Author Topic: Cowardly criticism of players  (Read 2370 times)

Gael85

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Re: Cowardly criticism of players
« Reply #15 on: September 21, 2021, 08:58:04 PM »
Iíd add referees too.

Slightly off topic, but refs and respect, well lack of it... Was at girls game last night , club game. The abuse from adults spectating towards the ref and opposition players (we're taking 12 / 13 / 14 year old girls) was off the charts. Both teams management behaviour towards the ref was almost as bad. It was embarrassing to listen to

And you be guaranteed most people berating the referee haven't a clue of rules of the game. Soccer is just bad with people attitudes to referees.

thewobbler

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Re: Cowardly criticism of players
« Reply #16 on: September 21, 2021, 09:08:52 PM »
I donít think knowledge (or lack thereof) of the rules plays any rule.

There is a huge cultural problem in Gaelic Games whereby aggressively calling out the referee after every decision, is not just acceptable, but in a lot of cases is expected of players, mentors and spectators.

Itís rife at every level from u9 to adult, and itís ducking disgusting.

And you know whoís (currently) most to blame? The referees. In the form of the black card, they were given a weapon to brandish some 7 years ago to curtail this from players. Thatís where it has start. And do you know what they did? They hid the thing in their pockets.

I will never ever understand this.

Jell 0 Biafra

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Re: Cowardly criticism of players
« Reply #17 on: September 22, 2021, 01:26:54 AM »
I'd say that lack of knowledge of the rules does play a role.

For example, people who think the black card is for any cynical foul--as opposed to a clearly defined set of offences-- will feel aggrieved when one isn't given for a foul on their county player, which, while cynical, isn't actually a black card.

Or people who don't know that a red-carded player can be reintroduced during extra time (which is most people, as far as I can tell), will feel that they are being cheated out of it once an opposing red-carded player is reintroduced in extra time. 

These perceived abuses add to a general feeling that the world is out to get you, and that adds to the venting on social media.

Or so it seems to me, at any rate.

thewobbler

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Re: Cowardly criticism of players
« Reply #18 on: September 22, 2021, 08:24:21 AM »
Jell in my experience, this isnít ignorance of the rules, but a summation of culture in our sport whereby every time a free is awarded against your team, itís okay to abuse the referee with all manner of poorly thought opinion and foul language.

JoG2

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Re: Cowardly criticism of players
« Reply #19 on: September 22, 2021, 08:28:49 AM »
I'd say that lack of knowledge of the rules does play a role.

For example, people who think the black card is for any cynical foul--as opposed to a clearly defined set of offences-- will feel aggrieved when one isn't given for a foul on their county player, which, while cynical, isn't actually a black card.

Or people who don't know that a red-carded player can be reintroduced during extra time (which is most people, as far as I can tell), will feel that they are being cheated out of it once an opposing red-carded player is reintroduced in extra time. 

These perceived abuses add to a general feeling that the world is out to get you, and that adds to the venting on social media.

Or so it seems to me, at any rate.

Another member of the match day panel can be introduced to make 15 for extra time. A red carded player (2 x yellows / 1 x Black & 1 yellow = red / straight red) during normal time cannot be brought back on during extra time

nrico2006

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Re: Cowardly criticism of players
« Reply #20 on: September 22, 2021, 08:44:15 AM »
I'd say that lack of knowledge of the rules does play a role.

For example, people who think the black card is for any cynical foul--as opposed to a clearly defined set of offences-- will feel aggrieved when one isn't given for a foul on their county player, which, while cynical, isn't actually a black card.

Or people who don't know that a red-carded player can be reintroduced during extra time (which is most people, as far as I can tell), will feel that they are being cheated out of it once an opposing red-carded player is reintroduced in extra time. 

These perceived abuses add to a general feeling that the world is out to get you, and that adds to the venting on social media.

Or so it seems to me, at any rate.

