The Palestine thread

[charlieTully]

Great to see the Palestine ambassador at today's Hunger Strike rally in Derrylin.So sad listening to him but also so proud when he talks about the great support from Ireland.

Did the DFM apologise for his love affair with caterpillar and promise to disolve all dealings with them?

[Lar Naparka]

Whitey
In answer to your reply to Eamonnca1

You're correct of course but you forgot to make any comment about the understandable anger felt by societies who are so cruelly treated by oppressive dictators. Would you be a "terrorist" if you lived in Palestine?

Pro Israel supporters in general don't want to go down those paths

Would there be peace in Ireland if the IRA was still engaged in armed resistance?

No...the Republican movement realized that they just couldn't militarily defeat the British Army, so they agreed to a compromise that in prior years would have been unconscionable.

At some point, the Palestinians need to be able to find a way to reach some type of similar compromise.

The 2 problems I see is (1) The Israelis wont move and could care less about public opinion (2) Hamas are Muslim extremists and subscribe to a dogma thats incompatible with a democratic process.

Pressure is going to have come on both sides to reach an accomadation.

I think one could say with even greater justification that the BA realised that they could not defeat the Provos. According to Bertie Ahern, the IRA never had more than 250 active volunteers at any time during the Troubles and yet the combined might of the Brits' military and intelligence resources was unable to defeat them.
Right now, I think the only "winners" in the conflict in Gaza will be Hamas.
Like the IRA in the North, Hamas enjoys a great dead of popular support -sympathy if not active co-operation, and as long as they have that, the rocket attacks on southern Israel will continue.
The Israelis held Gaza under military rule for more than 35 years after the Seven Day War.
They withdrew in 2005 ( I think) and have re-invaded the strip a total of 3 times since then and so far they have not been able to defeat insistence fighters and if history is anything to go by, they never will.
Every massacre and indiscriminate attacks on schools, hospitals and refugee centres will drive scores of ordinary people into the  arms of Hamas. Anyone who believes that martyrdom will guarantee everlasting happiness in Paradise will always be a difficult opponent!
Overwhelming military superiority doesn't always mean the aggressive party in a conflict will win.
The Brits didn't in Northern Ireland and neither did the French, and later the US, in Vietnam.
The Russians invaded Afghanistan ion 1979 and were forced to pull out ten years later. The Americans fared no better when they did the same. Iraq in post-Saddam days is in more turmoil than it was when the US and their allies decided to intervene.
What the IDF is up to in Gaze defiles the concept of humanity but it wouldn't defeat Hamas and its' adherents.
The rockets will continue to be launched until the warring parties decide to sit down around some table, somewhere, sometime.

[Arthur_Friend]

The Palestinians have been compromising for quite some time now whitey.

The formation of the Palestinian Unity Government is thought by some to be the reason behind the latest Israeli murder spree.

You know what.....you might be onto something. For the first time in a long time Hamas has lost its traditional supporters in the Muslim world. Israel possibly viewed this as an opportunity to inflict some serious body blows without having to worry about looking over their shoulder. The more I read about the Israelis the more I dislike the. ( I just dislike Hamas a whole lot more)

More like Israel wants continual conflict in order to continue it's annexation of the West Bank. A credible united Palestinian front willing to talk peace is a threat to that. Also, when has Israel in the past ever had to look over it's shoulder when it decides to murder a few thousand Palestinians?

[rossiewanderer]

Full credit to our national broadcaster RTE for their unstinting 'coverage' of the horror in Gaza.
One must credit the unyielding bravery of RTE anchors who actually pick up the phone and ring channel 4 and BBC war correspondents who are on the ground in in Gaza.It must be tough talking to real journalists who are in actual danger doing their job.

[Eamonnca1]

Full credit to our national broadcaster RTE for their unstinting 'coverage' of the horror in Gaza.
One must credit the unyielding bravery of RTE anchors who actually pick up the phone and ring channel 4 and BBC war correspondents who are on the ground in in Gaza.It must be tough talking to real journalists who are in actual danger doing their job.

The American PBS TV network and NPR radio network make regular use of BBC and ITN correspondents.

[imtommygunn]

Is there not some controversy over whether the bbc correspondent Bowen is still there too??

[muppet]

Full credit to our national broadcaster RTE for their unstinting 'coverage' of the horror in Gaza.
One must credit the unyielding bravery of RTE anchors who actually pick up the phone and ring channel 4 and BBC war correspondents who are on the ground in in Gaza.It must be tough talking to real journalists who are in actual danger doing their job.

Good man, civilians, including women and children, are being slaughtered, and this is your contribution.

I will happily pay to send you to Gaza, as long as you give hourly news reports to RTE. If you fail to do so for any reason, you pay me back, deal?

