26 County General Election 2020

[Angelo]

Especially as we'll all be living in €65,000 houses, will have no tax to pay, everything will be free.......
Why didnt someone think of all this before?
Who said 1977?

Lad, what slightly irritates me is this snobbery around SF's lack of financial know how. I mean when you consider the mess the country is in today, homelessness, a childrens hospital out of control and hospital services that are almost 3rd world (to name a few) brought to you by the financial experts in FF and FG. Who are they or their supporters to throw stones. They have royally fucked the country. For christ sake FF ran it to bankruptcy and had the IMF in and their leader was a minister in that government!

You've never been to a 3rd world if you think the health service, level of homelessness and what is being spent on a children's hospital are 3rd world.

Read what I wrote again,  slowly

Health service will only get worse under SF, because they will damage the economy. Anti-European, anti-business, anti-entrepreneur = anti-jobs.
We've full employment, tax takes are booming. Tax rates are extremely low for the low paid and progressive (high) for the well paid. Minimum wage is second highest in Europe.
Health service is a long way short, but Slaintecare is the best plan we've had. Throwing money at it on it's own won't work, but finally we've a thought-out plan that should improve things considerably.

The health service is the toilet and the homeless crisis continues to spiral out of control.

But hey, there's a booming economy as wealth inequality sores.

[Fear Bun Na Sceilpe]

The amount of people defending SF's stance on the Paul Quinn case is really disgusting. Brainwashed.

[Tubberman]

How exactly did FF and FG "create the pension crisis"?
By not legalising Euthanasia?
By not making Euthanasia compulsory?

Jases Angelo you're shinnerbotism at its worst

Well first of all, I'd like to draw attention to the idiocy of this post.

You seem to be alluding to the fact that the pension crisis was a magical creation that happened out of thin air? The contradiction here is that you are ashamed to admit your FF/FG allegiance, yet you are one of their most ardent apologists here, consistently out here defending the indefensible for them.

The pensions crisis arose from gross mismanagement by both FF/FG. You obviously seem to be under the delusion that government makes no policy on pension contributions and entitlements, that government takes no role in fiscal management and that government and that government takes no responsibility for forward planning and contingencies when it comes to meeting those entitlements. A government in your eyes does not take any accountability for the gross incompetence and abuse of power that FF/FG have had throughout their control on the state.

The real roots of the pension issue are the bloated public sector pensions that the two establishment parties introduced and failed to address before it was too late and a pension crisis ensued.

Wink wink, nudge nudge politics that FF and FG engage in is the type of government that will bring you from one scandal into the next and I guess they're chuffed to know they'll still have a few village idiots like yourself to put a tick beside them in the ballot box.

The fact you're spouting on about euthanasia shows the level of intelligence of your average FF/FG hick.

It's a global issue largely related to demographic changes i.e. people living longer and having fewer children, therefore more pensioners with less working people to support them.
It is not an Irish or FF/FG specific issue.
The SF "solution" that "demographics will look after it" is laughable! The demographic changes are what has caused the problem! Mary-Lou reckons having SF in office will mean we'll suddenly revert to having 5 kids per household.

That's not true though, it's a bloated public service pension that is a crux of the matter and neither FF or FG took any steps to tackle the system until it was too late.

The old scheme, which applies to those hired before 2013, offers those on full 40-year service a pension equal to 50 per cent of final salary, index linked to future public pay increases and with a tax-free lump sum of 1½ times annual salary on retirement.

So someone on around €66,000 with full service would get a tax-free lump sum of around €100,000 on departure, and then a generous pension entitlement. This has generally been an unfunded pay-as-you scheme, though some groups, including teachers, have paid contributions. It is, on any calculation, an extraordinary perk.

First, a new scheme was created, the so-called single scheme, which pared back the entitlements for those joining after January 1st, 2013. Pensions for newer entrants are based on career average earnings, and are index-linked based on inflation rather than tied to public sector wage rises.

Second, a pension-related deduction was introduced for public servants as one of the crisis measures, and this was subsequently transformed – in slightly less onerous form – into an ongoing additional contribution to their pension (the so-called ACS).

