Fermanagh v Armagh Brewster Pk Sat 19th May 7:00pm

[Taylor]

Can honestly say I never thought I would see an Armagh team play like that.

Completely spineless and clueless all over the field.

What tactics did ye play during the league? Have to assume ye have never played against a blanket defence before and didnt plan for it.

Seemed your plan was to give it to 11 and 23 (I think) and let them run as far as they could with it before hitting the blanket defence & handpassing to someone (irrespective of the position the receiver was in).

Someone of the Fermanagh behaviour was less than desirable but at the end of the day its all about winning at this level.

Fermanagh are no great outfit but they have a belief and hunger that will get them past most average teams. Not Monaghan though who will win pulling up.

[blewuporstuffed]

Just noticed Clare number 11 in hurling getting a yellow card for a similar tackle to the one Grimley got sent off for.

That's because his opponent didn't roll around in feigned agony, clutching his face and took it in a manly fashion without trying to get his man sent off.

To be honest I reckon it's more to do with media punditry.

In hurling, the analysts describe anything short of a night in hospital as men being men. So the masses buy into this, and what referee really wants to go against the masses?

Whereas in football, there's a queue of absolute shithead analysts waiting to denounce anything and everything as GBH, especially when one of their own county's team is tackled. So everything goes under the spotlight, the public go up in arms, and referees have no choice but to do what is demanded off them.

The levels of diving and injury feigning in our game is directly related to this too.

Agree with you here wobbler

[haranguerer]

From my own point of view, my intention to referencing the cynicism of Fermanagh was simply to present it as an observation on my part - not a complaint. Armagh last night have too many concerns of our own to worry about what others do.

Our great team of the noughties had a reputation for cynicism, but my feeling would be it was not for trash talking or feigning injury, or indeed disrupting the opposition kick-outs by pinging a second football onto the pitch. Maybe others will disagree and point to some specific incident from 2007 that totally undermines what I said. Ho hum.

The behaviour yesterday from Fermanagh was no surprise given that McMenamin is in the management team.  it would have been poor enough with Gallagher in charge but McMenamin bring things to another level, to that previously was the preserve of his Tyrone teams.

In general the squad from 1999 to 2008 played a hard game and while blocking off the running player was a tactic and not against any rule, the players with the possible exception of Marty O'Rourke didn't bother with the trash talk that was so evident yesterday from the Fermanagh team.  They have taken the feigning of injury to a level that Tyrone have set since 2003.  While Grimley was stupid in swinging his arm, Quigley, who has serious form for cheating, fell to the ground instantly holding his face.

He got clocked in the face ffs 

Armagh tackling was that indisciplined they were regularly making contact with the face. Yer man crealey was like a windmill, it was brutal. The reference on commentary re players going down referred to both teams - there'd been a good shot of murnin going down holding his face shortly before when no contact with it.

[Taylor]

Like the DOC elbow last week it was stupid and dangerous and he deserved the red.
Quigley fell to the ground holding his face - where would you suggest he holds 

Lets hope the referees are consistent in this for the remainder of the championship

[Farrandeelin]

Where will the Fermanagh v Monaghan game be played?

[Taylor]

Where will the Fermanagh v Monaghan game be played?

Omagh in 2 weeks

[mackers]

There has been a growing frustration within the county (as I alluded to in my pre-match post) that the best players in the county are starting to turn their back on inter-county football in Armagh.  Obviously people will say that this is a countrywide issue and it is.  I do feel it is magnified in Armagh by the fact that we have a small enough playing population and it also being driven by our manager also.  If I see him being quoted again in the Irish News saying that he has a panel of players that "want to play for the jersey/Armagh" I'll scream.  When I read that I translate it to a panel of players that are willing to sacrifice their commitment to their clubs.  Not all of our players that are county standard want to do that and some element of flexibility must come into play to address the situation (see Paul Grimley's reign as Armagh manager as a precedent).  It feels like he is running a cult and if you don't adhere to the rules you're on the outside.  This must be addressed by the stakeholders within the county set-up.
From last October we knew that we were going to play a Rory Gallagher led Fermanagh who were going to be uber-defensive.  In fairness it is up to the Fermanagh management to set up whatever way they like.  It is, however, up to our management to come up with a plan to dismantle it.  I don't know what they were doing in Portugal but it obviously wasn't conjuring up a plan to break down a mass defence. Yet again this Armagh team failed miserably against a blanket defence.  TSG analysis last night showed how Monaghan used angles of running and speed off the shoulder to break down Tyrone's defence.  It's not rocket science!!
We have players who have the speed to punch holes in a blanket if the game plan is there to utilise it.  I felt that Mark Shields tried very hard to use his speed to great effect.  I felt Mini McShane did too and was harshly taken off.
Our manager's attitude to club football means that he is rarely (never!) at club matches to see who's going well.  I would actually use Mini McShane is an example of what I'm talking about.  I have watched Mini over a few years now ripping holes in club defences within the county and always felt that he should be tried at inter county level and in fairness he was.  He is however an exception rather than the rule. There are several more McShane's in the county and they need to be brought into the county setup.  There has to be a sea change in the attitude of our management to see this happen.

