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How are teams relegated to Intermediate and Junior championships in Cavan? I understand winning is the pathway to the level above, but how do you go about going down?

1 up 1 down. Essentially the bottom 4 in the group stages play off in relegation semi finals, and then losers play relegation final when the Championship quarters, semi etc are ongoing. So overall loser relegated and replaced by below Championship winner. You have to win to move up, lose to move down

Only exception to this is when rejigging numbers, and the odd year you relegate 2 and so on. Covid also messed it here when none were relegated in 2020, but had a promotion, so 2 were relegated in 2021 and so on to rejig numbers across the 3 Championships

Your league is a farce so and handy for outside managers to make a few bob. Mess about in the league and win an odd game in champ and your grand.

Lose a few games in Monaghan and Tyrone in the league and your gone,you get found out pretty quick.

Yes, mostly. Not for the everyday club player, but mostly. Split season the issue here overall. Glad you've finally caught up

Managers still lose their jobs. Might not be as valued, but you can't lose all your games either. My own team cut their manager mid League last season.

So the league is juat a waste of time so. What's tbe point of lads playing if no interest in it.

Being a club manager in Cavan must be handy money...and no pressure.

There is interest in it, just a much lesser competition and a great chance for lads on the fringes to exposure to a higher level in a club with second team, or for bringing young lads through.

I'd argue taking the league so seriously is a gimmick managers use to rip clubs off and charge more for their services with all the additional training and fitness stats. You cannot expect club players to be at peak from March to October. So I'd take it with a pinch of salt how tough the leagues are or at least how practical it is from a player welfare POV.

Whatever little joy is left in the club game is slowly being sucked away completely by these "professional" managerial setups and they always know how to charge regardless of results. Northern managers are notorious for it and they're picking up plenty of work in Cavan. Indeed in Dreadnought's own club it was a northern duo who unceremoniously got the gate. Seriously ignorant pair completely stuck up their own holes and extremely detrimental to player morale and development. 

The League is hardly a friendly competition. Players who don't perform will not be in contention for a championship start. Winning a league is a nice feather for a manager so long as he doesn't flop come championship. Same as performing poorly in the league will either be forgiven if you go well in championship, or it will be used as a stick to further beat a manager with if he also performs poorly come championship. But this is all old news to any GAA fan. I think some on here are being deliberately disingenuous. 

And just on the unavailability of county players for league. "County player" is a bit of a stretch. Lads not within an ass's roar of a match day panel, basically anyone sniffing around a county panel will be kicked off it if they play club league. This is something I completely and utterly disagree with and really annoys me but was introduced by, funnily enough a Tyrone man and his Monaghan side kick. Then the new man after them kept it going.

[By any league metric Arva are a div 2 side.]

I mentioned it before, but the biggest issue seems to be they had played, and maintained their division 1 league status, and played in a junior championship. 

Had it been intermediate championship they had won, I would say people, like myself, could reconcile more with that. 

This is coming from my own point of view where, in Armagh, the leagues and championships are linked, the idea of a senior league team entering a junior championship would seem preposterous, and the outcome would be inevitable. 

Just one caveat there though. By any league metric Arva are a div 2 side. It was a championship style one game knockout kept them there when they were completely adrift of everyone. So you absolutely cannot call them a senior side. That is completely disingenuous.

Elaborate?

Finished rock bottom of league. In any league scenario this should mean relegation.

But they were a (albeit struggling) division 1 team in 2023 and played junior championship.

Aye generally it does, in this case it didn't. 

You can't argue that by all conceivable metrics they are a division 2 team based on their final league position, when the same county board that allowed them to play junior championship also allowed them the chance to stay in division 1 with a relegation playoff. 

If I'm arguing anything at all it's that you can't argue by all conceivable metrics that they are a div1/senior side based on a knockout playoff ad hoc format to league, when the same knockout championship proper format has kept them Junior. 

[By any league metric Arva are a div 2 side.]

