the other topic regarding the first news reports you can remember has got me thinking about this.
the troubles I've seen, I'm sure we all have some serious some sad and some very funny things that happened through the troubles. some may be distorted over time but I've some vivid memory's from growing up on the Falls road.
Gun attacks, bombs going off and gun battles in the streets, the funnier side being when the Hunger strike rioting was going on and i was at the shop with my cousin when a drinks lorry was hijacked. being ten we gathered up the coke bottles drunk some and threw some at the gable wall. heading home later my mate shouted to me that i was on the news, not waiting to find out what i was doing i ran in to tell my mum. we all sat down as i watched myself throwing coke bottles at a wall. a few smacks later and i was sent to bed >:( and was not aloud out for two days
I used to work in a country pub that has been shot at 3-4 times...Out in the middle of nowhere!! Football team that played there (when i used to play) were getting showered when 2 gun men came towards the changing rooms but the gun jammed....They would have killed all of us!! The bar still has bullet proof glass!!
http://www.courtsni.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/62814296-641A-405C-9BF1-9C4DE2DFD104/0/j_j_COGF3503.htm
A court document from one of the incedents
This is going to be a depressing thread.
I'm not depressed at all...Thanking my lucky stars i'm still here!!
has anyone seen Dark Cloud?
My primary school got blown up, always remember it as it was the night we were told we'd be having a new brother or sister, right when we were being told the bomb went off, we could hear it at home 4 miles away!
Then around the time of Drumcree, me and a few mates could see thick dark smoke in the sky, so we decided to get on our bikes and investigate. Once we got there it was a train that had been hijacked and was being burnt out in Kilwilke!
What always sticks out is the Rosemary Nelson murder. I was old enough to understand what was going on and it was quite a distressing time, i would have known one of her sons from school...I remember a Brit helicopter landing in the field next to the neighbours house and the Brits getting out and walking up our street. I live in a cul-de-sac of five houses about 60 yards long and its the first and only time I ever saw soldiers walking up it. Was always baffled as to the reason why soldiers would be near our us as we were kinda out of the way so to speak and never had any trouble in the estate, but it soon became apparent why
Teebane bomb were 8 Protestant workmen were blew up..lived beside it
King rat came twice to a garage beside home..owner got away both times...2nd time gun jammed and he beat the f**k out of the rat
thankfully crip finished him off ;)
Quote from: fitzroyalty on January 24, 2009, 06:40:31 PM
My primary school got blown up, always remember it as it was the night we were told we'd be having a new brother or sister, right when we were being told the bomb went off, we could hear it at home 4 miles away!
Then around the time of Drumcree, me and a few mates could see thick dark smoke in the sky, so we decided to get on our bikes and investigate. Once we got there it was a train that had been hijacked and was being burnt out in Kilwilke!
What always sticks out is the Rosemary Nelson murder. I was old enough to understand what was going on and it was quite a distressing time, i would have known one of her sons from school...I remember a Brit helicopter landing in the field next to the neighbours house and the Brits getting out and walking up our street. I live in a cul-de-sac of five houses about 60 yards long and its the first and only time I ever saw soldiers walking up it. Was always baffled as to the reason why soldiers would be near our us as we were kinda out of the way so to speak and never had any trouble in the estate, but it soon became apparent why
Collusion that's why!
Left in a car in Portadown at Christmastime while my parents went shopping (probably 1963), and having a drunken Loyalist stagger by yelling, "Yiz F@@kin' Fenian bosstirds!" Scared to death, thinking, of course, that he was referring to me and my brothers. First encounter with sectarianism.
Hearing the first Armagh Civil Rights' marchers singing "We Shall Overcome" on their way to their confrontation with Paisleyites in Thomas Street. Moved by the song, and terrified too about what would happen.
Juggling a soocer ball on way to setting a personal record (had always stopped at 500 out of boredom) as an army foot patrol went by. About 200 taps or so later, a shot cracked and interrupted my quest. Later learned that a soldier had been killed in D'alton Park.
Sitting in Charlie McMahon's pub when it was rocked by the reverberations from the bomb blast that had hit McGleenan's where I was supposed to be.
Being stupidly sent to retrieve my younger brother from the Pearse Og club at the Athletic Grounds during a riot in Drumarg, when the Ogs club was probably the safest place to be on the planet-- its own little Fort Apache.
Being stopped by a foot patrol up an alley behind Rice's. My friend produced a holy card of St. Bernadette of Lourdes, and having the soldier ask him if that was a picture of his mother. A nineteenth century French peasant girl! Then having same soldier pee on the back of our legs as we were up against the wall.
Playing Gaelic football against St. Mary's, Dundalk. A shot rings out over the Athletic Grounds intended for army on the Ring Road. The Dundalk team hits the ground, wisely enough, but we, used to such things, carry on and score a goal, clinching the match.
Going to my friend's house in Drumarg during an army blackout, tripping over a soldier who is partially hidden under a shrub, and having my friend's father open the door, point to the soldier and say, "How do you like me new garden gnome?"
And many more . . .
Quote from: Oraisteach on January 24, 2009, 07:15:54 PM
Going to my friend's house in Drumarg during an army blackout, tripping over a soldier who is partially hidden under a shrub, and having my friend's father open the door, point to the soldier and say, "How do you like me new garden gnome?"
:D
favourite one of mine is:
A riot had just started on the Falls at the top of the Donegall road, a hooded gunman got on the bus and ordered everyone off the bus, as they were walking past the bloke a woman shouted to him "!!!! is that you?" then started to bait her son around the head with her handbag, much to the delight of the people on the bus, she continued to do this until she had forced him off the bus.
i remember one Saturday afternoon, sun was shining and i was heading back from the club. it seemed real quiet but as a Saracen was coming up the road one of the local ballons ran out onto the road and chucked a beer keg at the Saracen. the keg bounced off the thing and whacked one of the other guys, hilarious
Quote from: Square Ball on January 24, 2009, 08:14:18 PM
favourite one of mine is:
A riot had just started on the Falls at the top of the Donegall road, a hooded gunman got on the bus and ordered everyone off the bus, as they were walking past the bloke a woman shouted to him "!!!! is that you?" then started to bait her son around the head with her handbag, much to the delight of the people on the bus, she continued to do this until she had forced him off the bus.
Thats like the boys from Lurgan who hijacked a bus...Got on with petrol and doused it all over the bus....Not one of these smart individuals had a match to light the think.....Priceless
Quote from: fitzroyalty on January 24, 2009, 06:40:31 PM
My primary school got blown up, always remember it as it was the night we were told we'd be having a new brother or sister, right when we were being told the bomb went off, we could hear it at home 4 miles away!
