Messages

George Best, a true blue for five minutes wanted an Irish team, it makes sense to everyone except the neanderthals, especially the one's up north.

I think we should forget about flying flags and singing anthems and just go out and play for the Country, the whole country, if i was a rugby head from the north and a Prod I probably wouldn't want to hear the irish National Anthem blaring out, the solution, feck them all and do without!

I'm a unionist with a small u.  Not voted since GFA (Yes vote by the way) and would vote Alliance if push came to shove.  The thing is I am a big supporter of the NI football team and resent being called a neanderthal for being so.  I have always gone to matches and want to continue to do so.
I do take your point re anthems / flags etc.  There should be no GSTQ at WP for NI football matches, nor should there be the Soldiers Song at Lansdowne Road for rugby internationals, or the Aviva, as I believe we are now meant to call it.

Hmmm, interesting. What is your view on the playing of our national anthem at Gaelic matches?

Don't have an issue with that at all, just don't see the point.  Particularly, if GAA is wanting to attract unionists / protestants to play Gaelic games.

Right so, ever since the Penal Laws the british have been trying to stamp out anything Irish, in Ireland. Our Irish language was driven to the corners of the provinces, Irish names were anglosized, our culture and religion surpressed etc etc. And today in the six counties things are not much different. The whole raison d'etre of the GAA was to stop the erosion of our culture. But yet you dont see the point of flying the tricolour? Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but I find your statement rather bizarre.

Flying the tricolour where?  If you are talking about at Gaelic matches, I would stand by my point above.

[Your post also suggests the players we are referring to were somehow approached and had their heads somehow turned, but similar 'approaches' have not been made to players of a unionist/protestant background, which suggests some sort of sectarian agenda by the FAI... Bizarre.]

There is a de facto all ireland team in soccer at the minute, no need to change and bring troublemakers on board.

There is not a de facto all Ireland team - It would be fairer to say that there is a team made up of Irish born players from a nationalist background.  To date, to the best of my knowledge, approaches have not been made to young up and coming Northern Irish players from a protestant / unionist background.

There is a de facto all-Ireland team because players from the six counties who consider themselves Irish, a right guaranteed to them under the GFA you voted for, now feel confident enough to express their nationality after 70 years of having that identity discriminated against. Despite this they still have to deal with abuse from OWC heads for abandoning their, ahem, 'country', a 'country' that treated their parents, grandparents and great-grandparents as third class citizens in their own land. Your post also suggests the players we are referring to were somehow approached and had their heads somehow turned, but similar 'approaches' have not been made to players of a unionist/protestant background, which suggests some sort of sectarian agenda by the FAI... Bizarre. Come back to me when the Republic's captain is booed by his own fans because of his religion and has to give up his international career due to death threats

ese players are somehow traitors
Has it not been reported that young nationalist players are being approached?  To believe otherwise, is naive in my opinion.

I know footballers do have a reputation for being thick, but is it not equally naïve to not credit young players from the six counties proud of their Irish nationality with having a brain to make their own choice over who they play for, rather than blaming it on some bizarre conspiracy theory that allows OWCers to think they are being sinned against and these players are somehow traitors to their 'country'. Let's not forget, when McClean was by far and away the best player in the League of Ireland he was completely ignored by OWC while many a clown from the Irish League were given caps... And we all know why, don't we? By all means support your team and good luck to you, but don't be so naïve about why young Irish men from the six counties choose to play for THEIR country

Of course I fully appreciate how young nationalists would want to play for ROI.  I would just prefer it, howver, if they decided to do this before being developed by NI's Youth Development system and depriving another young player of representative honours.  The way your man Wilson went about things was fine.
I do, however, think young players should be left to make their decision without external influence, particularly if they have hitherto had no problem previously representing NI at under age level.  To suggest that young players are not being pressurised is wrong.  For example, do you genuinely believe that nobody from the FAI had been in Shane Ferguson's ear when he was deciding which way to jump?

