The SDLP

Started by ardmhachaabu, April 23, 2010, 09:32:25 PM

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imtommygunn

Hopefully that was a lesson to south belfast. There shouldn't be  a DUPer in south belfast.

Eventually they will waken up. Currently the policy is basically if you don't vote for us SF will get in and in a lot of areas it is working. Eventually that has to die out - hopefully anyway.


Main Street

Quote from: Evil Genius on July 22, 2020, 01:55:10 PM
NI is hardly any less a "viable concern" than (post-oil) Scotland, Wales or large parts of England. Though all have thrived at various times in the past, and who knows, could be so again.

Likewise, who would have thought as recently as the late 1970's/early 1980's that the Republic, which had always been an economic basket case throughout its existence, would be the economic success story it is now?

in any case, we are where we are, and if NI were to join a UI in such circumstances, who is going to foot the bill?

Dublin? I think not.

The EU? Just ask eg the Greeks what they think of your chances there!

A dowry from Westminster? Good luck with that one.

Or maybe you're expecting a letter from America any day now?
You are 7 years behind the times when it comes to EU  and ECB economic policy since 2013.
The Greek fiscal deficit was  +1%   last year.
NI's fiscal deficit since  the turn of the century is about - 35%  to -38% on average. Year in year out in NI, the difference between income and expenditure  hovers around the 10bn mark for the last 20 years
All this GBP 200bn paid for by the extending the UK national debt by 200BN to a total of 2Tn.
The EU stood solid in support of the GFA,  in fact George Mitchell claimed recently that there would have been no GFA but for the EU. 
Why do you think the EU would not stand behind and support a UI referendum and offer solid support should the outcome be a  'positive' yes to a UI? The  ECB could purchase  Irish Gov bonds at zero interest  ad infinitum for years..

QuoteAnd while I accept that that might be possible in time and  without causing a violent backlash, it is never going to happen while there is a chance we may be entrusting our future to a government in Dublin in which SF has power and influence.

For the dogs on the streets know that SF in Dublin take their orders from SF in Belfast, who in turn take their orders from The Army Council.

And the Council? "Well they haven't gone away, you know", as someone famously said, even if the late Bobby Storey has:

The old Unionist bogeyman use to be Roman Rule and the harlot Pope whose apparent goal in life was to destroy all Ulster protestants after raping all the women. Now this bogey is replaced by the hidden demonic hands of the old ageing IRA council, as they depart one by one (socially distant) to their hereafter.

five points

Quote from: Main Street on July 23, 2020, 09:37:01 AM
The EU stood solid in support of the GFA,  in fact George Mitchell claimed recently that there would have been no GFA but for the EU. 

Mitchell is talking through his behind sadly. The EU barely lifted a finger to assist the cause of peace and in its predecessor EC & EEC forms tolerated 20 years of the Troubles and did nothing in response.

five points

Quote from: Franko on July 22, 2020, 11:41:28 PM
Quote from: five points on July 22, 2020, 05:30:12 PM
Quote from: Franko on July 22, 2020, 05:17:29 PM
Quote from: five points on July 22, 2020, 05:10:44 PM
Why is Brexit so pivotal? With the Republic caught on the hook this week for €16 billion, I suspect that support for EU membership will wane down here over the next while as cutbacks and tax hikes arising from Covid-19 start to bite.

Yeah, that's not likely to happen any time soon.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/brexit-eu-survey-italy-ireland-portugal-eurosceptic-poll-a8888126.html

When Irish people watch the "cutbacks and tax hikes arising from Covid-19" that the UK will inevitably introduce, it would take some snake oil salesman to convince them that the fault for this lies with the EU.

You know all those surveys tend to be paid for by the EU?

Lol, a cracking response.  The Czechs must have stiffed them on the bill. 😂

Laugh away. This was a Eurobarometer poll, bought and paid for by the European Parliament.

https://ec.europa.eu/commfrontoffice/publicopinion/index.cfm

https://www.newstalk.com/news/80-irish-people-vote-stay-eu-poll-finds-852096

Quote

A new survey has shown that, if a referendum on EU membership were held tomorrow, 83% of people in Ireland would vote to remain.

This is the second highest result in the EU, after the Netherlands.

The European Parliament survey
found that 8% here would vote to leave the bloc, while 9% were not sure.

While the same question asked in Britain saw 35% saying they would vote to leave the bloc, 53% would remain and 12% were not sure.

The Spring 2019 Eurobarometer was conducted three months ahead of the European elections.

Some 68% of respondents across the EU27 believe that their countries have benefited from being part of the EU.

armaghniac

Quote from: johnnycool on July 23, 2020, 08:39:56 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 23, 2020, 08:21:37 AM
I would feel exactly the same Rois. Brexit is a game changer for me. To me it should also show to unionists how little the DUP actually care about them and how it's all about themselves and feathering their own nests.

