Down Club Hurling & Football

[imagine]

Accountability and transparency are huge factors.
Without them, there is no integrity and people lose confidence and have no faith in decision-makers and the structures they apparently uphold.
When you hear about task forces, steering committees, focus groups, think tanks etc it pretty much smells of bullshit, smoke and mirrors. And for a long time people in the county have been blinded by the bullshit and swallowed it whole.

A brush should be taken to that county board and the unelected figures in the background that use them as puppets roaded.
Jobs for the boys.

Have a friend who's son is on the Down U16 Dev Squad and a nephew who is on the Tyrone U16 one.The Down squad are scheduled to meet 6 times from the start of the year up to the end of August.Tyrone have met at least twice every three weeks but it's mostly weekly around this time of the year.Manager of the Down squad is Benny Coulter.

What is your point,  a quick glance on social media would see that Down u15 and u16s have been playing plenty of matches? What would be the point of taking kids halfway across the county to train when they are already getting coaching 2-3 times a week in their clubs with a match on a Monday night!
BTW that is a gripe of mine, carrying 50 odd lads on a development squad !!

Apparently Mooney is back in the Down camp.

So TruthHurts,Tyrone have got it wrong all these years.
We're doing it correctly and getting exactly what for this good practice?

[Truth hurts]

Accountability and transparency are huge factors.
Without them, there is no integrity and people lose confidence and have no faith in decision-makers and the structures they apparently uphold.
When you hear about task forces, steering committees, focus groups, think tanks etc it pretty much smells of bullshit, smoke and mirrors. And for a long time people in the county have been blinded by the bullshit and swallowed it whole.

A brush should be taken to that county board and the unelected figures in the background that use them as puppets roaded.
Jobs for the boys.

Have a friend who's son is on the Down U16 Dev Squad and a nephew who is on the Tyrone U16 one.The Down squad are scheduled to meet 6 times from the start of the year up to the end of August.Tyrone have met at least twice every three weeks but it's mostly weekly around this time of the year.Manager of the Down squad is Benny Coulter.

What is your point,  a quick glance on social media would see that Down u15 and u16s have been playing plenty of matches? What would be the point of taking kids halfway across the county to train when they are already getting coaching 2-3 times a week in their clubs with a match on a Monday night!
BTW that is a gripe of mine, carrying 50 odd lads on a development squad !!

Apparently Mooney is back in the Down camp.

So TruthHurts,Tyrone have got it wrong all these years.
We're doing it correctly and getting exactly what for this good practice?

I do not get what you are getting at?

[johnnycool]

Taken from an article in Irish News - Jan 2016.

.....the main focus for the Mourne county is ending the barren run they find themselves on at present. No Ulster senior football title in 22 years. No Ulster minor football title in 17 years (although there was an All-Ireland in between). Just three provincial U21 titles since the mid-1980s.

It is not a particularly healthy recent roll of honour. They know that themselves. They're reminded of it often enough. But over the past year-and-a-half, the building blocks for the restoration of Down's lofty reputation have been laid.

1991 All-Ireland winning captain Paddy O'Rourke was appointed last November to head a steering committee for the new Mourne Academy. By that stage, he had a year under him of working with the county's development squads. James McCartan, who only stepped away from the senior job at the end of the 2014 season, has already been tempted back in to try and boost Down's quest to return to the top table at minor level.

The likes of '94 captain DJ Kane, professor Niall Moyna (who acts as a consultant) and county development manager Conor O'Toole are also on the steering group: "Two years ago, we launched a consultative programme," says long-serving Down county secretary Seán Óg McAteer.

"We took in a wonderful man, David Passmore, a senior lecturer in DCU, whose background is Irish hockey. He's done a really in-depth report, having consulted widely with schools, clubs, former players, people who were interested in Down football.

"In the past, we've done four plans in hurling and never one in football. For a county like Down never to have looked at its football from Maurice Hayes' time..."

That was part of the problem. 'The Down Way' brought regular success from 1960 until the mid-90s, give or take an odd blip. But at present, Down are enduring their longest spell without senior success since the years prior to their 1959 Ulster title.