In an ideal world I'd prefer them to go up through the FAI's structures, but you and I know the uproar and sectarian abuse from OWCers if the FAI had, in the past, attempted to establish such structures in the six counties ... which is just another example of the way young Irish players from the six counties were discriminated against in the statelet. In many ways these young lads had little choice but take the IFA route. Bottom line, I assume they were picked by the IFA at under age level because they were better than those round them. The like of McClean was still better than those round him (north and south) when he played for Derry City, yet he wasn't picked for the senior team while other eejits from the Irish League were, for purely sectarian reasons imo. McCourt and McGinn weren't exactly regular choices either for a long time when they were clearly better than some of the tubes given caps while playing at a similar level. As for Shane Ferguson, he made his choice, good luck to him, but he has, like the rest of us, got 2 ears, and I'm sure the IFA were in the other one, but at the end of the day it's down to the individual. To my knowledge young Ferguson hasn't been subject to the abuse from Ireland fans for his decision that OWC has heaped on McClean and Darron Gibson

So just to clarify, are you saying that selection is only based on sectarian grounds at full international level and that this is not the case at under age level?
If you had ever watched or taken any notice of Northern Irish football, you would know that selection is made on merit, with equal numbers of protestant and catholic players generally selected. 
With regards McClean, I'm not sure that many Irish League players were selected ahead of him when he was plying his trade in the LOI.  Colin Coates springs to mind, although he plays in a completely different position. 
As for McCourt and McGinn not being regulars for a while, this is because both were not playing regularly at club level (McCourt for Celtic and McGinn for Celtic and when at Brentford on loan). 
As for the IFA being in Ferguson's ear, is that not fair enough given that he come through the IFA system and is from Derry?  As for not getting stick from ROI fans, it's a completely different situation as he never represented them and then changed his mind and play for a different team.

Not from the North, but when Paddy McCourt was playing LOI with Derry City, Nigel Wortington constantly overlooked him. He was the best player in the League at the time by a Country Mile. Niall McGinn was also in very good form with Derry and was never selected until his move to Celtic.

Worthington clearly overlooked players from LOI, a league which is a better standard then the Irish League.

It was a good move by the IFA to appoint Michael O Neill for the sake of Northern Ireland football, as he doesn't have any agenda's with LOI having already managed in it and might help sway players from the Nationalist backgrond to play with Norn Iron.

Agree on Worthington overlooking players from LOI, but don't think this was based on sectarian grounds.  Also, as I said above, it's not like he was selecting lots of players fro the Irish League at the same time, which I agree is an inferior league.  The key point perhaps though, is that the LOI is still not a great standard which could explain what McClean and McGinn were overlooked when playing in it.  Lets also not overlook the fact that old Worthy was not the greatest manager, with some bizarre selections throughout his tenure, none more so than his persistence with Gorman from Wolves. 

[Your post also suggests the players we are referring to were somehow approached and had their heads somehow turned, but similar 'approaches' have not been made to players of a unionist/protestant background, which suggests some sort of sectarian agenda by the FAI... Bizarre.]

There is a de facto all ireland team in soccer at the minute, no need to change and bring troublemakers on board.

There is not a de facto all Ireland team - It would be fairer to say that there is a team made up of Irish born players from a nationalist background.  To date, to the best of my knowledge, approaches have not been made to young up and coming Northern Irish players from a protestant / unionist background.

There is a de facto all-Ireland team because players from the six counties who consider themselves Irish, a right guaranteed to them under the GFA you voted for, now feel confident enough to express their nationality after 70 years of having that identity discriminated against. Despite this they still have to deal with abuse from OWC heads for abandoning their, ahem, 'country', a 'country' that treated their parents, grandparents and great-grandparents as third class citizens in their own land. Your post also suggests the players we are referring to were somehow approached and had their heads somehow turned, but similar 'approaches' have not been made to players of a unionist/protestant background, which suggests some sort of sectarian agenda by the FAI... Bizarre. Come back to me when the Republic's captain is booed by his own fans because of his religion and has to give up his international career due to death threats

ese players are somehow traitors
Has it not been reported that young nationalist players are being approached?  To believe otherwise, is naive in my opinion.

