Qualifiers.

[ILikeStrawberryJam]

Looking at the panel the following players are 30+

Timmons
Booth
Mcmahon
Strong
Meaney
Quigley
Begley ( i think)
Donaher
Conway
Walsh
Ross

thats 11 potential starters .. 8 starters (ross came on) booth was injured ..

We have been getting hiding at underage for a decade ..

So who replaces these players when 90% retire over the next 2 years

There is a some talent coming through but lets face it, it very limited

BallyroanAbu its clear you're a passionate Laois gaa man and i agree with a lot of your posts but i just dont
get your optimism about Clancy. I've no problem with him getting the job but like Tony said we've been in
a serious decline for 5+ years now . . i cant see Clancy having a major impact as they players aint there but
i'm open minded about who gets the job ..

we did seem tactically clueless all year and unfit so Creedon has to take his share of blame there .. It does appears that some players
are going through the motions this year, so maybe a bit of a clear out might help ...

We will get promoted as we are better than most of the teams down there although not much better than Carlow anymore

The crowds will be in the low hundreds next year meaning less money .. its a bit of a vicious circle now .. i guess we're reaping
what we sowed ..

The only way out of this mess is to get the underage structures right and slowly over a long period of time we will hopefully
drag ourselves up the divisions ..

[BallyroanAbu]

I think you could be surprised by Clancy,  what's our options otherwise hire some fella nobody else wants, and give him €25,000 for the pleasure.  I really think it's a no lose situation if a young Laois Manager has success I think the multiplier effect of a Laois Man in charge would be huge.  Even at your best guesstimate we will be 10 years sorting out underage we really don't have that time.  I am telling you like him or don't Clancy has a X factor which draws people to him that otherwise would not look twice at us.  I am sure he has plenty of faults but I really don't think they matter or are relevant.

[Junior Ex Laoistalk]

I would love to see Clancy involved but not as manager just yet. Maybe put him in with Creedon and let him see the setup at first hand and with his experience as a player having gone through a number of managers he would have a lot to offer. If we got out of Div.4 fairly soon and Clancy take over then he might have a good young squad to work with.

There is no point pinning our hopes on the current squad as they are going to fall apart next year so let's be patient and hope our Co. Board take into account how serious this situation is and take steps to rectify it.

[OTF]

Clancy would be mad to take on this job at this point because let's call a spade a spade here this group are gone. They have being going down hill since Healy got his second yellow against Galway in'13 and have being going down steadily since with nothing coming through.

The place for clancy is with the u20 or u17 or development squads, he needs to learn a bit as well.
If he goes in with the seniors at this point he will forever be associated with a sinking ship in my opinion
.
I heard the CB have received the most funding (after Dublin that is) of any Leinster country can anyone confirm.....and how was it spent.

[oneflewoverthecuckoonest]

we have to start  a rebuild now, and not spend talking about rebuilding and letting the grass grow under our feet.

after 8 months at the helm I cannot think of one positive aspect of creedon's tenure. sacking managers will not solve the underlying issues, however a deadbeat in charge will not help a revival movement. the lack of fan support(pathetic actually last Saturday) indicates the general laois public have zero faith in this manager. he must go.

we don't want one of the usual cast of journeymen managers to replace him........perhaps find a coach from the sigerson level seeking a challenge and add some of the local former players to his management team, and find a specialist defensive coach.

The problem I see ahead, is that the clowns at county board level have not the personal and collective acumen to put together a management set up to help the rebuild, always easier to get one of the journeymen clowns from the circus.

I could start criticising players on fitness, discipline and application, but with the season over, we cannot change the past, easier to address the future.