I mentioned it before, but the biggest issue seems to be they had played, and maintained their division 1 league status, and played in a junior championship. 

Had it been intermediate championship they had won, I would say people, like myself, could reconcile more with that. 

This is coming from my own point of view where, in Armagh, the leagues and championships are linked, the idea of a senior league team entering a junior championship would seem preposterous, and the outcome would be inevitable. 

Just one caveat there though. By any league metric Arva are a div 2 side. It was a championship style one game knockout kept them there when they were completely adrift of everyone. So you absolutely cannot call them a senior side. That is completely disingenuous.

Elaborate?

Finished rock bottom of league. In any league scenario this should mean relegation.

But they were a (albeit struggling) division 1 team in 2023 and played junior championship.

Because they struggled to win Junior for long enough.

[It the same thing now in GAA at all levels]

you could stop the whole argument about intermediate and junior championships by scrapping them and  just giving the intermediate and junior  champions a place in the county's  senior championships so there is a pathway for them to be provincial or all ireland champions.

Intermediate champions already get a place (if they want it) in the counties senior championship I'd imagine in most counties

The competition serves up a great carrot, to win a final at Croke park with your teammates

People growing up as kids playing soccer in the streets, wanted to score the winner in the FA Cup final at Wembley. It the same thing now in GAA at all levels, scoring the winner at Croke park with your club, parish town or City

No it's not, junior and intermediate aren't fit for purpose

Tell that to Cullyhanna and Arva...

You're not within a country mile of the point

Its fit for purpose with one simple rule, no div 1 teams in intermediate or Junior for that matter and only div 3 or 4 teams can play Junior ..

Whatever way a county runs off its championship is up to them, but no team can enter the all Ireland series based on those simple enough rules, they must nominate a team, even Jimmy McGuinness could understand that set up!

That will encourage teams to actually play at their level ad not 'below'

Cork and Dublin could really mix it up with their A and B championships though, but to be fair to them as a county they haven't, Kerry are just ruining it

If people still have their knickers in a twist over the whole Arva thing then go get the rules changed for the sake of changing them, whatever. They have little to be at.

But that statement is a load of nonsense. Arva's priority would always have been championship. Winning the Junior championship was the only "encouragement" they'd ever have had. Took them a few years because that was their level, they couldn't rise "above" it. Your statement is implying there was something untoward going on, that they somehow designed this situation for unfair advantage. Other posters have implied this on here too. Need a serious bit of cop on.

There's no cop on required. Playing div 1 and playing junior championship is not the norm up and down the country.

All I'm saying is any county can run their own championship whatever way they feel works for them. But, a div 1 league team shouldn't be playing in the provincial championship and beyond. A nominated div 3-4 team that's reached further than a div 2 team and Div 1 team.. 

There's no beef with Cavan or Avra, they've done nowt wrong

I wouldn't be in favour of this but if it gets voted in that's the rules we'll go by.

We operate a 2 up 2 down in league, 1 up 1 down in championship so teams operating in different tiers for both competitions is completely normal for us. League playoffs instead of proper league standings might magnify the quirks at bit e.g as someone said Knockbride will play div1 next year but are still Junior. They finished 3rd in div2 but won a playoff.

I don't see the problem really. Complaining about other counties or team ranked 20 from county A playing team ranked 30 from count B is irrelevant. Counties are not standard units and clubs are not standard units. Absolutely no business comparing div1 in Cavan and say Dublin. AI Senior club championship is completely stacked with only a handful of elites capable of winning. Do we start handicapping some teams to make it "fairer" or just get on with it.
JFC and IFC have a much leveler playing field. So Kerry are strong in it. That's hardly surprising or worrying for a county with a huge GAA tradition and a huge rural population.

[By any league metric Arva are a div 2 side.]

I mentioned it before, but the biggest issue seems to be they had played, and maintained their division 1 league status, and played in a junior championship. 

Had it been intermediate championship they had won, I would say people, like myself, could reconcile more with that. 

