The IRISH RUGBY thread

[JoG2]

It's gas that some people here think a rugby Test Match is somehow equivalent to a soccer friendly or GAA challenge match.
Why would you post on a thread about something you know nothing about when all you achieve is to highlight your complete ignorance?!

Just because rugby (and cricket, which is similar) Test Matches are meaningless to you, because you lack the basic comprehension to understand the sport, does not mean they are meaningless!

I've never heard a proper explanation of the difference beyond "they just are"

Me either. I get that its one of the best teams in the world etc and it was a fine performance. BUT - there are no trophies, no medals, the team wasnt crowned as champions of anything. Calling it a "test" match (whatever that is supposed to mean) doesn't change those facts no matter what any of the D4 brigade tell you. Do the English or French spend as much time blowing about winning these glorified challenge games as in Ireland?

Do rugby supporters on here spend as much time talking about rugby than you pair?

[seafoid]

It has more prestige ,but New Zealand were on the beer during the week. They had played 14 International since June while Ireland had played 4. They were coming to Europe on.a bit of a wind down.

Ireland beat the All Blacks in 16 and 18.and flopped where it mattered against Japan at the WC.

The reason they were beaten at the RWC was because they were predictable. They need to work on this for next time.

Hence showing your hand this far out from a WC may be not the wisest thing to do, but no one goes out not to give it their all and hence why I think Saturdays performance was pleasing in that not only did Ireland dominate the ball in a way they've never done against any AB side, they weren't hanging on and if anything the 9 point win didn't tell the true tale of the dominance Ireland had.

One thing of concern is Irelands inability to come away with points when camped on the try line. The AB defence was superb but there's only so much crashing over the line you can do before accepting it's futile and a bit more width out back could have helped. Lowe's try came from sucking in AB defenders only for a few quick passes out the back putting Lowe in space to finish in the other corner.
More of that please.

O'Mahoney is a penalty giving away machine but he's on that edge that McCaw used to inhabit and must be a pain for the opposition, Farrell has found he's the man for the last 10 minutes. Beirne also better coming in fresh rather than starting and although I think he's better than Henderson in the round, Henderson can hammer away for 50 odd minutes before introducing Beirne..

Nice to see Doris going so well after all his concussion woes.

They need to get more out of incursions into the AB 22.
The AB 2013 vintage  were very like Kilkenny of the time . They were inside Ireland's head. Everyone knew they were going to win. Same as 2012 hurling final.
Now is different. What Ireland learn from now until the RWC is what will count.

[NAG1]

It has more prestige ,but New Zealand were on the beer during the week. They had played 14 International since June while Ireland had played 4. They were coming to Europe on.a bit of a wind down.

Ireland beat the All Blacks in 16 and 18.and flopped where it mattered against Japan at the WC.

The reason they were beaten at the RWC was because they were predictable. They need to work on this for next time.

Hence showing your hand this far out from a WC may be not the wisest thing to do, but no one goes out not to give it their all and hence why I think Saturdays performance was pleasing in that not only did Ireland dominate the ball in a way they've never done against any AB side, they weren't hanging on and if anything the 9 point win didn't tell the true tale of the dominance Ireland had.

One thing of concern is Irelands inability to come away with points when camped on the try line. The AB defence was superb but there's only so much crashing over the line you can do before accepting it's futile and a bit more width out back could have helped. Lowe's try came from sucking in AB defenders only for a few quick passes out the back putting Lowe in space to finish in the other corner.
More of that please.

O'Mahoney is a penalty giving away machine but he's on that edge that McCaw used to inhabit and must be a pain for the opposition, Farrell has found he's the man for the last 10 minutes. Beirne also better coming in fresh rather than starting and although I think he's better than Henderson in the round, Henderson can hammer away for 50 odd minutes before introducing Beirne..

Nice to see Doris going so well after all his concussion woes.

They need to get more out of incursions into the AB 22.
The AB 2013 vintage  were very like Kilkenny of the time . They were inside Ireland's head. Everyone knew they were going to win. Same as 2012 hurling final.
Now is different. What Ireland learn from now until the RWC is what will count.

No it won't exactly the same thing will happen again, they will get to the world cup and without the comfort of playing at home will do what they have done before. When the level goes up at WC time they just can't live with it.
AB been on a majorly long tour and the freshness of the Irish team showed through clearly.

Great win in a friendly game.

[Milltown Row2]

I've a good friend who has played at Ulster level, he's chairman of a Belfast club, his son was on under 17 Ulster squads, he's got a fair knowledge of the game and what it represents.

In terms of competition the World cup followed by the six nations,  they are the main tournaments to judge the international team, but by the same token the Autumn internationals are very big in the rugby calendar as they give the international teams a chance to play the southern hemisphere teams and give them an indication of where they are at.

