The Many Faces of US Politics...

[whitey]

There's a video of exactly what happened.....did you not see it?  Directly from body cam

It's tragic what happened, but Eamonn referring to the cops as Nazis for doing their fvckin jobs is completely unhinged

If someone was walking around my town, at night, in the middle of summer wearing a balaclava, I sure as hell would want the cops to stop and question them. I bought a house in a quiet town because I don't want or need aggravation. If you or I reacted the way that kid did, we would have been treated in a similar manner.

He was told to stop and stand still but he didn't. 
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/there-were-shouts-for-him-to-stop-stand-still-he-didn-t-1.3402021

I have no doubt that when this happened, there were plenty of people saying "why was he running if he had nothing to hide"!!

Apples and oranges

You are required (regardless of race) to comply with a lawful command from a police officer....end of

It's not a suggestion like it is in Ireland

Here's a direct quote form the DA


"Ultimately, while I may share the vast public opinion that Elijah McClain's death could have been avoided, it is not my role to file criminal charges based on opinion, but, rather, on the evidence revealed from the investigation and applicable Colorado law," Young, the distinct attorney for the 17th Judicial District, wrote in the statement."

[J70]

There's a video of exactly what happened.....did you not see it?  Directly from body cam

It's tragic what happened, but Eamonn referring to the cops as Nazis for doing their fvckin jobs is completely unhinged

If someone was walking around my town, at night, in the middle of summer wearing a balaclava, I sure as hell would want the cops to stop and question them. I bought a house in a quiet town because I don't want or need aggravation. If you or I reacted the way that kid did, we would have been treated in a similar manner.

He was told to stop and stand still but he didn't. 
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/there-were-shouts-for-him-to-stop-stand-still-he-didn-t-1.3402021

I have no doubt that when this happened, there were plenty of people saying "why was he running if he had nothing to hide"!!

Apples and oranges

You are required (regardless of race) to comply with a lawful command from a police officer....end of

It's not a suggestion like it is in Ireland

Ireland, north and south, compliance with police requests/orders was/is optional?

[whitey]

There's a video of exactly what happened.....did you not see it?  Directly from body cam

It's tragic what happened, but Eamonn referring to the cops as Nazis for doing their fvckin jobs is completely unhinged

If someone was walking around my town, at night, in the middle of summer wearing a balaclava, I sure as hell would want the cops to stop and question them. I bought a house in a quiet town because I don't want or need aggravation. If you or I reacted the way that kid did, we would have been treated in a similar manner.

He was told to stop and stand still but he didn't. 
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/there-were-shouts-for-him-to-stop-stand-still-he-didn-t-1.3402021

I have no doubt that when this happened, there were plenty of people saying "why was he running if he had nothing to hide"!!

Apples and oranges

You are required (regardless of race) to comply with a lawful command from a police officer....end of

It's not a suggestion like it is in Ireland

Ireland, north and south, compliance with police requests/orders was/is optional?

Yes

[J70]

There's a video of exactly what happened.....did you not see it?  Directly from body cam

It's tragic what happened, but Eamonn referring to the cops as Nazis for doing their fvckin jobs is completely unhinged

If someone was walking around my town, at night, in the middle of summer wearing a balaclava, I sure as hell would want the cops to stop and question them. I bought a house in a quiet town because I don't want or need aggravation. If you or I reacted the way that kid did, we would have been treated in a similar manner.

He was told to stop and stand still but he didn't. 
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/there-were-shouts-for-him-to-stop-stand-still-he-didn-t-1.3402021

I have no doubt that when this happened, there were plenty of people saying "why was he running if he had nothing to hide"!!

Apples and oranges

You are required (regardless of race) to comply with a lawful command from a police officer....end of

It's not a suggestion like it is in Ireland

Ireland, north and south, compliance with police requests/orders was/is optional?

Yes

There are statutes, case law and so on making this clear?

[whitey]

There's a video of exactly what happened.....did you not see it?  Directly from body cam

It's tragic what happened, but Eamonn referring to the cops as Nazis for doing their fvckin jobs is completely unhinged

If someone was walking around my town, at night, in the middle of summer wearing a balaclava, I sure as hell would want the cops to stop and question them. I bought a house in a quiet town because I don't want or need aggravation. If you or I reacted the way that kid did, we would have been treated in a similar manner.

He was told to stop and stand still but he didn't. 
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/there-were-shouts-for-him-to-stop-stand-still-he-didn-t-1.3402021

I have no doubt that when this happened, there were plenty of people saying "why was he running if he had nothing to hide"!!

Apples and oranges

You are required (regardless of race) to comply with a lawful command from a police officer....end of

It's not a suggestion like it is in Ireland

Ireland, north and south, compliance with police requests/orders was/is optional?