This has left pre-2013 public servants with a sweet deal despite the fact they are paying a bit more. The civil service pension scheme website, for example, calculates that to buy the benefits available to a higher executive officer on retirement would require someone in the private sector to have a pension pot of €690,000, while for a principal officer the sum rises to €1.34 million.

Those public sector pension levels are obscene compared to the rest of Europe.

I don't disagree that public pensions are way too generous for those who retired before the crash. But the larger demographic point is the bigger issue coming down the road.
How does SF policy of giving the pension to everyone at 65 (and no indication of increasing that age in years to come) resolve the issue in any way??

[Snapchap]

The amount of people defending SF's stance on the Paul Quinn case is really disgusting. Brainwashed.

The amount of people using him for political point scoring is disgusting. And it's typically from people who neither know about, nor want to know about the victims of the conflict unless there's an election campaign happening. Then they'll always pick a useful one. And when the campaign is over, there won't be a word about Paul from the same people. Because that's how much they really care about him and his case. People who a fortnight ago probably never heard of Paul Quinn, but weirdly are taking an interest these days. Nothing like digging up the IRA or things that happened 15 years ago to distract simpletons from the homelessness & health crises that are the real clear & present danger to people today.

[yellowcard]

Briege Quinn on the Stephen Nolan show this morning calling on Conor Murphy to quit and Doug Beattie and Jim Allister on now doing the same. The story has now grown legs since last night and Conor Murphy could now be under serious pressure.

[Angelo]

How exactly did FF and FG "create the pension crisis"?
By not legalising Euthanasia?
By not making Euthanasia compulsory?

Jases Angelo you're shinnerbotism at its worst

Well first of all, I'd like to draw attention to the idiocy of this post.

You seem to be alluding to the fact that the pension crisis was a magical creation that happened out of thin air? The contradiction here is that you are ashamed to admit your FF/FG allegiance, yet you are one of their most ardent apologists here, consistently out here defending the indefensible for them.

The pensions crisis arose from gross mismanagement by both FF/FG. You obviously seem to be under the delusion that government makes no policy on pension contributions and entitlements, that government takes no role in fiscal management and that government and that government takes no responsibility for forward planning and contingencies when it comes to meeting those entitlements. A government in your eyes does not take any accountability for the gross incompetence and abuse of power that FF/FG have had throughout their control on the state.

The real roots of the pension issue are the bloated public sector pensions that the two establishment parties introduced and failed to address before it was too late and a pension crisis ensued.

Wink wink, nudge nudge politics that FF and FG engage in is the type of government that will bring you from one scandal into the next and I guess they're chuffed to know they'll still have a few village idiots like yourself to put a tick beside them in the ballot box.

The fact you're spouting on about euthanasia shows the level of intelligence of your average FF/FG hick.

It's a global issue largely related to demographic changes i.e. people living longer and having fewer children, therefore more pensioners with less working people to support them.
It is not an Irish or FF/FG specific issue.
The SF "solution" that "demographics will look after it" is laughable! The demographic changes are what has caused the problem! Mary-Lou reckons having SF in office will mean we'll suddenly revert to having 5 kids per household.

That's not true though, it's a bloated public service pension that is a crux of the matter and neither FF or FG took any steps to tackle the system until it was too late.

The old scheme, which applies to those hired before 2013, offers those on full 40-year service a pension equal to 50 per cent of final salary, index linked to future public pay increases and with a tax-free lump sum of 1½ times annual salary on retirement.

So someone on around €66,000 with full service would get a tax-free lump sum of around €100,000 on departure, and then a generous pension entitlement. This has generally been an unfunded pay-as-you scheme, though some groups, including teachers, have paid contributions. It is, on any calculation, an extraordinary perk.

First, a new scheme was created, the so-called single scheme, which pared back the entitlements for those joining after January 1st, 2013. Pensions for newer entrants are based on career average earnings, and are index-linked based on inflation rather than tied to public sector wage rises.

Second, a pension-related deduction was introduced for public servants as one of the crisis measures, and this was subsequently transformed – in slightly less onerous form – into an ongoing additional contribution to their pension (the so-called ACS).

This has left pre-2013 public servants with a sweet deal despite the fact they are paying a bit more. The civil service pension scheme website, for example, calculates that to buy the benefits available to a higher executive officer on retirement would require someone in the private sector to have a pension pot of €690,000, while for a principal officer the sum rises to €1.34 million.