Some will call in a friendly, when they step out on to that pitch it doesn't look friendly at all

[Don Cockburn]

The downside of professionalism is that New Zealand come up too often nowadays.
Years ago it was a hallmark occasion for the All Blacks to come on tour and play in Ireland.

[johnnycool]

I've a good friend who has played at Ulster level, he's chairman of a Belfast club, his son was on under 17 Ulster squads, he's got a fair knowledge of the game and what it represents.

In terms of competition the World cup followed by the six nations,  they are the main tournaments to judge the international team, but by the same token the Autumn internationals are very big in the rugby calendar as they give the international teams a chance to play the southern hemisphere teams and give them an indication of where they are at.

Some will call in a friendly, when they step out on to that pitch it doesn't look friendly at all

The three tests down in NZ in the summer will be interesting. If Ireland can put a performance or two in there then that'll mean more to me TBH

[seafoid]

The downside of professionalism is that New Zealand come up too often nowadays.
Years ago it was a hallmark occasion for the All Blacks to come on tour and play in Ireland.

The money in rugby union is in the Northern Hemisphere.
NZ wouldn't be fluirseach

[screenexile]

I've a good friend who has played at Ulster level, he's chairman of a Belfast club, his son was on under 17 Ulster squads, he's got a fair knowledge of the game and what it represents.

In terms of competition the World cup followed by the six nations,  they are the main tournaments to judge the international team, but by the same token the Autumn internationals are very big in the rugby calendar as they give the international teams a chance to play the southern hemisphere teams and give them an indication of where they are at.

Some will call in a friendly, when they step out on to that pitch it doesn't look friendly at all

The three tests down in NZ in the summer will be interesting. If Ireland can put a performance or two in there then that'll mean more to me TBH

Definitely! Go down there after a long season and beat them on their own patch is a much bigger victory than the one on Saturday.

[tiempo]

I've a good friend who has played at Ulster level, he's chairman of a Belfast club, his son was on under 17 Ulster squads, he's got a fair knowledge of the game and what it represents.

In terms of competition the World cup followed by the six nations,  they are the main tournaments to judge the international team, but by the same token the Autumn internationals are very big in the rugby calendar as they give the international teams a chance to play the southern hemisphere teams and give them an indication of where they are at.

Some will call in a friendly, when they step out on to that pitch it doesn't look friendly at all

The three tests down in NZ in the summer will be interesting. If Ireland can put a performance or two in there then that'll mean more to me TBH

They'll get smashed to bits at the end of a grueling 6 nations and long domestic season, same as who NZ were vulnerable at the weekend, Ireland a long way off beating NZ in a WC

[seafoid]

I've a good friend who has played at Ulster level, he's chairman of a Belfast club, his son was on under 17 Ulster squads, he's got a fair knowledge of the game and what it represents.

In terms of competition the World cup followed by the six nations,  they are the main tournaments to judge the international team, but by the same token the Autumn internationals are very big in the rugby calendar as they give the international teams a chance to play the southern hemisphere teams and give them an indication of where they are at.

Some will call in a friendly, when they step out on to that pitch it doesn't look friendly at all

NZ have 50%more registered players
https://lastwordonsports.com/rugby/2020/07/14/top-20-rugby-union-countries-registered-players/

The three tests down in NZ in the summer will be interesting. If Ireland can put a performance or two in there then that'll mean more to me TBH

They'll get smashed to bits at the end of a grueling 6 nations and long domestic season, same as who NZ were vulnerable at the weekend, Ireland a long way off beating NZ in a WC

[seafoid]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azXJwJEA4B8

[Estimator]

Ireland team to play Argentina.
4 Changes -
Out: Aki, Conway, Sexton, JGP
In: Baloucoune, Henshaw, Carbery, Murray

Ireland: Keenan; Baloucoune, Ringrose, Henshaw, Lowe; Carbery, Murray; Porter, Kelleher, Furlong, Henderson, Ryan; Doris, van der Flier, Conan.

Replacements: Sheehan, Healy, O'Toole, Beirne, O'Mahony, Casey, Byrne, Earls.

[Itchy]

Over the past three weeks following his death in a road accident, it was made clearer that former Ireland secondrow Davy Tweed was much more than the bigoted museum piece most of us believed him to be.

The former international rugby player, who opened his short, late career in a Five Nations match against France in 1995 and also played with Ireland in that year's World Cup, was once the demonstration model for rugby as a sport that could cross divides.

We give you Tweedy, a divisive and graceless promoter of a certain kind of Loyalism. In the neutral space of sport he was the oversized cartoon character, who sold his bigotry as a kind of cultural asset. So, they put him in the deplorable box and marked it "Larger than life".