This is coming from my own point of view where, in Armagh, the leagues and championships are linked, the idea of a senior league team entering a junior championship would seem preposterous, and the outcome would be inevitable. 

Just one caveat there though. By any league metric Arva are a div 2 side. It was a championship style one game knockout kept them there when they were completely adrift of everyone. So you absolutely cannot call them a senior side. That is completely disingenuous.

Elaborate?

Finished rock bottom of league. In any league scenario this should mean relegation.

I mentioned it before, but the biggest issue seems to be they had played, and maintained their division 1 league status, and played in a junior championship. 

Had it been intermediate championship they had won, I would say people, like myself, could reconcile more with that. 

This is coming from my own point of view where, in Armagh, the leagues and championships are linked, the idea of a senior league team entering a junior championship would seem preposterous, and the outcome would be inevitable. 

Just one caveat there though. By any league metric Arva are a div 2 side. It was a championship style one game knockout kept them there when they were completely adrift of everyone. So you absolutely cannot call them a senior side. That is completely disingenuous.

This is a championship thread. There's some too simple on here think it's a league thread.

[It the same thing now in GAA at all levels]

you could stop the whole argument about intermediate and junior championships by scrapping them and  just giving the intermediate and junior  champions a place in the county's  senior championships so there is a pathway for them to be provincial or all ireland champions.

Intermediate champions already get a place (if they want it) in the counties senior championship I'd imagine in most counties

The competition serves up a great carrot, to win a final at Croke park with your teammates

People growing up as kids playing soccer in the streets, wanted to score the winner in the FA Cup final at Wembley. It the same thing now in GAA at all levels, scoring the winner at Croke park with your club, parish town or City

No it's not, junior and intermediate aren't fit for purpose

Tell that to Cullyhanna and Arva...

You're not within a country mile of the point

Its fit for purpose with one simple rule, no div 1 teams in intermediate or Junior for that matter and only div 3 or 4 teams can play Junior ..

Whatever way a county runs off its championship is up to them, but no team can enter the all Ireland series based on those simple enough rules, they must nominate a team, even Jimmy McGuinness could understand that set up!

That will encourage teams to actually play at their level ad not 'below'

Cork and Dublin could really mix it up with their A and B championships though, but to be fair to them as a county they haven't, Kerry are just ruining it

If people still have their knickers in a twist over the whole Arva thing then go get the rules changed for the sake of changing them, whatever. They have little to be at.

But that statement is a load of nonsense. Arva's priority would always have been championship. Winning the Junior championship was the only "encouragement" they'd ever have had. Took them a few years because that was their level, they couldn't rise "above" it. Your statement is implying there was something untoward going on, that they somehow designed this situation for unfair advantage. Other posters have implied this on here too. Need a serious bit of cop on.

If that is there level how did they rise to div 1?

If Div 1 is their level why were they hammered in most games? Why couldn't they win out Div 2? Why couldn't they win Junior championship? Why give more weight to league when formatting championship?

I really couldn't give a shit answering these stupid questions. Like I said, if some want to change the formats and give more weight to completely different competitions, then go ahead if it stops them going on like auld grannies with pot sticks up their holes.

But I'll take issue with implying they was some cheating going on with some gran plan taking years in the making. Get a life. 

You got up on the wrong side...

Well they are still div 1 this year so must be their level.

Great logic. Finish rock bottom in one competition that's your level. Fail to win another you're 2 levels too low.

What a shocker!!! So you're telling me any team than wins out a competition are too good for that level and might actually be middling next level up? This is a lot to take in.

[It the same thing now in GAA at all levels]

you could stop the whole argument about intermediate and junior championships by scrapping them and  just giving the intermediate and junior  champions a place in the county's  senior championships so there is a pathway for them to be provincial or all ireland champions.