Then around the time of Drumcree, me and a few mates could see thick dark smoke in the sky, so we decided to get on our bikes and investigate. Once we got there it was a train that had been hijacked and was being burnt out in Kilwilke!
What always sticks out is the Rosemary Nelson murder. I was old enough to understand what was going on and it was quite a distressing time, i would have known one of her sons from school...I remember a Brit helicopter landing in the field next to the neighbours house and the Brits getting out and walking up our street. I live in a cul-de-sac of five houses about 60 yards long and its the first and only time I ever saw soldiers walking up it. Was always baffled as to the reason why soldiers would be near our us as we were kinda out of the way so to speak and never had any trouble in the estate, but it soon became apparent why
Fairly similar experiences to yourself Fitz. Can remember us having to duck down beneath our desks in school one day because there shots outside. Think the IRS were shooting at the Brits. Seemed totally bizarre at the time.
The Rosemary Nelson one sticks out as the thing that would have had the most effect on me. Was very friendly with one of the sons at the time. Don't think I'll ever forget that funeral.
Bobby Sands dying, all the hunger strikers dying actually but Sands's death made more of an impact on me than the others.
A Prison Officer getting killed outside Armagh jail (can't remember his name), we were in our car and drove past about 10 minutes afterwards. Carnage.
Yer man Kerr getting shot dead at Armagh Cathedral after attending Mass with his wife and family.
Multiple bombings and shootings
I can't say I would ever wish to see a return to the likes of that. All of it was just pure insanity.
Too much really...
It is scary how much we sweep aside and move on from.
When you think of what most people have lived through and it hasn't really affected them it is a bit shocking.
The riots in Armagh for me after drumcree were the biggest thing I was ever involved in - crazy times - getting shot at at the shambles when a lone guman fired from a crowd at the police and they returned fire above everyone's heads - I thought I was dead lol
Love hearing stories from some of the older lads about town of goings on - my parents generation were in the thick of things and its great to listen to what happened from a historical point of view
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on January 26, 2009, 01:10:32 PM
Too much really...
Correct saan. Plus you have to watch what you say incase it came back to haunt ya, you never know who's reading this sh1t...
Quote from: new devil on January 24, 2009, 06:41:13 PM
Teebane bomb were 8 Protestant workmen were blew up..lived beside it
King rat came twice to a garage beside home..owner got away both times...2nd time gun jammed and he beat the f**k out of the ratthankfully crip finished him off ;)
Never heard that ! Are you serious ?
A wee woman was standing in a shop in the Falls in 1974 when there's an almighy crash & rumble heard in the distance! She runs outside and says "Was that thunder?" and a passing pedestrian says "I think is was a bomb love" to which she replies, "Thank heavens for that, I have a line of washing out!"
The Post Office in Armagh getting blown up, what I remember most is the soldiers and cops all grabbing as many bank notes as possible :D
Quote from: orangeman on January 26, 2009, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: new devil on January 24, 2009, 06:41:13 PM
Teebane bomb were 8 Protestant workmen were blew up..lived beside it
King rat came twice to a garage beside home..owner got away both times...2nd time gun jammed and he beat the f**k out of the ratthankfully crip finished him off ;)
Never heard that ! Are you serious ?
A cousin of mine had a gun pulled on her by either the rat or one of his crew. Came up alongside on a motorbike and the gun jammed. He was also said to have walked into Mickey Kellys bar and took a good look around before walking back out. Dont know how true that is.
A second cousin of mine was shot dead in portadown in 98, lovely lad had no involvement in anything, just part of the loyalists any taig will do campaign. No one ever convicted of his murder, no surprise there.
When i was about 10 i was heading up to the youth club on a bright Saturday morning. We went into Kellys shop to buy sweets when there was a huge bang. A man by the name of Herbie Burrows was blown to smithereens by a bomb intended for his boss a part time Ruc man. I remember looking at the body and wondering what it was.
Another time there was a bomb on the primary school wall, my two older sisters were just leaving the house when my mother called them back to ask if they had taken a key with them. Bomb was 150 yards away - only she called them back they would have been passing it at the time.
There by the grace of god.
I remember the Bond Store on the Quay in Newry getting blown up....all the drink was dumped in the quarry up beside us...I remember some of the "big boys" in school drinking whiskey with their lunch!!
Growing up in Omagh, we were relatively untouched by the troubles, until of course the bombing.
For some reason I was very sensitive to the news and the reports of all the murders up and down the country still sticks with me. I remember me da running out of petrol on some back road outside armagh one day when I was with him on his rounds and he flagged down a van load of builders who gave us a lift in the back of it into armagh town. I remember being f**king petrified of these boys and sure that this was the end of me and me da.
Quote from: Puckoon on January 26, 2009, 04:45:20 PM
Growing up in Omagh, we were relatively untouched by the troubles, until of course the bombing.
For some reason I was very sensitive to the news and the reports of all the murders up and down the country still sticks with me. I remember me da running out of petrol on some back road outside armagh one day when I was with him on his rounds and he flagged down a van load of builders who gave us a lift in the back of it into armagh town. I remember being f**king petrified of these boys and sure that this was the end of me and me da.
What sort do you think we are ?
Quote from: maddog on January 26, 2009, 04:52:01 PM
Quote from: Puckoon on January 26, 2009, 04:45:20 PM
Growing up in Omagh, we were relatively untouched by the troubles, until of course the bombing.
For some reason I was very sensitive to the news and the reports of all the murders up and down the country still sticks with me. I remember me da running out of petrol on some back road outside armagh one day when I was with him on his rounds and he flagged down a van load of builders who gave us a lift in the back of it into armagh town. I remember being f**king petrified of these boys and sure that this was the end of me and me da.
What sort do you think we are ?
I was never as happy to get out of a transit van in all my life. I kept thinking to myself - whats the cut off for these f**kers? They do know Im only 10, sure they cant shoot me.
Quote from: maddog on January 26, 2009, 03:51:39 PM
Quote from: orangeman on January 26, 2009, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: new devil on January 24, 2009, 06:41:13 PM
Teebane bomb were 8 Protestant workmen were blew up..lived beside it
King rat came twice to a garage beside home..owner got away both times...2nd time gun jammed and he beat the f**k out of the ratthankfully crip finished him off ;)
Never heard that ! Are you serious ?
A cousin of mine had a gun pulled on her by either the rat or one of his crew. Came up alongside on a motorbike and the gun jammed. He was also said to have walked into Mickey Kellys bar and took a good look around before walking back out. Dont know how true that is.
A second cousin of mine was shot dead in portadown in 98, lovely lad had no involvement in anything, just part of the loyalists any taig will do campaign. No one ever convicted of his murder, no surprise there.
