Tyrone v Monaghan the battle for Ulster’s heart aisf 2018

[Jayop]

All the Tyrone boys (correctly) asking for fairness in the post match discussion of refereeing errors after the crying many of them did about McQuillan following the Donegal game.

I thought the vast vast majority of the discussion after the Donegal game was that Cavanagh should have had a black card?? Hardly Tyrone people complaining about that. In the Donegal game Tyrone got dry humped in the first half and Donegal got the worst of it in the second. The quality of reffing in the country is clean shocking. There's not a single close game that goes by now without one team or the other thinking they got rode. I see it every Tyrone game, I see it watching games as a neutral. Christ even Gough who will probably get the final can be brutal at times giving off the ball frees for nothing.

[Keyboard Warrior]

Where can the game be watched in full? Link? Thanks.

I think this feature hasn't been available for the past few years (certainly this year anyway) and you can only watch snippets from the Sunday Game rather than the full thing. As far as I can see, it is due to GAA GO being released. GAA charge to watch games back (and also The Sunday Game programmes).

[Fuzzman]

I've not had time to read too much of this thread but here's my quick thoughts on yesterday

I was sitting in the middle of the lower Hogan and it was 95% Monaghan and very loud and foul mouthed around me. The amount of times I heard the phrase ye cheating Tyrone tr**p used was despicable. One "lady" behind me had a 4 year old on her knee and the language out of her was unreal, so much so I turned to her at one point and said can you try to tone it down a bit for your kids sake. That's awful language and she told me its not her F-ing daughter and to turn around and F**K off. I did.

I had Scooby Doo with me and that got loads of laughs and craic and some good photos including one of him sitting behind the TV Camera.

I thought Monaghan got a harder time with the ref than we did but then again my thoughts could be influenced by the very vociferous fans around me. Had I been with Tyrone fans I made have felt the other way.

It certainly looked like SOME of the Monaghan players were playing for frees and the one right at the end was never a free and I think you could tell the ref had noticed that Hughes was taken on JUST to win frees and cause panic.

Despite being called all sorts yesterday as I was totally outnumbered in our section, I did feel for the Monaghan fans. You could see that they and their players had put a HUGE amount of effort into the whole performance and they must wonder what the hell it takes to beat Tyrone in Croker. I think some would say a draw would have been a fair result but I'd say the ref didn't want to play extra time anyway.
I saw loads of fans crying after the game but in fairness a good few shook my hand on the way out (NOT THE ONES around me)
Did you notice one of the Monaghan players rejected a hand shake from McKernan I think it was.

One last point, I think when an underdog like Monaghan play a team like Tyrone for the chance to get to their first AI final for the first time in years, it will always influence the neutrals in how they view the game and how certain decisions dont go the way you would wanna see. I spoke with a Fermanagh fan today and she said totally disgusted with the whole game yesterday. Thought Tyrone were terrible rough and dirty and diving and the ref rode Monaghan time and time again. She's usually sound but I could just tell she wanted Tyrone OUT and was angry that the marginal calls went Tyrones way not the underdog. She thought 3 mins was a total travesty despite what they said on TSG last night

Having lived in Dublin for 22 years now and have 4 kids (One still a red hander) I have been looking forward to this final since I moved here. There is already some craic in work and I think I'll put up a few more flags and posers around my desk. Scooby Doo-her is already sitting up in his red Rockwell shirt

[J70]

All the Tyrone boys (correctly) asking for fairness in the post match discussion of refereeing errors after the crying many of them did about McQuillan following the Donegal game.

I thought the vast vast majority of the discussion after the Donegal game was that Cavanagh should have had a black card?? Hardly Tyrone people complaining about that. In the Donegal game Tyrone got dry humped in the first half and Donegal got the worst of it in the second. The quality of reffing in the country is clean shocking. There's not a single close game that goes by now without one team or the other thinking they got rode. I see it every Tyrone game, I see it watching games as a neutral. Christ even Gough who will probably get the final can be brutal at times giving off the ball frees for nothing.

Refs get one look in real time in a very fast game, with other players often obscuring their view. On top of that you have players playacting, exaggerating and provoking. Refereeing is a thankless enough task without the vilification they receive on top of it, including from this forum. A lot of fans (of all teams) are blinkered idiots with no conception of the difficulty of the referee's job. I'd imagine it's hard enough to recruit and keep capable refs, but honestly, in this day and age especially, I don't know why they bother or how they can justify the abuse they're subjecting themselves to. I don't know what it's like in Ireland, but they're having great difficulty in parts of the US getting referees for underage soccer due to the abuse they have to take from fans and parents. I'd love to know where these people think we are going to end up?