Those public sector pension levels are obscene compared to the rest of Europe.

I don't disagree that public pensions are way too generous for those who retired before the crash. But the larger demographic point is the bigger issue coming down the road.
How does SF policy of giving the pension to everyone at 65 (and no indication of increasing that age in years to come) resolve the issue in any way??

Well SF is a side issue to what is being denied at the minute.

FF/FG are the cause of the pension crisis, so why on earth would anyone trust them to sort it?

As regards how to solve it, the issue is not necessarily the pension age that is the issue - it's the level of pensions and associated benefits alone being hoovered up by high ranking retired public and civil servants and even the ones at the lower level. That's a creation of FF and FG, for many years these bloated pensions were UNFUNDED. Enda Kenny has retired now and gets a pot of €2m and a and an annual pension of €126k, it would cost €5m of contributions in the private sector. For years and years and years, FF and FG were asleep at the wheel regarding this.

A huge pension deficit was created that FF and FG did not put in place contributions to fund it, it's a making entirely of their policies and complete incompetence.

[Snapchap]

Briege Quinn on the Stephen Nolan show this morning calling on Conor Murphy to quit and Doug Beattie and Jim Allister on now doing the same. The story has now grown legs since last night and Conor Murphy could now be under serious pressure.

Jim Allister is on the Nolan Show???


FFS. People still listen to that tripe?

[Tubberman]

The amount of people defending SF's stance on the Paul Quinn case is really disgusting. Brainwashed.

The amount of people using him for political point scoring is disgusting. And it's typically from people who neither know about, nor want to know about the victims of the conflict unless there's an election campaign happening. Then they'll always pick a useful one. And when the campaign is over, there won't be a word about Paul from the same people. Because that's how much they really care about him and his case. People who a fortnight ago probably never heard of Paul Quinn, but weirdly are taking an interest these days. Nothing like digging up the IRA or things that happened 15 years ago to distract simpletons from the homelessness & health crises that are the real clear & present danger to people today.

You might be right that for most of the time they're not highlighting the Paul Quinn case.
But the reason they're highlighting it now is to remind the electorate of the shady dealings SF are involved in, that these people are still involved in SF today at high office and this issue occurred after the GFA, so cases like this can hardly be described as "victims of the conflict" as you put it.
Murder is still a lot more serious than vote-gate or swing-gate, and rightly so.

[Tubberman]

How exactly did FF and FG "create the pension crisis"?
By not legalising Euthanasia?
By not making Euthanasia compulsory?

Jases Angelo you're shinnerbotism at its worst

Well first of all, I'd like to draw attention to the idiocy of this post.

You seem to be alluding to the fact that the pension crisis was a magical creation that happened out of thin air? The contradiction here is that you are ashamed to admit your FF/FG allegiance, yet you are one of their most ardent apologists here, consistently out here defending the indefensible for them.

The pensions crisis arose from gross mismanagement by both FF/FG. You obviously seem to be under the delusion that government makes no policy on pension contributions and entitlements, that government takes no role in fiscal management and that government and that government takes no responsibility for forward planning and contingencies when it comes to meeting those entitlements. A government in your eyes does not take any accountability for the gross incompetence and abuse of power that FF/FG have had throughout their control on the state.

The real roots of the pension issue are the bloated public sector pensions that the two establishment parties introduced and failed to address before it was too late and a pension crisis ensued.

Wink wink, nudge nudge politics that FF and FG engage in is the type of government that will bring you from one scandal into the next and I guess they're chuffed to know they'll still have a few village idiots like yourself to put a tick beside them in the ballot box.

The fact you're spouting on about euthanasia shows the level of intelligence of your average FF/FG hick.

It's a global issue largely related to demographic changes i.e. people living longer and having fewer children, therefore more pensioners with less working people to support them.
It is not an Irish or FF/FG specific issue.
The SF "solution" that "demographics will look after it" is laughable! The demographic changes are what has caused the problem! Mary-Lou reckons having SF in office will mean we'll suddenly revert to having 5 kids per household.

That's not true though, it's a bloated public service pension that is a crux of the matter and neither FF or FG took any steps to tackle the system until it was too late.