When i was about 10 i was heading up to the youth club on a bright Saturday morning. We went into Kellys shop to buy sweets when there was a huge bang. A man by the name of Herbie Burrows was blown to smithereens by a bomb intended for his boss a part time Ruc man. I remember looking at the body and wondering what it was.
Another time there was a bomb on the primary school wall, my two older sisters were just leaving the house when my mother called them back to ask if they had taken a key with them. Bomb was 150 yards away - only she called them back they would have been passing it at the time.
There by the grace of god.
We were in McIlvanna's in the Moy one Saturday night when the rat came in and did the same thing, it took a few seconds for someone to cop on to who he was, a few of us walked out the door just in time to see him getting into the back of a police landrover :o and slowly drive off.
Quote from: Tyrones own on January 26, 2009, 06:00:39 PM
Quote from: maddog on January 26, 2009, 03:51:39 PM
Quote from: orangeman on January 26, 2009, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: new devil on January 24, 2009, 06:41:13 PM
Teebane bomb were 8 Protestant workmen were blew up..lived beside it
King rat came twice to a garage beside home..owner got away both times...2nd time gun jammed and he beat the f**k out of the ratthankfully crip finished him off ;)
Never heard that ! Are you serious ?
A cousin of mine had a gun pulled on her by either the rat or one of his crew. Came up alongside on a motorbike and the gun jammed. He was also said to have walked into Mickey Kellys bar and took a good look around before walking back out. Dont know how true that is.
A second cousin of mine was shot dead in portadown in 98, lovely lad had no involvement in anything, just part of the loyalists any taig will do campaign. No one ever convicted of his murder, no surprise there.
When i was about 10 i was heading up to the youth club on a bright Saturday morning. We went into Kellys shop to buy sweets when there was a huge bang. A man by the name of Herbie Burrows was blown to smithereens by a bomb intended for his boss a part time Ruc man. I remember looking at the body and wondering what it was.
Another time there was a bomb on the primary school wall, my two older sisters were just leaving the house when my mother called them back to ask if they had taken a key with them. Bomb was 150 yards away - only she called them back they would have been passing it at the time.
There by the grace of god.
We were in McIlvanna's in the Moy one Saturday night when the rat came in and did the same thing, it took a few seconds for someone to cop on to who he was, a few of us walked out the door just in time to see him getting into the back of a police landrover :o and slowly drive off.
Did he have a gun with him that jammed, or was this purely scaremongering?
Fcuk who knows...looking for some poor bastard no doubt but no.. no gun.
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on January 26, 2009, 01:10:32 PM
Too much really...
Yeah, I've no desire to enter that part of my head.
I'll never move on, or forgive.
There was riots up in one of the nationalist estates in Enniskillen, think it was around the 12th or Drumcree. Anyway a load of hoods where throwing rocks etc at the cops, next thing a plastic bullet comes flying from the cops, everyone ducks and the next thing the town clown is jumping around like a mad thing shouting, 'Ahh me arse!' It hit him square on the backside. Everybody on both sides just burst out laughing
Quote from: pintsofguinness on January 26, 2009, 07:09:01 PM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on January 26, 2009, 01:10:32 PM
Too much really...
Yeah, I've no desire to enter that part of my head.
I'll never move on, or forgive.
forgive who? move on where?
Quote from: milltown row on January 26, 2009, 10:14:59 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on January 26, 2009, 07:09:01 PM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on January 26, 2009, 01:10:32 PM
Too much really...
Yeah, I've no desire to enter that part of my head.
I'll never move on, or forgive.
forgive who? move on where?
I cant and wont forgive the things the Brits have done on me and my neighbours and friends. By move on I mean, forget.
but what about the young Sheffield kid who joins the army 19 years of age, (can you remember what it was like when ya were 19?) sent straight over here during the 70's and didn't care not one jot about who's right or wrong, to him it was paddy's fighting paddys. next thing he's heading down towards the border and blown to pieces. what did he do?
i've no problem with not forgiving the peelers/brits who with first hand experiences seen the brutality daily growing up. but lets not generalise as there was brutal acts on both sides and they claimed they did it for ireland/ulster
if we don't move on then you'll die a bitter twisted man. life's for living, I'm glad that i made it through the rough times, growing up on the Falls during the troubles was tough and plenty of reasons for hate
Quote
i've no problem with not forgiving the peelers/brits who with first hand experiences seen the brutality daily growing up.
So what are you disagreeing with me about?
you not getting over the hatred. by living in the past your no better than the loyalist thugs calling for Irish Blood.
if more people moved on we'd be in a better place. whats done is done and we can never raise the dead
I'm not calling for anyone's blood. I just wont forget what has been done.
Quote from: milltown row on January 26, 2009, 10:46:56 PM
but what about the young Sheffield kid who joins the army 19 years of age, (can you remember what it was like when ya were 19?) sent straight over here during the 70's and didn't care not one jot about who's right or wrong, to him it was paddy's fighting paddys. next thing he's heading down towards the border and blown to pieces. what did he do?
i've no problem with not forgiving the peelers/brits who with first hand experiences seen the brutality daily growing up. but lets not generalise as there was brutal acts on both sides and they claimed they did it for ireland/ulster
if we don't move on then you'll die a bitter twisted man. life's for living, I'm glad that i made it through the rough times, growing up on the Falls during the troubles was tough and plenty of reasons for hate
You talk about the young guy from Sheffield.... I used to think 'Yeah, Tiocfaidh ar la!' .. do you recall the young squaddie in the Falls about 1972 who got lost from his patrol and was told by local women that it was okay - we'll get you out .. next thing he starts crying for his mother while someone phones the 'boys' .. three in the head he got! - Ireland's Heroes me thinks. Nah! Nobody is innocent mate!
Quote from: cville on January 26, 2009, 11:38:19 PM
Quote from: milltown row on January 26, 2009, 10:46:56 PM
but what about the young Sheffield kid who joins the army 19 years of age, (can you remember what it was like when ya were 19?) sent straight over here during the 70's and didn't care not one jot about who's right or wrong, to him it was paddy's fighting paddys. next thing he's heading down towards the border and blown to pieces. what did he do?
i've no problem with not forgiving the peelers/brits who with first hand experiences seen the brutality daily growing up. but lets not generalise as there was brutal acts on both sides and they claimed they did it for ireland/ulster
if we don't move on then you'll die a bitter twisted man. life's for living, I'm glad that i made it through the rough times, growing up on the Falls during the troubles was tough and plenty of reasons for hate
You talk about the young guy from Sheffield.... I used to think 'Yeah, Tiocfaidh ar la!' .. do you recall the young squaddie in the Falls about 1972 who got lost from his patrol and was told by local women that it was okay - we'll get you out .. next thing he starts crying for his mother while someone phones the 'boys' .. three in the head he got! - Ireland's Heroes me thinks. Nah! Nobody is innocent mate!