For Newry Mitchel's man McAteer, one of the keys to bringing the county back to the top table is expanding Gaelic games through the schools: "Currently, we're in 86 primary schools through a coaching programme. We'd really like to broaden that.

"We're in some integrated schools, but we'd really like to get into state schools as well. Not to shove anything down anybody's throat, but to let them sample Gaelic games. To actually just have taster sessions and tell them the story of what Down's about.

"You go somewhere and someone asks where you're from, you'll say county Derry, I'll say county Down. It's one thing that unites people. It isn't a badge of anything; it's where you're from. The people from Comber, Saintfield, Newtownards are as much a Down person as anyone from Newry or Downpatrick or Kilcoo.

"We've got something there that can be a brand that unites people. That's something we'd like to explore by telling our story through the communities and schools over the next few years."

The issues Down face are not unique. Other counties have similar problems. For Derry, it is the city. For Antrim, it's the middle of Belfast. Donegal have their struggles in Letterkenny.

Soccer and rugby, particularly the growth of the latter, continue to enjoy a duopoly on the youth's imagination. The bigger the population base, the wider the sporting pallet of the inhabitants.

Take the 2005 All-Ireland minor winning squad. Two "major population centres", as McAteer puts it, of Newry and Downpatrick provided precisely none of what was, at one stage, a 38-man squad.

In Newry, the Shamrocks and John Bosco are both in Division Three. John Mitchel's are in Division Four. And yet, out in the hinterlands, Ballyholland, Glenn, Saval and clubs like them thrive in the top flight.

"There's a problem there definitely, within Newry. There's a lot of work being done in all of those clubs at underage levels," McAteer added.

"We have to try as a county to allow that work to happen and to develop it at underage through the schools. We have to try and ensure there are as many people as possible in Newry playing Gaelic football and hurling as possible.

"We have to look at Newry and Downpatrick in particular, but there are other urban centres there too. You have Banbridge, Kilkeel, Warrenpoint, all growing towns. You have that area of St Paul's and Holywood and Newtownards and nobody from those population centres about county panels. That needs to change if we're going to be successful.

"This year, as part of James' work with the minors, we've set up coaching clinics in Belfast, which run on a weekly basis, targeting young players from around Bredagh, St Paul's, Carryduff, Drumaness, Darragh Cross and people from the schools in Belfast. It's not just our usual schools that need to be targeted; it's all the schools in the Belfast area. In all those schools, there's people playing Gaelic games, at home or wherever.

"We hope that project will come to fruition and we'll maybe get a few to county minor panels. We mightn't get anybody, but at least those boys are exposed to good quality coaching for 10 weeks and the opportunity to get onto a Down minor panel. We have to be creative. We are being imaginative. These things will take time to come."

A passionate McAteer also clarified comments he made at the recent Down convention. In his report, McAteer hit out at the media, suggesting the "ethos of the GAA... is not something of interest" to reporters who also cover soccer and rugby.

However, he told The Irish News earlier this week he respects that people have opinions and that they're entitled to offer them: "Last year, we were probably getting a bit of a kicking at times. I'm passionate about Down GAA, it's my life and my work," he said.

"But we have to respect that the people within The Irish News provide a vital outlet for the promotion of our games. We have to be positive about that as well. We saw the value of that when we advertised our club championship games in The Irish News this year and we saw our gates increase. We saw the number of people at our games increase because we positively marketed our games through The Irish News.

"It's a two-way street. We recognise the work that journalists do in promoting our games. It's vital that we're an open house for journalists. There's no room within Down for us to be a closed house. We have to respect that journalists have a job to do. We mightn't always agree with what they say, but we have to respect that people have opinions and that they're entitled to offer them."

Back to the job in hand and a determined McAteer sees high hopes for Down. The timeframe for Down success? Between seven and 10 years, according to the report produced by David Passmore.

If things go to plan, that is the timeframe inside which Down hope to be back competing for Ulster and All-Ireland titles regularly: "You will get to the top table at different stages in that time, but we need to be consistently there," said McAteer.