[trueblue1234]

Look I could understand why some Monaghan fans were annoyed with the ref. I didn't think he was good and Tyrone got the benefit of a couple more wrong calls than Monaghan. But there's always over analysis of the losing sides mistakes. I don't know why some posters get so wound up because of that. I know had I been a Monaghan supporter yesterday I'd be fairly p!ssed of the day as well.
Course the genuinely annoyed Monaghan posters shouldn't be confused with some of the Derry/ Armagh posters on here who are less worried about the performance of the ref, as by the fact Tyrone progressed. T'is these that are trying to take a couple of decisions or missed decisions and make out that Tyrone are any more cynical than any of the other top teams.
If When Dublin win, all will be right with their world again, while the rest of the us worry about how the feck you get closer to beating Dublin. 

[Jayop]

All the Tyrone boys (correctly) asking for fairness in the post match discussion of refereeing errors after the crying many of them did about McQuillan following the Donegal game.

I thought the vast vast majority of the discussion after the Donegal game was that Cavanagh should have had a black card?? Hardly Tyrone people complaining about that. In the Donegal game Tyrone got dry humped in the first half and Donegal got the worst of it in the second. The quality of reffing in the country is clean shocking. There's not a single close game that goes by now without one team or the other thinking they got rode. I see it every Tyrone game, I see it watching games as a neutral. Christ even Gough who will probably get the final can be brutal at times giving off the ball frees for nothing.

Refs get one look in real time in a very fast game, with other players often obscuring their view. On top of that you have players playacting, exaggerating and provoking. Refereeing is a thankless enough task without the vilification they receive on top of it, including from this forum. A lot of fans (of all teams) are blinkered idiots with no conception of the difficulty of the referee's job. I'd imagine it's hard enough to recruit and keep capable refs, but honestly, in this day and age especially, I don't know why they bother or how they can justify the abuse they're subjecting themselves to. I don't know what it's like in Ireland, but they're having great difficulty in parts of the US getting referees for underage soccer due to the abuse they have to take from fans and parents. I'd love to know where these people think we are going to end up?

It is a thankless task, and it is a very hard job, but the standard at the moment is just terrible and it's having a negative effect on the games. Players play act because a lot of times they have to, there's no reward for trying to stay on your feet when you're being fouled so why do it? In terms of abuse for refs I don't think that's any worse now than it ever was. Refs were always being called blind bastards of being told to wear the jersey. The problem in the GAA and in a lot of soccer refs too is that there's no punishment for being an awful ref, they keep being given high profile games over and over despite being useless. I know a lad who's been trying to break into the intercounty scene for a long time and all he gets is linesman and possibly first sub ref for the mens game. Maybe he's not good enough but unless he's given a chance to prove it we'll never know. One thing we do know is that the likes of Coldrick and that fella yesterday just aren't good enough. We've had Coldrick 3 times this year in the championship and on the line yesterday. I already outlined one of the most bizarre decisions I've ever seen that happened right at his feet. It was inexplicable that he didn't call a foul but he didn't. Should we be thanking him for that after the game?

I don't know what the answer is. I don't think bringing in VAR would work because even after seeing  the replays a lot of the decisions are still hard to call and VAR would ruin the game as a spectacle.

[J70]

The answer is that it is going to get worse. Refs may always have been abused (a relative of mine helped throw a ref into the River Finn in Ballybofey decades ago during a game!), but the microanalysis of every missed call and online piling on was not a factor until recently. You're going to end up with even poorer refereeing at all levels and even shortages at lower levels because even the capable ones are going to say "f**k it, it's not worth the abuse" and not stick at it.

[Jayop]

I'd say decent young refs not getting a crack at the bigger games is probably more of a risk to losing them than a bit of analysis.

[Jim Bob]

you can be sure that rte/gaa will have had a very hard word in the refs ear to make sure tyrone do not make the final at all cost.

Well thebigdog. Some post you put up earlier. Reckon the ref is deaf?

[SouthDublinBro]

I think a major source of the Monaghan anguish is that their supporters had a real feeling that it was "their time". Tyrone on the other hand were the younger squad with time on their side. You get the feeling that Monaghan are going in the opposite direction to this Tyrone team. Tyrone were there for the taking but getting to an All Ireland final will do wonders for them over the next few years.

I would safely wager that a lot of those Monaghan players will not get so close to an AI Final again. Their veteran harder tacklers will be difficult to replace. We could be looking at a mirror of the slow Donegal decline after losing that final to Kerry as 'softer' players replace those veterans.

[straightred]

All the Tyrone boys (correctly) asking for fairness in the post match discussion of refereeing errors after the crying many of them did about McQuillan following the Donegal game.