He was a soldier wasnt he? made a choice and all that.
A few things stand out for me. On the day that 18 paras were killed in Warrenpoint, I happened to be in the graveyard in Burren. Remember both explosions well and the gunfire afterwards. Wether or not it was the army shooting or ammunition going off from the fire in the hay lorry I don't know. A friends uncle worked for the fire service in Newry, he always maintained that there were a lot more than 18 soldiers killed that day. He wouldn't have been a man for telling stories either and had no political affiliations as he was English.
We had a delivery in work one Friday evening but the forklift was broke and there was no way anyone was staying on to offload it by hand. Arrangements were made to get a lend of a forklift first thing Saturday morning, so we were lumbered with a Scouse lorry driver for the night. He wanted to go on the lash so we all ended up in Cupids, cant remember who was playing that night but it could well have been Brush Shields, 5 Sams could probably confirm as he worked there. Anyway long story short there was a mortar attack on a police car outside the tax office and a police woman was killed and a policeman lost both his legs. There was a carnival atmosphere both inside and outside Cupids, felt sorry for the lorry driver as he was pretty scared by both the bomb attack and the atmosphere afterwards. He never came back on a delivery after that.
Saw plenty of riots in my day, the best of which were in Newry in 97 after the Drumcree debacle. Newry and South Armagh were like the wild west for a few days afterwards as the police that were left in Newry were confined to barracks. The younger generation think it was mad, but to us it was part of growing up. Although we have a "normal" society today, society in general isn't what it used to be.
Christ pints that's disgusting.
What puck?
Quote from: milltown row on January 26, 2009, 10:46:56 PM
growing up on the Falls during the troubles was tough and plenty of reasons for hate
What was tough about it? I'd have thought the Falls would have been a relatively safe place to see out the 'Troubles'. Ditto Cross and many areas west of the Bann such as Derry city.
As the old saying goes - all is fair in love and war.
On a purely humanitarian basis however, I find your justification of the demise of that young soilder disgusting.
Cant seem to put it any other way. Perhaps you have encountered things in your life that justify a young lad being brutally executed after being assured of safety -all because he was a soldier. If you have, then the whole thing is very sad.
Its amazing that people who have such strong anti abortion ideologies often miss the ironies of some of their other beliefs. The death penalty, and the soldiers fate being two such cases.
QuoteIts amazing that people who have such strong anti abortion ideologies often miss the ironies of some of their other beliefs. The death penalty, and the soldiers fate being two such cases.
I can't speak for Pints but I guess for me the unborn child not being afforded a choice is the fundamental difference there...not taking a side, rather IMO pointing out what could be seen as a difference.
So it is ok to take away life and play God, provided the "victim" has had a choice in living their life in such a manner that leads to their death at the hands of another?
Just flipping the coin so to speak.
Its just interesting to be asked questions like what gives me the right to decide "an unborn child" should be "killed" (even though Ive basically stated my case upon my beliefs of when life begins) by the same group that might justify the execution of a 18 year old because he made a choice to be a soldier. There is no denying, or grey matter when discussing if an 18 year old soldier is actually a living human being - but hey, its a British soldier in occupied Ireland. Serves him right.
That said - Im not sure the event in question even happened (although Im sure numerous events like it did), I guess Im just a big softie, and cant even begin to imagine the final moments of some of the numerous victims of the troubles, on both sides.
There are evil men and women with bloody hands on all three sides of the irish troubles, and Im sure many of them would disagree with abortion while sleeping happily in their beds at night.
Quote from: Donagh on January 27, 2009, 12:46:03 AM
Quote from: milltown row on January 26, 2009, 10:46:56 PM
growing up on the Falls during the troubles was tough and plenty of reasons for hate
What was tough about it? I'd have thought the Falls would have been a relatively safe place to see out the 'Troubles'. Ditto Cross and many areas west of the Bann such as Derry city.
What would have made it relatively safe, if I may ask?
I consider where I lived relatively safe, because I saw nothing, heard nothing, except what I saw on the news. I regularly saw the Falls Road on the news. We've already had posters from that area talk about "the troubles they've seen", and they saw alot more than I did! Surely growing up in an high octane area during the troubles, increased your chances of being directly affected by the time. Just because you may have been expected to be ok (due I guess to being surrounded and protected by your own) wouldnt have made it safe, per se?
Or am I totally not understanding what you're saying?
Puck you know perfectly well the dfference between a solider and an unborn baby.
As for the soldier, you seriously expect me to cry for someone who made a choice, is somewhere he shouldnt have been, is part of an army that has carried out atrocities all over the world? Forget it. I'm not trying to justify his killing or anything else, I'm saying I've zero sympathy. I dont care if he was crying for his mother, should have thought about that before he joined up.
I've heard that story before and I've thought it's an old wives tale, but my feeling is the same for any other british solider or policeman.
Quote from: Puckoon on January 27, 2009, 04:27:36 AM
What would have made it relatively safe, if I may ask?
I consider where I lived relatively safe, because I saw nothing, heard nothing, except what I saw on the news. I regularly saw the Falls Road on the news. We've already had posters from that area talk about "the troubles they've seen", and they saw alot more than I did! Surely growing up in an high octane area during the troubles, increased your chances of being directly affected by the time. Just because you may have been expected to be ok (due I guess to being surrounded and protected by your own) wouldnt have made it safe, per se?
Or am I totally not understanding what you're saying?
You answered that yourself.
So the people of the Shankill for example were safe among their own when Begley went into the fish shop? I wonder where a UDA/UVF hit squad would go if they wanted to indiscriminately kill a few Catholics? My wife saw a fella shot dead on the Springfield Rd when she was about 9 by the UDA (I think), because he was a Catholic, so there is another side to that argument Donagh. The very fact that "you are amomg your own" woul put the cross hairs on you.
Quote from: Minder on January 27, 2009, 09:15:16 AM
So the people of the Shankill for example were safe among their own when Begley went into the fish shop? I wonder where a UDA/UVF hit squad would go if they wanted to indiscriminately kill a few Catholics? My wife saw a fella shot dead on the Springfield Rd when she was about 9 by the UDA (I think), because he was a Catholic, so there is another side to that argument Donagh. The very fact that "you are amomg your own" woul put the cross hairs on you.
We're talking about the Falls not the Shankill but as I said, it's relative.
