Tyrone vs Mayo AISF Semi-Final - August 25th

[lynchbhoy]

cant see past a mayo win.
playing better at the moment.
Tyrone are the GAA villans at the present time so ref wont do them too many favours.
will the ref pull up mayo on their cynical fouling (not as highlighted as much this season as the red erses), will the ref penalise players for charging or taking too many steps with the ball - imo some tyrone players but most mayo players v guilty of both this season so far).
Harte might try to set tactical traps for mayo, but with the GAA top brass not wanting these tyrone bad boys to progress, I cant see them winning - just dont think they have the team for it yet. close but not close enough.

GAA and media want a mayo v dublin final and it looks like the GAA hq would prefer a mayo win (god knows they deserve it after all the years of heartbreak) - as they would reckon this young dublin team will be winning sam next year!

[larryin89]

cant see past a mayo win.
playing better at the moment.
Tyrone are the GAA villans at the present time so ref wont do them too many favours.
will the ref pull up mayo on their cynical fouling (not as highlighted as much this season as the red erses), will the ref penalise players for charging or taking too many steps with the ball - imo some tyrone players but most mayo players v guilty of both this season so far).
Harte might try to set tactical traps for mayo, but with the GAA top brass not wanting these tyrone bad boys to progress, I cant see them winning - just dont think they have the team for it yet. close but not close enough.

GAA and media want a mayo v dublin final and it looks like the GAA hq would prefer a mayo win (god knows they deserve it after all the years of heartbreak) - as they would reckon this young dublin team will be winning sam next year!

So it's a conspiracy ?

[Crete Boom]

cant see past a mayo win.
playing better at the moment.
Tyrone are the GAA villans at the present time so ref wont do them too many favours.
will the ref pull up mayo on their cynical fouling (not as highlighted as much this season as the red erses), will the ref penalise players for charging or taking too many steps with the ball - imo some tyrone players but most mayo players v guilty of both this season so far).
Harte might try to set tactical traps for mayo, but with the GAA top brass not wanting these tyrone bad boys to progress, I cant see them winning - just dont think they have the team for it yet. close but not close enough.

GAA and media want a mayo v dublin final and it looks like the GAA hq would prefer a mayo win (god knows they deserve it after all the years of heartbreak) - as they would reckon this young dublin team will be winning sam next year!

Personally I didn't think Deegan was swayed by Brolly ridiculous attempt to sway the ref against us in his All Ireland preview last year so I would be very surprised if he pays any attention to the Brolly rubbish about Mickey Harte/Sean Cavanagh for this game. He is a decent ref I think.

[BennyHarp]

If Tyrone are in with a chance with 15mins to go, they will win the game. It will have meant that this great Mayo team were not the free flowing attacking machine that they have been made out to be as Tyrone had matched them for 55mins. Mayo doubts will resurface and Tyrone are masters at closing out the big games.

And you accuse Emmett Ryan of lazy analysis, when have Mayo doubts surfaced previously?
What dont you say we choke in finals or we have no forwards 

The fact is that in every senior and minor championship since 1985, when they last won the minor all ireland title, Mayo's arses have fallen out of their challenge at some point, be that in Connaught,  AI Semi or final. (In that time Tyrone have won 5 minor AI and 3 Senior - which I would argue creates a tradition of winning big games) Now you can argue that they have won big games and I agree, yes they have, but they have never followed this up. I believe that this history plays on the mind of players and perhaps played a part in the nightmare finals v Kerry a few years ago. What I am saying, and if you read the rest of my post you'd probably have worked it out, is that this team have yet to prove they have greater mental fortitude than their predecessors - remember, this team lost the AI final last year! I think that that gives me enough evidence to back up my point, and it's not lazy analysis. (Plus I'm not selling book about my analysis which is why I was so critical - just like you may be on Martin Breheny!) I will reiterate (and I'm sure Mayo could hardly care less) that I will quite happily admit Mayo are a class team if they hammer Tyrone and go on to lift Sam. All I'm saying is hold your horses, boast when you win something and people like me all over the country will just have to suck it up! I'll be honest - ill be delighted or ye if you do!

Exactly what highorlow just said, we've lost AIFs in the past because we werent good enough, I dont think we've choked or have any lack of confidence

Do you genuinely think that having a tradition of winning All Ireland's plays no baring on a teams mindset? Why are Kerry always potential winners? Do they always had the best players? They are bought up to believe they are the best, their teams goes out and proves it and the cycle continues. If say, when Tyrone sat in the dressing room in the Marshes after Down beat them in the first round of the 2008 Ulster Championship and Mickey said, right lads, forget that, we're focusing on winning the All Ireland - do you genuinely believe that having won 2 all Ireland previously had no baring on that bunch of players having the belief to gone and do exactly that?