[AQMP]

Desperate stuff on Sat evening.  Poor from Armagh and Fermanagh under Gallagher and McMenamin are becoming the poster boys for anti-football, diving and play acting.

[illdecide]

Firstly, congrats to Fermanagh on their win and the deserved it thoroughly...Armagh were pathetic and got what they deserved.
Secondly, the ticket prices were a joke. I paid £24 to sit on the most uncomfortable D Rail timber fence ever...fecking joke.

On the match...KmcG's boat has sailed, I'm never one for lambasting players or management as I played the game and I know how hard it is and the fools on the side lines shouting the biggest load of tripe don't help but Kieran has had his time and has not made any head way at all. Armagh were clueless all over the field, even their go-to men (Vernon, Donaghy, Forker etc) were shockingly bad. Ethan Raferty was clearly not fit to play and how he was kept on so long was embarrassing, Crealey' tackling was so bad and didn't know where to run or where not to run was unreal. There was not one Armagh man I could have said afterwards done himself proud and the Irish News today gave almost everyone a 6 outta 10...WTF, was i watching a different match to the Irish News guy?

On another note...Are we getting carried away or are we realistic with our talent pool, we're a small County with limited resources and are we always expecting to be better than the players available to us (silk purse outts sow's ear). Don't be jumping all over me for this as i know Fermanagh have a smaller County than us and apparently on the Sunday Game last night Monaghan only have 3 Counties in Ireland with a smaller population...I'm just asking are our targets for our County set too high or should we be doing much better with the players we do have?

[mackers]

On another note...Are we getting carried away or are we realistic with our talent pool, we're a small County with limited resources and are we always expecting to be better than the players available to us (silk purse outts sow's ear). Don't be jumping all over me for this as i know Fermanagh have a smaller County than us and apparently on the Sunday Game last night Monaghan only have 3 Counties in Ireland with a smaller population...I'm just asking are our targets for our County set too high or should we be doing much better with the players we do have?

I get what you're saying.  We won't/can't win Ulster at the minute (AIs aren't even in the conversation) but we have players that can/will see us compete at mid/top of Division 2 standard.  All we want our management to be able to do is have us playing at or towards our best.  Nobody can say that that's what happened on Saturday evening.  The one thing I will say is that McGeeney has us playing attractive football when we're allowed to (e.g Kildare match last year) but when we come up against a blanket defence which is still prevalent in today's football we are lost.  We need to get all our best players back in the fold for the League campaign otherwise we will find ourselves dropping back into Division 3 AGAIN!  Whether this management can address this situation is subject to debate.

[haranguerer]

Firstly, congrats to Fermanagh on their win and the deserved it thoroughly...Armagh were pathetic and got what they deserved.
Secondly, the ticket prices were a joke. I paid £24 to sit on the most uncomfortable D Rail timber fence ever...fecking joke.

I paid £30 in o'neills the morning of the game 

[seafoid]

Just noticed Clare number 11 in hurling getting a yellow card for a similar tackle to the one Grimley got sent off for.

That's because his opponent didn't roll around in feigned agony, clutching his face and took it in a manly fashion without trying to get his man sent off.

To be honest I reckon it's more to do with media punditry.

In hurling, the analysts describe anything short of a night in hospital as men being men. So the masses buy into this, and what referee really wants to go against the masses?

Whereas in football, there's a queue of absolute shithead analysts waiting to denounce anything and everything as GBH, especially when one of their own county's team is tackled. So everything goes under the spotlight, the public go up in arms, and referees have no choice but to do what is demanded off them.

The levels of diving and injury feigning in our game is directly related to this too.

I think the pundits are marginal, Wobbler. The main problem is the definition of the tackle and the consistency with which refs interpret it. I also think the  game has evolved beyond the point where one ref can be in total control.

[lurganblue]

That's one of the worst performances i have ever seen from Armagh.  You could have called that the match was only going to go one way from about 15/20 mins in.  Armagh looked lacklustre and clueless from the get-go.  Simple things easily fell apart.

I agree that KMCG has had his day and it is time to try a different approach.   

[illdecide]

Would i be right in saying yesterday was the first in a long time that no Crossmaglen men lined out for Armagh...Not sure about dates as i know there was something in the paper about this a few weeks back, think it was mid 90's

[Ethan Tremblay]

In my opinion the Armagh job is a poisoned chalice.  The fans are deluded into thinking they are better than what they are.  Arguably the best players don't want to play and the talent to compete isn't there from what is left. 

Has Mc Geeney has his day in the sun, possibly, but it doesn't matter who is taking that team, the core problems are still going to exist.  Armagh are in the lower bracket of ulster teams at the moment with potentially Antrim, Down and Fermanagh, so losing to one of these teams shouldn't come as a big shock anymore.