The Palestine thread

[Mike Sheehy]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, the second biggest tragedy to befall the Palestinian people after the occupation of their lands was the hijacking of their cause by anti-semites. The very people that were the root cause of their present situation are now their biggest "defenders". It would be laughable if it were not so tragic.

[AZOffaly]

Ok. I get you now. And can see why you might think the reply flippant. It wasn't intended to be. I'd assume that all right thinking people would react with disgust to such an attack, and assumed that was taken as read in my case.

I should have said " that's horrific, Israel is a disgrace in the way it conducts these attacks.. By the way, why do you feel the need to refer to the missing teenagers in that manner".

My point still stands in that I feel you and seafoid definitely seem to lack empathy with Israeli victims, but I certainly would not trivialise the treatment the Palestinian people are getting.

[Mike Sheehy]

Lets call a spade a spade. Seafoid and GHD do more than show a lack of empathy, they positively delight in any Israeli deaths/casualties/kidnappings.

[give her dixie]

Ok. I get you now. And can see why you might think the reply flippant. It wasn't intended to be. I'd assume that all right thinking people would react with disgust to such an attack, and assumed that was taken as read in my case.

I should have said " that's horrific, Israel is a disgrace in the way it conducts these attacks.. By the way, why do you feel the need to refer to the missing teenagers in that manner".

My point still stands in that I feel you and seafoid definitely seem to lack empathy with Israeli victims, but I certainly would not trivialise the treatment the Palestinian people are getting.

Israeli victims? How are they victims? Plus, in the past 5 years as I have already stated, close to 2,000 Palestinians have been murdered. To the best of my knowledge, around 20 Israeli's have been killed in that same time. Some of whom were killed by "friendly fire".

Over 500,000 illegal settlers currently occupy land stolen from Palestine. These are people who feel this is their land because "God gave it to them" and by been Jewish, they have a divine right to occupy this land. Illegally of course. 

The 3 people alleged to have been kidnapped are illegal settlers who illegally occupy this land.

Robert Fisk says that the current Israeli Government and Zionism is no different to what Cromwell did here in Ireland all those years ago. What we are currently witnessing is a repeat of history.

An example of this is Gordon McKnight from Bangor Co down who became a Jew and felt he had more right to this land than those who have lived there for thousands of years.  Check out what he has to say:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4Eh12TG_N0

If you have the time, check out a few of the videos on you tube on how these settlers behave towards the indigenous people and their land.

[Mike Sheehy]

You just don't get it do you ? Pointing out examples of extremist settlers will not stop us pointing out the extremism of your position.
Do I need to post some articles from your friend Mattias Chang or www.barnesreview.org to illustrate that point ?

You are simply the other side of that Gordon McKnight coin. You are just as bad, Just as guilty.

[seafoid]

Calling dark skinned people spades is racist. Tsk tsk.

[Mike Sheehy]

Calling dark skinned people spades is racist. Tsk tsk.

You could use a spade as you are really digging there aren't you.

It gives me great pleasure to know I have reduced you to this. Always good to know I have the anti-Semitic bigots on the back foot 

[Mike Sheehy]

By the way lads, just so ye all know, Seafoid and GHD's intransigence is not accidental. They are marching to a tune so to speak.

you know those lads that are always shouting at you on the streets of Cork and Dublin with loudspeakers about Zionists and the like ? Well this is a behind the scenes look at what they are like

(background: These lads are extremely political. Lots of extremist republicans, stalinsts...the usual assortment of idiots with a mindset stuck in 1980's  the student union entertainments office etc...anyway, circa 2009 there was a "spilt" with much ensuing comedy gold....)

http://www.david-morrison.org.uk/ipsc/problems-20090918.pdf

Anyway, when you've stopped laughing at the pomposity and the hilarious similarities to this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gb_qHP7VaZE  there are some serious points to be made

here are some quotes...you will forgive me for using Seafoids trick of quoting selectively....

When individuals volunteer to take up NC positions, they implicitly undertake to advocate in public IPSC policy as determined by IPSC
members, not their own views. In other words, by taking up NC positions, individuals implicitly
accept the possibility that their freedom of speech may be restricted.

i.e. stay on message, repeat ad-nauseum, no straying from the accepted line....sound familiar ?

When I became a Political Officer, I was conscious that, if I
continued doing so, criticism of Fatah by me might be interpreted as criticism of Fatah by the IPSC,
contrary to the established principle that IPSC doesn't take sides in internal Palestinian politics. So I
stopped making criticisms of Fatah.

criticism of only one side of the conflict ....sound familiar ?

I regard our commitment not to take sides in Palestinian politics
as extremely important, particularly at this time when, regrettably, the division between Fatah and
Hamas is so deeply entrenched.

