Author Topic: The IRISH RUGBY thread  (Read 356260 times)

Jim_Murphy_74

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Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #5775 on: May 30, 2017, 05:41:25 PM »
The point about the 5 or 6 teams being better than the rest is also a bit muted when you consider there is only 4 teams in the whole of Ireland that the general rugby fan base has any interest in. And they cant even win a competition against smaller club teams from Scotland and Wales.

Since it's inception Irish times have won the Pro12 9 times (Leinster 4, Munster 3, Connacht 1, Ulster 1 ), Welsh teams 6 times and Scottish 1 time.  So arguably they can win it but not ever year.

/Jim.

seafoid

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Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #5776 on: May 30, 2017, 08:08:44 PM »
Think Irish rugby's heyday could be receding. Starting to fall off the pace in the 6 Nations and clubs not cutting it in the Euro competitions as much. Just don't have the financial clout to compete with English/French clubs for the better players and a lack of visible high-profile success could turn youngsters back to the GAA in in creasing numbers.
I think it dépends what kind of rugby is played by the Irish teams. In terms of Bosh concussion bosh you are probably right but something more flaithiulach a la Connacht 2016 would have more of a chance of success.

Beirne who played for Scarlets is interesting. He wouldn't have made the Leinster team and is not supposed to see a rugby future outside of Ireland.
"you can try and intimidate us, but f**k youse, we're going to win an All-Ireland anyway"

The Subbie

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Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #5777 on: May 31, 2017, 03:31:09 AM »
Think Irish rugby's heyday could be receding. Starting to fall off the pace in the 6 Nations and clubs not cutting it in the Euro competitions as much. Just don't have the financial clout to compete with English/French clubs for the better players and a lack of visible high-profile success could turn youngsters back to the GAA in in creasing numbers.
I think it dépends what kind of rugby is played by the Irish teams. In terms of Bosh concussion bosh you are probably right but something more flaithiulach a la Connacht 2016 would have more of a chance of success.

Beirne who played for Scarlets is interesting. He wouldn't have made the Leinster team and is not supposed to see a rugby future outside of Ireland.

Exactly, then you read the comments about him and see pricks like this lad

A 10/1 shot to still be there in 18/19 season. Will be back at Leinster, and will be a great re-signing.

And the Leinster goys wonder why people gloat at their misfortune!!

mouview

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Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #5778 on: May 31, 2017, 10:08:48 AM »
Think Irish rugby's heyday could be receding. Starting to fall off the pace in the 6 Nations and clubs not cutting it in the Euro competitions as much. Just don't have the financial clout to compete with English/French clubs for the better players and a lack of visible high-profile success could turn youngsters back to the GAA in in creasing numbers.

 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D What a WUM!!!

Not a WUM. Children will emulate at play whatever they see as being topical or successful at a given time. If Irish rugby is on a downturn and struggling to achieve tangible success, kids will be less attracted to it. GAA's advantage is that it's peak exposure time comes during the summer months when children have more time to be outside and playing in the parks, streets, fields etc.

Walter Cronc

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Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #5779 on: May 31, 2017, 11:10:28 AM »
Think Irish rugby's heyday could be receding. Starting to fall off the pace in the 6 Nations and clubs not cutting it in the Euro competitions as much. Just don't have the financial clout to compete with English/French clubs for the better players and a lack of visible high-profile success could turn youngsters back to the GAA in in creasing numbers.

 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D What a WUM!!!

Not a WUM. Children will emulate at play whatever they see as being topical or successful at a given time. If Irish rugby is on a downturn and struggling to achieve tangible success, kids will be less attracted to it. GAA's advantage is that it's peak exposure time comes during the summer months when children have more time to be outside and playing in the parks, streets, fields etc.

Apologies, you are just talking complete tosh then. You speak of this downturn in Irish teams fortunes, well that ain't happening anytime soon. If anything the next crop are potentially better than we've ever had. So you may get used to it!

Kids playing in the streets, parks and fields. You living back in the 1950's?? :)

mouview

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Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #5780 on: May 31, 2017, 12:03:40 PM »
Think Irish rugby's heyday could be receding. Starting to fall off the pace in the 6 Nations and clubs not cutting it in the Euro competitions as much. Just don't have the financial clout to compete with English/French clubs for the better players and a lack of visible high-profile success could turn youngsters back to the GAA in in creasing numbers.

 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D What a WUM!!!

Not a WUM. Children will emulate at play whatever they see as being topical or successful at a given time. If Irish rugby is on a downturn and struggling to achieve tangible success, kids will be less attracted to it. GAA's advantage is that it's peak exposure time comes during the summer months when children have more time to be outside and playing in the parks, streets, fields etc.

Apologies, you are just talking complete tosh then. You speak of this downturn in Irish teams fortunes, well that ain't happening anytime soon. If anything the next crop are potentially better than we've ever had. So you may get used to it!

