Messages

We don't have the experience of winning in Ulster. We have failed numerous times to close out close games falling short on almost every occasion. The Donegal game will be the true acid test.

Jesus I really liked watching Armagh over the course of the league, but ye are the greatest shower of whingers I've come across. And we have the Rossies for neighbours, so that's saying something.

I would rather the talk about the melee just ended. It has happened, time has passed, accept punishments and get on with it. Armagh fans blame Donegal ones and Donegal ones will blame Armagh but there is no video evidence to suggest who started it. During the melee both sides shoulder the blame and whilst Armagh might have been punished a lot harsher than Donegal it doesn't always go the way you want. We have a game in a few weeks against them, we still have our key players whilst the others undoubtedly make an impact we have even better players returning.

The Armagh players were down this road already with the Tyrone game.  They saw the consequences - cameras everywhere, criticised from every corner, suspensions inevitable - just a load of hassle distracting from the teams progress.  Why they then went and did it all again in Donegal is literally inexplicable. It's embarrassingly naive or stupid.

So only Armagh should be embarrassed, did you see all the off the ball stuff, the ineptitude of officials to act the lying down feigning head injuries when Armagh were on the attack, Armagh might be a lot of things to other counties an embarrassment for being provoked and cheated and offered nothing from inept officials they certainly are not.

If it was Donegal that initiated it, it is our fault for falling for it. Nobody else to blame. We played our part in it and there is no excusing that. I don't particularly like "Armagh have a history of this" so that means we instantly have to shoulder the blame especially as there is no evidence to suggest this.

The Armagh players were down this road already with the Tyrone game.  They saw the consequences - cameras everywhere, criticised from every corner, suspensions inevitable - just a load of hassle distracting from the teams progress.  Why they then went and did it all again in Donegal is literally inexplicable. It's embarrassingly naive or stupid.

They didn't start it at the Tyrone game and have you seen evidence of Armagh starting it this time? They were certainly involved but who started it nobody knows other than those watching in front of it all.

Can ye start an 'Ulster Infighting' thread and continue your pulling and dragging there instead?

It is getting a bit boring.  Anyone want to start the Donegal vs Armagh USFC 24/04/22 topic? 

[Donegal sub goalkeeper, he was continous in tussles.]

As usual supporters can't handle suspension, every time it's some else fault, personally I thought there no reasons for subs and backroom staff to he involved in this, and hardly any supsended. The Donegal sub goalkeeper, he was continous in tussles. So in short absolutely nothing fired out to stop the same happening again. Pathetic.

Glad someone picked up on it.

[They should be well up for the rematch]

If Murphy struck on the full time whistle and there is no video evidence available, then I'm afraid that he will not be suspended. It doesn't mean that he is innocent, just that he didn't get caught.

Presumably both teams will have videoed  the match along with the actual TV footage but neither side are going to release footage incriminating their own players. Obviously the GAA have access to a lot more footage than we have seen publicly, otherwise I'm not sure how they could suspend the 3 Armagh lads who supposedly have received bans.

Either way there will appeals and counter appeals as this rumbles on for weeks.

As oisin said after the tyrone game, there shouldn't be any appeals. Tyrone should just take their medicine. Funny I haven't heard him say it this time.

Where was he interviewed?

Does he have to be interviewed to give his opinion? Isn't that what social media is for. He was passionate about the gaa drawing a line in the sand and saying enough is enough and that tyrone shouldn't appeal decisions. Well shoe is on the other foot now so if he was sincere come out and tell armagh to suck it up.

Same as kieran. Was having a dig at tyrone saying fergal will be sticking in an appeal then he has the cheek to appeal the single red card they got.

If he did say that (I dunno) then perhaps he should heed his own advice. Regardless, pundits are always going to be biased towards their own county.  Armagh are no different and Tyrone are no different  - its the nature of the game.

He said it on the Sunday game I think it was and I agreed with him. Most of tyrones red cards were justified and I had hoped that tyrone wouldn't appeal it but unfortunately they tried to.

Oisin is a very good pundit and is usually fair enough to be honest hopefully he will come out now that the players have been identified. As someone else has said this is like gold dust for Armagh in terms of creating a team bond. They should be well up for the rematch

Do people actually think that Armagh wouldn't have been up for the match in the first instance. Their whole season centres mostly around this game so I don't know how people are trying to spin this into a positive for Armagh.