[Giovanni]

I was there in O Moore Park for my sins on Saturday amidst one of the smallest crowds I have seen this year and like most people who were there it was a painful experience.
Within three seconds of the start of the game we had won a free. At that moment  my two year old chose to pull my leg for a snack and by the time I had given it to him and looked up we were a point down inside the opening minute and the same old foreboding that has come with every Laois match this season came back again.
There are some good posts on this thread and there are sadly a lot of bad ones but a general consensus seems to be that replacing Creedon is not the answer and that we simply don't have the players to compete at this level. This is something I can't agree with.
While we obviously don't have the players of yester year do we really have that worse of a team than Clare, Louth, Sligo, Antrim or Offaly of all teams? Now I know we have a lot of problems with the county structure and the board but for me I don't think we do and I think a lot of that comes from the manager. And if we have to start there.
Clare were no great shakes but for most of the game if not all of it looked comfortably better than us. Simply because they looked organised and had a plan and we, like nearly every game I have seen us play this year look like a shambles.
Examples of this would be the contrast in kickouts. The majority of our kickouts were long to the middle were a single laois man jumped usually on his own against 2-3 Clare players who broke the ball off him and we had no one even close to gather it up. Farrell must have been told to do a dummy run for each or own kickout's because he would start on one wing and loop around to the other and then back again as the ball was being kicked. No one from Clare even bothered tracking him and not one kickout landed near him.
Clare on the other hand took short kickouts. They won their first 5-6 kickouts with short ones to the backs while our forwards retreated up the pitch allowing them 40-50 yards before even attempting a tackle. Indeed some of their early scores came from a kickout and then 2-3 passes up the pitch without a single laois hand touching a Clare player which is criminal at this level.
After the first 5-6 kickouts someone decided that we had to push up on them which resulted in the Clare backs getting into a huddle and then breaking in all directions at once to receive the short kick out and hand pass it back to their keeper. As soon as the keeper received the ball again the Laois forwards retreated back and the same thing happened again. It was a snapshot of everything we have done this season. It was half arsed.
Under Creedon we have looked to play a defensive game with players crowding back and often a lone Donnie or an empty pitch ahead of them. At like most things done this year again it is half arsed. Players don't seem to know what to do in this defensive system apart from get back. Its like being told today you have to build a house here's a hammer and having no clue what to do after that. No one seems to know how to track runners, when to double mark, at what point you stop retreating and at what point you push up. With frightening regularity a static midfield is facing 2-3 players running full speed at them and is quickly over run.
Our fitness this year has also been shocking and this is something we never really had a problem with before. Against Kildare we were blowing after 20 mins and in most games this year we have faded off badly at the end.
Our support running is non existent at times and our movement off the ball is criminal. One of the worst examples of this was in Tullamore when late in the game Brody had to solo out the ball. He ended up in Kildare half, alone with four Kildare players around him and not one Laois player within twenty yards. This is not a skill issue or not having the player's issue. Its players not being fit enough or arsed enough or coached enough to run in support.
After watching Laois this year I have no idea what Creedon has done or what he has hoped to achieve. I can't say we are an attacking team or a defensive team. All I know is we are a poor team. To say the players are not there is an easy excuse but all the above are just simple examples of bad play. Nothing to do with skill. It's about bad management and organisation and fitness. We might not be able to change the players but we can change these things with a better manager.
Someone made a comment about Jim McGuinness a couple of posts ago and I ll be honest before the Donegal job I had never heard of the man. I m sure there an awful lot of managers out there in a similar vein managing at club or college level waiting for a chance.  Look at Cian O Neill with Kildare. There are still only a small few county managers jobs available each year. Managers that have a plan at least or think outside the box.
Because at the moment we are playing with no definite plan of action, players don't know what to do or when to do it and in such a situation good players look average at best and average players look very poor.

I think this is a superb post.

As I was sitting there on Saturday watching our lads being fairly easily dismantled, I began to think of High Fielder! I had never bought into High Fielder's idea that these players weren't good enough but looking at them on Saturday, I began to think that maybe he was right. The Laois player with the most composure on the ball is the goalkeeper ffs! Only Stephen Attride and young Farrell seem to understand that a quick ball is always preferable no matter what your game plan. Of the big names, JOL and Donie Kingston don't look fit and Begley and Quigley are just not playing well. Of the experienced players, only Mark Timmons, despite the lack of fitness work and despite serious injury, is the only one to do himself justice. Looking at it on Saturday (and looking at what we've been seeing for the last few years) you couldn't just dismiss the possibility that these lads are just playing at their level and that's it. He's also right that we don't have very defensive minded players in the squad.

