The OFFICIAL Liverpool Supporters thread

[Carmen Stateside]

Imo Liverpool club as a whole are looking to get out of the deal and this includes Rafa! Alonso's pre season form i think has had a big bearing on it! I think the voice of the fans could have changed a few minds also!

[Mentalman]

True about the Valencia situation, as I said he's an obstinate man, but if the right opening were to come along who knows, I still expect Schuster to get the boot at Madrid sooner rather than later too. It's a strange situation, as I think most Liverpool fans, in fact most soccer fans, think Barry is over priced. However open differences between the Manager and the owners/chief executive are not the Liverpool way, and yet again point to the breakdown in communication over the last 18 months. In the current circumstances the majority of fans will support the manager.

[Mentalman]

Imo Liverpool club as a whole are looking to get out of the deal and this includes Rafa! Alonso's pre season form i think has had a big bearing on it! I think the voice of the fans could have changed a few minds also!

True, but with Rafa it's a case of his way or no way at all, and I can't see him taking this quietly. Hopefully I'm wrong. As I written before, I'm a big Alonso fan, mostly because I think Liverpool need to get back to pass and move and he's the man to pull the strings, but if the price of him staying were to be Rafa going it would be a high one. Also if they lose Benitez I'm not sure how long someone like Torres would stay, especially as he is so highly sought after as it is.

[Minus15]

If we lose Benitez you may as well say another 5 years before we get close to the title again. A new man coming in trying to build his own side takes time. The Liverpool side now is the best equipped squad we have had to put up a challenge for the last 15 years. Rafa has them organised and playing well and are very difficult to play against. Transferring the knack of getting results against the top teams in Europe to against the top teams in the prem is a must! 3 home wins and 3 away draws could win the league for us this year! Start with a win at anfield on sept 13th and go from there!

[Mentalman]

Rafa - Alonso may still leave
Reds midfielder will be sold for the right price

By Chris Burton   Last updated: 9th August 2008

Liverpool boss Rafa Benitez has refused to rule out the possibility of selling Xabi Alonso.

The Spain international appears to have become the victim of the Reds' continued pursuit of Aston Villa midfielder Gareth Barry.

He has the full support of the Anfield faithful, though, who backed him throughout Friday's friendly against Lazio, while also displaying their opposition towards any move for Barry.

However, Benitez appears to have turned a deaf ear to the views from the terraces, admitting that a suitable offer could yet see him part with a popular member of his squad.

Price

"We knew Alonso was a very good player and as a result he had a good price (on his head). We had offers, but they were not enough so we decided he needed to stay with us," said the Spanish coach.

"It could be that he does stay with us.

"For me it is not a problem if he stays or not. He can stay, we always have felt he is a good player.

"We are only talking about a very, very good price. He is a good player, if he is not going to bring a good price then it is very simple, easy to understand.

"I heard the crowd, obviously. We know now, as we knew before, that he could stay with us."

Possibilities

Benitez needs to sell in order to fund any potential bid for Barry and admits that there are likely to be changes within the Reds camp before the new season gets underway.

"It is not positive that we may not have the players we want here before the Champions League game," he said.

"But the transfer window closes at the end of August, we will try to do our best to bring in the players to improve us by then.

"I try to do the best for my club with the possibilities that you have, I have done this every year since I have been here. And I am trying to do the same for this coming season.

"I do not feel any more pressure, every season is the same. We have a good squad, better than before, but we can improve a little bit more."

http://www.skysports.com/football/competition/0,19734,11660,00.html

Once Rafa sets his mind to something he is like a dog with a bone...

[el_cuervo_fc]

RAFA TURMOIL
Liverpool face same old enemy - themselves


UNDER PRESSURE - Kop boss Rafa Benitez
By CHRIS BASCOMBE, 10/08/2008

NOT for the first time in his Liverpool career, Rafa Benitez feels undermined, embarrassed and isolated by his board.

