China Coronavirus

[Milltown Row2]

There are reasons why the vaccine moved so quickly. It doesn't mean anything underhand happened. (Cut and pasted).

The COVID-19 vaccines from Pfizer/BioNTech and Moderna were created with a method that has been in development for years, so the companies could start the vaccine development process early in the pandemic.

China isolated and shared genetic information about COVID-19 promptly, so scientists could start working on vaccines.
The vaccine developers didn't skip any testing steps, but conducted some of the steps on an overlapping schedule to gather data faster.

Vaccine projects had plenty of resources, as governments invested in research and/or paid for vaccines in advance.

Some types of COVID-19 vaccines were created using messenger RNA (mRNA), which allows a faster approach than the traditional way that vaccines are made.

Social media helped companies find and engage study volunteers, and many were willing to help with COVID-19 vaccine research.

Because COVID-19 is so contagious and widespread, it did not take long to see if the vaccine worked for the study volunteers who were vaccinated.

Companies began making vaccines early in the process — even before FDA authorization — so some supplies were ready when authorization occurred.

https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/coronavirus/covid-19-vaccines-myth-versus-fact

There is a lot of truth here, and an uncomfortable truth for the industry is that the COVID pandemic and the swift approval of the vaccine shone a light on areas of waste and dead space within the pharmaceutical industry. It exists primarily to underscore the Safety Assessment of pharmaceuticals - even if we rehash the same development pathway for drugs of very similar classes. It happens, because of liability.

Over time we have learned so much about almost all drug modalities. So much so that we could shorten the development time (and money) for a drug (Drug B) that is similar to an already approved product (Drug A) that you see on the TV. Upside, quicker development, drug gets to patient faster, and the drug development is cheaper. Downside is that we are relying on predictive modeling behaviour and assuming that what we understand about Drug A applies unilaterally and without exception to Drug B. Considering that even fully developed drugs that have undergone the full rigorous non clinical and clinical safety testing have thrown up some nasty surprises for patients post commercialization, it is a risk to assume drug similarities and therefore extrapolate data from one drug to another (no matter how similar in structure and mechanism). 

COVID gave the green light for accepting what we know about a modality (mRNA) and taking that relatively calculated risk to extrapolate that data across the vaccinations and expedite the approval process. In the absence of a global pandemic this would (in my opinion) never have happened.

Another example of FDA "fast tracking" is for a disease so serious that the patient will die in any case, therefore there is nothing to lose when giving them a novel, not yet approved therapy in an attempt to save their life. FDA compassionate use is an additional expedited protocol

While you both are lumped together here, please lead me to the document where "China isolated and shared genetic information about COVID-19 promptly". I have yet to see such a thing. I would be forever grateful if one or both of you produced it. Please make sure the document followed the proper guidelines for isolation before submitting. Didn't Johns Hopkins partner with the World Economic Forum and the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation to hosted Event 201 on October 18, 2019 in NY and another similar high-level pandemic exercise event recently?  So if John Hopkins says such a document exists without showing any evidence, it must be true. Still I would like to see it.

A compassionate FDA, I've heard it all now.

I've little interest in pursuing this debate with you as I can see a lost case when it's in front of me. And the rapidly approaching rabbit hole is something I'd prefer to avoid for both our sakes.

However on the highlighted bit. Have a google, there are any number of articles ( I'm sure even a few from sources you'd accept) that confirm what I said. If you've something to dispute these multiple sources then I'd be keen to hear it.

https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/covid-19/china-releases-genetic-data-new-coronavirus-now-deadly

So that's the best you can do trueblue? Some scientific document that was, a bat mind you or was it a dog? I agree, no need to debate that nonsense. I'll love ye and leave ye guys, the very best of luck, stay healthy, stay safe.  May drop back in in a year or two, then again maybe not.

A turmeric a day and all that!!

[trueblue1234]

There are reasons why the vaccine moved so quickly. It doesn't mean anything underhand happened. (Cut and pasted).

The COVID-19 vaccines from Pfizer/BioNTech and Moderna were created with a method that has been in development for years, so the companies could start the vaccine development process early in the pandemic.

China isolated and shared genetic information about COVID-19 promptly, so scientists could start working on vaccines.
The vaccine developers didn't skip any testing steps, but conducted some of the steps on an overlapping schedule to gather data faster.

Vaccine projects had plenty of resources, as governments invested in research and/or paid for vaccines in advance.

Some types of COVID-19 vaccines were created using messenger RNA (mRNA), which allows a faster approach than the traditional way that vaccines are made.

Social media helped companies find and engage study volunteers, and many were willing to help with COVID-19 vaccine research.

Because COVID-19 is so contagious and widespread, it did not take long to see if the vaccine worked for the study volunteers who were vaccinated.

Companies began making vaccines early in the process — even before FDA authorization — so some supplies were ready when authorization occurred.

https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/coronavirus/covid-19-vaccines-myth-versus-fact

There is a lot of truth here, and an uncomfortable truth for the industry is that the COVID pandemic and the swift approval of the vaccine shone a light on areas of waste and dead space within the pharmaceutical industry. It exists primarily to underscore the Safety Assessment of pharmaceuticals - even if we rehash the same development pathway for drugs of very similar classes. It happens, because of liability.

Over time we have learned so much about almost all drug modalities. So much so that we could shorten the development time (and money) for a drug (Drug B) that is similar to an already approved product (Drug A) that you see on the TV. Upside, quicker development, drug gets to patient faster, and the drug development is cheaper. Downside is that we are relying on predictive modeling behaviour and assuming that what we understand about Drug A applies unilaterally and without exception to Drug B. Considering that even fully developed drugs that have undergone the full rigorous non clinical and clinical safety testing have thrown up some nasty surprises for patients post commercialization, it is a risk to assume drug similarities and therefore extrapolate data from one drug to another (no matter how similar in structure and mechanism). 