I think we (nationalists) always knew the DUP feathered their nests but their dogma in wanting to align with the very right wing of the torys and even Aaron Banks and the likes should be a wake up call for unionists but as we haven't really felt the pain of Brexit as yet I think those types of unionists will look to their pockets and maybe consider a UI just like some small n nationalists who would maybe have wavered slightly on a UI will be reinforced.

Shinners should be out with their appeasement rhetoric to at least attempt to win them over, but then Martina and Francie will open their gobs...

I think we all thought the DUP would feather their nests but that in general their voters would act to support the union, yet they all rolled in behind Brexit which is the biggest threat to the union since 1920. I find all of this very strange.
If at first you don't succeed, then goto Plan B

imtommygunn

They were conned.

armaghniac

Quote from: imtommygunn on July 23, 2020, 10:58:41 AM
They were conned.

Something that nobody seems very annoyed about, no heads rolled in the DUP, there has been no reflection on the issue at all.
Mind you, the likes of Simon Hamilton left and the DUP haven't a great profile among the younger voters.
If at first you don't succeed, then goto Plan B

Taylor

Quote from: armaghniac on July 23, 2020, 11:05:39 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 23, 2020, 10:58:41 AM
They were conned.

Something that nobody seems very annoyed about, no heads rolled in the DUP, there has been no reflection on the issue at all.
Mind you, the likes of Simon Hamilton left and the DUP haven't a great profile among the younger voters.

Armaghniac - no one is annoyed yet because nothing has really changed yet.

Just wait until January when they start to see changes and more importantly less money in their pockets.

The majority of people in NI care more about putting bread on the table than a political party - if you are hit in your pocket things change very quickly

Rossfan

Presumably DUPUDA and their voters thought Brexit would reintroduce a hard border and drive a wedge between 6 and 26?
Also of course it proved their überBritness.

When their annual heat period ends on 1st September will they have the brains to realise having a foot in the GB market and the 440m EU market is a unique positive for the North that they might be able to cash in on for the greater good?
Davy's given us a dream to cling to
We're going to bring home the SAM

marty34

Quote from: Taylor on July 23, 2020, 11:29:56 AM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 23, 2020, 11:05:39 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 23, 2020, 10:58:41 AM
They were conned.

Something that nobody seems very annoyed about, no heads rolled in the DUP, there has been no reflection on the issue at all.
Mind you, the likes of Simon Hamilton left and the DUP haven't a great profile among the younger voters.

Armaghniac - no one is annoyed yet because nothing has really changed yet.

Just wait until January when they start to see changes and more importantly less money in their pockets.

The majority of people in NI care more about putting bread on the table than a political party - if you are hit in your pocket things change very quickly

It will make no difference.

Check out the stories about the pogroms in the shipyards in the 1920's - it's all about being more british than the british.  The mentality is always no, no, no.  Will never change.

Unionists have only the DUP now.  It's back to a one party outfit for them.  The UUP have been swallowed up. 

It really is a head count now.  All boils down to the numbers game.

Taylor

Quote from: marty34 on July 23, 2020, 11:36:56 AM
Quote from: Taylor on July 23, 2020, 11:29:56 AM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 23, 2020, 11:05:39 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 23, 2020, 10:58:41 AM
They were conned.

Something that nobody seems very annoyed about, no heads rolled in the DUP, there has been no reflection on the issue at all.
Mind you, the likes of Simon Hamilton left and the DUP haven't a great profile among the younger voters.

Armaghniac - no one is annoyed yet because nothing has really changed yet.

Just wait until January when they start to see changes and more importantly less money in their pockets.

The majority of people in NI care more about putting bread on the table than a political party - if you are hit in your pocket things change very quickly

It will make no difference.

Check out the stories about the pogroms in the shipyards in the 1920's - it's all about being more british than the british.  The mentality is always no, no, no.  Will never change.

Unionists have only the DUP now.  It's back to a one party outfit for them.  The UUP have been swallowed up. 

It really is a head count now.  All boils down to the numbers game.

I take your point but back then most people only ever knew poverty and tough times.

There is a new generation of people who have had disposable income for a long time - if that starts to change expect a major shift and God forbid an independent party who is not about the green or orange...........I thought Alliance were that party but they cant keep from getting caught up in the mire of the hatred

marty34

Quote from: Taylor on July 23, 2020, 11:41:12 AM
Quote from: marty34 on July 23, 2020, 11:36:56 AM
Quote from: Taylor on July 23, 2020, 11:29:56 AM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 23, 2020, 11:05:39 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 23, 2020, 10:58:41 AM
They were conned.

Something that nobody seems very annoyed about, no heads rolled in the DUP, there has been no reflection on the issue at all.
Mind you, the likes of Simon Hamilton left and the DUP haven't a great profile among the younger voters.

Armaghniac - no one is annoyed yet because nothing has really changed yet.

Just wait until January when they start to see changes and more importantly less money in their pockets.