His summer pursuit of Gareth Barry over, Benitez has two options.


He can accept the decision and use the £18million earmarked for the Villa man to make an alternative target — David Silva — the third most expensive player in Liverpool's history.


Or, as his latest cryptic Press conference hinted, he can end the uneasy truce since 'Klinsmanngate' made Liverpool the grubbiest story in town and ensure the new campaign starts amid similar chaos.


So hurt is Benitez by what he perceives as a challenge to his leadership, even his hierarchy have no idea what he'll do or say next.


They hope Benitez will be wise enough to see, on top of the £20m spent on Robbie Keane, the kitty available would be the envy of every other Premier League manager outside Stamford Bridge.


Instead, Benitez spent part of Friday backing a move from Belfast tycoon John Miskelly to loan the club £12m for transfers.


Such a proposal was doomed. It wasn't that Hicks and Gillett couldn't meet the asking price for Barry. They just didn't want to.


The decision not to pursue Barry wasn't due to lack of funds, nor did it reflect a mistrust of Benitez's judgement in the transfer market.


Put simply, the Americans didn't think Barry was worth the money and would rather the manager invested elsewhere on the team.


The delay in enforcing that decision was bewildering — doubts about the deal were first reported in this paper two weeks ago — but the argument has validity.


The circumstances which made a deal seem attractive in May had altered.


Benitez originally said Xabi Alonso would be sold and Barry recruited at a profit.

But as the summer progressed, it became clear that would not happen and if the deal had gone through, Alonso would have gone for nothing like the £25m Benitez had hoped for. In fact, Liverpool would have made a huge loss.

Strategy
If such a strategy was applied at every football club, it's the quickest way towards bankruptcy, especially as Alonso is one of Liverpool's most popular assets inside and outside the dressing room.


At every club, a line has to be drawn. Even Bill Shankly was sometimes told to think again when he drew up a list of targets.


Any concerns Hicks and Gillett harboured about how their decision would be received were eased against Lazio when The Kop, always more sympathetic to the underdog, warmly supported Alonso.


Alonso was given the same backing Benitez received when it was he who was seeing replacements courted behind his back.


What the latest spat demonstrates is the poor working relationship between Benitez and his board was never cured. It was like trying to heal a terminal wound with a sticking plaster.


There is a dangerous philosophical split in how Liverpool should be run which is irreparable, so the club is limping along making the best of a woeful situation. In recent years, Benitez has become a bullfighter as much as manager, engaging in one public scrap after another.


His closest aides act as if they relish and invite public confrontation to try to alert the fans to disagreements, rather than resolving differences with private discussions. This is the latest example.


Hicks and Gillett, for all their flaws, were as infuriated as Martin O'Neill when the pursuit of Barry was made public.


They've begun to recognise the conflict between Benitez's approach to transfer deals — firmly rooted in the Real Madrid tradition — and the Liverpool way, which the fans crave a return to.

Misery
The situation won't be resolved until one side, or all, are finally moved on, putting themselves and the increasingly fed-up Liverpool fans out of their misery.

It would enrage the supporters if Benitez said enough was enough, but the Spanish boss is cunning enough to recognise Liverpool's ownership issue remains unresolved and he might yet see off both Hicks and Gillett, who still can't stand each other.


The Dubai International Capital interest in Liverpool is all but dead, but that of Sheikh Mohammed is not.


He's now instructed alternative Arab investment companies from his vast portfolio to make capturing a controlling interest at Anfield a priority.


It's hoped a £240m bid for a 60 per cent stake may be enough to tempt Gillett and Hicks to sell-up — with both receiving £120m and a share of future profits.


Such a deal is still some way off, however, and for now Liverpool must head into a new campaign facing the same eternal questions.


"It's hard enough trying to fight Manchester United and Chelsea without fighting each other," captain Steven Gerrard warned last May.