COVID gave the green light for accepting what we know about a modality (mRNA) and taking that relatively calculated risk to extrapolate that data across the vaccinations and expedite the approval process. In the absence of a global pandemic this would (in my opinion) never have happened.

Another example of FDA "fast tracking" is for a disease so serious that the patient will die in any case, therefore there is nothing to lose when giving them a novel, not yet approved therapy in an attempt to save their life. FDA compassionate use is an additional expedited protocol

While you both are lumped together here, please lead me to the document where "China isolated and shared genetic information about COVID-19 promptly". I have yet to see such a thing. I would be forever grateful if one or both of you produced it. Please make sure the document followed the proper guidelines for isolation before submitting. Didn't Johns Hopkins partner with the World Economic Forum and the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation to hosted Event 201 on October 18, 2019 in NY and another similar high-level pandemic exercise event recently?  So if John Hopkins says such a document exists without showing any evidence, it must be true. Still I would like to see it.

A compassionate FDA, I've heard it all now.

I've little interest in pursuing this debate with you as I can see a lost case when it's in front of me. And the rapidly approaching rabbit hole is something I'd prefer to avoid for both our sakes.

However on the highlighted bit. Have a google, there are any number of articles ( I'm sure even a few from sources you'd accept) that confirm what I said. If you've something to dispute these multiple sources then I'd be keen to hear it.

https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/covid-19/china-releases-genetic-data-new-coronavirus-now-deadly

So that's the best you can do trueblue? Some scientific document that was, a bat mind you or was it a dog? I agree, no need to debate that nonsense. I'll love ye and leave ye guys, the very best of luck, stay healthy, stay safe.  May drop back in in a year or two, then again maybe not.

As I said google is your friend. But we're wasting time as no source I provide is going to change your mind. Here's another albeit a big more of a slog.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmoa2001017

Enjoy your time away, stay safe.

[Seamus]

Just a little encore that I feel is necessary. A couple of quotations that will hopefully save lives as at this stage, three years on we all know of somebody who's life was suddenly cut far too short because of the jab.

"Helmets prevent skull fractures. Tinfoil hats prevent myocarditis"

I love my Tinfoil hat, so enlightening and empowering.

"Google is the Enemy"

Adios Amigos, now where is that Turmeric?

[Milltown Row2]

Just a little encore that I feel is necessary. A couple of quotations that will hopefully save lives as at this stage, three years on we all know of somebody who's life was suddenly cut far too short because of the jab.

"Helmets prevent skull fractures. Tinfoil hats prevent myocarditis"

I love my Tinfoil hat, so enlightening and empowering.

"Google is the Enemy"

Adios Amigos, now where is that Turmeric?

I don't know anyone that died because of the vaccine

[armaghniac]

Just a little encore that I feel is necessary. A couple of quotations that will hopefully save lives as at this stage, three years on we all know of somebody who's life was suddenly cut far too short because of the jab.

No, we don't. But some of us would not be here without the jab.

[From the Bunker]

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/health/achill-island-boy-14-died-three-weeks-after-getting-first-dose-of-pfizer-covid-vaccine-inquest-hears-42162426.html

[armaghniac]

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/health/achill-island-boy-14-died-three-weeks-after-getting-first-dose-of-pfizer-covid-vaccine-inquest-hears-42162426.html

Didn't know him.

[From the Bunker]

Excess deaths around the world.


https://twitter.com/wolsned/status/1624744582263996417

[armaghniac]

Excess deaths around the world.


https://twitter.com/wolsned/status/1624744582263996417

The usual shite data, no source and no date.

[From the Bunker]

Excess deaths around the world.


https://twitter.com/wolsned/status/1624744582263996417

The usual shite data, no source and no date.

Look at the video there is a sourse and plenty of dates.

[theskull1]

To anyone who lost loved ones to covid in hospital, this will not be an easy watch

Pandemic unnecessary deaths, the data

https://youtu.be/GEwktv-AGEw

How many of these deaths were covid?
How many of these deaths were iatrogenic?

iatrogenic
adjective
: induced unintentionally by a physician or surgeon or by medical treatment or diagnostic procedures

[Gabriel_Hurl]

that bluffer still pumping out the videos then

[theskull1]

That 'bluffer' presenting official guidelines from NICE (the version issued in March 2020) along with official data on the spike in these 'end of life' drugs he's referring to 

https://web.archive.org/web/20200409054527/https://www.nice.org.uk/guidance/ng163/resources/covid19-rapid-guideline-managing-symptoms-including-at-the-end-of-life-in-the-community-pdf-66141899069893


https://openprescribing.net/analyse/#org=regional_team&numIds=0408020W0,1501041T0,0408020V0,0401010Q0&denom=nothing&selectedTab=chart

Whats to bluff here?

[PadraicHenryPearse]

again i gave benefit of the doubt to this muppet and the poster... i wasted 20 mins listening to waffle....

he didn't answer any 4 of his questions he mentioned at the end only get very sombre during them.

he didn't mention that most of the guidance had as required or when required.. assuming doctors treat each case on it merits.

he without evidence suggests that people who took the drugs he mentioned caused their deaths. He just shows different potentially urelated info and lets people assume causation. He didn't speculate that they were provided in the appropriate circumstances to provide end of life care.

I would suspect that end of life care is provided more when more people are dying.

[thebigfella]

Anyone check out how much John Campbell pretend doctor earns from this bluffing. Makes you think.