The problem with the rules is that they are constantly changing, its hard to keep up.  I didn't know that a red carded player could be brought back on though, seems strange.  As for the black card, its understandable that people expect every cynical foul to be a potential black card offence given that most commentators seem to be of that belief.  There was a cynical foul in the AIF, can't even remember who was involved, but it was nowhere near being any of the defined black card offences yet the commentator was expecting a black card and was surprised when one wasn't given.  Still don't understand why the black card offences hasn't been updated to simply account for any deliberate cynical fouls either.
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Milltown Row2

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Re: Cowardly criticism of players
« Reply #21 on: September 22, 2021, 11:13:17 AM »
A player red carded, or two yellow cards or a yellow card followed by a black cannot play in extra time, never could. the team can start with 15 players, but none of those players sent off in normal time... their offences would need to been seen before a CCC meeting to determined their offence and ban..

The yellow cards from the 'normal' games are squashed.. so it seems even the keyboard warriors are unsure of the rules..

as for applying them wobbler that's down to the referee, his call his interpretation of the rules, not your interpretation of the rules. If you'd like to carry out that function on the pitch for your county then they would love to have a man that knows it all and be able to carry it out correctly
Anything I post is not the view of the County Board!! Nobody died in the making of this post ;-)

thewobbler

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Re: Cowardly criticism of players
« Reply #22 on: September 22, 2021, 12:21:46 PM »
Iíll never put myself forward for that tbf MR2. But the gist of my point is that if referees were less willing to interpret verbal abuse from players (and mentors), and more willing to punish it every single time it happens, then 2/3rds of the holy trinity of ref-abusers would have no choice but to soak it upÖ. and should that happen, I would think large parts of the crowd would follow suit, for the culture of the game would be changing.
 

TheGreatest

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Re: Cowardly criticism of players
« Reply #23 on: September 22, 2021, 12:42:04 PM »
While social media can be a cesspit, this is squarely directed at mainstream media's criticism of Aidan O'Shea, in particular the Joe Brolly rant in whatever paper he wrote it.

Players who take advantage of media attention to build their own profile are also building a rod for their own backs when things don't go well on the pitch.

Dublin in the Lyons and Caffrey years embraced the hype, but got pilliored for it every year when Sam wasn't won. Although at least they were all on the hype-train together and the abuse was shared around!

In recent years, you could probably compare AOS to Bernard Brogan in terms of media attention, but Bernard was lucky enough to have success follow him so didnt have much personal abuse to deal with.

He's mentioned supporters in this, and they are your behind the keyboard trolls who are faceless, at least Brolly and co don't hide, and can and are pulled on their comments

Some of whom are on this forum.

yellowcard

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Re: Cowardly criticism of players
« Reply #24 on: September 22, 2021, 01:04:15 PM »
I've seen plenty of people wade in with criticism of these so called Mayo criticis. Yet barring Joe Brolly, has there really been that much personal criticism of them, because I haven't seen it. Or perhaps they are just afraid of calling out Brolly directly and instead make it some form of generalised complaint.

If there is a lot of criticism then the people who should be most defending their own players are the Mayo county board and team management. If I'm a Mayo player already hurting after losing an All Ireland final, I don't need to open the newspaper the following morning to be told that I'm a timewaster. The management and county board owe it to their players to defend their reputation but instead it has been mostly other media making some vague form of criticism of the abuse. 

PMG1

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Re: Cowardly criticism of players
« Reply #25 on: September 23, 2021, 02:55:26 AM »
A player red carded, or two yellow cards or a yellow card followed by a black cannot play in extra time, never could. the team can start with 15 players, but none of those players sent off in normal time... their offences would need to been seen before a CCC meeting to determined their offence and ban..

