The IRISH RUGBY thread

Started by Donnellys Hollow, October 27, 2009, 05:26:16 PM

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Hound

Quote from: Syferus on November 26, 2018, 03:17:31 PM
Farrell seems the smart choice to replace Schmidt. I read that the only teams to prevent the All Blacks scoring a try in 23 years were us a week ago and the Lions last summer, both defensively coached by Farrell. Clearly he was about to get a head coaching job somewhere, so why not with us and try to ensure some continuity with our best ever management team post-WC?

England may come to regret letting Farrell walk in the aftermath of the Lancaster disaster.
Farrell is definitely the right choice.

How much credit he should get for the shut outs (versus the head coach and/or the players on the day) is open for debate. Clearly himself and Lancaster failed for England, and who was most to blame for that also open to debate. Lancaster seems to be doing brilliantly for Leinster and most people give him more credit than Cullen, and who knows whether that's right or wrong.

Second in commands to great managers don't have that great a record when going alone. Ferguson's second in commands at ManU often failed when moving on. Neil Francis in the Sindo (prone to exaggeration, but others can comment whether this is BS or not) said that over many years 34 of Bill Belichick's coaches (Francis rates Belichick as one of the greatest coaches in any sport ever) moved on to other jobs, and only 1 was successful  ;D 

QuoteThe Belichick coaching tree is a salutary lesson for organisations that think they have hired someone who has supped on the salmon of knowledge. Eight of Belichick's assistant coaches have been hired as NFL coaches. Seven assistant coaches have become head coaches at NCAA level. Nineteen assistant coaches have been eagerly recruited to be assistant coaches in other franchises. That's a lot of coaches who worked with The Man, who probably thought they knew what was what. Knew the systems, heard the crucial calls being made. They could do that. They have experienced it. No!

Only one coach, Nick Saban, has been a success. The rest of them, who coached brilliantly talented rosters, floundered badly. They posted losing records and shuffled away into the shadows, barely acknowledging the lack of intellectual breadth and intuition. You either have it or you don't. A singular lack of personality. Found out!

But Andy Farrell is the obvious choice to succeed Joe. Whether he'll work our or not is a different issue!

seafoid

http://sport24.lefigaro.fr/rugby/xv-de-france/actualites/le-xv-de-france-ne-repond-plus-934821

Les Bleus ont perdu pour la première fois de leur histoire face aux Fidji. Une humiliation de plus pour cette génération sans caractère.
Évidemment, dans les jours qui viennent, on va se pencher sur les causes profondes, structurelles, récurrentes de ce fiasco majuscule . Ridicule. Grotesque.

France lost for the first time in their history to Fiji. Another humiliation for this characterless team. Obviously in the next few days we will look at the
deep, recurring, structural causes of this major fiasco.
Ridiculous. Grotesque


"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

seafoid

Discuss

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/brian-o-driscoll-opens-up-about-use-of-legal-painkillers-when-he-was-playing-1.3721692
Brian O'Driscoll opens up about use of legal painkillers when he was playing

'It almost became like habit' says former Ireland and Lions captain

Gavin Cummiskey



Brian O'Driscoll leaves the field injured in his last match for Leinster, against Glasgow in May 2014. Photograph: Patrick Bolger/Inpho.
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The prescription painkillers Difene and co-codamol were regularly handed out  to Leinster and Ireland rugby players so they could 'play their best game', former Ireland captain Brian O'Driscoll has revealed.
"I'd have been part of teams where the doctor would have walked down the bus on the way to games inquiring who wanted what in advance [of kick-off]," said O'Driscoll on Off The Ball. "For me, for the last couple of seasons, part of my match prep would have been a Difene and couple of co-codamol."
O'Driscoll was speaking in the context of a International Rugby Players' survey that revealed 45 per cent of players feel pressured by coaches and staff to play while injured.
He never felt such pressure.
"In the Leinster and Irish set-ups you could get your hands on difene. You got to fight your case a bit more now, and prove their necessity. Drug cabinets that might have been open once upon a time are very much shut and inaccessible.
"It used to be for sleepers as well. Diazepam [valium] to try and counteract what would happen with the caffeine [tablets] because they couldn't sleep.
"I'm not saying it was the culture but it happened."
Asked to explain the value of such drugs, by OTB presenter Joe Molloy, he replied, "Just a painkiller if I was carrying something. You know what? It almost became like habit, where it gave me a fighting chance if I wasn't feeling 100 percent that it might have levelled it up."

'Perfectly legal'
"Which might have been most of the time?" asked Molloy.
"Which was probably a lot of the time. That is the reality of it. I wouldn't have been the only one doing that. It was usually the older players, just to get you to balance the equilibrium, almost of feeling okay.
"I'm sure at times in my subconscious I would have taken it where maybe I could have done without it," O'Driscoll continued. "If it is perfectly legal there is no need for TUEs [Therapeutic Use Exemptions] , give yourself a chance of playing your best game.
"I also had caffeine before games. I'd have three little tablets of caffeine, like chewing gum. You'd get into a routine where I knew exactly what I was doing, I had it down to the final seconds. As soon as I ran out on the pitch I'd bash it away and do my pre-warm up before we got together with the team.
"That was part and parcel of the last four or five years of my career."
Difene, co-codamol and Diazepam all require prescriptions to purchase in a pharmacy.
On the related issue of player welfare, O'Driscoll added: "This definitely comes into the realms of player welfare where they won't protect [players] from themselves, from taking these things.
"You play games, you make money, you've a better quality of life. It's a simple pyramid; you've more chance of success the more you play.