Intermediate champions already get a place (if they want it) in the counties senior championship I'd imagine in most counties

The competition serves up a great carrot, to win a final at Croke park with your teammates

People growing up as kids playing soccer in the streets, wanted to score the winner in the FA Cup final at Wembley. It the same thing now in GAA at all levels, scoring the winner at Croke park with your club, parish town or City

No it's not, junior and intermediate aren't fit for purpose

Tell that to Cullyhanna and Arva...

You're not within a country mile of the point

Its fit for purpose with one simple rule, no div 1 teams in intermediate or Junior for that matter and only div 3 or 4 teams can play Junior ..

Whatever way a county runs off its championship is up to them, but no team can enter the all Ireland series based on those simple enough rules, they must nominate a team, even Jimmy McGuinness could understand that set up!

That will encourage teams to actually play at their level ad not 'below'

Cork and Dublin could really mix it up with their A and B championships though, but to be fair to them as a county they haven't, Kerry are just ruining it

If people still have their knickers in a twist over the whole Arva thing then go get the rules changed for the sake of changing them, whatever. They have little to be at.

But that statement is a load of nonsense. Arva's priority would always have been championship. Winning the Junior championship was the only "encouragement" they'd ever have had. Took them a few years because that was their level, they couldn't rise "above" it. Your statement is implying there was something untoward going on, that they somehow designed this situation for unfair advantage. Other posters have implied this on here too. Need a serious bit of cop on.

If that is there level how did they rise to div 1?

If Div 1 is their level why were they hammered in most games? Why couldn't they win out Div 2? Why couldn't they win Junior championship? Why give more weight to league when formatting championship?

I really couldn't give a shit answering these stupid questions. Like I said, if some want to change the formats and give more weight to completely different competitions, then go ahead if it stops them going on like auld grannies with pot sticks up their holes.

But I'll take issue with implying they was some cheating going on with some gran plan taking years in the making. Get a life. 

[It the same thing now in GAA at all levels]

you could stop the whole argument about intermediate and junior championships by scrapping them and  just giving the intermediate and junior  champions a place in the county's  senior championships so there is a pathway for them to be provincial or all ireland champions.

Intermediate champions already get a place (if they want it) in the counties senior championship I'd imagine in most counties

The competition serves up a great carrot, to win a final at Croke park with your teammates

People growing up as kids playing soccer in the streets, wanted to score the winner in the FA Cup final at Wembley. It the same thing now in GAA at all levels, scoring the winner at Croke park with your club, parish town or City

No it's not, junior and intermediate aren't fit for purpose

Tell that to Cullyhanna and Arva...

You're not within a country mile of the point

Its fit for purpose with one simple rule, no div 1 teams in intermediate or Junior for that matter and only div 3 or 4 teams can play Junior ..

Whatever way a county runs off its championship is up to them, but no team can enter the all Ireland series based on those simple enough rules, they must nominate a team, even Jimmy McGuinness could understand that set up!

That will encourage teams to actually play at their level ad not 'below'

Cork and Dublin could really mix it up with their A and B championships though, but to be fair to them as a county they haven't, Kerry are just ruining it

If people still have their knickers in a twist over the whole Arva thing then go get the rules changed for the sake of changing them, whatever. They have little to be at.

But that statement is a load of nonsense. Arva's priority would always have been championship. Winning the Junior championship was the only "encouragement" they'd ever have had. Took them a few years because that was their level, they couldn't rise "above" it. Your statement is implying there was something untoward going on, that they somehow designed this situation for unfair advantage. Other posters have implied this on here too. Need a serious bit of cop on.

"Not one jot "
Sure
Piers Morgan
https://twitter.com/MiddleEastEye/status/1747295144729297379

Israel don't have a plan for after. Looks more like they're working on a final solution.

Watched Beyond Utopia, film on underground railroad trying to get people out of North Korea. Excellent watch, very tough viewing at times but great people in it too. In subtitles though for those with poor vision.

Any netflix/prime download recommendations for a 13hr flight coming up?

Either binge series or good films. Tks

Slow Horses on Apple TV justifies the subscription fee on its own, well worth it.

Excellent show, highly recommend.