Author Topic: How strong is Ulster compared to the other provinces?  (Read 4375 times)

Franko

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Re: How strong is Ulster compared to the other provinces?
« Reply #45 on: August 23, 2022, 11:22:23 PM »
They did beat Fermanagh

Jesus,  what is it about Derry and Armagh wans. Obsessed with Tyrone. Always. Rent Free.

Lol I forgot about Fermanagh… you got me Tyrone are definitely rated the best team in Ulster now 😂😂

Lol at the shape of this discussion

Looking forward to starting back at school lads?

yellowcard

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Re: How strong is Ulster compared to the other provinces?
« Reply #46 on: August 24, 2022, 11:05:00 AM »
Tyrone are no. 1 in Ulster and 2 in Ireland. They just had the 20% new champions tax.
The 8 All-Ireland winning Dublin footballers, the current Limerick hurlers and Cody with 11 All-Irelands couldn't retain the an All-Ireland as new champions, so Tyrone were never going to either. Kerry will have a similar tax next year which puts Tyrone front and central to win the All-Ireland. The starting XV v Mayo would already put them in the frame but throw in two Canavans and a fit McShane and they'd be well ahead of the possé.
McShane getting fully fit is a big ask though. He must be the oldest 26 year old around!

Champions tax, I've heard it all now! Currently they are not number 2 in Ulster never mind Ireland. Players like McShane and McKenna have flattered to deceive. McShane has not been the same player since he was given the package to stay at home and Darragh Canavan has produced little at county level to suggest he can nail down a place for Tyrone never mind make a difference. The younger Canavan looks like a good player but is still a few years away from making an impact at senior level. Harte and Donnelly and probably a few others have their best days behind them whilst they have already lost a good few squad players since winning the AI title. It doesn't seem like a happy, motivated camp to me. I don't think even the most ardent of Tyrone fan would claim that they are number 2 in Ireland. 

twohands!!!

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Re: How strong is Ulster compared to the other provinces?
« Reply #47 on: August 24, 2022, 11:18:28 AM »
Tyrone are no. 1 in Ulster and 2 in Ireland. They just had the 20% new champions tax.
The 8 All-Ireland winning Dublin footballers, the current Limerick hurlers and Cody with 11 All-Irelands couldn't retain the an All-Ireland as new champions, so Tyrone were never going to either. Kerry will have a similar tax next year which puts Tyrone front and central to win the All-Ireland. The starting XV v Mayo would already put them in the frame but throw in two Canavans and a fit McShane and they'd be well ahead of the possé.
McShane getting fully fit is a big ask though. He must be the oldest 26 year old around!

Champions tax, I've heard it all now! Currently they are not number 2 in Ulster never mind Ireland. Players like McShane and McKenna have flattered to deceive. McShane has not been the same player since he was given the package to stay at home and Darragh Canavan has produced little at county level to suggest he can nail down a place for Tyrone never mind make a difference. The younger Canavan looks like a good player but is still a few years away from making an impact at senior level. Harte and Donnelly and probably a few others have their best days behind them whilst they have already lost a good few squad players since winning the AI title. It doesn't seem like a happy, motivated camp to me. I don't think even the most ardent of Tyrone fan would claim that they are number 2 in Ireland.

On the idea of a champions tax, I'm convinced that the split-season is going to help teams retain Sam.
I think the much longer gap between the final and being allowed start collective training/the start of the league will be a massive help for whoever is champion.

yellowcard

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Re: How strong is Ulster compared to the other provinces?
« Reply #48 on: August 24, 2022, 11:29:54 AM »
Tyrone are no. 1 in Ulster and 2 in Ireland. They just had the 20% new champions tax.
The 8 All-Ireland winning Dublin footballers, the current Limerick hurlers and Cody with 11 All-Irelands couldn't retain the an All-Ireland as new champions, so Tyrone were never going to either. Kerry will have a similar tax next year which puts Tyrone front and central to win the All-Ireland. The starting XV v Mayo would already put them in the frame but throw in two Canavans and a fit McShane and they'd be well ahead of the possé.
McShane getting fully fit is a big ask though. He must be the oldest 26 year old around!

Champions tax, I've heard it all now! Currently they are not number 2 in Ulster never mind Ireland. Players like McShane and McKenna have flattered to deceive. McShane has not been the same player since he was given the package to stay at home and Darragh Canavan has produced little at county level to suggest he can nail down a place for Tyrone never mind make a difference. The younger Canavan looks like a good player but is still a few years away from making an impact at senior level. Harte and Donnelly and probably a few others have their best days behind them whilst they have already lost a good few squad players since winning the AI title. It doesn't seem like a happy, motivated camp to me. I don't think even the most ardent of Tyrone fan would claim that they are number 2 in Ireland.

On the idea of a champions tax, I'm convinced that the split-season is going to help teams retain Sam.
I think the much longer gap between the final and being allowed start collective training/the start of the league will be a massive help for whoever is champion.

I would agree on that. More recuperative time for players to rest up both mentally and physically. Letting them enjoy their down time and the reduced pressure of the club season can only be a good thing for players and also help prolong playing careers which had been shortening gradually.