"You're not always going to win because there's only ever one team at each age group that will win. But we need to be consistently at the top table."

Mourne County GAA Academy under the chairmanship of former All-Ireland winning captain Paddy O'Rourke. Other members of the Group include 1994 All-Ireland winning captain DJ Kane (Newry Shamrocks), Declan Mussen (Kilcoo), Dr Eddie Harney (Saul), Joe Tunney (Carryduff), James McCartan (Minor Manager), Conor O'Toole (County Development Manager), Tom Potter (Coaching Officer) and Professor Niall Moyna (DCU) who will act as a consultant/advisor to the group.

Id love someone to give an update on how all this is going roughly 6 years after this was all conceived.

4 plans for hurling, I know of one done by a clubmember of mine of my fathers generation "Getting Down to Hurl" and as I said before putting a plan on paper is one thing, on the grass is another and I don't think any of his recommendations ever made it to fruition.

The others must also be gathering dust somewhere


FWIW, I do believe the change in how U13's are structured this year is a good thing although ultimately I would like to see the return of U12, U14, U16 and U18 instead of U13 go games, and U15 and U17 full rules.

[wobbller]

Accountability and transparency are huge factors.
Without them, there is no integrity and people lose confidence and have no faith in decision-makers and the structures they apparently uphold.
When you hear about task forces, steering committees, focus groups, think tanks etc it pretty much smells of bullshit, smoke and mirrors. And for a long time people in the county have been blinded by the bullshit and swallowed it whole.

A brush should be taken to that county board and the unelected figures in the background that use them as puppets roaded.
Jobs for the boys.

Have a friend who's son is on the Down U16 Dev Squad and a nephew who is on the Tyrone U16 one.The Down squad are scheduled to meet 6 times from the start of the year up to the end of August.Tyrone have met at least twice every three weeks but it's mostly weekly around this time of the year.Manager of the Down squad is Benny Coulter.

What is your point,  a quick glance on social media would see that Down u15 and u16s have been playing plenty of matches? What would be the point of taking kids halfway across the county to train when they are already getting coaching 2-3 times a week in their clubs with a match on a Monday night!
BTW that is a gripe of mine, carrying 50 odd lads on a development squad !!

Apparently Mooney is back in the Down camp.

So TruthHurts,Tyrone have got it wrong all these years.
We're doing it correctly and getting exactly what for this good practice?

I do not get what you are getting at?

I think what he is getting at is that the Down method of running their Dev squads is not yielding results( U16's only meeting 6 out of 33-35 possible weeks---ridiculous if true) whereas Tyrone's method over the years of putting real work into their Dev squads has and probably will continue to reap rewards.That's twice today our paid employees that been brought into the various conversations on the ills of Down football.Both probably paid Managers in other Clubs.

[Truth hurts]

Accountability and transparency are huge factors.
Without them, there is no integrity and people lose confidence and have no faith in decision-makers and the structures they apparently uphold.
When you hear about task forces, steering committees, focus groups, think tanks etc it pretty much smells of bullshit, smoke and mirrors. And for a long time people in the county have been blinded by the bullshit and swallowed it whole.

A brush should be taken to that county board and the unelected figures in the background that use them as puppets roaded.
Jobs for the boys.

Have a friend who's son is on the Down U16 Dev Squad and a nephew who is on the Tyrone U16 one.The Down squad are scheduled to meet 6 times from the start of the year up to the end of August.Tyrone have met at least twice every three weeks but it's mostly weekly around this time of the year.Manager of the Down squad is Benny Coulter.

What is your point,  a quick glance on social media would see that Down u15 and u16s have been playing plenty of matches? What would be the point of taking kids halfway across the county to train when they are already getting coaching 2-3 times a week in their clubs with a match on a Monday night!
BTW that is a gripe of mine, carrying 50 odd lads on a development squad !!

Apparently Mooney is back in the Down camp.

So TruthHurts,Tyrone have got it wrong all these years.
We're doing it correctly and getting exactly what for this good practice?

I do not get what you are getting at?