The old scheme, which applies to those hired before 2013, offers those on full 40-year service a pension equal to 50 per cent of final salary, index linked to future public pay increases and with a tax-free lump sum of 1½ times annual salary on retirement.

So someone on around €66,000 with full service would get a tax-free lump sum of around €100,000 on departure, and then a generous pension entitlement. This has generally been an unfunded pay-as-you scheme, though some groups, including teachers, have paid contributions. It is, on any calculation, an extraordinary perk.

First, a new scheme was created, the so-called single scheme, which pared back the entitlements for those joining after January 1st, 2013. Pensions for newer entrants are based on career average earnings, and are index-linked based on inflation rather than tied to public sector wage rises.

Second, a pension-related deduction was introduced for public servants as one of the crisis measures, and this was subsequently transformed – in slightly less onerous form – into an ongoing additional contribution to their pension (the so-called ACS).

This has left pre-2013 public servants with a sweet deal despite the fact they are paying a bit more. The civil service pension scheme website, for example, calculates that to buy the benefits available to a higher executive officer on retirement would require someone in the private sector to have a pension pot of €690,000, while for a principal officer the sum rises to €1.34 million.

Those public sector pension levels are obscene compared to the rest of Europe.

I don't disagree that public pensions are way too generous for those who retired before the crash. But the larger demographic point is the bigger issue coming down the road.
How does SF policy of giving the pension to everyone at 65 (and no indication of increasing that age in years to come) resolve the issue in any way??

Well SF is a side issue to what is being denied at the minute.

FF/FG are the cause of the pension crisis, so why on earth would anyone trust them to sort it?

As regards how to solve it, the issue is not necessarily the pension age that is the issue - it's the level of pensions and associated benefits alone being hoovered up by high ranking retired public and civil servants and even the ones at the lower level. That's a creation of FF and FG, for many years these bloated pensions were UNFUNDED. Enda Kenny has retired now and gets a pot of €2m and a and an annual pension of €126k, it would cost €5m of contributions in the private sector. For years and years and years, FF and FG were asleep at the wheel regarding this.

A huge pension deficit was created that FF and FG did not put in place contributions to fund it, it's a making entirely of their policies and complete incompetence.

How are they a side issue!? They're asking people to vote for them, so people are entitled to ask how are they going to fix the issue.

[Angelo]

How exactly did FF and FG "create the pension crisis"?
By not legalising Euthanasia?
By not making Euthanasia compulsory?

Jases Angelo you're shinnerbotism at its worst

Well first of all, I'd like to draw attention to the idiocy of this post.

You seem to be alluding to the fact that the pension crisis was a magical creation that happened out of thin air? The contradiction here is that you are ashamed to admit your FF/FG allegiance, yet you are one of their most ardent apologists here, consistently out here defending the indefensible for them.

The pensions crisis arose from gross mismanagement by both FF/FG. You obviously seem to be under the delusion that government makes no policy on pension contributions and entitlements, that government takes no role in fiscal management and that government and that government takes no responsibility for forward planning and contingencies when it comes to meeting those entitlements. A government in your eyes does not take any accountability for the gross incompetence and abuse of power that FF/FG have had throughout their control on the state.

The real roots of the pension issue are the bloated public sector pensions that the two establishment parties introduced and failed to address before it was too late and a pension crisis ensued.

Wink wink, nudge nudge politics that FF and FG engage in is the type of government that will bring you from one scandal into the next and I guess they're chuffed to know they'll still have a few village idiots like yourself to put a tick beside them in the ballot box.

The fact you're spouting on about euthanasia shows the level of intelligence of your average FF/FG hick.

It's a global issue largely related to demographic changes i.e. people living longer and having fewer children, therefore more pensioners with less working people to support them.
It is not an Irish or FF/FG specific issue.
The SF "solution" that "demographics will look after it" is laughable! The demographic changes are what has caused the problem! Mary-Lou reckons having SF in office will mean we'll suddenly revert to having 5 kids per household.

That's not true though, it's a bloated public service pension that is a crux of the matter and neither FF or FG took any steps to tackle the system until it was too late.

The old scheme, which applies to those hired before 2013, offers those on full 40-year service a pension equal to 50 per cent of final salary, index linked to future public pay increases and with a tax-free lump sum of 1½ times annual salary on retirement.