I know footballers do have a reputation for being thick, but is it not equally naïve to not credit young players from the six counties proud of their Irish nationality with having a brain to make their own choice over who they play for, rather than blaming it on some bizarre conspiracy theory that allows OWCers to think they are being sinned against and these players are somehow traitors to their 'country'. Let's not forget, when McClean was by far and away the best player in the League of Ireland he was completely ignored by OWC while many a clown from the Irish League were given caps... And we all know why, don't we? By all means support your team and good luck to you, but don't be so naïve about why young Irish men from the six counties choose to play for THEIR country

Of course I fully appreciate how young nationalists would want to play for ROI.  I would just prefer it, howver, if they decided to do this before being developed by NI's Youth Development system and depriving another young player of representative honours.  The way your man Wilson went about things was fine.
I do, however, think young players should be left to make their decision without external influence, particularly if they have hitherto had no problem previously representing NI at under age level.  To suggest that young players are not being pressurised is wrong.  For example, do you genuinely believe that nobody from the FAI had been in Shane Ferguson's ear when he was deciding which way to jump?

In an ideal world I'd prefer them to go up through the FAI's structures, but you and I know the uproar and sectarian abuse from OWCers if the FAI had, in the past, attempted to establish such structures in the six counties ... which is just another example of the way young Irish players from the six counties were discriminated against in the statelet. In many ways these young lads had little choice but take the IFA route. Bottom line, I assume they were picked by the IFA at under age level because they were better than those round them. The like of McClean was still better than those round him (north and south) when he played for Derry City, yet he wasn't picked for the senior team while other eejits from the Irish League were, for purely sectarian reasons imo. McCourt and McGinn weren't exactly regular choices either for a long time when they were clearly better than some of the tubes given caps while playing at a similar level. As for Shane Ferguson, he made his choice, good luck to him, but he has, like the rest of us, got 2 ears, and I'm sure the IFA were in the other one, but at the end of the day it's down to the individual. To my knowledge young Ferguson hasn't been subject to the abuse from Ireland fans for his decision that OWC has heaped on McClean and Darron Gibson

So just to clarify, are you saying that selection is only based on sectarian grounds at full international level and that this is not the case at under age level?
If you had ever watched or taken any notice of Northern Irish football, you would know that selection is made on merit, with equal numbers of protestant and catholic players generally selected. 
With regards McClean, I'm not sure that many Irish League players were selected ahead of him when he was plying his trade in the LOI.  Colin Coates springs to mind, although he plays in a completely different position. 
As for McCourt and McGinn not being regulars for a while, this is because both were not playing regularly at club level (McCourt for Celtic and McGinn for Celtic and when at Brentford on loan). 
As for the IFA being in Ferguson's ear, is that not fair enough given that he come through the IFA system and is from Derry?  As for not getting stick from ROI fans, it's a completely different situation as he never represented them and then changed his mind and played for a different team.

[Your post also suggests the players we are referring to were somehow approached and had their heads somehow turned, but similar 'approaches' have not been made to players of a unionist/protestant background, which suggests some sort of sectarian agenda by the FAI... Bizarre.]

There is a de facto all ireland team in soccer at the minute, no need to change and bring troublemakers on board.

There is not a de facto all Ireland team - It would be fairer to say that there is a team made up of Irish born players from a nationalist background.  To date, to the best of my knowledge, approaches have not been made to young up and coming Northern Irish players from a protestant / unionist background.

There is a de facto all-Ireland team because players from the six counties who consider themselves Irish, a right guaranteed to them under the GFA you voted for, now feel confident enough to express their nationality after 70 years of having that identity discriminated against. Despite this they still have to deal with abuse from OWC heads for abandoning their, ahem, 'country', a 'country' that treated their parents, grandparents and great-grandparents as third class citizens in their own land. Your post also suggests the players we are referring to were somehow approached and had their heads somehow turned, but similar 'approaches' have not been made to players of a unionist/protestant background, which suggests some sort of sectarian agenda by the FAI... Bizarre. Come back to me when the Republic's captain is booed by his own fans because of his religion and has to give up his international career due to death threats

ese players are somehow traitors
Has it not been reported that young nationalist players are being approached?  To believe otherwise, is naive in my opinion.

