This is 2009, right? Insanity at Knock!

[Lawrence of Knockbride]

FFS wise up. When people believe in something, their ma, da and granny doesn't come into it. They may have introduced them to it but the individual takes the choice. That is why we have non-believers, who were brought up the same as the believers.

"Do you still believe in Santa"?

You're a gimp.

The individual after a lifetime of (varying degrees of) indoctrination must at some stage open his mind to the possibility that what he has learned over the years is just a human control construct. I'm sure the vast majority (including St Teresa) question the very idea of there being such a thing as a god and at that point scurry back down into the safe burrow that they feel comfortable in, as they can't concieve a contented existence moving beyond that point where they believe god doesn't exist (both from an inner conscience and the social aspect of church going points of view). Non believers have went through the same questioning of faith and have simply had the balls to move away from safe ground as the evidence for believing in it is just not there when you actually go loooking for it (many don't). This blessed are those who have not seen and yet believe bullshit is the biggest controlling mechanism/get out clause in the church. Following a doctrine that was created by Romans 200 years after the death of Jesus using "selected" documents which were written in a totally different language to the area in which jesus lived, no earlier than 70 years after his death (most >100 years after)  does not make the Bible the word of God. The record shows that Christianity was used over the ages by the rulers to control the masses whilst the leaders of "the faith" abused and corrupted all around them.

But there aint to many "believers" who want to understand the history before they make these choices that you talk about. If deciding to keep the blinkers on and ignore historical and scientific evidence of the natural world then thats your choice. But it doesn't give you much to argue with.

Oh you're in for it now, not to mention going to hell.

[rossie mad]

I have read the thread and my first impression is that the people who believe in god and have faith are being ridiculed for doing so.

Several posters have likened to believing in God to some sort of stupidity or unwell mental state.

The poster questioning the evidence and proof of such a god says it couldnt possibly make sense.
I do have faith and had not such faith a few years ago.
Situations changed in my life which left me in a state of complete lonliness and depression (it involved the tragic death of a family member and my best friend) and the only thing i could turn too after this person died was a spark of faith that had been in me through my teenage and early adult years.
i had never been a strong religous person in fact quite the oppisite but i felt i could turn no where else and i know prayer didnt bring this person back but it helped me understand better what had just turned my world upside down including that of my family.
I believe i will see him again and that what makes me get through the bad times and i do feel him when im in need of help.
It was gods will that did this and i have to accept that and there is times i question this believe me there is times i just feel like giving up but thats the whole mystery of it.

It is his will in my view and i just live with it.
Im not imposing my beleifs on anyone or am i justifying religion but please dont ridicule my beliefs as hokey hackey because in my eyes they are not.

A poster asked believers to look at the history and id just like to tell that poster that his historical points are the same as i read in dan browns da vici code.
I doubt his creditionals as a theologian or a historical scholar are up to scratch.

my example i have not given lightly and please dont feel im playing a sympathy card because my life at the moment is wonderful.
Im marrying the woman i love and have a lovely son so i have no complaints.
Just dont ridicule my beleifs cause if you cant prove im wrong about god,im not going ask you to prove me right.

[theskull1]

Religion and the whole idea of a god in heaven to alot of people can be a great source of strength to those going through tough times...I get that and I suppose I would not want to shatter or convince people going through those tough times of the absence of god or an afterlife, but that does mean that there is such a thing as a god or a heaven. It is meerly a coping mechanism of the mind at play here and the god in heaven story plays to the mental frialties that I'm sure we all possess and makes understanding of tragedy easier on the mind.

wiki the history of the development of the new testament rossie if your so doubting of my points rather than simply ridiculing

I can tell you that once you have dependants especially that, you do not need a belief in a god to do good things, show good example and possess a strong mental resilience through all the shite this world throws at us. When you realise your children look to you for leadership there is no other way of behaving that I can think of. It's just built into our gene survival instincts. I'm sure for many, religious myths play a part in that whole mechanism but as I've said before that doesn't make the story true.

I would not liken a belief in a diety as showing someone up as stupid or unwell mentally. I would say blinkered would be a better description. Hands over eyes and ears because of the emotional investment paid down as well as the alternative being too difficult to comprehend. If thats where your at then thats where your at. I suggest that you don't read foums where people are able to share their views on such topics in case you read something you don't want to consider.

[ardmhachaabu]

Lawrence, it's not just you that takes this line - I am tired of immature people who think they can tell everyone how to think and ridicule people who have faith.  Apologies if I mistook you for something you aren't 

[Gnevin]

Lawrence, it's not just you that takes this line - I am tired of immature people who think they can tell everyone how to think and ridicule people who have faith.  Apologies if I mistook you for something you aren't 

What would you say to some one who claimed to believed in the Flying Spaghetti Monster ,Celestial Teapot or  Invisible Pink Unicorn?