No adverse effects
"I wouldn't change a whole lot, now . . . I haven't felt any adverse effects. Ask me at 75 and see what the state of my insides are like. I didn't take so many Difene that I'm concerned but there would be players out there taking them every single day, that can't be good for you. "
Also during the interview on Wednesday Night Rugby concerns were raised about the damage Difene does to a person's insides.
"I'd never take Difene on an empty stomach. That would absolutely pull your stomach apart. I was always very conscious not to take it with orange juice or a cup of coffee. You'd need to eat and make sure you've a full stomach and I never had an issue."
O'Driscoll, Ireland's most capped player and record try scorer, retired from rugby in 2014.
"It's always something that stayed with me," said the 39 year old. "I'd have some Difene in my golf bag now. Might not take one before I tee off but stiffen up on the round I might take a Difene."
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

AZOffaly

This cannot be a surprise. The punishment these lads take, they have to be taking painkillers just to turn around and play the next week.

Insane Bolt

The use of these painkillers was the cause of Lewis Moody being diagnosed with Ulcerative Colitis in 2005.

seafoid

Quote from: AZOffaly on December 06, 2018, 10:25:12 AM
This cannot be a surprise. The punishment these lads take, they have to be taking painkillers just to turn around and play the next week.
It is all about money . So is concussion
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Dinny Breen

Quote from: seafoid on December 06, 2018, 10:49:54 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on December 06, 2018, 10:25:12 AM
This cannot be a surprise. The punishment these lads take, they have to be taking painkillers just to turn around and play the next week.
It is all about money . So is concussion

That is professional sport.
#newbridgeornowhere

Walter Cronc

I wonder is it the same at high level inter county football/hurling in August/September when games are coming thick and fast?

GetOverTheBar

Quote from: Walter Cronc on December 06, 2018, 10:58:21 AM
I wonder is it the same at high level inter county football/hurling in August/September when games are coming thick and fast?

O'Driscoll put in his book he used to take Ibuprofen prior to games to start the recovery process as soon as possible. This story doesn't surprise me at all.

I'd say it's not as rampant in the GAA, for all intents and purposes they aren't in the same league contact wise.

seafoid

Quote from: Dinny Breen on December 06, 2018, 10:55:59 AM
Quote from: seafoid on December 06, 2018, 10:49:54 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on December 06, 2018, 10:25:12 AM
This cannot be a surprise. The punishment these lads take, they have to be taking painkillers just to turn around and play the next week.
It is all about money . So is concussion

That is professional sport.
Maybe rugby shouldn't be professional, Dinny.
Being a gym bunny is one thing when the sport is based on avoiding people .
Rugby is all about attrition and bodies aren't designed for professional attrition.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

seafoid

Quote from: Walter Cronc on December 06, 2018, 10:58:21 AM
I wonder is it the same at high level inter county football/hurling in August/September when games are coming thick and fast?
You could probably measure intensity levels of rugby vs GAA over say 70 vs 80 mins and then recovery times.
The GAA season is definitely shorter at the highest level. What counts is the frequency of pharma use over the long term.

In fairness the IRFU have done a good job reducing the exposure of players to too many matches but the body recovery issue is still a problem.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Dinny Breen

Quote from: seafoid on December 06, 2018, 12:43:00 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on December 06, 2018, 10:55:59 AM
Quote from: seafoid on December 06, 2018, 10:49:54 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on December 06, 2018, 10:25:12 AM
This cannot be a surprise. The punishment these lads take, they have to be taking painkillers just to turn around and play the next week.
It is all about money . So is concussion

That is professional sport.
Maybe rugby shouldn't be professional, Dinny.
Being a gym bunny is one thing when the sport is based on avoiding people .
Rugby is all about attrition and bodies aren't designed for professional attrition.

At least being professional means being accountable, unlike the GAA they treat concussion and player burn-out seriously..
#newbridgeornowhere

Tony Baloney

Quote from: seafoid on December 06, 2018, 12:47:25 PM
Quote from: Walter Cronc on December 06, 2018, 10:58:21 AM
I wonder is it the same at high level inter county football/hurling in August/September when games are coming thick and fast?
You could probably measure intensity levels of rugby vs GAA over say 70 vs 80 mins and then recovery times.
The GAA season is definitely shorter at the highest level. What counts is the frequency of pharma use over the long term.

In fairness the IRFU have done a good job reducing the exposure of players to too many matches but the body recovery issue is still a problem.
The IRFU have, but the Premiership in England is an absolute grind. The big boys like Saracens etc. can rotate squads to a certain extent but I'd say some of the smaller teams have boys patched together going across the white line.

Dinny Breen

Btw I say if you did a quick poll of the serious footballers such as AZ or BC1 I would be surprised if they've never taken pain killing pills or injection to play an important match..
#newbridgeornowhere

screenexile

Yeah I've taken painkillers before a match not that often but definitely 2/3 times . . . I remember on one occasion thinking I wouldn't be fit for a match and the manager landed at my house before the game "The doc says they're strong but they'll sort you out"

I was 23 and had a badly bruised thumb. They didn't sort me out I couldn't catch the ball but the other times were just niggly injuries where I probably didn't need them but took them anyway as they were available.