Once again, Liverpool's most dangerous opponents appear to be themselves

http://forums.liverpoolecho.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=48432

[el_cuervo_fc]

From Arab press

DIC ready for fresh Liverpool bid


The National Staff

Last Updated: August 09. 2008 11:37PM UAE / August 9. 2008 7:37PM GMT DUBAI // Dubai International Capital (DIC) have made it clear they still want to buy Liverpool, as the club's ownership battle threatens to flare up again over the proposed transfer of Gareth Barry.

Manager Rafa Benitez is reported to be at loggerheads with Liverpool's American owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett after it emerged the duo had turned down an offer of a £12million (Dh84.6m) interest-free loan to help to buy Aston Villa midfield player Barry, 27.

Benitez had waited all week for money to be put in place to allow him to end the Barry saga before he sells any more players to fund the deal. But the US owners' failure to produce the promised short-term loan may mean the £18m transfer deal could soon be dead.

The debacle might play straight in to the hands of long-term suitors DIC who have let it be known they are still waiting in the wings with their own proposals for the club.

The investment group had a £400m offer for the Merseyside club turned down in March and a source close to DIC said: "Just because it is has been a quiet summer does not mean DIC have lost interest. They are happy that things have now become low key, and they are awaiting developments."

There is also speculation a former prospective buyer, and several rich US-based fans, are ready to help the club out of their cash problems.

Observers believe plans for the new stadium have, as yet, not included confirmed building contracts or the lease being agreed with the local council. The club's owners are also going to have to find cash soon to fund the stadium as well as re-finance the current loans.

But the delay over the Barry deal is beginning to embarrass Liverpool. As soon as it was suggested the owners were looking to borrow money to fund the deal, City sources – admittedly close to the DIC bid – insisted borrowing would be difficult in the current climate.

http://forums.liverpoolecho.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=48436

[Mentalman]

Somethings got to give here.

[Chrisowc]

Somethings got to give here.

Hopefully dum and dummer fcuk right off.  And take Parry with them!

[GalwayBayBoy]

This Barry thing has been a complete fiasco. It's not the job of the owners to be telling the manager what players he should or should not be buying. The manager is given his budget and he should be free to spend it how he chooses if he believes it will improve the team. The owners are only there to sign the cheques not to query the managers judgement. They either have faith in him or not.

[slow corner back]

The whole point is surely that Liverpool do not have the money to buy Barry without selling players or borrowing more. The owners/ banks will have the final say on any more borrowing. The owners have stumped up quite a lot of cash for Rafa and apart from torres most of it has been badly spent.

[under the bar]

Surely Hicks and Gillett have the right to put their employee Benitez in his place and tell him what's what?  Same goes for the fans. Who owns the club after all?

[Mentalman]

Surely Hicks and Gillett have the right to put their employee Benitez in his place and tell him what's what?  Same goes for the fans. Who owns the club after all?

Maybe, but previously David Moores didn't slap down Rafa, or Houllier or Evans, in public, this type of stuff was all discussed and agreed in private. Also I'm not sure dumb and dumber actually agree on principle, but rather agree they don't want to spend anymore money than they need too to keep the club competitive until one of Sheik Mohammed's investment vehicles moves in. As mentioned by GBB it's more typical for the owners to agree a budget with the manager which he can spend as he pleases, rather than veto who the manager should and shouldn't sign, after all what do a pair of septic tanks know about "soccer"? 

[gawa316]

The owners have stumped up quite a lot of cash for Rafa and apart from torres most of it has been badly spent.

Yeah Mascherano, Babel, Skrtel, Lucas etc etc have all been a waste of money. What was Rafa thinking

[BerfArmagh]

Liverpool have turned into a real mickey mouse club. Rafa loses the run of himself, if he had'nt shouted his big mouth off in the first place and done his business on the QT, he would'nt be embarassed as he currently is.

At the end of the day, the money is'nt there. Rafa to spit his dummy out by the end of the week