Lets be honest, Donegal are the big winners here. I'd much prefer to have the 3 players available.

I expect Donegal to have the upper hand. I watched one or two of the dubious frees they got against Tyrone. Their player literally threw themselves off their feet into the legs of Burns and Burns ended up getting a yellow card.

We were lucky in some respects if this is the end of it.  We played our part in the melee and with that comes punishment, nobody likes it but it was coming. I am not sure what Nugent or Campbell did based on TV coverage.

If Murphy struck on the full time whistle and there is no video evidence available, then I'm afraid that he will not be suspended. It doesn't mean that he is innocent, just that he didn't get caught.

Presumably both teams will have videoed  the match along with the actual TV footage but neither side are going to release footage incriminating their own players. Obviously the GAA have access to a lot more footage than we have seen publicly, otherwise I'm not sure how they could suspend the 3 Armagh lads who supposedly have received bans.

Either way there will appeals and counter appeals as this rumbles on for weeks.

As oisin said after the tyrone game, there shouldn't be any appeals. Tyrone should just take their medicine. Funny I haven't heard him say it this time.

Where was he interviewed?

Does he have to be interviewed to give his opinion? Isn't that what social media is for. He was passionate about the gaa drawing a line in the sand and saying enough is enough and that tyrone shouldn't appeal decisions. Well shoe is on the other foot now so if he was sincere come out and tell armagh to suck it up.

Same as kieran. Was having a dig at tyrone saying fergal will be sticking in an appeal then he has the cheek to appeal the single red card they got.

If he did say that (I dunno) then perhaps he should heed his own advice. Regardless, pundits are always going to be biased towards their own county.  Armagh are no different and Tyrone are no different  - its the nature of the game. And of course management are going to try and appeal bans - it would be stupid not to unless it was crystal clear.

Only 5 between the two teams suggests to me that they only went after the ones they had completely dead-to-rights so that no-one gets off on appeal.

If they really wanted to throw the book at the teams, they could easily have charged a whole raft of others based on what I saw.

Armagh and Donegal can probably consider themselves fairly fortunate.

Hard to argue against, some very lucky boys indeed.

Odhran McFadden-Ferry and McGee for Donegal

Campbell, Nugent and Mackin for Armagh

Nugent and Murnin were targeted all match and McGee came on to do a job - classy bunch.

You do have to question McGee's intentions considering he received a yellow card for the little time he was on the pitch and when on the subs bench he is suspended for his part in a melee.

Odhran McFadden-Ferry and McGee for Donegal

Campbell, Nugent and Mackin for Armagh

tyrone have suffered trial by media many times before.

Ok list the instances then. Note media coverage of guilt is not trial of media. Presumably you will reply with a list of innocent players who were portrayed as guilty in the media and then punished? Let's hear it.

Armagh should have learnt that they got off very lightly at that game

Name the guilty players then?

I am an armagh supporter and firmly believe that guilty players should be punished irrespective of where they are from. I am deeply suspicious that some want players punished because of where they are from

OK let's do this. First of all trial by media doesn't mean someone is innocent. It means the media have blown it out of proportion before the pushment has been given.

Saying as you are so interested but too lazy to find the Armagh players at fault I have done it for you

https://twitter.com/TheSundayGame/status/1508193364159733767?t=po_dYBWAiqBrjpYoUbgUjA&s=19

21 seconds in. Armagh number 15 punched dongel number 10 in side on head.

32 seconds armagh number 25 grabbed Donegal number 10 from behind and pulled him to the ground. Then an armagh sub in black top comes in and takes a swing when the Donegal player gets up.

40 seconds in Armagh number 17 drags a Donegal player down from behind by the neck.

Is that enough? Also any punch to the head is significantly more dangerous than a headlock. Count lads have died from one punch to the head.

Just for balance - First one fair enough, no justification. 

Second incident involving number 10 - Funnily enough with a bit of editing from the Sunday game an incident happened just before where #10 for Donegal forcefully shoved Jamar Hall in the back when he was walking away and Hall got back up and confronted him. The only clear headlock is from Donegal #10 on Hall and he took him to the ground.

Number 7 for Donegal through an uppercut to I think it was and the same player punched Duffy in the face.