Donagh, perhaps in the likes of Cross we were much safer from being targets, but I wouldn't put The Falls in that bracket. Sure you have the whole safety in numbers, but that is not everything. We had the physical protection of being isolated, a 99% Catholic community with the physical protection of the rural countryside backing us up. Why do you think that so much "other" stuff happened in the area, you can be very lost in South Armagh very quickly. The spin from the Falls to the Shankill isn't exactly that far, couple with the collusion allowing a clear passage for attackers, then I certainly would not have liked to live there. I would put the likes of the whole north Armagh in the same bracket as the Falls, and probably it was more dangerous with that fcuker King Rat being the main man there.
The other thing is that being among your own isn't always safe. While there were touts in South Armagh, there was a greater opportunity in the urban areas. I would categorically state that in all my time living in the north, I never felt happier or safer than whenever I pulled down the road at Camlough lake, lost my phone reception and avoided the black holes on the road to Cross.
BC, my point is that it was all relative. South Armagh was probably one of the safest places in the north from the 80's on, likewise West Tyrone and many parts of Derry and Fermanagh. West Belfast while a bit riskier, still had a self contained community with it's own shops, social and leisure facilities. If you want tough, try North Belfast, North Armagh, South Antrim, Mid Down, East Tyrone where not only had you the Brits and peelers on your back, you had to live with death squads targeting exposed communities, tartan gangs and other random groups targeting people, running the gauntlet to do the shopping every day or to use leisure facilities.
That's true Donagh, particularly North Belfast.
South Armagh in the 1970's had all sorts of odd things going on, most of them not especially traumatic to me. However I recall vividly travelling back from an evening event at the Abbey in Newry with my parents and the car being overtaken by two ambulances. We realised why when we came to Silverbridge and the aftermath of the bomb at Donnelly's pub.
Quote from: Double Cross on January 27, 2009, 12:06:17 AM
A few things stand out for me. On the day that 18 paras were killed in Warrenpoint, I happened to be in the graveyard in Burren. Remember both explosions well and the gunfire afterwards. Wether or not it was the army shooting or ammunition going off from the fire in the hay lorry I don't know. A friends uncle worked for the fire service in Newry, he always maintained that there were a lot more than 18 soldiers killed that day. He wouldn't have been a man for telling stories either and had no political affiliations as he was English.
We had a delivery in work one Friday evening but the forklift was broke and there was no way anyone was staying on to offload it by hand. Arrangements were made to get a lend of a forklift first thing Saturday morning, so we were lumbered with a Scouse lorry driver for the night. He wanted to go on the lash so we all ended up in Cupids, cant remember who was playing that night but it could well have been Brush Shields, 5 Sams could probably confirm as he worked there. Anyway long story short there was a mortar attack on a police car outside the tax office and a police woman was killed and a policeman lost both his legs. There was a carnival atmosphere both inside and outside Cupids, felt sorry for the lorry driver as he was pretty scared by both the bomb attack and the atmosphere afterwards. He never came back on a delivery after that.
Saw plenty of riots in my day, the best of which were in Newry in 97 after the Drumcree debacle. Newry and South Armagh were like the wild west for a few days afterwards as the police that were left in Newry were confined to barracks. The younger generation think it was mad, but to us it was part of growing up. Although we have a "normal" society today, society in general isn't what it used to be.
I remember it well Doublecross although I wasnt working that night.....what year was that???
I remember Narrow Water well also...we were having a kickabout in the field in Ballyholland about 5 miles away and could hear everything that went on...Mountbatten and a local young fella were blown up the same day in Mullaghmore.
Quote from: armaghniac on January 27, 2009, 10:22:41 AM
South Armagh in the 1970's had all sorts of odd things going on, most of them not especially traumatic to me. However I recall vividly travelling back from an evening event at the Abbey in Newry with my parents and the car being overtaken by two ambulances. We realised why when we came to Silverbridge and the aftermath of the bomb at Donnelly's pub.
That was the week before Christmas 1975 armaghniac. I was born on the 17th as was Roisin Brecknall. We were in class together in Primary School. Her dad, Trevor, was there wetting her head and was killed in the blast. Here is an extract from the case
QuoteBrecknell - The applicant, Anne Brecknell, was born in 1933 and lives in Armagh in Northern Ireland. She is Trevor Brecknell's widow. On 19 December 1975 loyalist gunmen went into Donnelly's Bar, Silverbridge, in County Armagh, throwing a bomb and firing a machine gun. Trevor Brecknell, Patrick Donnelly and Michael Donnelly (aged 14) were killed and six others were seriously injured. The applicant was at the time in hospital following the birth of her daughter. In 1981 a decision was taken not to pursue charges against two people who had apparently driven the perpetrators (including a member of the Ulster Defence Regiment (UDR)) on the night of the incident.
Obviously it did not have a direct effect on me, but haunted me because of the connection.
Quote from: Double Cross on January 27, 2009, 12:06:17 AM
The younger generation think it was mad, but to us it was part of growing up. Although we have a "normal" society today, society in general isn't what it used to be.
Very true, there was less crime, drugs etc in South Armagh before the ceasefire
f**k i used to love going up to South Armagh on Sundays for a match as you were guaranteed not to get stopped by the scum bags once you were in bandit country, always seen the helicopters coming in and out of the barracks whilst a match was on and hovering above the pitch just to annoy the folk. But living in Lurgan was a different cattle of fish alltogether you just never knew when or where you were going to be stopped and searched and held for hours for no reason other than being a catholic. Lurgan town centre was another shit hole as it's divided down the middle and when you were young you daren't venture up the other end of the town without getting the f**k beat out of ya, i also remember the time of "the Jackell" and "King Rat" and it was scary shit just to walk at night, cars used to pull up alongside ya and slow down and you thought your days were numbered just waiting on someone opening their window and shooting ya...I've seen a solider shot in Kilwilkee (minor injury) and the squeals of that hoor was nothing normal...seen many more incidents but wont comment on them...
I was 19 when Jack Lynch made his famous statement to the Nation "We will not stand idly by" (which as we now all know is exactly what we did the government did. Anyway, we were all rounded up and we were all supposed to be going into the North. We were taken to Cathal Brugha barracks first and lined up to see "who could fire a Bren Gun, who could drive a truck etc. As is now know we had to do a bread run to the Curragh to get provisions first and by the time we reached the border the Brits were in place.
Anyway, we did border patrol for a few months and we were holed up in this place, a Christian Brothers monastry in Tannagh in Cootehill. At the end of our spell the regular army decided to throw a party for us and it included a soccer match between the regulars and the FCA. Time to settle an old score with one of the regular corporals who had bullied us during our stay so myself and another lad banjoed him and got promptly sent off. As Eddie Moroney woukld say, we made pure shite of him. We were banned from the nights celebratioins and put on guard duty for the night.