Still, I still think Helmut's post above is more correct. When McNulty was in charge, the same players were only conceeding about 10-12 points a game. Peter O Leary was playing in the corner back position. We've all seen teams more limited than Laois really making life difficult for higher level opposition - last year's Fermanagh team have hardly better players than us. They do have a fantastic manager though.

I think we've been really let down by successive management teams. And I think we've been let down by the players themselves. Fellas playing inter-county football shouldn't have arses the size of Stradbally. You shouldn't need a manager to tell you that. That might have changed if there was someone challenging for their positions of course. Ultimately though the really best players motivate themselves from within. If anyone saw Cahir Healy or Sean Downey playing with the hurlers over the last few weeks, you'd know what that means.

I think we have some talent but we don't have the desire, the organisation or the togetherness to go with it. This group have certainly underachieved in the last few years and it's a real shame to see that that basic talent has gone to waste.

My hope is that although the talent might be weaker in the coming years, we will be able to assemble a team of committed and bright players (Brody, Farrell, Attride) who can grow into their role as leaders of the county eam in the next 3 or 4 years. It's going to be tough!

[Tony]

. the lack of fan support(pathetic actually last Saturday) indicates the general laois public have zero faith in this manager. he must go.

Look whatever about Creedon going or staying this above quote is wrong. Have you not been to Laois games the last 5 - 7 years? The support has been miniscule and has been for some time. To say that indicates that the public have no faith in the manager is wrong - sure it's been this way for years! Pretty much since 09 we've been getting worse and worse crowds. At the end of the day, nobody wants to go watch their team play very poorly and unfortunately that's what we've generally being doing the last 10 years. The supporters will come back once we have a team that's achieving progress and creating a buzz.

[The Monument Road]

Looking at the panel the following players are 30+

Timmons
Booth
Mcmahon
Strong
Meaney
Quigley
Begley ( i think)
Donaher
Conway
Walsh
Ross

thats 11 potential starters .. 8 starters (ross came on) booth was injured ..

We have been getting hiding at underage for a decade ..

So who replaces these players when 90% retire over the next 2 years

There is a some talent coming through but lets face it, it very limited

BallyroanAbu its clear you're a passionate Laois gaa man and i agree with a lot of your posts but i just dont
get your optimism about Clancy. I've no problem with him getting the job but like Tony said we've been in
a serious decline for 5+ years now . . i cant see Clancy having a major impact as they players aint there but
i'm open minded about who gets the job ..

we did seem tactically clueless all year and unfit so Creedon has to take his share of blame there .. It does appears that some players
are going through the motions this year, so maybe a bit of a clear out might help ...

We will get promoted as we are better than most of the teams down there although not much better than Carlow anymore

The crowds will be in the low hundreds next year meaning less money .. its a bit of a vicious circle now .. i guess we're reaping
what we sowed ..

The only way out of this mess is to get the underage structures right and slowly over a long period of time we will hopefully
drag ourselves up the divisions ..

Timmons
Booth ( Wasnt picked /Not injured)
Mcmahon
Strong
Meaney
Quigley
Begley ( i think) (Minor in 2003 so he must be 32 this year  at least)
Donaher
Conway
Walsh ( Was a minor in 2007 so he is 27 now)
Ross

[oneflewoverthecuckoonest]

sorry Tony, yet another defensive reply on your part re Creedon.


Tony........

one simple question, and I will leave it at this.

Can you name one positive aspect Creedon brought to Laois this past season?

[Keyser Söze]

Ah come off it Ballyroan. Let's say we get the same Leinster draw for 2018 as 2017. We might get past Longford 50/50 but do you think with the current squad and it's lack of pace and overall ability we'll come anywhere near Kildare, with Clancy as the only difference? Do you think Clancy with a couple of years can turn this around?

The point you keep missing is this;

Nobody expects that we would beat Kildare as is under any manager, Creedon, Clancy or Jack Charlton. It's not the Kildare result that has many people questioning Mr Creedon.
But Clancy doesn't have to achieve that to be an improvement on Creedon.
All he has to do is not lose to the likes of Sligo, Antrim and Offaly in the league!