Watching successful lads like McCaffrey and Mannion seeking time out of the game in their mid 20s due to the workload was becoming almost normal. The biggest challenge for lower ranked counties is to retain a core group of players that they can build something with and the split season can only help with that too.

trueblue1234

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Re: How strong is Ulster compared to the other provinces?
« Reply #49 on: August 24, 2022, 11:44:42 AM »
Tyrone are no. 1 in Ulster and 2 in Ireland. They just had the 20% new champions tax.
The 8 All-Ireland winning Dublin footballers, the current Limerick hurlers and Cody with 11 All-Irelands couldn't retain the an All-Ireland as new champions, so Tyrone were never going to either. Kerry will have a similar tax next year which puts Tyrone front and central to win the All-Ireland. The starting XV v Mayo would already put them in the frame but throw in two Canavans and a fit McShane and they'd be well ahead of the possé.
McShane getting fully fit is a big ask though. He must be the oldest 26 year old around!

Champions tax, I've heard it all now! Currently they are not number 2 in Ulster never mind Ireland. Players like McShane and McKenna have flattered to deceive. McShane has not been the same player since he was given the package to stay at home and Darragh Canavan has produced little at county level to suggest he can nail down a place for Tyrone never mind make a difference. The younger Canavan looks like a good player but is still a few years away from making an impact at senior level. Harte and Donnelly and probably a few others have their best days behind them whilst they have already lost a good few squad players since winning the AI title. It doesn't seem like a happy, motivated camp to me. I don't think even the most ardent of Tyrone fan would claim that they are number 2 in Ireland.

To be fair Blanketattack is one of the only posters on this thread without skin in the game and properly unbiased. You can make an argument to suit the narrative you want to project to favour Tyrone, Armagh, Derry etc. I’d still be placing any money for Ulster on Tyrone because in my view I think they will bounce back an return to their pre 2022 form of making the semi’s most years. They’ve got that longer term track record plus some strong under age coming through. It’s hardly surprising that posters will rate the teams differently.
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tonto1888

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Re: How strong is Ulster compared to the other provinces?
« Reply #50 on: August 24, 2022, 01:05:04 PM »
Tyrone are no. 1 in Ulster and 2 in Ireland. They just had the 20% new champions tax.
The 8 All-Ireland winning Dublin footballers, the current Limerick hurlers and Cody with 11 All-Irelands couldn't retain the an All-Ireland as new champions, so Tyrone were never going to either. Kerry will have a similar tax next year which puts Tyrone front and central to win the All-Ireland. The starting XV v Mayo would already put them in the frame but throw in two Canavans and a fit McShane and they'd be well ahead of the possé.
McShane getting fully fit is a big ask though. He must be the oldest 26 year old around!

Champions tax, I've heard it all now! Currently they are not number 2 in Ulster never mind Ireland. Players like McShane and McKenna have flattered to deceive. McShane has not been the same player since he was given the package to stay at home and Darragh Canavan has produced little at county level to suggest he can nail down a place for Tyrone never mind make a difference. The younger Canavan looks like a good player but is still a few years away from making an impact at senior level. Harte and Donnelly and probably a few others have their best days behind them whilst they have already lost a good few squad players since winning the AI title. It doesn't seem like a happy, motivated camp to me. I don't think even the most ardent of Tyrone fan would claim that they are number 2 in Ireland.

To be fair Blanketattack is one of the only posters on this thread without skin in the game and properly unbiased. You can make an argument to suit the narrative you want to project to favour Tyrone, Armagh, Derry etc. I’d still be placing any money for Ulster on Tyrone because in my view I think they will bounce back an return to their pre 2022 form of making the semi’s most years. They’ve got that longer term track record plus some strong under age coming through. It’s hardly surprising that posters will rate the teams differently.

It wouldn't surprise me if they won Ulster and made the AISF/AIF next year. However, It wouldn't overly surprise me if they had a similar year to this one

seafoid

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Re: How strong is Ulster compared to the other provinces?
« Reply #51 on: August 28, 2022, 08:08:45 AM »
The challenge for both Connacht and Ulster is to reduce the proportion of all Irelands won by Kerry and Dublin. They have won more than half of the Sams over the last 2 decades.
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Re: How strong is Ulster compared to the other provinces?
« Reply #52 on: August 28, 2022, 10:50:57 AM »
90s was the only decade in in the last 50 years that Kerry and Dublin didn't win a majority of Sams.
That great decade saw Down 2 Meath 2 Galway, Derry, Donegal, Kerry, Cork, Dublin 1 each.
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seafoid

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Re: How strong is Ulster compared to the other provinces?
« Reply #53 on: August 28, 2022, 12:37:03 PM »
90s was the only decade in in the last 50 years that Kerry and Dublin didn't win a majority of Sams.
That great decade saw Down 2 Meath 2 Galway, Derry, Donegal, Kerry, Cork, Dublin 1 each.