I know footballers do have a reputation for being thick, but is it not equally naïve to not credit young players from the six counties proud of their Irish nationality with having a brain to make their own choice over who they play for, rather than blaming it on some bizarre conspiracy theory that allows OWCers to think they are being sinned against and these players are somehow traitors to their 'country'. Let's not forget, when McClean was by far and away the best player in the League of Ireland he was completely ignored by OWC while many a clown from the Irish League were given caps... And we all know why, don't we? By all means support your team and good luck to you, but don't be so naïve about why young Irish men from the six counties choose to play for THEIR country

Of course I fully appreciate how young nationalists would want to play for ROI.  I would just prefer it, howver, if they decided to do this before being developed by NI's Youth Development system and depriving another young player of representative honours.  The way your man Wilson went about things was fine.
I do, however, think young players should be left to make their decision without external influence, particularly if they have hitherto had no problem previously representing NI at under age level.  To suggest that young players are not being pressurised is wrong.  For example, do you genuinely believe that nobody from the FAI had been in Shane Ferguson's ear when he was deciding which way to jump?

[Your post also suggests the players we are referring to were somehow approached and had their heads somehow turned, but similar 'approaches' have not been made to players of a unionist/protestant background, which suggests some sort of sectarian agenda by the FAI... Bizarre.]

There is a de facto all ireland team in soccer at the minute, no need to change and bring troublemakers on board.

There is not a de facto all Ireland team - It would be fairer to say that there is a team made up of Irish born players from a nationalist background.  To date, to the best of my knowledge, approaches have not been made to young up and coming Northern Irish players from a protestant / unionist background.

There is a de facto all-Ireland team because players from the six counties who consider themselves Irish, a right guaranteed to them under the GFA you voted for, now feel confident enough to express their nationality after 70 years of having that identity discriminated against. Despite this they still have to deal with abuse from OWC heads for abandoning their, ahem, 'country', a 'country' that treated their parents, grandparents and great-grandparents as third class citizens in their own land. Your post also suggests the players we are referring to were somehow approached and had their heads somehow turned, but similar 'approaches' have not been made to players of a unionist/protestant background, which suggests some sort of sectarian agenda by the FAI... Bizarre. Come back to me when the Republic's captain is booed by his own fans because of his religion and has to give up his international career due to death threats

Has it not been reported that young nationalist players are being approached?  To believe otherwise, is naive in my opinion.

There is a de facto all ireland team in soccer at the minute, no need to change and bring troublemakers on board.

There is not a de facto all Ireland team - It would be fairer to say that there is a team made up of Irish born players from a nationalist background.  To date, to the best of my knowledge, approaches have not been made to young up and coming Northern Irish players from a protestant / unionist background.

George Best, a true blue for five minutes wanted an Irish team, it makes sense to everyone except the neanderthals, especially the one's up north.

I think we should forget about flying flags and singing anthems and just go out and play for the Country, the whole country, if i was a rugby head from the north and a Prod I probably wouldn't want to hear the irish National Anthem blaring out, the solution, feck them all and do without!

I'm a unionist with a small u.  Not voted since GFA (Yes vote by the way) and would vote Alliance if push came to shove.  The thing is I am a big supporter of the NI football team and resent being called a neanderthal for being so.  I have always gone to matches and want to continue to do so.
I do take your point re anthems / flags etc.  There should be no GSTQ at WP for NI football matches, nor should there be the Soldiers Song at Lansdowne Road for rugby internationals, or the Aviva, as I believe we are now meant to call it.

Michael, not all northern  supporters are neanderthals obviously and I did not mean that you were one, that said the northern team has their fair share to be sure.

Fair share admittedly.  However, the same could be said for some supporters of the ROI team - Particularly those from Northern Ireland. 

George Best, a true blue for five minutes wanted an Irish team, it makes sense to everyone except the neanderthals, especially the one's up north.