The majority of people in NI care more about putting bread on the table than a political party - if you are hit in your pocket things change very quickly

It will make no difference.

Check out the stories about the pogroms in the shipyards in the 1920's - it's all about being more british than the british.  The mentality is always no, no, no.  Will never change.

Unionists have only the DUP now.  It's back to a one party outfit for them.  The UUP have been swallowed up. 

It really is a head count now.  All boils down to the numbers game.

I take your point but back then most people only ever knew poverty and tough times.

There is a new generation of people who have had disposable income for a long time - if that starts to change expect a major shift and God forbid an independent party who is not about the green or orange...........I thought Alliance were that party but they cant keep from getting caught up in the mire of the hatred

Alliance are ok until you ask the important question: where do they stand on the union etc.?

All well being 'neutral' but no good when the elephant is in the room.  Only thing is that when their voters realise what will happen after Brexit, then they might think twice.

Rossfan

Weren't most Alliance voters anti Brexit?
They're also the ones who will in effect decide the "Border Poll".
Davy's given us a dream to cling to
We're going to bring home the SAM

LeoMc

Quote from: marty34 on July 23, 2020, 01:29:29 PM
Quote from: Taylor on July 23, 2020, 11:41:12 AM
Quote from: marty34 on July 23, 2020, 11:36:56 AM
Quote from: Taylor on July 23, 2020, 11:29:56 AM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 23, 2020, 11:05:39 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 23, 2020, 10:58:41 AM
They were conned.

Something that nobody seems very annoyed about, no heads rolled in the DUP, there has been no reflection on the issue at all.
Mind you, the likes of Simon Hamilton left and the DUP haven't a great profile among the younger voters.

Armaghniac - no one is annoyed yet because nothing has really changed yet.

Just wait until January when they start to see changes and more importantly less money in their pockets.

The majority of people in NI care more about putting bread on the table than a political party - if you are hit in your pocket things change very quickly

It will make no difference.

Check out the stories about the pogroms in the shipyards in the 1920's - it's all about being more british than the british.  The mentality is always no, no, no.  Will never change.

Unionists have only the DUP now.  It's back to a one party outfit for them.  The UUP have been swallowed up. 

It really is a head count now.  All boils down to the numbers game.

I take your point but back then most people only ever knew poverty and tough times.

There is a new generation of people who have had disposable income for a long time - if that starts to change expect a major shift and God forbid an independent party who is not about the green or orange...........I thought Alliance were that party but they cant keep from getting caught up in the mire of the hatred

Alliance are ok until you ask the important question: where do they stand on the union etc.?

All well being 'neutral' but no good when the elephant is in the room.  Only thing is that when their voters realise what will happen after Brexit, then they might think twice.
On a day to day basis it is not the important question. Day to day most people are more concerned about whether their bins will be lifted and roads fixed than they are about who the leisure centre or play park is named after.

Chief

Quote from: LeoMc on July 23, 2020, 01:54:05 PM
Quote from: marty34 on July 23, 2020, 01:29:29 PM
Quote from: Taylor on July 23, 2020, 11:41:12 AM
Quote from: marty34 on July 23, 2020, 11:36:56 AM
Quote from: Taylor on July 23, 2020, 11:29:56 AM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 23, 2020, 11:05:39 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 23, 2020, 10:58:41 AM
They were conned.

Something that nobody seems very annoyed about, no heads rolled in the DUP, there has been no reflection on the issue at all.
Mind you, the likes of Simon Hamilton left and the DUP haven't a great profile among the younger voters.

Armaghniac - no one is annoyed yet because nothing has really changed yet.

Just wait until January when they start to see changes and more importantly less money in their pockets.

The majority of people in NI care more about putting bread on the table than a political party - if you are hit in your pocket things change very quickly

It will make no difference.

Check out the stories about the pogroms in the shipyards in the 1920's - it's all about being more british than the british.  The mentality is always no, no, no.  Will never change.

Unionists have only the DUP now.  It's back to a one party outfit for them.  The UUP have been swallowed up. 

It really is a head count now.  All boils down to the numbers game.

I take your point but back then most people only ever knew poverty and tough times.

There is a new generation of people who have had disposable income for a long time - if that starts to change expect a major shift and God forbid an independent party who is not about the green or orange...........I thought Alliance were that party but they cant keep from getting caught up in the mire of the hatred

Alliance are ok until you ask the important question: where do they stand on the union etc.?

All well being 'neutral' but no good when the elephant is in the room.  Only thing is that when their voters realise what will happen after Brexit, then they might think twice.
On a day to day basis it is not the important question. Day to day most people are more concerned about whether their bins will be lifted and roads fixed than they are about who the leisure centre or play park is named after.

True - but you cannot deny that the constitutional question is the ever present undercurrent to every issue in the North.

It permeates literally everything - the area you live in, the school you go to, what your pass times are likely to be, what pub you drink in etc, etc, depressingly etc