Yes

There are statutes, case law and so on making this clear?

It was a tongue in cheek comment based on what happens in practice  but I may actually be correct

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/justice/arrests/questioning_and_surveillance.html

Where a Garda is investigating a criminal offence, the Garda is entitled to seek the co-operation of anyone by asking the person questions about what they saw or heard. However, while the Gardaí are entitled to question members of the public, there is generally no legal obligation to answer any such questions or to co-operate with the Gardaí.

What is the definition of "cooperate". So my reading of that is that you wouldn't  have to stop if requested to by the Garda

Edit

An example of this would be where a Garda observes you acting suspiciously late at night in an area where a lot of crimes are being committed. The Garda is entitled to stop you in order to detect and prevent crime. You are under no legal obligation to co-operate with the Garda and the Garda cannot use force to restrain your freedom under common law, short of arresting you.

[johnnycool]

There's a video of exactly what happened.....did you not see it?  Directly from body cam

It's tragic what happened, but Eamonn referring to the cops as Nazis for doing their fvckin jobs is completely unhinged

If someone was walking around my town, at night, in the middle of summer wearing a balaclava, I sure as hell would want the cops to stop and question them. I bought a house in a quiet town because I don't want or need aggravation. If you or I reacted the way that kid did, we would have been treated in a similar manner.

He was told to stop and stand still but he didn't. 
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/there-were-shouts-for-him-to-stop-stand-still-he-didn-t-1.3402021

I have no doubt that when this happened, there were plenty of people saying "why was he running if he had nothing to hide"!!

Apples and oranges

You are required (regardless of race) to comply with a lawful command from a police officer....end of

It's not a suggestion like it is in Ireland

Ireland, north and south, compliance with police requests/orders was/is optional?

Yes

There are statutes, case law and so on making this clear?

It was a tongue in cheek comment based on what happens in practice  but I may actually be correct

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/justice/arrests/questioning_and_surveillance.html

Where a Garda is investigating a criminal offence, the Garda is entitled to seek the co-operation of anyone by asking the person questions about what they saw or heard. However, while the Gardaí are entitled to question members of the public, there is generally no legal obligation to answer any such questions or to co-operate with the Gardaí.

What is the definition of "cooperate". So my reading of that is that you wouldn't  have to stop if requested to by the Garda

The right to remain silent?

I'd say if you took to your heels the Guards may give chase rather than pull out the old gun and riddle you.

[Gmac]

Rachel was smiling last night at the thought of how bad the jobs report would be today, another disaster for Moscow Maddow why does she roof against the country so much .

[J70]

Rachel was smiling last night at the thought of how bad the jobs report would be today, another disaster for Moscow Maddow why does she roof against the country so much .

I'm guessing this shocking development for all that is decent and right is keeping the Putin bounties out of the headlines over there in the fever swamps.

[Gmac]

Rachel was smiling last night at the thought of how bad the jobs report would be today, another disaster for Moscow Maddow why does she roof against the country so much .

I'm guessing this shocking development for all that is decent and right is keeping the Putin bounties out of the headlines over there in the fever swamps.

no doubt she's rooting for that story to be true

[J70]

Rachel was smiling last night at the thought of how bad the jobs report would be today, another disaster for Moscow Maddow why does she roof against the country so much .

I'm guessing this shocking development for all that is decent and right is keeping the Putin bounties out of the headlines over there in the fever swamps.

no doubt she's rooting for that story to be true

She probably cares more about those soldiers than the Dear Leader.

[omochain]

There's a video of exactly what happened.....did you not see it?  Directly from body cam

It's tragic what happened, but Eamonn referring to the cops as Nazis for doing their fvckin jobs is completely unhinged

If someone was walking around my town, at night, in the middle of summer wearing a balaclava, I sure as hell would want the cops to stop and question them. I bought a house in a quiet town because I don't want or need aggravation. If you or I reacted the way that kid did, we would have been treated in a similar manner.

He was told to stop and stand still but he didn't. 
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/there-were-shouts-for-him-to-stop-stand-still-he-didn-t-1.3402021

I have no doubt that when this happened, there were plenty of people saying "why was he running if he had nothing to hide"!!

Apples and oranges

You are required (regardless of race) to comply with a lawful command from a police officer....end of

It's not a suggestion like it is in Ireland

Ireland, north and south, compliance with police requests/orders was/is optional?

Yes

May have been optional in your Mayo. But in my South Armagh it could have got you killed... now you and that person from Queen's County need to go and reflect on the corruption of the regime that you spend your lives defending. Go reflect on the unnecessary deaths that you are ignoring while you get indignant about Police Officers who don't get the fact that they have two ears and one mouth. All they have to do is listen!