I think what he is getting at is that the Down method of running their Dev squads is not yielding results( U16's only meeting 6 out of 33-35 possible weeks---ridiculous if true) whereas Tyrone's method over the years of putting real work into their Dev squads has and probably will continue to reap rewards.That's twice today our paid employees that been brought into the various conversations on the ills of Down football.Both probably paid Managers in other Clubs.

They meet every weekend, this is enough. They develop in their schools and clubs more.

[Truth hurts]

We need Down schools competing at A grade Colleges Football and where we can't make A grade then we must aspire not to go below B grade for our bigger schools or more established names. If we look back to 2010, we had gained from having three Down schools play in the Mac Rory in the era of 2005/6 as the Abbey, St Louis and St Colman's did battle, the hard yards ploughed in those competitions helped Marty Clarke, Kevin McKernan and others take their places as County Footballers. So, I say that post-Christmas in the academic year of 2022, let us deploy our coaches in our second level schools, and not just as coaches but as Development Officers to undertake work to develop Club-School links.

We have for 20 plus years channelled all of our Coaching through the Primary Schools, we offered that to schools again in the period September to December 2021, now I am saying let us take a chance put our Coaches and our GDM into the Second level schools to work from January to June for the betterment of Schools, Club and County. Let us experiment, let us feel the fear but let's do it anyway.

Thats an extract from Sean ogs secretart report in 2021, its on the Down website

[Mourne Red]

Accountability and transparency are huge factors.
Without them, there is no integrity and people lose confidence and have no faith in decision-makers and the structures they apparently uphold.
When you hear about task forces, steering committees, focus groups, think tanks etc it pretty much smells of bullshit, smoke and mirrors. And for a long time people in the county have been blinded by the bullshit and swallowed it whole.

A brush should be taken to that county board and the unelected figures in the background that use them as puppets roaded.
Jobs for the boys.

Have a friend who's son is on the Down U16 Dev Squad and a nephew who is on the Tyrone U16 one.The Down squad are scheduled to meet 6 times from the start of the year up to the end of August.Tyrone have met at least twice every three weeks but it's mostly weekly around this time of the year.Manager of the Down squad is Benny Coulter.

What is your point,  a quick glance on social media would see that Down u15 and u16s have been playing plenty of matches? What would be the point of taking kids halfway across the county to train when they are already getting coaching 2-3 times a week in their clubs with a match on a Monday night!
BTW that is a gripe of mine, carrying 50 odd lads on a development squad !!

Apparently Mooney is back in the Down camp.

So TruthHurts,Tyrone have got it wrong all these years.
We're doing it correctly and getting exactly what for this good practice?

I do not get what you are getting at?

I think what he is getting at is that the Down method of running their Dev squads is not yielding results( U16's only meeting 6 out of 33-35 possible weeks---ridiculous if true) whereas Tyrone's method over the years of putting real work into their Dev squads has and probably will continue to reap rewards.That's twice today our paid employees that been brought into the various conversations on the ills of Down football.Both probably paid Managers in other Clubs.

They meet every weekend, this is enough. They develop in their schools and clubs more.

Isn't this the same fella who said u11s should be training and having matches 3 times a week? You're some BSr Truth

[imagine]

Accountability and transparency are huge factors.
Without them, there is no integrity and people lose confidence and have no faith in decision-makers and the structures they apparently uphold.
When you hear about task forces, steering committees, focus groups, think tanks etc it pretty much smells of bullshit, smoke and mirrors. And for a long time people in the county have been blinded by the bullshit and swallowed it whole.

A brush should be taken to that county board and the unelected figures in the background that use them as puppets roaded.
Jobs for the boys.

Have a friend who's son is on the Down U16 Dev Squad and a nephew who is on the Tyrone U16 one.The Down squad are scheduled to meet 6 times from the start of the year up to the end of August.Tyrone have met at least twice every three weeks but it's mostly weekly around this time of the year.Manager of the Down squad is Benny Coulter.

What is your point,  a quick glance on social media would see that Down u15 and u16s have been playing plenty of matches? What would be the point of taking kids halfway across the county to train when they are already getting coaching 2-3 times a week in their clubs with a match on a Monday night!
BTW that is a gripe of mine, carrying 50 odd lads on a development squad !!