Kids playing in the streets, parks and fields. You living back in the 1950's?? :)

Err. it's already happening. No Irish winner of the Champions cup since 2012. Slipping off the pace recently in the 6 Nations, though we last won the tournament in 2015. Connacht won the Pro12 in style last year, but it was a bit of an outlier; Lam is leaving for Bristol and the club has really struggled all season. Leinster and Munster both heavily defeated in this year's later stages. Never progressed beyond the 1/4 finals at the World Cup (have we won an knockout game yet in that tournament?)
Who are the new O'Driscolls, O'Garas, Hickeys, D'Arcys, Stringers etc. that are coming through?

Walter Cronc

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Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #5781 on: May 31, 2017, 12:51:49 PM »
Think Irish rugby's heyday could be receding. Starting to fall off the pace in the 6 Nations and clubs not cutting it in the Euro competitions as much. Just don't have the financial clout to compete with English/French clubs for the better players and a lack of visible high-profile success could turn youngsters back to the GAA in in creasing numbers.

 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D What a WUM!!!

Not a WUM. Children will emulate at play whatever they see as being topical or successful at a given time. If Irish rugby is on a downturn and struggling to achieve tangible success, kids will be less attracted to it. GAA's advantage is that it's peak exposure time comes during the summer months when children have more time to be outside and playing in the parks, streets, fields etc.

Apologies, you are just talking complete tosh then. You speak of this downturn in Irish teams fortunes, well that ain't happening anytime soon. If anything the next crop are potentially better than we've ever had. So you may get used to it!

Kids playing in the streets, parks and fields. You living back in the 1950's?? :)

Err. it's already happening. No Irish winner of the Champions cup since 2012. Slipping off the pace recently in the 6 Nations, though we last won the tournament in 2015. Connacht won the Pro12 in style last year, but it was a bit of an outlier; Lam is leaving for Bristol and the club has really struggled all season. Leinster and Munster both heavily defeated in this year's later stages. Never progressed beyond the 1/4 finals at the World Cup (have we won an knockout game yet in that tournament?)
Who are the new O'Driscolls, O'Garas, Hickeys, D'Arcys, Stringers etc. that are coming through?

Now that is the response of a WUM.  ;D ;D ;D ;D So kids will somehow stop following Ireland and the provinces as they haven't been successful??? Slipping off the pace at the 6 nations - you really don't have a clue do you. Did you start watching rugby in the 2000's.... Or maybe you remember when actually did struggle. On this warped rationale of yours then kids from 25+ counties in Ireland should stop following their county as they haven't a hope in hell of winning anything in the near future and I include my own in that!!




mouview

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Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #5782 on: May 31, 2017, 03:36:39 PM »

Now that is the response of a WUM.  ;D ;D ;D ;D So kids will somehow stop following Ireland and the provinces as they haven't been successful??? Slipping off the pace at the 6 nations - you really don't have a clue do you. Did you start watching rugby in the 2000's.... Or maybe you remember when actually did struggle. On this warped rationale of yours then kids from 25+ counties in Ireland should stop following their county as they haven't a hope in hell of winning anything in the near future and I include my own in that!!

Am I factually incorrect? Did I start personalising the argument? In the 2015 6 Nations we won 2 games, this year we were beaten by Scotland, a game we were well expected to win. I actually stopped watching rugby in the 2000's, (having followed it since the late 70s), a bit fed up with the whole Sky-ification of the sport.

My main point is that we have dropped back a lot from the peak glory days of O'Driscoll, 2009 Grand Slam et al, thus Irish rugby's profile is lowered and is less 'sexy' to younger people; therefore, in my opinion admittedly, the potential numbers taking up and playing the sport will be reduced. Please, present a factional rebuttal to this. Who are the new generation about to come through?

Walter Cronc

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Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #5783 on: May 31, 2017, 04:54:54 PM »

Now that is the response of a WUM.  ;D ;D ;D ;D So kids will somehow stop following Ireland and the provinces as they haven't been successful??? Slipping off the pace at the 6 nations - you really don't have a clue do you. Did you start watching rugby in the 2000's.... Or maybe you remember when actually did struggle. On this warped rationale of yours then kids from 25+ counties in Ireland should stop following their county as they haven't a hope in hell of winning anything in the near future and I include my own in that!!

Am I factually incorrect? Did I start personalising the argument? In the 2015 6 Nations we won 2 games, this year we were beaten by Scotland, a game we were well expected to win. I actually stopped watching rugby in the 2000's, (having followed it since the late 70s), a bit fed up with the whole Sky-ification of the sport.

My main point is that we have dropped back a lot from the peak glory days of O'Driscoll, 2009 Grand Slam et al, thus Irish rugby's profile is lowered and is less 'sexy' to younger people; therefore, in my opinion admittedly, the potential numbers taking up and playing the sport will be reduced. Please, present a factional rebuttal to this. Who are the new generation about to come through?

And yet you refuse to compare your rationale in the context of GAA. Will young lads in Derry & Armagh stop playing football, will young lads in Cork stop playing hurling?? Success doesnt always impact playing numbers and future success as much as you think. How did Spain go from perennial under-achievers to world beaters?? Better coaching, more coaches and better structures. Ireland is now tapping into GAA heartlands and unearthing the likes of Sean O'Brien and Tadgh Furlong and this will only continue.