I think we should forget about flying flags and singing anthems and just go out and play for the Country, the whole country, if i was a rugby head from the north and a Prod I probably wouldn't want to hear the irish National Anthem blaring out, the solution, feck them all and do without!

I'm a unionist with a small u.  Not voted since GFA (Yes vote by the way) and would vote Alliance if push came to shove.  The thing is I am a big supporter of the NI football team and resent being called a neanderthal for being so.  I have always gone to matches and want to continue to do so.
I do take your point re anthems / flags etc.  There should be no GSTQ at WP for NI football matches, nor should there be the Soldiers Song at Lansdowne Road for rugby internationals, or the Aviva, as I believe we are now meant to call it.

Hmmm, interesting. What is your view on the playing of our national anthem at Gaelic matches?

Don't have an issue with that at all, just don't see the point.  Particularly, if GAA is wanting to attract unionists / protestants to play Gaelic games.

George Best, a true blue for five minutes wanted an Irish team, it makes sense to everyone except the neanderthals, especially the one's up north.

I think we should forget about flying flags and singing anthems and just go out and play for the Country, the whole country, if i was a rugby head from the north and a Prod I probably wouldn't want to hear the irish National Anthem blaring out, the solution, feck them all and do without!

I'm a unionist with a small u.  Not voted since GFA (Yes vote by the way) and would vote Alliance if push came to shove.  The thing is I am a big supporter of the NI football team and resent being called a neanderthal for being so.  I have always gone to matches and want to continue to do so.
I do take your point re anthems / flags etc.  There should be no GSTQ at WP for NI football matches, nor should there be the Soldiers Song at Lansdowne Road for rugby internationals, or the Aviva, as I believe we are now meant to call it.

Irish League Supporters forum.  Has attendances for last 3 or 4 seasons.
www.irishleaguesupporters.com/forums/

They'll get a grant to refurbish facilities.Magnificent achievement all the same in such a short space of time,and hopefully Newry will be back too.

If Newry struggled to get much support, does the area need 2 Irish League clubs?

How much support do you need in the irish league, some games I doubt would get 300 paying supporters.

Average attendance for 2012-13 is 918.  Highest is Linfield with 2050 and lowest is Donegal Celtic with 293. 
Newry City's average attendance in 2010-11 was 367.

They'll get a grant to refurbish facilities.Magnificent achievement all the same in such a short space of time,and hopefully Newry will be back too.

If Newry struggled to get much support, does the area need 2 Irish League clubs?

At least 50 afternoons were ruined this afternoon as a result of these actions. 22 players, 8 backroom staff, 4 officials, 1 ticket collector, and unknown number of supporters, estimated at 15.

I'd imagine crowd would have been about 2000 or so

[there will be serious unrest for a short time]

There is a diffence between a survey asking would you vote for a UI and an actual border poll

As much I think the North is financially better of in the United Kingdom (or at least the individuals in the North - due to public setor jobs, handouts, NHS etc) - I do think that whatever the conditions for a UI at the time of the border poll, my heart would force me to vote YES.

I think many of the people that said they would vote No would actually vote yes if we really did get a border poll.

The reality of what a United Ireland would be like needs to be drawn up before any border poll, the undecided Catholics are not likely to vote for the unknown, but if the economics of a United Ireland can be put into a positive light then who knows how the vote would go.

Most of the people the voted in favour of the GFA basically voted in favour of peace, the vote for a UI could be sold the same way - the only way there will be everlasting peace in Northern Ireland is if reunification occurs - there will be serious unrest for a short time but eventually it will die down and Ireland can move forward as one peaceful country which will be a massive benefit economically for Northern Ireland - we could attract more businesses who are keen to locate in Northern Ireland due to the skills of the workforce etc, but are put off by the unrest.

There is no reason for the Unionists to be afraid of a United Ireland - look at Donegal, a massive 12th takes place in it every year, peacefully!

Have you been watching the flag dispute?  You're clearly a 'half full' kinda guy.

Didn't see match - Evans play well?