So the question I'm posing is, is this Mayo team good enough to break down all those stereotypes, to put 60 odd years of defeat behind them and believe they are good enough to lift Sam? All I'm saying is that I'm not 100% sure they are as it takes a very special team to make that break through and what they have done so far does not provide enough evidence to suggest they are any different from teams in years gone by. I just dont see the pedigree in this Mayo team to warrant the hype. The only All Ireland's to show for this bunch of players is one U21 championship in 2006, this is not exactly the stuff that generates huge optimism in my mind. Tyrone were winning All Ireland's for fun at underage by the time they made the big break through in 2003. That engendered a winning mentality and having beaten Kerry along the way in a few of those removed the mystic they create. So that's why I am a bit uneasy about proclaiming this team as the greatest before they actually prove it and why I'm quietly confident Tyrone will not be the canon fodder that Larryin89 and the lads think they will be.

And by the way - it won't bother me if they do live up to the hype, as I love to see great new teams come to the fore and their battles with Dublin over the next 3/4 years could be on a par with the Tyrone v Kerry battles on the mid noughties. Who wouldn't want to witness that again?

[macdanger2]

Do you genuinely think that having a tradition of winning All Ireland's plays no baring on a teams mindset? Why are Kerry always potential winners? Do they always had the best players? They are bought up to believe they are the best, their teams goes out and proves it and the cycle continues. If say, when Tyrone sat in the dressing room in the Marshes after Down beat them in the first round of the 2008 Ulster Championship and Mickey said, right lads, forget that, we're focusing on winning the All Ireland - do you genuinely believe that having won 2 all Ireland previously had no baring on that bunch of players having the belief to gone and do exactly that?

Of course having a tradition of winning has a bearing on a team's mindset, what you referred to previously however was the reverse - that Mayo not having a tradition of winning All Irelands will somehow affect this game. Tyrones recent success (not sure I'd call it a "tradition" a la Kerry / KK yet) will certainly be something they can draw on when the game is tight in the last few minutes but Mayo's lack of success (in All Ireland finals rather than semi finals remember) will not have any impact on them.

[Zulu]

Donegal had no recent underage success prior to winning the All Ireland last year and Laois were an underage powerhouse but never even played in a senior All Ireland final so I don't think you can question Mayo's ability to win on that basis. The bottom line for me is that this Mayo team have proved to be mentally strong and will perform on Sunday. Are they good enough to win the All Ireland? I don't know, there are still aspects of their team I'd still question but I don't think they'll fold against anyone and that is all any supporter can ask for. The All Ireland will be hard won from here on in by whichever team wins it.

[BennyHarp]

Donegal had no recent underage success prior to winning the All Ireland last year and Laois were an underage powerhouse but never even played in a senior All Ireland final so I don't think you can question Mayo's ability to win on that basis. The bottom line for me is that this Mayo team have proved to be mentally strong and will perform on Sunday. Are they good enough to win the All Ireland? I don't know, there are still aspects of their team I'd still question but I don't think they'll fold against anyone and that is all any supporter can ask for. The All Ireland will be hard won from here on in by whichever team wins it.

When have they proven to be mentally strong?

By the way - Donegal weren't 2/7 favourites to beat Tyrone with people talking about the game being over at half time. It's the premature proclamation of greatness of this Mayo team that don't convince me. Also Donegal were the product of a unique manager who had instilled a winning mentality at u21 level - even though they lost by missing a last min pen in the u21 final I'm sure they believed they could have won that game and All Ireland.

[Zulu]

They've beaten the past 3 All Ireland champions, they conceded 2 goals in the first few minutes of last years All Ireland yet came back to make a game of it rather than folding their tents as some would have expected and they've hammered all before them so far. Mental toughness isn't only about winning tight games, it's about being able to deliver performances when you have to and this Mayo squad have tended to do that.

Mayo have no control over their betting price so I don't know what that has to do with anything and what is unique about Jim McGuinness, he has won one All Ireland and oversaw the worst hammering a defending champion has suffered in I don't know how many years?

[whitey]

cant see past a mayo win.
playing better at the moment.
Tyrone are the GAA villans at the present time so ref wont do them too many favours.
will the ref pull up mayo on their cynical fouling (not as highlighted as much this season as the red erses), will the ref penalise players for charging or taking too many steps with the ball - imo some tyrone players but most mayo players v guilty of both this season so far).
Harte might try to set tactical traps for mayo, but with the GAA top brass not wanting these tyrone bad boys to progress, I cant see them winning - just dont think they have the team for it yet. close but not close enough.

GAA and media want a mayo v dublin final and it looks like the GAA hq would prefer a mayo win (god knows they deserve it after all the years of heartbreak) - as they would reckon this young dublin team will be winning sam next year!

Personally I didn't think Deegan was swayed by Brolly ridiculous attempt to sway the ref against us in his All Ireland preview last year so I would be very surprised if he pays any attention to the Brolly rubbish about Mickey Harte/Sean Cavanagh for this game. He is a decent ref I think.