Who are the future stars of Irish rugby? Darren Sweetnam, Jacob Stockdale, James Ryan, Kieran Treadwell, Jordan Larmour  & Andrew Porter to name but a few. You can use that down in the pub with your mates!


mouview

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Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #5784 on: June 01, 2017, 03:30:32 PM »
GAA is endemic in Irish culture, (and soccer to an extent in towns and cities.) There is a notion (cf. Seofoid), whether real or perceived, that rugby has always been elitist or 'minority' (albeit a fairly sizeable one) and will thus be battling for playing numbers among children. In other words, children will usually default to playing GAA or soccer when/if they are out playing with their mates. Lesser success in rugby at top club or international level won't improve this and makes the game a harder sell, again IMHO.

Spain may have been perennial underachievers but they've always been a soccer-playing nation with prominent and visible club sides down through the years. Again, you can't apply this template to Irish rugby clubs, who've only really come to prominence with their formation at Provincial level.

How do you know whether I've any mates, or go to the pub, or meet any mates I may have in the pub?

AhNowRef

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Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #5785 on: June 01, 2017, 03:35:29 PM »

Now that is the response of a WUM.  ;D ;D ;D ;D So kids will somehow stop following Ireland and the provinces as they haven't been successful??? Slipping off the pace at the 6 nations - you really don't have a clue do you. Did you start watching rugby in the 2000's.... Or maybe you remember when actually did struggle. On this warped rationale of yours then kids from 25+ counties in Ireland should stop following their county as they haven't a hope in hell of winning anything in the near future and I include my own in that!!

Am I factually incorrect? Did I start personalising the argument? In the 2015 6 Nations we won 2 games, this year we were beaten by Scotland, a game we were well expected to win. I actually stopped watching rugby in the 2000's, (having followed it since the late 70s), a bit fed up with the whole Sky-ification of the sport.

My main point is that we have dropped back a lot from the peak glory days of O'Driscoll, 2009 Grand Slam et al, thus Irish rugby's profile is lowered and is less 'sexy' to younger people; therefore, in my opinion admittedly, the potential numbers taking up and playing the sport will be reduced. Please, present a factional rebuttal to this. Who are the new generation about to come through?

Refer to bold above ..... Jeez, So how can you tell whats going on then  :o

btw, Gaelic is my first sport .. Rugby is next and its bloody great, and I honestly believe that we (Ireland & Provinces) have a great future..
« Last Edit: June 01, 2017, 03:37:03 PM by AhNowRef »

Walter Cronc

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Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #5786 on: June 01, 2017, 04:09:24 PM »

Now that is the response of a WUM.  ;D ;D ;D ;D So kids will somehow stop following Ireland and the provinces as they haven't been successful??? Slipping off the pace at the 6 nations - you really don't have a clue do you. Did you start watching rugby in the 2000's.... Or maybe you remember when actually did struggle. On this warped rationale of yours then kids from 25+ counties in Ireland should stop following their county as they haven't a hope in hell of winning anything in the near future and I include my own in that!!

Am I factually incorrect? Did I start personalising the argument? In the 2015 6 Nations we won 2 games, this year we were beaten by Scotland, a game we were well expected to win. I actually stopped watching rugby in the 2000's, (having followed it since the late 70s), a bit fed up with the whole Sky-ification of the sport.

My main point is that we have dropped back a lot from the peak glory days of O'Driscoll, 2009 Grand Slam et al, thus Irish rugby's profile is lowered and is less 'sexy' to younger people; therefore, in my opinion admittedly, the potential numbers taking up and playing the sport will be reduced. Please, present a factional rebuttal to this. Who are the new generation about to come through?

Refer to bold above ..... Jeez, So how can you tell whats going on then  :o

btw, Gaelic is my first sport .. Rugby is next and its bloody great, and I honestly believe that we (Ireland & Provinces) have a great future..

LOL looks like Mouview is busted

trileacman

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Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #5787 on: June 01, 2017, 11:20:08 PM »
You all seem like you're on your periods. Bit of a non-issue to get all angsty about.

Rugby will suffer like Gaa in that the drive to professionalism deters participation. Gone are the days that a heavy drinking culture was synonymous with a rugby/gaa club. That and the damage done to the body and brain by 80+ mins of bash artistry will probably go against rugby in the draw for larger youth numbers.
Fantasy Rugby World Cup Champion 2011,
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Walter Cronc

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Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #5788 on: June 01, 2017, 11:31:22 PM »
You all seem like you're on your periods. Bit of a non-issue to get all angsty about.

Rugby will suffer like Gaa in that the drive to professionalism deters participation. Gone are the days that a heavy drinking culture was synonymous with a rugby/gaa club. That and the damage done to the body and brain by 80+ mins of bash artistry will probably go against rugby in the draw for larger youth numbers.

No need to be sexist pal ;)

trileacman

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Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #5789 on: June 02, 2017, 12:16:01 AM »
Apologies to anyone who is actually on their period.
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