The yellow cards from the 'normal' games are squashed.. so it seems even the keyboard warriors are unsure of the rules..

as for applying them wobbler that's down to the referee, his call his interpretation of the rules, not your interpretation of the rules. If you'd like to carry out that function on the pitch for your county then they would love to have a man that knows it all and be able to carry it out correctly

Here is one for you and happened in the London Intermediate final last
Weekend, a player was black carded 2 or 3 minutes before the end of normal time, game went to extra time but given he has only 3 minutes of his 10 minute spell served should he have been allowed to start extra time or not?

delgany

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Re: Cowardly criticism of players
« Reply #26 on: September 23, 2021, 06:43:46 AM »
A player red carded, or two yellow cards or a yellow card followed by a black cannot play in extra time, never could. the team can start with 15 players, but none of those players sent off in normal time... their offences would need to been seen before a CCC meeting to determined their offence and ban..

The yellow cards from the 'normal' games are squashed.. so it seems even the keyboard warriors are unsure of the rules..

as for applying them wobbler that's down to the referee, his call his interpretation of the rules, not your interpretation of the rules. If you'd like to carry out that function on the pitch for your county then they would love to have a man that knows it all and be able to carry it out correctly

Here is one for you and happened in the London Intermediate final last
Weekend, a player was black carded 2 or 3 minutes before the end of normal time, game went to extra time but given he has only 3 minutes of his 10 minute spell served should he have been allowed to start extra time or not?

His black card ended at the conclusion of full time.
Extra time is deemed a new game, which is why teams can start with 15. A new team sheet is given to ref at inter county  games !

JoG2

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Re: Cowardly criticism of players
« Reply #27 on: September 23, 2021, 08:46:54 AM »
A player red carded, or two yellow cards or a yellow card followed by a black cannot play in extra time, never could. the team can start with 15 players, but none of those players sent off in normal time... their offences would need to been seen before a CCC meeting to determined their offence and ban..

The yellow cards from the 'normal' games are squashed.. so it seems even the keyboard warriors are unsure of the rules..

as for applying them wobbler that's down to the referee, his call his interpretation of the rules, not your interpretation of the rules. If you'd like to carry out that function on the pitch for your county then they would love to have a man that knows it all and be able to carry it out correctly

Here is one for you and happened in the London Intermediate final last
Weekend, a player was black carded 2 or 3 minutes before the end of normal time, game went to extra time but given he has only 3 minutes of his 10 minute spell served should he have been allowed to start extra time or not?

His black card ended at the conclusion of full time.
Extra time is deemed a new game, which is why teams can start with 15. A new team sheet is given to ref at inter county  games !

The players 10 mins, or whatever remains of it is carries into extra time.


Milltown Row2

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Re: Cowardly criticism of players
« Reply #28 on: September 23, 2021, 09:05:14 AM »
A player red carded, or two yellow cards or a yellow card followed by a black cannot play in extra time, never could. the team can start with 15 players, but none of those players sent off in normal time... their offences would need to been seen before a CCC meeting to determined their offence and ban..

The yellow cards from the 'normal' games are squashed.. so it seems even the keyboard warriors are unsure of the rules..

as for applying them wobbler that's down to the referee, his call his interpretation of the rules, not your interpretation of the rules. If you'd like to carry out that function on the pitch for your county then they would love to have a man that knows it all and be able to carry it out correctly

Here is one for you and happened in the London Intermediate final last
Weekend, a player was black carded 2 or 3 minutes before the end of normal time, game went to extra time but given he has only 3 minutes of his 10 minute spell served should he have been allowed to start extra time or not?

His black card ended at the conclusion of full time.
Extra time is deemed a new game, which is why teams can start with 15. A new team sheet is given to ref at inter county  games !

The players 10 mins, or whatever remains of it is carries into extra time.

Its a new game, so shouldn't carry across into new game, but as I said yellow cards are scrubbed and for whatever reason, (this was the case last year) the noting of a player continues!!?? into extra time
Anything I post is not the view of the County Board!! Nobody died in the making of this post ;-)

nrico2006

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Re: Cowardly criticism of players
« Reply #29 on: September 23, 2021, 09:26:55 AM »
Why is it seen as a new game anyway? 
'To the extreme I rock a mic like a vandal, light up a stage and wax a chump like a candle.'