A player whose number we cannot see for Donegal (funny that, the same with the other Donegal players) was going around antagonising every other Armagh player for a fight as he went around the field and started squared up to Forker, Duffy, Sheridan, McCabe and pushed his head into Rian O'Neill's face. 

The 40 second incident didn't happen as the video was transitioning but again, that was Duffy pulling a player off Hall and you could clearly see him pulling him off from the shirt moments before. Then the same Donegal guy going around starting fights with Armagh players was there AGAIN dragging Duffy to the floor.

No doubt about it Donegal we're at it, I didn't focus on them as I was asked to show the Armagh ones. You could easily pull up the same number if Donegal players as well.

It isn't going to happen but I really do hope all angles are shown - I really want to know what happened on the nearside. 

tyrone have suffered trial by media many times before.

Ok list the instances then. Note media coverage of guilt is not trial of media. Presumably you will reply with a list of innocent players who were portrayed as guilty in the media and then punished? Let's hear it.

Armagh should have learnt that they got off very lightly at that game

Name the guilty players then?

I am an armagh supporter and firmly believe that guilty players should be punished irrespective of where they are from. I am deeply suspicious that some want players punished because of where they are from

OK let's do this. First of all trial by media doesn't mean someone is innocent. It means the media have blown it out of proportion before the pushment has been given.

Saying as you are so interested but too lazy to find the Armagh players at fault I have done it for you

https://twitter.com/TheSundayGame/status/1508193364159733767?t=po_dYBWAiqBrjpYoUbgUjA&s=19

21 seconds in. Armagh number 15 punched dongel number 10 in side on head.

32 seconds armagh number 25 grabbed Donegal number 10 from behind and pulled him to the ground. Then an armagh sub in black top comes in and takes a swing when the Donegal player gets up.

40 seconds in Armagh number 17 drags a Donegal player down from behind by the neck.

Is that enough? Also any punch to the head is significantly more dangerous than a headlock. Count lads have died from one punch to the head.

Just for balance - First one fair enough, no justification. 

Second incident involving number 10 - Funnily enough with a bit of editing from the Sunday game an incident happened just before where #10 for Donegal forcefully shoved Jamar Hall in the back when he was walking away and Hall got back up and confronted him. The only clear headlock is from Donegal #10 on Hall and he took him to the ground.

Number 7 for Donegal through an uppercut to I think it was and the same player punched Duffy in the face.

A player whose number we cannot see for Donegal (funny that, the same with the other Donegal players) was going around antagonising every other Armagh player for a fight as he went around the field and started squared up to Forker, Duffy, Sheridan, McCabe and pushed his head into Rian O'Neill's face. 

The 40 second incident didn't happen as the video was transitioning but again, that was Duffy pulling a player off Hall and you could clearly see him pulling him off from the shirt moments before. Then the same Donegal guy going around starting fights with Armagh players was there AGAIN dragging Duffy to the floor.

its pretty rich Eamonn McGee making comment about any type of rough play, given the antics of both him and his brother over the years! How long did Neil McGee last on the pitch after being yellow carded ??   They would both know all about it.  Having viewed the pictures that he has put onto social media, its just a pity he didn't go and put the pictures up of what actually started it ie Messrs Murphy, McFaddan -Ferry, McBrearty along with most of the Donegal Back room Team and a few what looked like Stewards ? (yellow bibs) throwing their weight around. Then to start talking about the Donegal Doctor's warnings( the Doctor who spends most time on the pitch will all these invisible head injuries Donegal seem to have, when the game needs slowed down - Yet no-one ever goes off)!! Actually pretty sad from Eamonn McGee that he has to go back to a time when Karl Lacey was playing to write a story.. Armagh were no angels, but the blatant picking and choosing by some in the southern media is a joke.  Whatever punishment that is handed out needs to be taken on the chin and move on, So Long as the punishment is fair and not just directed at Armagh.  As an Armagh Fan i certainly did not shout for any Tyrone Players to be suspended in that game but Peter Harte's actions (who i like as a player) were much more rough and dangerous that anything that happened on Sunday !

It is difficult to not be bias, even when you think you aren't being biased there is always going to be a slight element of it. Unless I see it with my own two eyes, I cannot say who started it. We can speculate who started it but that is not evidence in itself. I don't like it when people form an opinion without any evidence such as "Oh Armagh must have started it, they were involved with something similar against Tyrone".  They make themselves look like clowns when they do shite like that, because it is downright lazy. I am being careful not to blame anyone because its difficult to do so amongst all that therefore you are left with the aftermath - and it doesn't look good for either team whilst the initial instigators get to have an easy ride. However, in relation to what McGee is saying - he is 100% biased so why would anyone within the GAA listen to that?