So someone on around €66,000 with full service would get a tax-free lump sum of around €100,000 on departure, and then a generous pension entitlement. This has generally been an unfunded pay-as-you scheme, though some groups, including teachers, have paid contributions. It is, on any calculation, an extraordinary perk.

First, a new scheme was created, the so-called single scheme, which pared back the entitlements for those joining after January 1st, 2013. Pensions for newer entrants are based on career average earnings, and are index-linked based on inflation rather than tied to public sector wage rises.

Second, a pension-related deduction was introduced for public servants as one of the crisis measures, and this was subsequently transformed – in slightly less onerous form – into an ongoing additional contribution to their pension (the so-called ACS).

This has left pre-2013 public servants with a sweet deal despite the fact they are paying a bit more. The civil service pension scheme website, for example, calculates that to buy the benefits available to a higher executive officer on retirement would require someone in the private sector to have a pension pot of €690,000, while for a principal officer the sum rises to €1.34 million.

Those public sector pension levels are obscene compared to the rest of Europe.

I don't disagree that public pensions are way too generous for those who retired before the crash. But the larger demographic point is the bigger issue coming down the road.
How does SF policy of giving the pension to everyone at 65 (and no indication of increasing that age in years to come) resolve the issue in any way??

Well SF is a side issue to what is being denied at the minute.

FF/FG are the cause of the pension crisis, so why on earth would anyone trust them to sort it?

As regards how to solve it, the issue is not necessarily the pension age that is the issue - it's the level of pensions and associated benefits alone being hoovered up by high ranking retired public and civil servants and even the ones at the lower level. That's a creation of FF and FG, for many years these bloated pensions were UNFUNDED. Enda Kenny has retired now and gets a pot of €2m and a and an annual pension of €126k, it would cost €5m of contributions in the private sector. For years and years and years, FF and FG were asleep at the wheel regarding this.

A huge pension deficit was created that FF and FG did not put in place contributions to fund it, it's a making entirely of their policies and complete incompetence.

How are they a side issue!? They're asking people to vote for them, so people are entitled to ask how are they going to fix the issue.

It's a side issue as FF/FG created the the crisis.

It's not your standard private sector worker who retires at 65 who has paid their taxes all their lives and will take home about 12k a year in a pension that is the issue. A person retires at 65, lives on average we'll say 17 years, that's an outlay of 200k for his pensions entitlements.

Now you look at the private sector, take a high ranking civil servant who on retirement will take a lump sump of 150k, will get an annual pension of 75k. That civil servants lives 17 years and costs the tax payer €1.45m including their lump sump. This public sector pension schemes were by and large unfunded.

A pension crisis exists because of mismanagement by FF/FG. There's also plenty of taxation avenues of large multi nationals and the banking sector that neither FF or FG want to touch.

[Snapchap]

The amount of people defending SF's stance on the Paul Quinn case is really disgusting. Brainwashed.

The amount of people using him for political point scoring is disgusting. And it's typically from people who neither know about, nor want to know about the victims of the conflict unless there's an election campaign happening. Then they'll always pick a useful one. And when the campaign is over, there won't be a word about Paul from the same people. Because that's how much they really care about him and his case. People who a fortnight ago probably never heard of Paul Quinn, but weirdly are taking an interest these days. Nothing like digging up the IRA or things that happened 15 years ago to distract simpletons from the homelessness & health crises that are the real clear & present danger to people today.

You might be right that for most of the time they're not highlighting the Paul Quinn case.
But the reason they're highlighting it now is to remind the electorate of the shady dealings SF are involved in, that these people are still involved in SF today at high office and this issue occurred after the GFA, so cases like this can hardly be described as "victims of the conflict" as you put it.
Murder is still a lot more serious than vote-gate or swing-gate, and rightly so.

Except that Sinn Féin were not involved in Paul Quinn's murder. That's the sort of 'shady' obfuscation that people cynically abusing his name are trying to engage in. The issue was that Conor Murphy stated Paul was involved in criminality. Incidentally, Bertie made the exact same claim in the Dáil, saying his murder "was not paramilitary but pertained to feuds about criminality that were taking place".