Watch the first 6 minutes of last years final.

Donegal man-high challenge-no card.

Mayo man-high challenge-card

The Donegal tackle was arguably much more dangerous and the commentators were shocked at the fact the Mayo player got a card.

It may have had nothing to do with Brolly, but perception becomes reality

[macdanger2]

By the way - Donegal weren't 2/7 favourites to beat Tyrone with people talking about the game being over at half time. It's the premature proclamation of greatness of this Mayo team that don't convince me. Also Donegal were the product of a unique manager who had instilled a winning mentality at u21 level - even though they lost by missing a last min pen in the u21 final I'm sure they believed they could have won that game and All Ireland.

Who's proclaiming greatness?? There seems to be an idea on Tryone supporters that if Mayo beat them, then it makes Mayo a "great" team!! Far from it lads. Winning the All Ireland is all that will make this (or any other) team very good - winning 2+ All Irelands is needed to be considered a great team.

[Captain Obvious]

Donegal had no recent underage success prior to winning the All Ireland last year and Laois were an underage powerhouse but never even played in a senior All Ireland final so I don't think you can question Mayo's ability to win on that basis. The bottom line for me is that this Mayo team have proved to be mentally strong and will perform on Sunday. Are they good enough to win the All Ireland? I don't know, there are still aspects of their team I'd still question but I don't think they'll fold against anyone and that is all any supporter can ask for. The All Ireland will be hard won from here on in by whichever team wins it.

2006,2010 minor,U-21 Ulster titles is what Donegal won and they would have won the U-21 All Ireland if Murphy didn't miss penalty with the last kick of the game.

K O'Malley; T Howley, G Cafferkey, K Higgins; C Barrett, T Cunniffe, C Boyle; S O'Shea, B Moran; A Campbell, J Dillon, A Kilcoyne; M Ronaldson, M Hannick, M Conroy. Subs - S Ryder, K Costello, E Varley.

Above is the 2006 Mayo U-21 team and those in red were good enough to win that All Ireland remains to be seen if they are good enough to win the senior All Ireland.

what is unique about Jim McGuinness, he has won one All Ireland and oversaw the worst hammering a defending champion has suffered in I don't know how many years?

2001 Kerry. People shouldn't forget before McGuinness took over Donegal they hadn't won Ulster title since 1992 and within two years he won Donegal the All Ireland.

[BennyHarp]

They've beaten the past 3 All Ireland champions, they conceded 2 goals in the first few minutes of last years All Ireland yet came back to make a game of it rather than folding their tents as some would have expected and they've hammered all before them so far. Mental toughness isn't only about winning tight games, it's about being able to deliver performances when you have to and this Mayo squad have tended to do that.

Mayo have no control over their betting price so I don't know what that has to do with anything and what is unique about Jim McGuinness, he has won one All Ireland and oversaw the worst hammering a defending champion has suffered in I don't know how many years?

I mentioned the betting merely as a reflection of how this Mayo team is perceived and the general consensus of them winning this game easily.

The examples you mentioned are all very good but have they any All Irelands to show for it? So ultimately they haven't achieved! One u21 AI in total since 1985 is not the pedigree of greatness or mental toughness in my mind.

[BennyHarp]

By the way - Donegal weren't 2/7 favourites to beat Tyrone with people talking about the game being over at half time. It's the premature proclamation of greatness of this Mayo team that don't convince me. Also Donegal were the product of a unique manager who had instilled a winning mentality at u21 level - even though they lost by missing a last min pen in the u21 final I'm sure they believed they could have won that game and All Ireland.

Who's proclaiming greatness?? There seems to be an idea on Tryone supporters that if Mayo beat them, then it makes Mayo a "great" team!! Far from it lads. Winning the All Ireland is all that will make this (or any other) team very good - winning 2+ All Irelands is needed to be considered a great team.

Ah FFS read back through this thread

[Captain Obvious]

By the way - Donegal weren't 2/7 favourites to beat Tyrone with people talking about the game being over at half time. It's the premature proclamation of greatness of this Mayo team that don't convince me. Also Donegal were the product of a unique manager who had instilled a winning mentality at u21 level - even though they lost by missing a last min pen in the u21 final I'm sure they believed they could have won that game and All Ireland.

Who's proclaiming greatness?? There seems to be an idea on Tryone supporters that if Mayo beat them, then it makes Mayo a "great" team!! Far from it lads. Winning the All Ireland is all that will make this (or any other) team very good - winning 2+ All Irelands is needed to be considered a great team.

Just Larryin89,Mayo Mick and Syferus i think.

[muppet]

Making Mayo favourites isn't proclaiming anything other than an expectation that 4 slaughters in a row is better form than back door form.

It won't matter a shite when the ball is thrown in.