There was no threat where we were and we saw guard duty as a charade and when the officers came back that night from a black tie do in Cootehill we just said "hows it going lads" as we sat in the back of one of the jeeps sipping pints the lads had smuggled out through the windows. They came out in full uniform and gave us a dressing down and told us if we did not do our job on this last night we would be here for another month without pay.
Later that night we heard screaming inside the bar area and we thought our lads and the regulars were at it, but, it was a lad from the signal corps who got appendix trouble and he was screaming in pain so they called the doctor from Cootehill. There was a big long driveway up to where we were and later, around half two in the morning, in the pissings of rain, thiunder and lightning this car comes flying towards us. It was Dr. Gunn from Cootehill.
I went down first with the torch and rifle and Duff, the guy with me was behind with a Gustaff. I said "halt who goes there" and without stopping yer man rolls down the window and shouts back at me , Dr. Gunn, Dr. Gunn. Next thing happens is Duff opens up with the Gustaff (after a few pints) and there are bullets flying over yer mans car and Duff says to him " I'll give you drop your f**king gun" (Gunn Dr. Gunn - drop yer gun)
Another time we were in Waterford barracks when rerfugees were coming down on busses and a fellow from Ballyroan brought some of them over to Fad Brownes to buy them a drink because he felt sorry for them. We looked down along the bar and this lad was drawing out something with a pen. Next morning most of the 'senior' refugees were gone - as was every rifle that was in our billet - which would be considerable easy if you had a map drawn out for you and the lock left off the chain.
Quote from: thebandit on January 27, 2009, 10:31:46 AM
Quote from: Double Cross on January 27, 2009, 12:06:17 AM
The younger generation think it was mad, but to us it was part of growing up. Although we have a "normal" society today, society in general isn't what it used to be.
Very true, there was less crime, drugs etc in South Armagh before the ceasefire
Not unless you count diesel smuggling, cattle rustling etc. as crime. We do where I'm from. That's not counting the various murders in the area.
Quote from: 5 Sams on January 27, 2009, 10:24:00 AM
I remember it well Doublecross although I wasnt working that night.....what year was that???
I remember Narrow Water well also...we were having a kickabout in the field in Ballyholland about 5 miles away and could hear everything that went on...Mountbatten and a local young fella were blown up the same day in Mullaghmore.
I thought it was the late 80s, but I googled it and it was March 1992.
"Narrow Water" has become synonymous with the death of 18 soldiers, but none of them were killed at Narrow Water, they were actually killed at the gates of Halls Castle. Yet again its funny what google throws up, just found out the Roger Hall, the owner of Halls Castle at the time of the death of those soldiers died recently. Incidentally his father was awarded a miltary cross for his part in the battle of the Somme. Small world.
Apparently Mountbatten had dandruff, they found his head and shoulders on a beach in Sligo.
Quote from: Double Cross on January 27, 2009, 01:55:43 PM
Quote from: 5 Sams on January 27, 2009, 10:24:00 AM
I remember it well Doublecross although I wasnt working that night.....what year was that???
I remember Narrow Water well also...we were having a kickabout in the field in Ballyholland about 5 miles away and could hear everything that went on...Mountbatten and a local young fella were blown up the same day in Mullaghmore.
I thought it was the late 80s, but I googled it and it was March 1992.
"Narrow Water" has become synonymous with the death of 18 soldiers, but none of them were killed at Narrow Water, they were actually killed at the gates of Halls Castle. Yet again its funny what google throws up, just found out the Roger Hall, the owner of Halls Castle at the time of the death of those soldiers died recently. Incidentally his father was awarded a miltary cross for his part in the battle of the Somme. Small world.
Apparently Mountbatten had dandruff, they found his head and shoulders on a beach in Sligo.
I was long gone out of Cupids by then Doublecross....by the way that Mountbatten joke is nearly as old as you!!
Quote from: Tony Baloney on January 27, 2009, 12:43:12 PM
Quote from: thebandit on January 27, 2009, 10:31:46 AM
Quote from: Double Cross on January 27, 2009, 12:06:17 AM
The younger generation think it was mad, but to us it was part of growing up. Although we have a "normal" society today, society in general isn't what it used to be.
Very true, there was less crime, drugs etc in South Armagh before the ceasefire
Not unless you count diesel smuggling, cattle rustling etc. as crime. We do where I'm from. That's not counting the various murders in the area.
yeah can see you don't approve of violence Tony ::)
QuoteNot unless you count diesel smuggling, cattle rustling etc. as crime. We do where I'm from. That's not counting the various murders in the area.
Where do you live then Tony?
was in milltown when stone attacked and it was scary,but the two visions of the troubles that will always stay with me are Mrs Sands outside the jail saying her son was dying and that auld bastard Thatcher talking on the tv saying it was up to the prisoners if they lived or died it was not her problem
Quote from: Donagh on January 27, 2009, 08:35:10 AM
Quote from: Puckoon on January 27, 2009, 04:27:36 AM
What would have made it relatively safe, if I may ask?
I consider where I lived relatively safe, because I saw nothing, heard nothing, except what I saw on the news. I regularly saw the Falls Road on the news. We've already had posters from that area talk about "the troubles they've seen", and they saw alot more than I did! Surely growing up in an high octane area during the troubles, increased your chances of being directly affected by the time. Just because you may have been expected to be ok (due I guess to being surrounded and protected by your own) wouldnt have made it safe, per se?
Or am I totally not understanding what you're saying?
You answered that yourself.
I guess that its a matter of opinion then. If my assumption of protection afforded by your own people is the basis for you stating that the Falls was a relatively safe place to see out the troubles, I think ill take my chances elsewhere. A quick search of murders on the falls road, or even just remembering back the high frequency of falls road related news stories during the troubles has me thinking otherwise.
Lots of people from that area ended up involved in the troubles against their wishes - not everyone wanted to run out and be an IRA gun man, nor did they want to end up shot dead as an informer. The area and political situation on the ground would have dragged quite a number of people into involvement, who elsewhere may have been happy (and better off) to stay away.
Quote from: Over the Bar on January 27, 2009, 02:12:24 PM
QuoteNot unless you count diesel smuggling, cattle rustling etc. as crime. We do where I'm from. That's not counting the various murders in the area.
Where do you live then Tony?
In a glass house/On a high horse.
Quote from: Puckoon on January 27, 2009, 05:08:17 PM
I guess that its a matter of opinion then. If my assumption of protection afforded by your own people is the basis for you stating that the Falls was a relatively safe place to see out the troubles, I think ill take my chances elsewhere. A quick search of murders on the falls road, or even just remembering back the high frequency of falls road related news stories during the troubles has me thinking otherwise.
