The Minister, the Commissioner and the whistleblower

[foxcommander]

From RTE.ie
"Minister for Justice Frances Fitzgerald has said there will be a Commission of Investigation following the publication of the Guerin Report.
The report looked into allegations that serious crimes were not investigated properly by gardaí."

Awesome. Problem fixed. Well done government, you have restored my confidence.
I had no need to worry about Deputy Fitzgerald. An enquiry into an enquiry was the answer. Why didn't we realise it?
That's why they get paid the big bucks.

[macdanger2]

But as for economic policy, with all politicians on all sides calling for less taxes, more public spending and higher unemployment benefit, because everyone's number one objective was to be popular and get elected next time, there's very very few people in this country who would have done anything differently had they been part of the government at that time.

The blame can't be laid purely at the feet of the politicians, if they don't tow the populist line then they're out on their ear. We, the people have to take responsibility for voting for these politicians in - over the past 15 years the likes of Lowry, the Flynns, Bertie, Lawlor, Healy Rae, etc, etc have topped the poll while the likes of Dick Spring & Alan Dukes lost or nearly lost their seats. A poor reflection on Irish society imo

[Pangurban]

Corrupt societies produce corrupt politicians. At the root of all the problems is the Irish disease of clientelism. This provides the platform for the bull-shitting politicians to appear to be doing something, when in fact they are doing nothing. If you are entitled to a service or benefit by virtue of your circumstances or citizenship you do not need the aid of a con-man to obtain it. An honest politician will not attempt to bribe you with stupid promises, that are only intended to make you feel disempowered. He will empower you and your community by listening, determining your needs and advising you are the community how best to organise your campaign plan. In this way he will empower individuals and communities, encourage them to employ their talents, become involved in decision making and not be treated as brain dead voting fodder. SF have absorbed this approach in the North, as have the DUP, hence their success. I dont believe the old traditional parties in the south are capable of reforming themselves, as there no real ideaological or politiical differences between, they are burnt out and lack vision. All that maintains them is stroke politics over petty parish pump issues, and the need to keep their electorates misinformed and grateful for small favours

[magpie seanie]

Corrupt societies produce corrupt politicians. At the root of all the problems is the Irish disease of clientelism. This provides the platform for the bull-shitting politicians to appear to be doing something, when in fact they are doing nothing. If you are entitled to a service or benefit by virtue of your circumstances or citizenship you do not need the aid of a con-man to obtain it. An honest politician will not attempt to bribe you with stupid promises, that are only intended to make you feel disempowered. He will empower you and your community by listening, determining your needs and advising you are the community how best to organise your campaign plan. In this way he will empower individuals and communities, encourage them to employ their talents, become involved in decision making and not be treated as brain dead voting fodder. SF have absorbed this approach in the North, as have the DUP, hence their success. I dont believe the old traditional parties in the south are capable of reforming themselves, as there no real ideaological or politiical differences between, they are burnt out and lack vision. All that maintains them is stroke politics over petty parish pump issues, and the need to keep their electorates misinformed and grateful for small favours

Well said. The bit in bold is key.

[magpie seanie]

Saw a few candidates for a party called Fís Nua in the local and Euro elections. Looked at their website and there's a serious amount of sense on it. That's probably why we've heard very little of them.

[AZOffaly]

Don't know about that Seanie. I looked at it, and it looks a bit 'crusty' for me. Point one of their manifesto is:

Move the monetary system away from a debt structure that requires continuous economic growth with a government supported national network of local currencies.

So you'll have the Tipperary tinfoil now being used to buy goods from the Sligo, where it will be converted into the local joycian currency.

[magpie seanie]

Don't know about that Seanie. I looked at it, and it looks a bit 'crusty' for me. Point one of their manifesto is:

Move the monetary system away from a debt structure that requires continuous economic growth with a government supported national network of local currencies.

So you'll have the Tipperary tinfoil now being used to buy goods from the Sligo, where it will be converted into the local joycian currency.

I didn't see that anywhere although I did see a few similar bit of waffle. There is some nonsense but on the big issues they are saying the right things.

Still, you're probably happy enough with the way things are if being "a bit crusty" turns you off more than being systemically corrupt.

[AZOffaly]

Happier than being run by airy fairy pie in the sky stuff like local currencies, yes.

Lookit, it's easy to say 'The people should not have to support the banks', but HOW? Put something concrete in front of me, not emotive statements that are self evident in an ideal world. These guys are talking about reforming society, and seem to be basing all of it on some flimsy utopian communist idea.

[magpie seanie]

Happier than being run by airy fairy pie in the sky stuff like local currencies, yes.

Lookit, it's easy to say 'The people should not have to support the banks', but HOW? Put something concrete in front of me, not emotive statements that are self evident in an ideal world. These guys are talking about reforming society, and seem to be basing all of it on some flimsy utopian communist idea.

At least it's an idea that's their own and is underpinned by fairness. It's at least a good start.

[AZOffaly]

Yeah. I don't mean to come across too harsh on them, and maybe you need a bit of looney in you to make a difference, but I just get leery when I see stuff like that. In Offaly the currency will be turf, and we'll have open borders with Kildare and Roscommon

Some of the things I do like the sound of, but again how do we as a country afford it? It's a societal and economic revolution. Maybe that's what's needed, but you need more than a few soundbites on a page.

In the interest of fairness, what I do like out of their 'Prosperity Agenda'

- Introduce a Basic Income that guarantees a sufficient income to each individual irrespective of personal circumstances, so that everyone can afford food and shelter and other daily needs. The Basic Income payment is tax free and all other income is taxed.  Q- At what rate? Are they punishing people who try to make money? I do like the basic income concept though.

- Abolish the Universal Social Charge, reduce VAT and support broadly progressive tax systems, with bands, to protect workers from inflation and avoid taxation by stealth. Q - Taxes raise money for other initiatives (including presumably the Basic Income) so where will this money come from? You can't abolish all tax and spend more money.

- Tax incentives to support and encourage home-grown SMEs, Co-operatives, and local indigenous industries and crafts persons who produce for both the home market and export

- With over three hundred thousand dwellings unoccupied in the state this can provide and ensure the delivery of 30,000 social and affordable housing units a year until the housing waiting lists are cleared.

- Positive incentives and home improvement grant schemes to encourage sustainable energy production and energy and water conservation measures.

- No taxation on water and opposition to water metres. No water privatisation.

- Support for a low carbon economy and renewable energy including solar power, small scale and non-intrusive on-shore wind power, offshore wind power, local biomass production and combined heat and power production.

- Work to eliminate corruption by supporting whistleblowers and implementing citizens recall so that MEPs, TDs and councillors who do not implement their election pledges can be removed from office at any time. I love this idea!

they have a lot of other stuff which I think is madness, and some stuff which, as I've said, reads great but I'd like to see the math behind it. Hard to lower taxes, and provide free healthcare to all,  and 24 hour PCFs with no money.

[magpie seanie]

Taking back our oil and gas is a good help at paying bills and repudiating the bank debt would also help.

[AZOffaly]

what form would 'repudiation' of the bank debt take?

[magpie seanie]

"f**k off, we're not paying it because it is not our debt to pay" - that would be about the size of it.

[Hound]

Taking back our oil and gas is a good help at paying bills and repudiating the bank debt would also help.

By taking back our oil and gas, do you mean just leaving it in the ground, or the Irish taxpayer fundings billions in expenditure to try and find and extract it?

[AZOffaly]

"f**k off, we're not paying it because it is not our debt to pay" - that would be about the size of it.

Right. And that would work how?