Apparently Mooney is back in the Down camp.

So TruthHurts,Tyrone have got it wrong all these years.
We're doing it correctly and getting exactly what for this good practice?

I do not get what you are getting at?

I think what he is getting at is that the Down method of running their Dev squads is not yielding results( U16's only meeting 6 out of 33-35 possible weeks---ridiculous if true) whereas Tyrone's method over the years of putting real work into their Dev squads has and probably will continue to reap rewards.That's twice today our paid employees that been brought into the various conversations on the ills of Down football.Both probably paid Managers in other Clubs.

They meet every weekend, this is enough. They develop in their schools and clubs more.

They do not meet every week.

[SamFever]

 They're all happy now that the challenge game is OFF.
A lot of anger today on this chat.Chill!

[Johnnysboys]

We need Down schools competing at A grade Colleges Football and where we can't make A grade then we must aspire not to go below B grade for our bigger schools or more established names. If we look back to 2010, we had gained from having three Down schools play in the Mac Rory in the era of 2005/6 as the Abbey, St Louis and St Colman's did battle, the hard yards ploughed in those competitions helped Marty Clarke, Kevin McKernan and others take their places as County Footballers. So, I say that post-Christmas in the academic year of 2022, let us deploy our coaches in our second level schools, and not just as coaches but as Development Officers to undertake work to develop Club-School links.

Are you serious. The PE staff in St Marks would take some look at ya if you even suggested going to B grade football let alone A grade. There are over 450 lads to play football in that place. Lads from Clonduff, Mayobridge, CPN, Burren, Rostrevor etc. serious strong clubs with serious history. I have no doubt the players are there - but the drive and ambition of the staff definitely ain't. Nerf wars and GAA training with soccer balls, playing D competitions - it's an absolute disgrace. Barney McAleenan would crack up if he was back now. Barney was a real tough task master who trained the sh**e out of us but we all left the school feeling like we were Down players. Surely the new county proposal should hopefully be targeting this place so we can get this once GAA institute back up the footballing ladder again.

[rosskarr]

 Teachers are not what they use to be.

[Walter Cronc]

Teachers are not what they use to be.

Most definitely agree with this. Then again they are probably under more pressure than before. Should counties not take control of coaching in these schools? I think St Mary's Magherafelt have a full time GAA coach - not sure who pays for it. It's resulted in a big upturn in their fortunes - albeit they were always competitive.

[delgany]

Teachers are not what they use to be.

Most definitely agree with this. Then again they are probably under more pressure than before. Should counties not take control of coaching in these schools? I think St Mary's Magherafelt have a full time GAA coach - not sure who pays for it. It's resulted in a big upturn in their fortunes - albeit they were always competitive.

St.Marys is a voluntary grammar , manages its own budget , charges a capital fee, pays for coaching expertise,  DOF .

[marty34]

Teachers are not what they use to be.

Most definitely agree with this. Then again they are probably under more pressure than before. Should counties not take control of coaching in these schools? I think St Mary's Magherafelt have a full time GAA coach - not sure who pays for it. It's resulted in a big upturn in their fortunes - albeit they were always competitive.

I wouldn't say it's down to one person.

This extra person in a school probably helps with coaching but is a big bonus in booking buses, pitches and contacting the other schools etc. A lot of time involved in that I'd say.

Good at helping out with the coaching but players/students coming to the school must be of a decent standard also.

[Johnnysboys]

Most definitely agree with this. Then again they are probably under more pressure than before. Should counties not take control of coaching in these schools? I think St Mary's Magherafelt have a full time GAA coach - not sure who pays for it. It's resulted in a big upturn in their fortunes - albeit they were always competitive.
[/quote]

What extra pressure are they under now that wasn't there in years gone by? I just think the excuses made are a joke. If you are working in a school PE department steeped in GAA tradition - you have to step up. Simple as that. Why would the county take control of this? That would be like Man Utd sending coaches into every school in Manchester to take coaching sessions while the teachers sit on their backsides doing nothing.