[Hereiam]

Have I got this right.
Britain beat the Turks in WWl and ruled over Palestine
The Arab's thought that Britain would reward them with this land for helping them beat the Turks
at the same time the Jews thought that Britain would also reward them with this land for helping them during WWl
For a period they lived side by side but then the Jews kept on coming and soon the Arabs realised that the Jews will soon outnumber them.
Both side took it out on the British army because Britain did not act on what they had promised.
The Jews fought for Britain in WWll and learnt a lot from this.
Fight picked up again after WWll with the British Army again taking the brunt of this.
Britain got out and divided the land between the Jews and the Israelis.
Both sides have been fighting ever since and with Britain and the US backing the Jews it is looking like the Arabs will be forced out of Palestine.

Just to note the Irish fought for Britain in WW1 thinking that they would get independence, look how that turned out. Britain was and always will be a nasty piece of work.

[johnneycool]

Have I got this right.
Britain beat the Turks in WWl and ruled over Palestine
The Arab's thought that Britain would reward them with this land for helping them beat the Turks
at the same time the Jews thought that Britain would also reward them with this land for helping them during WWl
For a period they lived side by side but then the Jews kept on coming and soon the Arabs realised that the Jews will soon outnumber them.
Both side took it out on the British army because Britain did not act on what they had promised.
The Jews fought for Britain in WWll and learnt a lot from this.
Fight picked up again after WWll with the British Army again taking the brunt of this.
Britain got out and divided the land between the Jews and the Israelis.
Both sides have been fighting ever since and with Britain and the US backing the Jews it is looking like the Arabs will be forced out of Palestine.

Just to note the Irish fought for Britain in WW1 thinking that they would get independence, look how that turned out. Britain was and always will be a nasty piece of work.

Fairly rudimentary analysis, but not a million miles off the mark;

Have a look for the Balfour Declaration on the web, the Brits were promising all and sundry for support and finances during the war to end all other start all other wars.

[Hereiam]

This photo says it all about what is happening over there.

[LeoMc]

Have I got this right.
Britain beat the Turks in WWl and ruled over Palestine
The Arab's thought that Britain would reward them with this land for helping them beat the Turks
at the same time the Jews thought that Britain would also reward them with this land for helping them during WWl
For a period they lived side by side but then the Jews kept on coming and soon the Arabs realised that the Jews will soon outnumber them.
Both side took it out on the British army because Britain did not act on what they had promised.
The Jews fought for Britain in WWll and learnt a lot from this.
Fight picked up again after WWll with the British Army again taking the brunt of this.
Britain got out and divided the land between the Jews and the Israelis.
Both sides have been fighting ever since and with Britain and the US backing the Jews it is looking like the Arabs will be forced out of Palestine.

Just to note the Irish fought for Britain in WW1 thinking that they would get independence, look how that turned out. Britain was and always will be a nasty piece of work.

Not a thread for jokes but I think that is what the Zionists believe.

[give her dixie]

Anger at Northern Ireland link to 'Israel's weapons of war': Caterpillar bulldozers 'used to raze Palestinian homes' in Gaza

By Suzanne Breen – 04 August 2014

A Palestinian journalist who has had 12 family members killed in Gaza is calling on Northern Ireland politicians to withdraw support for a company whose machinery is used by the Israeli military.

Yousef al-Helou says bulldozers made by the US engineering company Caterpillar, which has plants in Belfast and Larne, are being employed as "weapons of war bringing destruction to Gaza."

A dozen members of his extended family, including five children, were killed in an Israeli airstrike a fortnight ago.

Last week, his own home was destroyed with his wife and three daughters fleeing the building just before it was hit. Al-Helou is addressing meetings across Northern Ireland to highlight the plight of people in Gaza.

As well as requesting emergency supplies be sent to Palestinians, he is calling on local political parties to withdraw support for Caterpillar.

"D9 bulldozers made by Caterpillar are on the streets of Gaza now, leaving a trail of destruction behind them, razing thousands of Palestinian homes and farms in recent years," he said.

"They have destroyed electricity lines, water supplies, and sewerage systems. These bulldozers are used as strategic weapons which form a vital part of Israel's military arsenal.

"They have left tens of thousands of people homeless and without access to vital services which they need to live. I have seen first-hand the damage they have done.

"Given that people of Northern Ireland suffered during their own conflict, I ask them and their politicians, from the bottom of my heart, to stop supporting this company

"People I meet here are appalled at what is happening in Gaza. The goodwill towards the Palestinian people is overwhelming. But we now need practical help from the public and political leaders."

Last year it was announced that Invest NI had offered Caterpillar over £1.2 million funding. The initiative was backed by all the main political parties. The Department of Employment and Learning also offered training support of £440,000.

Peter Robinson and Martin McGuinness have previously visited Caterpillar's Chicago headquarters and are strong supporters of the company which employs several hundred people in Northern Ireland.

