Clerical abuse!

[The Iceman]

anyone can quote one line to tout whatever agenda they want Eamonn.....
tis you that has been had by the world

[Eamonnca1]

While the findings of the Cloyne report are undoubtedly shocking, what is equally as shocking is the political and media response which reveals how infantile a society we have become. While the largely anti-catholic media whip up a wave of hysteria, devoid of any balance or rational thought, our politicos respond with Knee Jerk proposals which clearly have not been thought through. Meanwhile on liveline and forums such as this, the great unwashed, most of whom have never darkened the Door of a Church, or entertained an original thought, jump on the Bandwagon to vent their spleen. We have our fair share of these idiots on this forum. Rupert Murdock and Tony O Reilly did not become millionaires by overestimating their stupidity.

How would you prefer to "balance" the discussion?  Would you like to hear these paedophiles justifying their sadistic and evil tendencies while an interviewer nods politely and "understands" why they did this?

Why do you find it so hard to condemn these child-raping sickos, Pangurban?

[Eamonnca1]

anyone can quote one line to tout whatever agenda they want Eamonn.....

Now you're catching on, old boy! 

[Pangurban]

EamonnCa1, I have no difficulty condemning these child abusing sickos, i hope they rot in hell. My problem lies with the public hysteria we are witnessing, which is being employed by cynical elements to condemn the Church and all it stands for. Rational debate has been rendered almost impossible. If the agenda is to drive the Church and its adherents, out of the marketplace and exclude them from all public debate, it will not succeed.

[Tyrones own]

Myles you made yourself quite clear, your agenda is the separation of Church and State, the abuse and the cover up are simply props for your soap box. You display no genuine apathy.

I don't stand by the Church for any of what happened. But I still stand before God, I still want to meet God in the Eucharist and I cannot do that without the Priests and the Church.

Do we need a cleansing, a reorganisation, a fresh start? Absolutely! I want to be part of it and I will be part of it.
I am by no means rubbishing the results of any report, or washing over anything that happened. But if you're going to beat a drum at least march with your own band.

Bullshit. I stand for the defence of all irish citizens from torture, abuse and rape. These victims were Irish citizens first and foremost. My "agenda" is a seperation of church and state to protect the future children of this country. My agenda is the absolute tough punishment of anyone who does this to kids and equally anyone who tries to cover it up. I have nothing against anything else you say in your post except in this country you should be doing this in your own time.

Tough punishment me hole....if it were joe blow on the street you'd be in the
Front line crowing about rehabilitation and how the state let him down or looking into his  past for possible explanations for his actions
You're clearly uncomfortable in your own skin so nothing surprises me as to your views of others.

Oh and "standing to defend all Irish citizens"
don't make me laugh ye fecking clown...sure you refuse
To stand on your own two feet here on the board
...hiding behind an ignore list

[mylestheslasher]

EamonnCa1, I have no difficulty condemning these child abusing sickos, i hope they rot in hell. My problem lies with the public hysteria we are witnessing, which is being employed by cynical elements to condemn the Church and all it stands for. Rational debate has been rendered almost impossible. If the agenda is to drive the Church and its adherents, out of the marketplace and exclude them from all public debate, it will not succeed.

Do you also condemn the bishops who covered it up and the vatican who also covered it up as outlined in the Cloyne report? While the abusing of the children is horrific, in my opinion those who covered it up are equally as bad. Wouldn't you agree or am I just being hysterical?

[Eamonnca1]

EamonnCa1, I have no difficulty condemning these child abusing sickos, i hope they rot in hell. My problem lies with the public hysteria we are witnessing, which is being employed by cynical elements to condemn the Church and all it stands for. Rational debate has been rendered almost impossible. If the agenda is to drive the Church and its adherents, out of the marketplace and exclude them from all public debate, it will not succeed.

The objective is not to "drive them out of all public debate". The objective is to drive them out of the institutions of the state, and rightly so. And it bloody well will succeed. Your attempt to portray the church as the martyr will not succeed, they're reaping what they've sown and they deserve it.

To condemn a child-raping and child-torturing paedophile is not "hysteria," it is the only rational thing a human being can do.