I agree with everyone else with regards to there having to be punishments for this and that it is unsightly etc. However, we make too much of a big deal out of it (myself included).  It is a competitive contact sport where teams work hard and want to win and that sometimes spills over. There is a lot that goes on on the field the cameras cannot capture. 

The McGee move seems rather suspicious

I'm not getting into the rights and wrongs of it but the irony of a McGee complaining about physical aggression!

Fair enough, but it was the headlocks, specifically, from what I read.

If there isn't a specific rule that states that a headlock is a red card then the GAA should introduce it into the rulebook, I have no problem with that. It is arguably more dangerous than a lot of current red card offences.

After that, if anybody choked an opponent in a headlock, then if the existing rules allow it issue them with a suspension. As long as the rules are applied evenly to both sides rather than this implication that it is a pre conceived tactic employed specifically by Armagh. Referencing an incident from 2014 bears little relevance to a League match 8 years later.

Dangerous play is a red card as is contributing to a melee and also a red card is striking, either with fist, arm, elbow, knee, foot or head. It was all uncalled for and subs should be in the stand, away ta feck from the sidlines were they are getting worked up along with the management

By not making it a specific offence it is then left down to the interpretation of the referee as to what is deemed dangerous. Is a headlock deemed dangerous? We have seen before how different instances of the same offence are dealt with differently by different referees.

I think there is a degree of dangerous play in those headlocks and I certainly would not like to be on the end of them, Ive ref'd long enough and this for me isn't something I've seen at club level as much, pulling lads apart or lads entering from outside is common but I hope we don't see it this season, once its properly up and running.

It will never have the uniform approach from even the best referees in the country, who you think is the best referee others will have a far less opinion on, his approach will suit your style of how it should be ref'd and others will view it differently, Gaelic games are not ref'd like other sports to be fair, soccer seems to be an easier sport to ref but there are still huge debates during and after the games and these ref's at the top table are professional ref's.

the melee is more in the public eye now due to social media smart phones and better coverage from the national TV stations

I was listening to Aaron Kernan on Sideline Eye podcast ( a much more measured approach than Eamon McGee elsewhere ) and he suggested that Croke Park could be influenced on suspensions by media and social media comment. Does anyone else think this is likely?
As an Armagh man I obviously don't want anyone suspended but if they are genuinely guilty and everyone else is treated equally then they only have themselves to blame. I would hate to think that biased social media comment could influence who gets a ban - especially if anyone has the misfortune to read the Hoganstand Forum !

I would agree with most of this however tyrone have suffered trial by media many times before. There were a right few armagh supporters pushing for tyrone suspensions after the game.

Armagh should have learnt that they got off very lightly at that game and should have the wit to keep their noses clean.

Everyone wants consistency and yes Tyrone have unfairly suffered at the hands of the media but they are not the only team to have experienced it. Armagh fans calling for Tyrone players to be suspended is completely different as Tyrone fans were making accusations that Armagh started it when this wasn't the case. Tyrone fans are now trying to lay the boot into Armagh for what happened and whilst Armagh are guilty of incidents there is no evidence to show they started it.

I could quite easily make an argument for both Armagh and Donegal wanting a reason to start it - FIVE Donegal players approached O'Neill in that melee and one of them forced their head into his face and O'Neill certainly was no angel btw neither was Hall. Something did happen with Grugan and four Donegal lads because you can see the Linesman approaching them. Likewise Armagh could be blamed for it. Wouldn't it be great to have Murphy and or McBreaty suspended?  The obvious point here is that Armagh had a history of being in a melee that is fresh in the minds of the GAA and rightly or wrongly Armagh are bearing the brunt of the blame for this even though there is nothing to suggest they started it - there is evidence to suggest suspensions are coming though for both teams in the aftermath.

Stupid judgements were made by players from both sides in the aftermath of that game and the crappy video evidence will not do the situation any justice. It is potentially a pointless exercise (in terms of getting it complete right) and  they perhaps should look at severe penalties for counties involved in them rather than having to deal with the mess.