Catholic Church suspends gay priest

theskull1 · October 15, 2007, 12:12:08 PM

http://news.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=1640942007

After being accused of being one of the hijackers of another thread by discussing this subject area, this well timed headline provides a good basis to discuss homosexuality in the priesthood. Now I'll admit at the outset that I'm an atheist, but the old catholic guilt still plays with the mind and as well as that I've children who need to go through a catholic education system so I'd like to be seen as a conscientious objector if you like. This headline suggests that I'm not the only one to see a lot of effeminate priests about the place who because they are living a lie cannot play a decent role in providing leadership to their flocks. Are those of you who would be more devout not concerned about the damage being done.

whiskeysteve · October 15, 2007, 12:19:47 PM

Are you saying that if you are a Catholic priest you are more likely to be gay?

theskull1 · October 15, 2007, 12:25:33 PM

No. Care to comment on what I did post?

whiskeysteve · October 15, 2007, 01:12:02 PM

Then what do you mean when you say that are a lot of effeminate priests who are living a lie?

Are you saying effeminate men make poor leaders?

Many religious leaders throughout the world have a gentle manner through which they provide spiritual guidance to their congregations. You could have the red blooded hellfire preachers / advocates of jihad I suppose but it is questionable whether their leadership is any better.

Hurler on the Bitch · October 15, 2007, 01:12:34 PM

Good point... In the 1950s and 1960s - or whenever ... Irish families had on average 8 or 9 kids ... all the brothers were all into the GAA, women etc but one had no interest in GAA - nor girls - and was he gay? No, in most homes it was because "he's bound for the priesthood" - simple fact was that in the law of averages he was gay... just very confused and ended up a priest..

Declan · October 15, 2007, 01:21:01 PM

Don't understand the point of your comments really. Just because they are effeminate they are gay?? Just because they are gay means they cannot carry out their duties?

A couple of points re the article itself.

It states

QuoteThe decision clearly illustrates the Vatican's stance that homosexuality is a sin

Not true -My understanding is that the sexual orientation itself is not a sin but the practice of it is - Same as pre-marital or sex outside marriage for heterosexuals.

Also any article that calls the Pope "enforcer of orthodoxy" to me indicates its unbalanced straight away.

Hound · October 15, 2007, 01:30:06 PM

Quote from: Declan on October 15, 2007, 01:21:01 PM

Also any article that calls the Pope "enforcer of orthodoxy" to me indicates its unbalanced straight away.

I don't think that means its unbalanced. He was regularly called the Vatican's chief enforcer of orthodoxy prior to becoming Pope! I thought that was a job title, but either way I dont think its derogatory.

Declan · October 15, 2007, 01:33:06 PM

QuoteHe was regularly called the Vatican's chief enforcer of orthodoxy

By whom? I'd suggest by those with an anti catholic church mindset

Hound · October 15, 2007, 01:41:37 PM

Quote from: Declan on October 15, 2007, 01:33:06 PM
QuoteHe was regularly called the Vatican's chief enforcer of orthodoxy

By whom? I'd suggest by those with an anti catholic church mindset

A quick google came up with the Guardian, Business Week, NY Times, LA Times, The Scotsman, USA Today and the Times. Dunno if they are all anti catholic, but what about the "Catholic League" - that well known anti catholic cult

http://www.catholicleague.org/release.php?id=956

"In 1998, as John Paul II's enforcer of orthodoxy, he said that the Church's prohibition against 'priestly ordination of women' had 'been set forth infallibly'"

Declan · October 15, 2007, 01:46:27 PM

Quote"Catholic League" - that well known anti catholic cult

Indeed cults the lot of them

theskull1 · October 15, 2007, 01:47:00 PM

Quote from: whiskeysteve on October 15, 2007, 01:12:02 PM
Then what do you mean when you say that are a lot of effeminate priests who are living a lie?

Are you saying effeminate men make poor leaders?

Many religious leaders throughout the world have a gentle manner through which they provide spiritual guidance to their congregations. You could have the red blooded hellfire preachers / advocates of jihad I suppose but it is questionable whether their leadership is any better.

Well as leaders of the catholic faith these men were meant to have joined the order because the had a "calling" from god. There are a sizable number who joined for different reasons. If you look at the pedophile priests and swimming coaches, it is blatantly obvious they were lying about the intentions going into such positions and have brought those profession into disrepute. I'm saying that these effeminate priests are (to a lesser degree of seriousness) doing the same....i.e. living a lie. They loose credibility when people realize why they became a priest in the first place.

To my mind there is a big difference between having a gentle manner and being effeminate. I'm saying that generally, effeminate men do not seem to possess the right character traits to be leaders. I just can't think of any examples of any. I'm prepared to admit I'm wrong if others can prove otherwise. These priest get on great with the rosary bead brigade but don't seem to be able to reach out beyond to the community they serve in and encourage the waverers back into the flock.

Declan · October 15, 2007, 01:55:05 PM

QuoteWell as leaders of the catholic faith

Why would they be seen as leaders of the catholic faith. Historically maybe but nowadays I doubt it.to my mind they are ministering to their flock etc rather than "leading" them

What would your definition of effeminate be?

Orior · October 15, 2007, 02:05:03 PM

My only concern here is how high will they be suspending the priest from?

Ah sure this is too serious an issue for me to be voicing my opinion (which I rate very highly). But what is the alternative for the Church? Let him continue? No way. Suspending him is the lessor or two evils. I'm sure ArchBishop High Priest His Holiness Pope Pat Buckley esquire will have a bed for him.

Declan · October 15, 2007, 02:07:35 PM

QuoteI'm sure ArchBishop High Priest His Holiness Pope Pat Buckley esquire will have a bed for him.

Single I hope Orior

theskull1 · October 15, 2007, 02:15:29 PM

Quote from: Declan on October 15, 2007, 01:55:05 PM
QuoteWell as leaders of the catholic faith

Why would they be seen as leaders of the catholic faith. Historically maybe but nowadays I doubt it.to my mind they are ministering to their flock etc rather than "leading" them

What would your definition of effeminate be?

Well their role has been watered down then
Would they not be providing a leadership role if they had the ability to do so? I'd say people are embarrassed with them but realise someone has to say mass, do christenings, funerals etc. It's not the type of thing people feel comfortable speaking up about. Some priests are still leaders in their communities btw and play a real positive role in their ministry so I'm not trying to tar every priest with this accusation.

As far as my definition of effeminate, I'm happy with the wikipedia definition

"Effeminacy is a trait in males that generally contradicts traditional male (masculine) gender roles. It is a term frequently applied to femininity; or womanly behavior, demeanor, and appearance displayed by a man". Not all effeminate men are homosexual but most of them are.