Lots of people from that area ended up involved in the troubles against their wishes - not everyone wanted to run out and be an IRA gun man, nor did they want to end up shot dead as an informer. The area and political situation on the ground would have dragged quite a number of people into involvement, who elsewhere may have been happy (and better off) to stay away.
As I've said on other posts, it was relatively safe compared to other areas. Do a search of the Falls and you'll see that the deaths on the Falls are mainly Brits, RUC or IRA. A comparative search of somewhere like north Armagh will show the same type of killings as well as a lot more civilians murdered by the death squads.
As I have also said on other posts, on the Falls you didn't have to run the gauntlet of loyalist gangs to go do the shopping or go to the local swimming pool. Neither did you have a cnut of a UDR man living up the street passing weapons and intelligence on you to the UVF and then donning a woolly face as soon as he took his uniform off.
Quote from: Bud Wiser on January 27, 2009, 11:47:56 AM
I was 19 when Jack Lynch made his famous statement to the Nation "We will not stand idly by" (which as we now all know is exactly what we did the government did.
Budwieser you must be 60! ..and I thought I was too old for this craic...
QuoteBrecknell - The applicant, Anne Brecknell, was born in 1933 and lives in Armagh in Northern Ireland. She is Trevor Brecknell's widow. On 19 December 1975 loyalist gunmen went into Donnelly's Bar, Silverbridge, in County Armagh, throwing a bomb and firing a machine gun. Trevor Brecknell, Patrick Donnelly and Michael Donnelly (aged 14) were killed and six others were seriously injured. The applicant was at the time in hospital following the birth of her daughter. In 1981 a decision was taken not to pursue charges against two people who had apparently driven the perpetrators (including a member of the Ulster Defence Regiment (UDR)) on the night of the incident.
And yet people dont understand why you're not crying for a soldier.
Quote from: Donagh on January 27, 2009, 07:24:22 PM
Quote from: Puckoon on January 27, 2009, 05:08:17 PM
I guess that its a matter of opinion then. If my assumption of protection afforded by your own people is the basis for you stating that the Falls was a relatively safe place to see out the troubles, I think ill take my chances elsewhere. A quick search of murders on the falls road, or even just remembering back the high frequency of falls road related news stories during the troubles has me thinking otherwise.
Lots of people from that area ended up involved in the troubles against their wishes - not everyone wanted to run out and be an IRA gun man, nor did they want to end up shot dead as an informer. The area and political situation on the ground would have dragged quite a number of people into involvement, who elsewhere may have been happy (and better off) to stay away.
As I've said on other posts, it was relatively safe compared to other areas. Do a search of the Falls and you'll see that the deaths on the Falls are mainly Brits, RUC or IRA. A comparative search of somewhere like north Armagh will show the same type of killings as well as a lot more civilians murdered by the death squads.
As I have also said on other posts, on the Falls you didn't have to run the gauntlet of loyalist gangs to go do the shopping or go to the local swimming pool. Neither did you have a cnut of a UDR man living up the street passing weapons and intelligence on you to the UVF and then donning a woolly face as soon as he took his uniform off.
break down of the deaths by area
Location No.
County Antrim 207
County Armagh 276
East Belfast 128
North Belfast 576
County Tyrone 339
West Belfast 623
County Down 243
County Fermanagh 112
Derry City 227
County Londonderry 123
Republic of Ireland 113
England 125
Lost Lives whilst slightly macabre is an excellent reference point for the troubles. I would advise anyone with an interest in the troubles to buy it.
Spotlight on now, should be interesting.
Responsibility for killing
Republican Paramilitary Groups 2055
Loyalist Paramilitary Groups 1020
Security Forces 368
Persons unknown 80
Total 3523
Good thread this. Very illuminating. I don't envy those of you who grew up under those conditions.
The numbers posted by Milltown kinda speak for themselves there, with a few relatively safe places situated in geographical areas with the highest body counts.
What milltown didnt post was the breakdown of the victims.
Deaths by status of victim[2]
Status No.
Civilian 1855
Members of security forces (and reserves) 1123
of whom:
British Army (excluding Northern Ireland regiments) 499
Royal Ulster Constabulary 301
Ulster Defence Regiment 197
Northern Ireland Prison Service 24
Garda Síochána (Republic of Ireland police) 9
Royal Irish Regiment 7
Territorial Army 7
English police forces 6
Royal Air Force 4
Royal Navy 2
Irish Army 1
Members of Republican Paramilitary Groups 394
Members of Loyalist Paramilitary Groups 151
1855 civilian deaths. Now allegedly this number is "grey" due to the secretive nature of the paramilitary organizations, so lets say we give the paramilitaries the 855, that still leaves 1000 civilian deaths. Well over a quarter innocent victims. Id never realised that before.
Quote from: milltown row on January 27, 2009, 10:37:59 PM
break down of the deaths by area
Location No.
County Antrim 207
County Armagh 276
East Belfast 128
North Belfast 576
County Tyrone 339
West Belfast 623
County Down 243
County Fermanagh 112
Derry City 227
County Londonderry 123
Republic of Ireland 113
England 125
Don't know what that's supposed to show. You'd be better of at looking at the type of deaths in the diferent areas. To do so, go to the Cain site and put the area into the search box.
On a semi-related note Shuggy Orde will be with us for another while!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7854843.stm (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7854843.stm)
Donagh what is the cain site?
Quote from: Puckoon on January 28, 2009, 05:07:02 PM
Donagh what is the cain site?
http://tinyurl.com/amwq73
Much obliged. Smartarse :D
Quote from: Puckoon on January 28, 2009, 05:07:02 PM
Donagh what is the cain site?
http://cain.ulst.ac.uk/index.html (http://cain.ulst.ac.uk/index.html)
or the deaths index
http://cain.ulst.ac.uk/sutton/ (http://cain.ulst.ac.uk/sutton/)Edit: as above. :D
Quote from: Donagh on January 28, 2009, 09:31:51 AM
Quote from: milltown row on January 27, 2009, 10:37:59 PM
break down of the deaths by area
Location No.
County Antrim 207
County Armagh 276
East Belfast 128
North Belfast 576
County Tyrone 339
West Belfast 623
County Down 243
County Fermanagh 112
Derry City 227
County Londonderry 123
Republic of Ireland 113
England 125
Don't know what that's supposed to show. You'd be better of at looking at the type of deaths in the diferent areas. To do so, go to the Cain site and put the area into the search box.
oh i think you said it was "safer" living in west belfast than say South Armagh or north belfast.....