Most of the Irish rugby players from the North did not bring their politics across the Border and most of the southern players did not bring their politics into the changing room. Tweed did. Stamped on his arse apparently.

But much like the Orange Parade that peacefully takes place in Donegal's Rossnowlagh each year, the giant secondrow posed no threat. Dublin was a million July marches from Ballymena and Tweed was given a pass to peacefully roam.

But sport does love a fresh face and the oldest-ever Irish debutant at 35 years old had quite a ring. Such a personal tragedy it must have been then that the late call-up to his only Rugby World Cup had the misfortune to be timed for South Africa in 1995, a year after Apartheid ended.

A country that knew how to properly segregate, he would have enjoyed such a rich cultural gain had the tournament come a decade earlier as a lad in his 20s.

What people didn't know was that while the then proud DUP man was scrumming down in the green of Ireland and the white of Ulster, his violating girls between the age of eight and 11 years old had already taken off.

Learn more

He would also demonstrate a revulsion for the mass-goers at Harryville's Our Lady's church, where he became a key figure in a particularly nasty piece of sectarian conflict.

In 2013, his "larger than lifeness" would catch up with him but not his shamelessness. Sentenced to eight years for a catalogue of child abuse, he smiled and waved in Downpatrick Crown Court. The big man he was.

Indecent assault

Bound for Maghaberry prison, the conviction details were 13 counts of abuse including indecent assault and gross indecency with a child. Victim impacts, which were detailed in court, disclosed that one of the girls involved had attempted suicide.

As his political career in the DUP and then the Traditional Unionist Voice (TUV) were taking a hit along with his personal freedoms, from a safe distance Tweed's wife Margaret found voice to recount the profoundly violent presence he had been during their 23-year relationship.

In the two decades they spent together before the church-going Christian left their home in 2007 after the allegations of sexual assault first arose, she suffered sustained beatings and was threatened with loyalist paramilitary violence.

"The beatings started from the year dot," she said. "He would beat me black and blue."

When he died three weeks ago, the politicians took their cue and spoke of a community man.

North Antrim MP Ian Paisley said: "To his family I send my condolences and heartfelt prayers at what must be an unimaginably heartbreaking time for them."

Maybe ask Margaret.

Leader of the TUV, the party that characterised Irish as a "leprechaun language" on its website, Jim Allister said: "Davy, a larger than life character, was widely known across North Antrim and further afield. I wish to express my deepest sympathy to his grieving family at this very difficult time."

Maybe ask Victoria.

DUP MLA Mervyn Storey described Mr Tweed as "a larger-than-life character" adding: "I have known Davy and his family most of my life and cannot begin to imagine the sorrow his family have been plunged into."

Maybe ask Catherine Alexandra.

Not for the first time, the suits couldn't read the room. The unimaginable sorrow, not entirely, his grieving family, not really. Two of his daughters, Victoria and Catherine Alexandra waived their right to anonymity and revealed that their father had also been sexually and physically assaulting them from as far back as when they were six years old.

Victoria, the second youngest of his four children, went to the police and made a statement but did not feel strong enough to follow through to court. When Tweed went to prison she applied for a visit so she could ask him questions. He turned her down.

The sorrow and grief were there alright, but only when the case was quashed on a technicality after Tweed walked after four years in prison. She made that perfectly clear.

"It was over the tiniest legal loophole not because he was innocent," she said.

Rugby is a legacy game and one that stands for values. We know that because we were told so in 2018 when the governing body put out a statement.

"The Irish Rugby Football Union and Ulster Rugby acknowledge our responsibility and commitment to the core values of the game – respect, inclusivity and integrity." And the committed Christian should not be denied that.

Davy Tweed: Secondrow. Four caps. Paedophile. Wife beater. Bigot.

[quit yo jibbajabba]

When your wains call you the Tweedophile i think its fair to say things havent went well

[Hound]

Ireland team to play Argentina.
4 Changes -
Out: Aki, Conway, Sexton, JGP
In: Baloucoune, Henshaw, Carbery, Murray

Ireland: Keenan; Baloucoune, Ringrose, Henshaw, Lowe; Carbery, Murray; Porter, Kelleher, Furlong, Henderson, Ryan; Doris, van der Flier, Conan.

Replacements: Sheehan, Healy, O'Toole, Beirne, O'Mahony, Casey, Byrne, Earls.

Jeez, I thought there was going to be wholesale changes. Sorry now that I put a tenner on the argies at 5/1 😝

Hopefully Baloucoune goes well, seems to be an exciting prospect. From Enniskillen I see.