[Eamonnca1]

Tough punishment me hole....if it were joe blow on the street you'd be in the
Front line crowing about rehabilitation and how the state let him down or looking into his  past for possible explanations for his actions

Really? Can you give me a link to a post from anyone on here (apart from religious apologists like yourself) who have defended paedophiles?

[mayogodhelpus@gmail.com]

Myles you made yourself quite clear, your agenda is the separation of Church and State, the abuse and the cover up are simply props for your soap box. You display no genuine apathy.

I don't stand by the Church for any of what happened. But I still stand before God, I still want to meet God in the Eucharist and I cannot do that without the Priests and the Church.

Do we need a cleansing, a reorganisation, a fresh start? Absolutely! I want to be part of it and I will be part of it.
I am by no means rubbishing the results of any report, or washing over anything that happened. But if you're going to beat a drum at least march with your own band.

There is absolutely no harm in a person Atheist or Theist to want seperation of church and state and still be disgusted in what happened.

There is no reason a true Republic should have to use a deity as some kind of legitimising factor. I do not care if the U.K., the U.S.A. or any other country may do the same. Maybe its time for Ireland to be a leader in this case and help forge a true Republic legitmite because of its people not because of a deity.

Its also time for a foreign power like the Vatican to be removed from any place of influence in our Republic. The confessional of the Vatican church can not be exempt from Irish law. No other church be they other Church of Ireland, Presbyterian, Methodist, Islam, Judaism, Hindus etc. should be allowed to have similar power. It is this corrupt power that has tied the hands of our Gaurds and TD's for years, similary the Reformed Churchs had similar power strangling the freedoms of the people up North. Without this power how long do you think the Catholic and other churchs have been able to cover up their multitude of abuses of peoples liberties.

[mayogodhelpus@gmail.com]

anyone can quote one line to tout whatever agenda they want Eamonn.....
tis you that has been had by the world

"Die Religion ... ist das Opium des Volkes" 

[mayogodhelpus@gmail.com]

EamonnCa1, I have no difficulty condemning these child abusing sickos, i hope they rot in hell. My problem lies with the public hysteria we are witnessing, which is being employed by cynical elements to condemn the Church and all it stands for. Rational debate has been rendered almost impossible. If the agenda is to drive the Church and its adherents, out of the marketplace and exclude them from all public debate, it will not succeed.

Drive the church (and all churches) from public debate - yes, drive its adherents out - no.

[Pangurban]

An idiotic statement, its adherents as you call them are the Church. As for EamonCA 1 question, yes i unreservedly condemn all who conspired to cover up these outrages, up to and including the Vatican. Perhaps those of you calling for the separation of Church and State ( a proposal with which i do not any problem), could clarify if it is the Church or God they wish to isolate

[mayogodhelpus@gmail.com]

An idiotic statement, its adherents as you call them are the Church. As for EamonCA 1 question, yes i unreservedly condemn all who conspired to cover up these outrages, up to and including the Vatican. Perhaps those of you calling for the separation of Church and State ( a proposal with which i do not any problem), could clarify if it is the Church or God they wish to isolate

No its not, the Church is the structures and administrators of the faith, the adherents are the believers/followers of that cult/faith.

Remove all churches, all deities, all toothfairies, all riversprites etc. from the Constitution of Ireland, from all the arms of the state and all its insitutions.

Its bad enough having a deity given such a special place in our States governance if it actually existed, but when it does not exist, never has existed and never will exist, well thats just an idiotic situation.

[Pangurban]

You are as well raving there as in Bed

[Eamonnca1]

An idiotic statement, its adherents as you call them are the Church. As for EamonCA 1 question, yes i unreservedly condemn all who conspired to cover up these outrages, up to and including the Vatican. Perhaps those of you calling for the separation of Church and State ( a proposal with which i do not any problem), could clarify if it is the Church or God they wish to isolate

What a bizarre question.

The catholic church (I assume that's the church you're talking about, there is more than one you know) has done a grand job of isolating itself.  I've wanted it to be removed from the institutions of the state for years before this scandal started breaking, the scandal has simply reinforced my point all the more.

I cannot isolate God because he doesn't exist.