would not have scored that goal if the ball went to Cavan? Glad you've seen the light. Finally. And if they could have scored similar goals, why didn't they? Fact is they benefitted from a bad referring decision. Luckily Cavan won, so it didn't matter so much in the grand scheme

Couldn't tell you.

What ifs aren't certain.

Indeed, but we can be certain that goal wouldn't have been scored if Down weren't awarded that mark

[mrdeeds]

Can we talk about the final.

[Milltown Row2]

If you are a team in div 4 your main goals are promotion, winning the All Ireland is not happening. Steady progression through  Div 3 to gain promotion and you're at least ready to compete in your province (unless you're in Leinster)

If you win a B championship along the way then happy days!

This continued mismatch games (before this year) were poor shows (in my view)

It's got to happen and some teams will be feel aggrieved at the start..

[Itchy]

Can we talk about the final.

Bonner must be worried, playing daft auld mind games about poor Michael Murphy getting no protection. From what I see, Murphy is well able to dish it out too. Wasnt Bonner over one of those U21 teams Cavan bet back in the day, one with McBrearty on it?

Anyway, I have no idea why and I have no logical reason for this but I think Cavan will go for this and might rattle Donegal.

[Milltown Row2]

Can we talk about the final.

Bonner must be worried, playing daft auld mind games about poor Michael Murphy getting no protection. From what I see, Murphy is well able to dish it out too. Wasnt Bonner over one of those U21 teams Cavan bet back in the day, one with McBrearty on it?

Anyway, I have no idea why and I have no logical reason for this but I think Cavan will go for this and might rattle Donegal.

Would need to play for two half this time!

How tired would the lads be leading up to this? Both teams?

[Itchy]

Can we talk about the final.

Bonner must be worried, playing daft auld mind games about poor Michael Murphy getting no protection. From what I see, Murphy is well able to dish it out too. Wasnt Bonner over one of those U21 teams Cavan bet back in the day, one with McBrearty on it?

Anyway, I have no idea why and I have no logical reason for this but I think Cavan will go for this and might rattle Donegal.

Would need to play for two half this time!

How tired would the lads be leading up to this? Both teams?

It was interesting listening to Mickey Harte who said hed prefer his team to be playing the games rather than have a break waiting. Cavan have finished all their games well so fitness hasn't been an issue yet. Would Donegal have preferred a tougher game in the semi, I think so.

[Cunny Funt]

Does anyone know to Cavan now avoid the B Championship next yr as a result of making this final? I read somewhere that was the case.

https://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2019/1019/1084423-two-tier-senior-football-championship-to-begin-in-2020/

It may be subject to change due to Covid - who knows

Not decided on yet. If the CCCC choose to have a regional league for 2021 (starting February 20th BTW) then the likes of Tipp and Cavan will avoid the All-Ireland B competition next summer.

If the normal NFL is played off then Cavan, Tipperary would have to either gain promotion to Division 2 or reach another provincial final to avoid the B All-Ireland.

Looking likely that the Super 8s will be scrapped and a return to the knock out stand alone Quarter final.

[BennyCake]

Does anyone know to Cavan now avoid the B Championship next yr as a result of making this final? I read somewhere that was the case.

https://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2019/1019/1084423-two-tier-senior-football-championship-to-begin-in-2020/

It may be subject to change due to Covid - who knows

Not decided on yet. If the CCCC choose to have a regional league for 2021 (starting February 20th BTW) then the likes of Tipp and Cavan will avoid the All-Ireland B competition next summer.

If the normal NFL is played off then Cavan, Tipperary would have to either gain promotion to Division 2 or reach another provincial final to avoid the B All-Ireland.

Looking likely that the Super 8s will be scrapped and a return to the knock out stand alone Quarter final.

If the normal NFL is replaced in 2021 with a regional NFL, then the B championship shouldn't happen next year (personally i think it should never happen).

Super 8 or knockout QFs - hardly matters in the great scheme of things, as the whole AI structures are a load of bollix.

[Cunny Funt]

Does anyone know to Cavan now avoid the B Championship next yr as a result of making this final? I read somewhere that was the case.

https://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2019/1019/1084423-two-tier-senior-football-championship-to-begin-in-2020/

It may be subject to change due to Covid - who knows

Not decided on yet. If the CCCC choose to have a regional league for 2021 (starting February 20th BTW) then the likes of Tipp and Cavan will avoid the All-Ireland B competition next summer.

If the normal NFL is played off then Cavan, Tipperary would have to either gain promotion to Division 2 or reach another provincial final to avoid the B All-Ireland.

Looking likely that the Super 8s will be scrapped and a return to the knock out stand alone Quarter final.

If the normal NFL is replaced in 2021 with a regional NFL, then the B championship shouldn't happen next year (personally i think it should never happen).

Super 8 or knockout QFs - hardly matters in the great scheme of things, as the whole AI structures are a load of bollix.

They are going to plough along with the B All-Ireland next year regardless. Shouldn't have brought it back IMO but those in Congress thought otherwise.

Knock out Qfs gives the underdogs a better chance of reaching All-Ireland semi finals plus knock out football is better than group system for the last 8 again in my opinion.

[Rossfan]

Mr Covid will influence a lot of decisions.

[armaghniac]

I'm sure Cavan will be looking forward to a semi final with Meath.

[mrdeeds]

No individual player deserves protection especially one that refs the game himself. Murphy should have got gate last year in first few minutes.

[Dreadnought]

No individual player deserves protection especially one that refs the game himself. Murphy should have got gate last year in first few minutes.

Indeed he should have, I'd hazard that any other player would have got the line for that. So maybe that does swing both ways, the big players do get targeted, but do get decisions like this too. Part and parcel of being the big player I suppose