I thought the vast vast majority of the discussion after the Donegal game was that Cavanagh should have had a black card?? Hardly Tyrone people complaining about that. In the Donegal game Tyrone got dry humped in the first half and Donegal got the worst of it in the second. The quality of reffing in the country is clean shocking. There's not a single close game that goes by now without one team or the other thinking they got rode. I see it every Tyrone game, I see it watching games as a neutral. Christ even Gough who will probably get the final can be brutal at times giving off the ball frees for nothing.

Refs get one look in real time in a very fast game, with other players often obscuring their view. On top of that you have players playacting, exaggerating and provoking. Refereeing is a thankless enough task without the vilification they receive on top of it, including from this forum. A lot of fans (of all teams) are blinkered idiots with no conception of the difficulty of the referee's job. I'd imagine it's hard enough to recruit and keep capable refs, but honestly, in this day and age especially, I don't know why they bother or how they can justify the abuse they're subjecting themselves to. I don't know what it's like in Ireland, but they're having great difficulty in parts of the US getting referees for underage soccer due to the abuse they have to take from fans and parents. I'd love to know where these people think we are going to end up?

It is a thankless task, and it is a very hard job, but the standard at the moment is just terrible and it's having a negative effect on the games. Players play act because a lot of times they have to, there's no reward for trying to stay on your feet when you're being fouled so why do it? In terms of abuse for refs I don't think that's any worse now than it ever was. Refs were always being called blind b**tards of being told to wear the jersey. The problem in the GAA and in a lot of soccer refs too is that there's no punishment for being an awful ref, they keep being given high profile games over and over despite being useless. I know a lad who's been trying to break into the intercounty scene for a long time and all he gets is linesman and possibly first sub ref for the mens game. Maybe he's not good enough but unless he's given a chance to prove it we'll never know. One thing we do know is that the likes of Coldrick and that fella yesterday just aren't good enough. We've had Coldrick 3 times this year in the championship and on the line yesterday. I already outlined one of the most bizarre decisions I've ever seen that happened right at his feet. It was inexplicable that he didn't call a foul but he didn't. Should we be thanking him for that after the game?

I don't know what the answer is. I don't think bringing in VAR would work because even after seeing  the replays a lot of the decisions are still hard to call and VAR would ruin the game as a spectacle.

As it happens I disagree with you on the incident you're describing - i didn't think Hughes fouled him and a line ball was fair enough. However, that aside the rest of your post is spot on. He wasn't up to the job and he shouldn't be let near a big game like this again. He has previous - donegal will remember him as the fellow who relegated them earlier this year by missing a loads of steps for Mayo's equaliser in the final league game. I'll remember him for the inexplicable frees he gave to harte and cavanagh. Didn't wexford make a video about him a few years ago too when they were on the wrong end of his genius ?

[straightred]

I think a major source of the Monaghan anguish is that their supporters had a real feeling that it was "their time". Tyrone on the other hand were the younger squad with time on their side. You get the feeling that Monaghan are going in the opposite direction to this Tyrone team. Tyrone were there for the taking but getting to an All Ireland final will do wonders for them over the next few years.

I would safely wager that a lot of those Monaghan players will not get so close to an AI Final again. Their veteran harder tacklers will be difficult to replace. We could be looking at a mirror of the slow Donegal decline after losing that final to Kerry as 'softer' players replace those veterans.

Whats changed really ? Bar a meltdown Dublin will be back in the semi next year and the other Div 1 teams plus Donegal and maybe kildare will fight it out for the other 3 spots. There's hardly a kick of a ball between any of them

[From the Bunker]

I think a major source of the Monaghan anguish is that their supporters had a real feeling that it was "their time". Tyrone on the other hand were the younger squad with time on their side. You get the feeling that Monaghan are going in the opposite direction to this Tyrone team. Tyrone were there for the taking but getting to an All Ireland final will do wonders for them over the next few years.

I would safely wager that a lot of those Monaghan players will not get so close to an AI Final again. Their veteran harder tacklers will be difficult to replace. We could be looking at a mirror of the slow Donegal decline after losing that final to Kerry as 'softer' players replace those veterans.

I doubt many Monaghan Fans lost the run of themselves in regards an AI title. Most just wanted the magic of seeing their county in an AI Final. Monaghan will dust themselves down and go again. Players will retire, be dropped. But there won't be a conveyour belt of replacements. Why, because Monaghan is a very small county! And punching well above its weight.

Dublin continue to be ''The Problem''. Their dominance, helped by almost every advantageous factor continues to grow the gap between them and the chasing bunch. 

[imtommygunn]

While i think corey's age hindered them a but yesterday and mone getting on a bit I don't think overall that monaghan team is that old. Mcmanus 30 but atill a few years in him.drew wylie looks older than he is i suspect.

[J70]

I'd say decent young refs not getting a crack at the bigger games is probably more of a risk to losing them than a bit of analysis.

"A bit of analysis"??