Sunday Life contacted Caterpillar's Belfast and Larne offices but no-one was available for comment. The company has previously stated it doesn't provide machinery directly to Israel.

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/anger-at-northern-ireland-link-to-israels-weapons-of-war-caterpillar-bulldozers-used-to-raze-palestinian-homes-in-gaza-30480785.html

[rossiewanderer]

Full credit to our national broadcaster RTE for their unstinting 'coverage' of the horror in Gaza.
One must credit the unyielding bravery of RTE anchors who actually pick up the phone and ring channel 4 and BBC war correspondents who are on the ground in in Gaza.It must be tough talking to real journalists who are in actual danger doing their job.

Good man, civilians, including women and children, are being slaughtered, and this is your contribution.

I will happily pay to send you to Gaza, as long as you give hourly news reports to RTE. If you fail to do so for any reason, you pay me back, deal?

I have a better idea.Why not send Gay Byrne out there.RTE journalists were falling over each other for President Higgins important state visit to Britain.

By the way you can make a very real contribution to the innocent children of Gaza through UNICEF or through the Irish Red Cross.The picture on page 21 of todays INDO reduced me to tears,It must be shown but it is unbelievably horrific and heartbreaking.Their are no winners in war.Hamas continued disregard for their civilian population and Israels murderous and reckless retaliatory disregard for civilian populations shows no signs of stopping.

[johnneycool]

Anger at Northern Ireland link to 'Israel's weapons of war': Caterpillar bulldozers 'used to raze Palestinian homes' in Gaza

By Suzanne Breen – 04 August 2014

A Palestinian journalist who has had 12 family members killed in Gaza is calling on Northern Ireland politicians to withdraw support for a company whose machinery is used by the Israeli military.

Yousef al-Helou says bulldozers made by the US engineering company Caterpillar, which has plants in Belfast and Larne, are being employed as "weapons of war bringing destruction to Gaza."

A dozen members of his extended family, including five children, were killed in an Israeli airstrike a fortnight ago.

Last week, his own home was destroyed with his wife and three daughters fleeing the building just before it was hit. Al-Helou is addressing meetings across Northern Ireland to highlight the plight of people in Gaza.

As well as requesting emergency supplies be sent to Palestinians, he is calling on local political parties to withdraw support for Caterpillar.

"D9 bulldozers made by Caterpillar are on the streets of Gaza now, leaving a trail of destruction behind them, razing thousands of Palestinian homes and farms in recent years," he said.

"They have destroyed electricity lines, water supplies, and sewerage systems. These bulldozers are used as strategic weapons which form a vital part of Israel's military arsenal.

"They have left tens of thousands of people homeless and without access to vital services which they need to live. I have seen first-hand the damage they have done.

"Given that people of Northern Ireland suffered during their own conflict, I ask them and their politicians, from the bottom of my heart, to stop supporting this company

"People I meet here are appalled at what is happening in Gaza. The goodwill towards the Palestinian people is overwhelming. But we now need practical help from the public and political leaders."

Last year it was announced that Invest NI had offered Caterpillar over £1.2 million funding. The initiative was backed by all the main political parties. The Department of Employment and Learning also offered training support of £440,000.

Peter Robinson and Martin McGuinness have previously visited Caterpillar's Chicago headquarters and are strong supporters of the company which employs several hundred people in Northern Ireland.

Sunday Life contacted Caterpillar's Belfast and Larne offices but no-one was available for comment. The company has previously stated it doesn't provide machinery directly to Israel.

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/anger-at-northern-ireland-link-to-israels-weapons-of-war-caterpillar-bulldozers-used-to-raze-palestinian-homes-in-gaza-30480785.html

No , it provides them for the US army who then give them to the Israelis..

[muppet]

Full credit to our national broadcaster RTE for their unstinting 'coverage' of the horror in Gaza.
One must credit the unyielding bravery of RTE anchors who actually pick up the phone and ring channel 4 and BBC war correspondents who are on the ground in in Gaza.It must be tough talking to real journalists who are in actual danger doing their job.

Good man, civilians, including women and children, are being slaughtered, and this is your contribution.

I will happily pay to send you to Gaza, as long as you give hourly news reports to RTE. If you fail to do so for any reason, you pay me back, deal?

I have a better idea.Why not send Gay Byrne out there.RTE journalists were falling over each other for President Higgins important state visit to Britain.

By the way you can make a very real contribution to the innocent children of Gaza through UNICEF or through the Irish Red Cross.The picture on page 21 of todays INDO reduced me to tears,It must be shown but it is unbelievably horrific and heartbreaking.Their are no winners in war.Hamas continued disregard for their civilian population and Israels murderous and reckless retaliatory disregard for civilian populations shows no signs of stopping.

You are the one who mentioned 'the unyielding bravery' of RTE anchors. I offered to pay your way and you chickened out.