Quote from: pintsofguinness on January 27, 2009, 08:54:50 PM
QuoteBrecknell - The applicant, Anne Brecknell, was born in 1933 and lives in Armagh in Northern Ireland. She is Trevor Brecknell's widow. On 19 December 1975 loyalist gunmen went into Donnelly's Bar, Silverbridge, in County Armagh, throwing a bomb and firing a machine gun. Trevor Brecknell, Patrick Donnelly and Michael Donnelly (aged 14) were killed and six others were seriously injured. The applicant was at the time in hospital following the birth of her daughter. In 1981 a decision was taken not to pursue charges against two people who had apparently driven the perpetrators (including a member of the Ulster Defence Regiment (UDR)) on the night of the incident.
And yet people dont understand why you're not crying for a soldier.
'No man is an island, entire of itself...any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind; and therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee."
Quote from: Myles Na G. on January 28, 2009, 09:02:44 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on January 27, 2009, 08:54:50 PM
QuoteBrecknell - The applicant, Anne Brecknell, was born in 1933 and lives in Armagh in Northern Ireland. She is Trevor Brecknell's widow. On 19 December 1975 loyalist gunmen went into Donnelly's Bar, Silverbridge, in County Armagh, throwing a bomb and firing a machine gun. Trevor Brecknell, Patrick Donnelly and Michael Donnelly (aged 14) were killed and six others were seriously injured. The applicant was at the time in hospital following the birth of her daughter. In 1981 a decision was taken not to pursue charges against two people who had apparently driven the perpetrators (including a member of the Ulster Defence Regiment (UDR)) on the night of the incident.
And yet people dont understand why you're not crying for a soldier.
'No man is an island, entire of itself...any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind; and therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee."
Bullshit
Quote from: Fionntamhnach on January 27, 2009, 03:30:13 PM
Like what Puck said, growing up around the Omagh area meant that the troubles to a certain extent had less impact on day-to-day life compared to other areas of the north though of course there was still a number of incidents - the one I remember the most was the bombing of the local police station after the "Christmas Ceasfire" that the IRA would make every year around the late 1980's & early 90's. To this day I live less than 50 metres from the station, a mortar rocket went over the reinforced steel & concrete wall and destroyed the building inside the barracks while at the same time blowing out the windows, including some of our own, of nearby houses. Housing Executive came out the next day to board up the windows at first (thankfully it wasn't raining) and put new windows in two days later. A larg-ish piece of shrapnel from the rocket landed in my back garden as well. Going back to school after the Christmas/New Year break several from Dromore said that they heard the bomb go off at the time, six miles away. Had the rocket overshot the station it would have landed in the middle of a housing estate.
:o
Quote from: milltown row on January 28, 2009, 06:22:52 PM
oh i think you said it was "safer" living in west belfast than say South Armagh or north belfast.....
I said it was safer than north Belfast but it wasn't the Brits I had in mind.
What pisses me off about the Troubles (or ongoing struggle for independence) is that the Good Friday agreement as applied by the Northern Courts currently is a f*cked up system. My sister was killed in a 'domestic dispute' after the agreement and the maximum sentence for the offense is deemed to be 10 years prior to the agreement. After the agreement all sentences were agreed to be cut in half. A man got 4 1/2 years for the cold blooded knifing of my sister and that to me is just with a slap on the wrist!
I found it strange too that during one of the court sittings there were lads running about on bail for gun running and kidnapping and they were sitting around in the gallery beside me.
On one occassion another of my sisters was talking to me on the phone from Belfast when 2 bombs went off in the distance and she judged them to be about a mile away and continued on talking as if nothing remarkable had happened. She is still living there to this day.
Quote from: Donagh on January 28, 2009, 09:16:01 PM
Quote from: milltown row on January 28, 2009, 06:22:52 PM
oh i think you said it was "safer" living in west belfast than say South Armagh or north belfast.....
I said it was safer than north Belfast but it wasn't the Brits I had in mind.
maths not your strong point then
Quote from: milltown row on January 29, 2009, 12:14:38 AM
Quote from: Donagh on January 28, 2009, 09:16:01 PM
Quote from: milltown row on January 28, 2009, 06:22:52 PM
oh i think you said it was "safer" living in west belfast than say South Armagh or north belfast.....
I said it was safer than north Belfast but it wasn't the Brits I had in mind.
maths not your strong point then
Obviously reading and comprehension isn't yours.
Quote from: Eoghan Mag on January 28, 2009, 10:01:55 PM
What pisses me off about the Troubles (or ongoing struggle for independence) is that the Good Friday agreement as applied by the Northern Courts currently is a f*cked up system. My sister was killed in a 'domestic dispute' after the agreement and the maximum sentence for the offense is deemed to be 10 years prior to the agreement. After the agreement all sentences were agreed to be cut in half. A man got 4 1/2 years for the cold blooded knifing of my sister and that to me is just with a slap on the wrist!
I'm not condoning the ridiculously light sentence he got, but 50% remission as applied in the north has nothing to do with the GFA.
Quote from: Donagh on January 29, 2009, 08:38:35 AM
I'm not condoning the ridiculously light sentence he got, but 50% remission as applied in the north has nothing to do with the GFA.
[/quote]
Yes it has. This was pointed out to us by the prosecuter. It has 100% got to to with the Good Friday Agreement and I'm very, very proud to say that I voted against that piece of trash legislation.
In 1991 I had to go to London for a serious operation to strength the bone in my neck. One heavy knock and I could have been paralysed. Anyway, for the operation I need a bone graft from my legs. To secure the bones in my neck, whilst the graft set, I had to wear a metal cage around my head. It was bolted to my skull and a body cast I had to wear. It was called a Halo. Google something if you wish. I wasn't allowed to sit any higher than 45 degrees for 4 months.
Anyway, back home I remember sitting outside during a hot summer's day. About 2 miles away a bomb went off. I'll never forget it... the vibrations shook the metal cage bolted to my skulls and it went right through me. Was a good 10/15 minutes before things settled down. Never forget it.... worst feeling I ever had.
Quote from: Eoghan Mag on January 29, 2009, 08:32:11 PM
Yes it has. This was pointed out to us by the prosecuter. It has 100% got to to with the Good Friday Agreement and I'm very, very proud to say that I voted against that piece of trash legislation.
Then the prosecuter lied to you. 50% remission was introduced in 1976, a full 22 years before the GFA.
I remember the house I live in shaking to its very foundations when a bomb went off in the next street, the evacuated half the street but never told us, that was terrible. I lived through the Hunger Strikes on the Falls and it was scary at times, in the 70s there was many a gun battle during the night and we used to go out and hunt for used cartridges the next day, we used to shake hedges and see what fell out, got a good few that way. also had a collection or rubber and plastic bullets.
make of mine got hit in the nuts with one, it wasn't a case of feel them it was count them