[Keyser Söze]

sorry Tony, yet another defensive reply on your part re Creedon.


Tony........

one simple question, and I will leave it at this.

Can you name one positive aspect Creedon brought to Laois this past season?

I can tell you what he is going to say......

No players went to America after the Kildare match!
Money well spent wasn't he!

[Tony]

It's just a fact: crowds for Laois games have been pathetic and dire these last 5-7 years and not just 2017. Everybody at the games know that. There's hardly ever a cheer for the lads when they come out. We're nearly always outnumbered, even from smaller counties and even in O'Moore Park. This has been the case for years on years and anybody who is going to the games will tell you that. It's not even up for discussion as it's a clear as day fact that anyone with common sense can figure out.

[stevecw]

I was at the Clare game there on Saturday as a neutral. Was shocked at how uninterested Laois looked especially after the sending off. It was odd, so many of the backs just shadowed their man instead of putting in a hit or a block or something.
Can't remember 1 good shoulder or even a hit on a man that might get a yellow but will get the team going.

The whole thing was so passive, it was like once they lost JOL, they just totally gave up, not that they were doing much up to then.
Have to feel sorry for Donie Kingston and McMahon in the backs too. Bit of quality and interest about those 2.
I see some people here defending the manager and saying you can't do better. He has to go, you can tell by body language of the team, they couldn't give a shit about him.

I see today he is looking for another year! If he gets it, Laois will remain in Div 4 and then he will be sacked. You need an internal manager, and somebody who will get the Portlaoise element back on board.

I see a lot of posts here are saying it'll be a year in div 4 to rebuild and we'll get out. A lot of teams come down from Div 3 and think they'll get straight back up. Ask Wexford, Limerick, all who have spent 2 or 3 years now in Div 4. The top 4/5 in Div 4 are equal to a lot of Div 3.

Laois
Antrim
Carlow
Limerick
Leitrim

Waterford
London
Wicklow

[Unison]

The supporters cannot be blamed for boycotting Laois matches. Players being continually sent off is indicative of the malaise that infests the set up in Laois at the moment from top to bottom. Players are not committed, Management are useless and the county board couldn't give a toss.

Expect one man and his dog watching them in Div 4 next year.

Failure cannot be rewarded. Therefore Creedon must be given his p45.

If the fact that we are in Div 4 does not motivate those in charge to change things drastically in the county, then we might as well do as Kilkenny footballers have done and pull out of the championship.

[mayoaremagic]

Another chap sent off when the game was in the mix. F*cking pathetic

Have listened to local journalists criticise poor Laois support, but I pity Laois supporters. Why support unfit and indisciplined teams? My advice is keep your money in your pockets.

Both of you guys were obviously at home and not at the game. O'Loughlin received a second yellow card but no-one can remember him getting the first one. He was being pulled and dragged off the ball and eventually shoved his marker away. The ref as usual took the handy way out and issued two yellows. The only other Laois player that received a yellow before that was Stephen Attride, not O'Loughlin.
Having said that Clare were the better team by far, way fitter and some great movement from their forwards. They deserved their win even tho' they did use 7 subs. I don't think a replay would do Laois any favours but it's out of their hands now.

7 Subs Used:
Clare: Joe Hayes; Gordon Kelly, Kevin Harnett, Martin McMahon; Pierce Lillis, Ciarán Russell, Dean Ryan; Gary Brennan, Cathal O'Connor; Cian O'Dea, Eoin Cleary, Sean Collins; Keelan Sexton, David Tubridy, Jamie Malone. Subs: John Hayes for Russell (56 mins), Gearoid O'Brien for Tubridy (56 mins), Seanie Malone for Sexton (61 mins), Darren Nagle for O'Dea (61 mins), Eoghan Collins for Harnett (64 mins), Darragh Bohannon for Lillis (69 mins), Kieran Malone for S Collins (69 mins).

Eoghan Collins for Kevin Harnett was a bloodsub