[yellowcard]

Briege Quinn on the Stephen Nolan show this morning calling on Conor Murphy to quit and Doug Beattie and Jim Allister on now doing the same. The story has now grown legs since last night and Conor Murphy could now be under serious pressure.

Jim Allister is on the Nolan Show???


FFS. People still listen to that tripe?

Whether it is opportunistic or not it does show how the media set the news agenda. They can dictate what and how news is reported. The Paul Quinn case has lay dormant for 13 years but has been resurrected a few days out from an election and I am sure there are others that could have been brought up. SF were always going to have to deal with the remnants of the troubles for a generation or more and will probably now suffer at the polling booths as a result which was always the intention. Paul Quinn's death has effectively been used as a political football for those who aren't really genuinely bothered about his family's plight for the rest of the time.   

[Angelo]

The amount of people defending SF's stance on the Paul Quinn case is really disgusting. Brainwashed.

The amount of people using him for political point scoring is disgusting. And it's typically from people who neither know about, nor want to know about the victims of the conflict unless there's an election campaign happening. Then they'll always pick a useful one. And when the campaign is over, there won't be a word about Paul from the same people. Because that's how much they really care about him and his case. People who a fortnight ago probably never heard of Paul Quinn, but weirdly are taking an interest these days. Nothing like digging up the IRA or things that happened 15 years ago to distract simpletons from the homelessness & health crises that are the real clear & present danger to people today.

You might be right that for most of the time they're not highlighting the Paul Quinn case.
But the reason they're highlighting it now is to remind the electorate of the shady dealings SF are involved in, that these people are still involved in SF today at high office and this issue occurred after the GFA, so cases like this can hardly be described as "victims of the conflict" as you put it.
Murder is still a lot more serious than vote-gate or swing-gate, and rightly so.

Shady dealings are not unique to SF.

Maybe take a look at the decades of corruption and cosy relationships with disreputable businessmen and white collar criminals FF and FG have been involved.

Michael Martin didn't get asked about dodgy property developers to his then taoiseach and lodging money from those dodgy property developers into his bank account last night.

FF and FG don't get asked about their backroom dealings with shadowy figures like Denis O'Brien.

There's never been any justice for the victims of the Dublin/Monaghan bombings or the victims of the Stardust fire and the government has never shown any appetite for it either, atrocities and negligent deaths committed in their own state.

[dublin7]

I don't vote SF but there is clearly an agenda against them in the media. The Irish Independent for example uses any chance it can to have a go at the party and/or it members.

FF & FG have had their opportunities at governing the country and alot of people are looking for something different which SF are now taking advantage of. Irish politics is a murky world. FG happy to business with Michael Lowry, who frankly should be in jail for getting Denis O'Brien the mobile licence.  Haughey living a life of a king on tax payers money, Bertie getting money from "betting on the horses"

I don't remember the Irish governments doing anything when Irish catholics were being burned out of the homes in the north. If they'd stepped in when they were needed SF wouldn't exist today.

 

[tbrick18]

Especially as we'll all be living in €65,000 houses, will have no tax to pay, everything will be free.......
Why didnt someone think of all this before?
Who said 1977?

Lad, what slightly irritates me is this snobbery around SF's lack of financial know how. I mean when you consider the mess the country is in today, homelessness, a childrens hospital out of control and hospital services that are almost 3rd world (to name a few) brought to you by the financial experts in FF and FG. Who are they or their supporters to throw stones. They have royally fucked the country. For christ sake FF ran it to bankruptcy and had the IMF in and their leader was a minister in that government!

You've never been to a 3rd world if you think the health service, level of homelessness and what is being spent on a children's hospital are 3rd world.

Read what I wrote again,  slowly

Health service will only get worse under SF, because they will damage the economy. Anti-European, anti-business, anti-entrepreneur = anti-jobs.
We've full employment, tax takes are booming. Tax rates are extremely low for the low paid and progressive (high) for the well paid. Minimum wage is second highest in Europe.
Health service is a long way short, but Slaintecare is the best plan we've had. Throwing money at it on it's own won't work, but finally we've a thought-out plan that should improve things considerably.

Genuinely not having a go, as I'm not particularly up-to-speed on Irish politics and affairs, but how can there be full employment with rising levels of homelessness?
Something doesn't add up there.