[ardmhachaabu]

Read my other posts to find out.

[Gnevin]

Read my other posts to find out.

I have and I haven't seen  anything related to this.

[ardmhachaabu]

Tough sh1t then, I am not repeating myself for the likes of you.

You simply aren't worth it

[Gnevin]

Tough sh1t then, I am not repeating myself for the likes of you.

You simply aren't worth it

Your not repeating yourself as you one asked you this before.  Typical of the god squad to ignore the hard questions 

[theskull1]

Lawrence, it's not just you that takes this line - I am tired of immature people who think they can tell everyone how to think and ridicule people who have faith.  Apologies if I mistook you for something you aren't 

Tough sh1t then, I am not repeating myself for the likes of you.

You simply aren't worth it

  immature indeed

Many thanks for trying to enlighten us 

[ardmhachaabu]

Lawrence, it's not just you that takes this line - I am tired of immature people who think they can tell everyone how to think and ridicule people who have faith.  Apologies if I mistook you for something you aren't 

Tough sh1t then, I am not repeating myself for the likes of you.

You simply aren't worth it

  immature indeed

Many thanks for trying to enlighten us 

Anyone following the thread will see you quoted me out of context and will also be able to see why I couldn't be bothered with Gnevin the WUM

If you have to sink so low to try and get one over on me without even trying to refute anything I said earlier in the thread, fair play to you 

[theskull1]

Whaaaa I seriously am confused. Set me in the direction and I'll try to understand where your coming from. How did I take you out of context

You said earlier that you believed in apparitions because the children who seen what the seen possessed vocabulary beyond their years. I can't think of anything else other than you belive in god that there is to refute.

Do I need to go back further? And what have I said to you that you describe as "sinking so low" 


Is this an attempt to just fall out and walk away from a difficult discussion? It looks like it. ...you'll not be the first

[ardmhachaabu]

Whaaaa I seriously am confused. Set me in the direction and I'll try to understand where your coming from. How did I take you out of context

You said earlier that you believed in apparitions because the children who seen what the seen possessed vocabulary beyond their years. I can't think of anything else other than you belive in god that there is to refute.

Do I need to go back further? And what have I said to you that you describe as "sinking so low" 


Is this an attempt to just fall out and walk away from a difficult discussion? It looks like it. ...you'll not be the first

Well, if you read that particular post then you will see my response to Gnevin was justified - he is being a WUM.  He doesn't deserve me to repeat myself.  End of.

So when you quoted my replies to Lawrence and Gnevin, you were quoting me out of context. 

Everyone on the board knows Gnevin is a WUM - this is one of his all-time favourite topics to be a WUM on.  Have you not noticed this before?

It would take someone to be very slow not to have caught on to this fact by now

[Gnevin]

Lawrence, it's not just you that takes this line - I am tired of immature people who think they can tell everyone how to think and ridicule people who have faith.  Apologies if I mistook you for something you aren't 

Tough sh1t then, I am not repeating myself for the likes of you.

You simply aren't worth it

  immature indeed

Many thanks for trying to enlighten us 

Anyone following the thread will see you quoted me out of context and will also be able to see why I couldn't be bothered with Gnevin the WUM

If you have to sink so low to try and get one over on me without even trying to refute anything I said earlier in the thread, fair play to you 

How are I a WUM? The FSM has just much fact backing it up than a Christian god.

So I ask you again to answer my question or is the question too hard so you'd prefer to keep defecting ?

[Gnevin]

Whaaaa I seriously am confused. Set me in the direction and I'll try to understand where your coming from. How did I take you out of context

You said earlier that you believed in apparitions because the children who seen what the seen possessed vocabulary beyond their years. I can't think of anything else other than you belive in god that there is to refute.

Do I need to go back further? And what have I said to you that you describe as "sinking so low" 


Is this an attempt to just fall out and walk away from a difficult discussion? It looks like it. ...you'll not be the first

Well, if you read that particular post then you will see my response to Gnevin was justified - he is being a WUM.  He doesn't deserve me to repeat myself.  End of.

So when you quoted my replies to Lawrence and Gnevin, you were quoting me out of context. 

Everyone on the board knows Gnevin is a WUM - this is one of his all-time favourite topics to be a WUM on.  Have you not noticed this before?

It would take someone to be very slow not to have caught on to this fact by now

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

Also it's not repeating your self if you never made a statement of the subject in the first place !