11-Plus Proposal

[JimStynes]

I see I got the primary school teachers' backs up. I was of course taking the piss. But sure we'll let this fly by no problem.....

Grammar schools, by selecting the best academically, avoid this heavy lifting. The teach to the class as a whole all day long with no differentiation. Much much easier

I don't think secondary teaching is the same level of differentiation. I don't doubt that secondary school teachers differentiate though. They have to. It would be impossible to just teach everyone the same thing all year round.

[Jim Bob]

Jimbob seemed to be making it a "I work harder than him" snorefest. We'll go out and clap him on Wednesday nights.

You've chucked in the towel Hardstation. 

[Jim Bob]

Pathetic response.
You realise you lost the argument and are now attempting to be a smsrtalec to divert away from that fact.
Tell me , how can you say for certain that no primary school teacher differentiates their work. Try to answer without attempting a silly attempt at humour to deflect the topic

[Jim Bob]

I'm not saying that. Of course they do. Me saying that was in response to you saying that grammar school teachers don't differentiate. That is a ridiculous statement and I was merely trying to show you that it's very simple to say something of little substance which can only be backed up by anecdotal evidence like "I know a teacher..." which we all know can be taken as shite.

Fair enough..... 

[Jim Bob]

If I'm honest, I really expected you to pick up on that much earlier.

Naw   What you thought was obvious......wasn't

[Jim Bob]

Was a poor effort to be honest

[delgany]

Lagan Integrated College in Belfast has pulled academic selection for its grammar stream. It is a bi- lateral scheme . Over subscribed by 300 applications last year.

The newry schools  were oversubscribed by  38, 51, 64 and 78 applications . Kilkeel school was under subscribed by 20 places .
Depending on enrolment trends they would be able to manage s selection process based on siblings and eldest child  and some parental attachment

[Jim Bob]

Lagan College have dropped the tests for this year as well. Good to see. Will put more pressure on those grammars who appear to be  still holding out.

[Milltown Row2]

Lagan College have dropped the tests for this year as well. Good to see. Will put more pressure on those grammars who appear to be  still holding out.

I e a mate that teaches there. What was their entrance marks to their 'grammar' stream?

[Olly]

Should it not just be on looks. All the top smartest people are handsome and beautiful. Most women CEOs are spectacular. I remember in Dungannon all the good looking lads and women went to the Academy. Some rare ones across the road.

[johnnycool]

Because it's only for a year and will still be a grammar school
That's why
What if I want my Johnny to go to the grammar school and he isn't accepted next year? This is real life stuff don't say that won't happen because it will

Could the primary schools divulge the pupils standardised scores over P6 or whatever?

There will be a few kids who just won't be able to cope even if mummy and daddy want them to attend!

[Jeepers Creepers]

Jeez I remember in my primnary school class we had a list of everyones names on the wall 1-25 of smartest to not so smart! Try that one now!

[delgany]

Because it's only for a year and will still be a grammar school
That's why
What if I want my Johnny to go to the grammar school and he isn't accepted next year? This is real life stuff don't say that won't happen because it will

Could the primary schools divulge the pupils standardised scores over P6 or whatever?

There will be a few kids who just won't be able to cope even if mummy and daddy want them to attend!

The P6 standardised scores are based on GL assessments ( not to be confused with the actual GL test ). They are generally undertaken in May/ June, in most schools, so no scores available.
There would also be differences in test application by schools , some use computer based tests and some use paper tests.
This could lead to discrepancies between the outcomes .

The scores would be subject to parents agreeing to share them as well.

Ultimately , parents complete the post primary applications , you be hoping they would listen to the primary schools advice.
The difficulty lies with the small group of children who would be borderline both in standardised scores, and they can either max out in the exams and do well or can slip down . They are the hardest calls for schools and indeed parents .

If post primary schools use non academic criteria , those kids that are the eldest/ only child and/ or have siblings at a school will be most likely to gain access to the school of their choice.

However , there will be a small group of children , who may struggle to get admitted as they dont match the criteria for schools that are heavily oversubscribed eg Lagan college was oversubscribed by 300 last year .

[tintin25]

Jeez I remember in my primnary school class we had a list of everyones names on the wall 1-25 of smartest to not so smart! Try that one now!

Had the same thing at Grammar school for the first 3 years

[brokencrossbar1]

Jeez I remember in my primnary school class we had a list of everyones names on the wall 1-25 of smartest to not so smart! Try that one now!

Had the same thing at Grammar school for the first 3 years

We had 3 rows from P 5 onwards....based on your summer exam results from the previous year.  That's right we did Christmas and Summer tests and had a proper report book etc. The ones in row 3 also went to the Remedial Reading and Maths Class. Imagine that nowadays and being called that!