Why leave out the 60s when the hoors only got 3 ?
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armaghniac

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Re: How strong is Ulster compared to the other provinces?
« Reply #54 on: August 28, 2022, 07:51:38 PM »
Because the 60s are more than 50 years ago? Only the likes of Orior can remember them days.
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seafoid

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Re: How strong is Ulster compared to the other provinces?
« Reply #55 on: August 29, 2022, 05:12:35 AM »
Because the 60s are more than 50 years ago? Only the likes of Orior can remember them days.
50 years is arbitrary

2000-2009 had 1 Galway, 1 Amagh , 3 Tyrone and 5 Kerry.
50/50 isn't bad
The following decade had 1 Cork 1 donegal 1 Kerry and 7 Dublin.
The collapse of Meath is significant.
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Main Street

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Re: How strong is Ulster compared to the other provinces?
« Reply #57 on: August 31, 2022, 01:34:44 AM »
Tyrone are no. 1 in Ulster and 2 in Ireland. They just had the 20% new champions tax.
The 8 All-Ireland winning Dublin footballers, the current Limerick hurlers and Cody with 11 All-Irelands couldn't retain the an All-Ireland as new champions, so Tyrone were never going to either. Kerry will have a similar tax next year which puts Tyrone front and central to win the All-Ireland. The starting XV v Mayo would already put them in the frame but throw in two Canavans and a fit McShane and they'd be well ahead of the possé.
McShane getting fully fit is a big ask though. He must be the oldest 26 year old around!

Champions tax, I've heard it all now! Currently they are not number 2 in Ulster never mind Ireland. Players like McShane and McKenna have flattered to deceive. McShane has not been the same player since he was given the package to stay at home and Darragh Canavan has produced little at county level to suggest he can nail down a place for Tyrone never mind make a difference. The younger Canavan looks like a good player but is still a few years away from making an impact at senior level. Harte and Donnelly and probably a few others have their best days behind them whilst they have already lost a good few squad players since winning the AI title. It doesn't seem like a happy, motivated camp to me. I don't think even the most ardent of Tyrone fan would claim that they are number 2 in Ireland.

To be fair Blanketattack is one of the only posters on this thread without skin in the game and properly unbiased. You can make an argument to suit the narrative you want to project to favour Tyrone, Armagh, Derry etc. I’d still be placing any money for Ulster on Tyrone because in my view I think they will bounce back an return to their pre 2022 form of making the semi’s most years. They’ve got that longer term track record plus some strong under age coming through. It’s hardly surprising that posters will rate the teams differently.
It may well be that Blanket Attack is unbiased, without skin in the game, but in itself that does not confer authority onto his claim "Tyrone are no.1 in Ulster and 2 in Ireland".
Possibly Tyrone might reach that spot next year, but as it stands now they are not nr. 1&2.  You can't credibly claim a team is  currently nr. 1&2  based on a speculation about the glory days of future performances. :)

trueblue1234

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Re: How strong is Ulster compared to the other provinces?
« Reply #58 on: August 31, 2022, 10:53:57 AM »
Tyrone are no. 1 in Ulster and 2 in Ireland. They just had the 20% new champions tax.
The 8 All-Ireland winning Dublin footballers, the current Limerick hurlers and Cody with 11 All-Irelands couldn't retain the an All-Ireland as new champions, so Tyrone were never going to either. Kerry will have a similar tax next year which puts Tyrone front and central to win the All-Ireland. The starting XV v Mayo would already put them in the frame but throw in two Canavans and a fit McShane and they'd be well ahead of the possé.
McShane getting fully fit is a big ask though. He must be the oldest 26 year old around!

Champions tax, I've heard it all now! Currently they are not number 2 in Ulster never mind Ireland. Players like McShane and McKenna have flattered to deceive. McShane has not been the same player since he was given the package to stay at home and Darragh Canavan has produced little at county level to suggest he can nail down a place for Tyrone never mind make a difference. The younger Canavan looks like a good player but is still a few years away from making an impact at senior level. Harte and Donnelly and probably a few others have their best days behind them whilst they have already lost a good few squad players since winning the AI title. It doesn't seem like a happy, motivated camp to me. I don't think even the most ardent of Tyrone fan would claim that they are number 2 in Ireland.

To be fair Blanketattack is one of the only posters on this thread without skin in the game and properly unbiased. You can make an argument to suit the narrative you want to project to favour Tyrone, Armagh, Derry etc. I’d still be placing any money for Ulster on Tyrone because in my view I think they will bounce back an return to their pre 2022 form of making the semi’s most years. They’ve got that longer term track record plus some strong under age coming through. It’s hardly surprising that posters will rate the teams differently.
It may well be that Blanket Attack is unbiased, without skin in the game, but in itself that does not confer authority onto his claim "Tyrone are no.1 in Ulster and 2 in Ireland".
Possibly Tyrone might reach that spot next year, but as it stands now they are not nr. 1&2.  You can't credibly claim a team is  currently nr. 1&2  based on a speculation about the glory days of future performances. :)

No but it can infer he isn’t tainted with heart ruling the head. Armagh and Derry have both been in the doldrums so Its not surprising that they will be hoping that this year is a changing of the guards. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to use a few years as a yard stick for speculation. One year might throw up the odd outlier (fingers crossed in Derry’s case).  It might not either, and could point to the start of a successful run. But either way they’re only opinions.
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