Unfortunately, that policy position was publicly contravened by Raymond Deane in a letter to the
Israeli embassy, which he published on Indymedia on 1 July [2]. There, he described the Fatahcontrolled
Palestinian Authority (PA) as a "Vichy or Quisling regime". In other words, in a letter to
Israel, he described a Palestinian entity as fascist. It is difficult to imagine a more deeply insulting
remark or a less appropriate letter in which to apply the term to a Palestinian entity.

No acknowledgement of the complex politics, identities and differing aspirations on the Palestinian side .....sound familiar ?

The IPSC doesn't prescribe any specific "solution" for Palestine, neither one-state, nor two-state, nor
any other. We believe that it's up to Palestinians to decide. It isn't appropriate that non-
Palestinians sitting in Dublin advocate a specific "solution". That's what imperialists in Washington
and London do.

Thats fine then let the Palestinians get on with it..if you , as an outsider, want to criticize there is an onus on you to
suggest some solutions. However, you've all noticed the way Seafoid and GHD never want to give specifics on any sort of solution .....that's no coincidence !!
(Hey Seafoid...once again, can you elaborate on your proposal for a Sunni homeland in Iraq..or it "not appropriate" for you to go into detail)














(P.S RN is the worst of them)

[Mike Sheehy]

Ok. I get you now. And can see why you might think the reply flippant. It wasn't intended to be. I'd assume that all right thinking people would react with disgust to such an attack, and assumed that was taken as read in my case.

I should have said " that's horrific, Israel is a disgrace in the way it conducts these attacks.. By the way, why do you feel the need to refer to the missing teenagers in that manner".

My point still stands in that I feel you and seafoid definitely seem to lack empathy with Israeli victims, but I certainly would not trivialise the treatment the Palestinian people are getting.

Israeli victims? How are they victims? Plus, in the past 5 years as I have already stated, close to 2,000 Palestinians have been murdered. To the best of my knowledge, around 20 Israeli's have been killed in that same time. Some of whom were killed by "friendly fire".

Over 500,000 illegal settlers currently occupy land stolen from Palestine. These are people who feel this is their land because "God gave it to them" and by been Jewish, they have a divine right to occupy this land. Illegally of course. 

The 3 people alleged to have been kidnapped are illegal settlers who illegally occupy this land.

Robert Fisk says that the current Israeli Government and Zionism is no different to what Cromwell did here in Ireland all those years ago. What we are currently witnessing is a repeat of history.

An example of this is Gordon McKnight from Bangor Co down who became a Jew and felt he had more right to this land than those who have lived there for thousands of years.  Check out what he has to say:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4Eh12TG_N0

If you have the time, check out a few of the videos on you tube on how these settlers behave towards the indigenous people and their land.

AZoffaly is probably the most reasonable poster on this board and has practically bent over backwards to avoid confrontation.

Your last post was a sarcastic remark dressed up as an "apology". Despite this AZoffaly (seemingly unaware of the sarcasm) still graciously gave you the benefit of the doubt. Yet you STILL chase after him for having the temerity to suggest Israelis are human. This illustrates what I have been trying to tell the board about you two for ages. You are driven by hatred. You are not rational. Even when confronted with the most reasonable, sane people you will not budge an inch. You are idealogues of the worst soviet totalitarian kind.

What gives you the right to harass and intimidate people on this board GHD ? Do you think you have some higher moral authority to preach to us on Israel/Palestine ?

[give her dixie]

Video footage from a couple of different cctv camera of the Israeli drone strike on the car yesterday that left 2 Palestinians dead in Gaza:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=767819409927148

Or view via youtube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wCg0xWGefE&feature=youtu.be

[seafoid]

Every Israeli who dies so that the occupation can continue is a waste of a life. It's no different to the 5000 in Northern Ireland. It's harder to see it from a normal society but when a country deteriorates to the point where military values and violence prevail everyone is a potential victim. Israel cynically manipulates its dead civilians to paint the Palestinians as savage, all the time killing more of them.

Israel can't escape the dysfunction by itself. This is why international apathy is so dangerous.

[Mike Sheehy]

Every Israeli who dies so that the occupation can continue is a waste of a life.

Well done. Maybe there is hope for you. Of course you had to get the qualification in there didn't you 

[give her dixie]

There is news breaking that 3 bodies have been found in Hebron, and the Israeli cabinet are to hold an emergency meeting.

[haveaharp]

There is news breaking that 3 bodies have been found in Hebron, and the Israeli cabinet are to hold an emergency meeting.

Im sure the response will be measured and proportionate

[give her dixie]

There is news breaking that 3 bodies have been found in Hebron, and the Israeli cabinet are to hold an emergency meeting.

Im sure the response will be measured and proportionate

I'm sure they will hit Gaza hard as they have been blaming Hamas from day 1. Yesterday they hit Gaza with an airstrike killing a Hamas resistance fighter and wounding several others.

Hebron will also suffer, and so will other area's throughout the West Bank.

Whatever they do, they will get away with it no matter how many are killed in revenge. The US will see to that, and so will a weak EU.