[whitey]

There's a video of exactly what happened.....did you not see it?  Directly from body cam

It's tragic what happened, but Eamonn referring to the cops as Nazis for doing their fvckin jobs is completely unhinged

If someone was walking around my town, at night, in the middle of summer wearing a balaclava, I sure as hell would want the cops to stop and question them. I bought a house in a quiet town because I don't want or need aggravation. If you or I reacted the way that kid did, we would have been treated in a similar manner.

He was told to stop and stand still but he didn't. 
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/there-were-shouts-for-him-to-stop-stand-still-he-didn-t-1.3402021

I have no doubt that when this happened, there were plenty of people saying "why was he running if he had nothing to hide"!!

Apples and oranges

You are required (regardless of race) to comply with a lawful command from a police officer....end of

It's not a suggestion like it is in Ireland

Ireland, north and south, compliance with police requests/orders was/is optional?

Yes

May have been optional in your Mayo. But in my South Armagh it could have got you killed... now you and that person from Queen's County need to go and reflect on the corruption of the regime that you spend your lives defending. Go reflect on the unnecessary deaths that you are ignoring while you get indignant about Police Officers who don't get the fact that they have two ears and one mouth. All they have to do is listen!

I have never said, nor do I believe that the police are without blame  and that serious reform arent needed.....far from it. But narrative being spun by the media which seems to have been swallowed hook, line and sinker by some posters on here is that, the go to position is the police are always  at fault and that the injured party is always an innocent victim. You and I both know that's a bunch of nonsense. Cops have a very, very difficult job especially in the inner cities and can face life and death scenarios in a regular basis. It's very easy to Monday morning quarterback them from your couch

[APM]

You read this:

.... and then you post this:

So a guy wearing a balaclava (in August)  fails to compl with a lawful order,, resists  arrest and attempts to take an officers gun (twice I believe), but the cops are at fault....eh......okay

Then you say this:

I have never said, nor do I believe that the police are without blame  and that serious reform aren't needed.....far from it. But narrative being spun by the media which seems to have been swallowed hook, line and sinker by some posters on here is that, the go to position is the police are always  at fault and that the injured party is always an innocent victim. You and I both know that's a bunch of nonsense. Cops have a very, very difficult job especially in the inner cities and can face life and death scenarios in a regular basis. It's very easy to Monday morning quarterback them from your couch

Your immediate response is to defend bad policing.  If you don't think the police are without blame, then why does that not form part of your initial response - why can you not say so without equivocation.  If you think serious reforms are needed, why not say so immediately instead of trying to defend the indefensible. 

What you have done here is similar to what happened during the troubles when the RUC or army committed a wrong. 

Let's take for example, the findings of the Bloody Sunday inquiry. Unionist politicians barely admit that the army were in the wrong. Oft-times there was no recognition of a wrong being committed:

They shouldn't have been on the street.  It was an illegal gathering.  They started it!

Even where there is some recognition of a wrong committed by the authorities it is mealy mouthed:

of course we should recognise the hurt.... but one bad apple etc etc

This is then often followed by a much more lengthy and stout defence of the authorities i.e.

we shouldn't forget that the British Army / RUC defended this country through 30 years of strife, the difficult job they had to do. Many good soldiers and police were killed.

What they fail to recognise is that this kind of behavior and moreover, official defence of bad behaviour, contributes to the sense of alienation of a whole demographic.  Bad policing is bad for everyone, including the police and should be tackled head on.  There is no excusing it.  The state always has to apply a higher set of values, because it should have the high-moral ground.  The minute it loses the high-moral ground, then trust is gone.  Attitudes like yours simply enables bad policing.

[whitey]

APM-what state did you live in?

If you were walking down the street at night in the middle of August wearing a balaclava would you expect to be stopped by the police if they had received a call from a concerned citizen reporting you?

If you were stopped by the police, would you actually answer whatever questions they had to clear things up and then go on your way, or would you continue walking while saying they shouldn't be stopping you, thereby refusing to comply with a lawful order?

And if they decided they were going to cuff you, would you then violently resist to the point That 4 of them need all their strength to subdue you and then attempt to grab the officers gun for good measure?


That's all there on the tape

[Milltown Row2]

Four hairy arse grown police Officers couldn't detain a autistic kid? Could they not have just used the taser,  get him on ground and move on?

No, let's just kill him and justify it with he'd his hand in his pocket or he was going for a gun or whatever way they've been trained to shout to cover their ass's.

The terminology used by police when they attempt to arrest someone seems as if they are readying themselves in case there is an incident