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Messages - Eamonnca1

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General discussion / Re: Eurovision final here we come!!
« on: June 15, 2018, 10:12:06 PM »
There's a poll going around on asking if Ireland should boycott Eurovision in Israel. Initially, I thought yes, but if someone were to pen a good song about standing up to colonizing land-grabbing oppressors on the other hand...

GAA Discussion / Re: Diarmuid not going to Boston After all
« on: June 14, 2018, 10:55:28 PM »
He flew on a plane twice within a month? Quick! Somebody begrudge him!

General discussion / Re: Depression
« on: June 13, 2018, 11:42:59 PM »
From the it's-good-to-talk department:

Last few days I was getting unbelievably stressed at work. I'd had a bad annual review (wasn't focused enough on my core area of responsibility, too much time spent on side projects that could create opportunities for me in the future but aren't directly related to what I was hired to do, hence quality of my work was suffering and others were having to re-do it) and I went home early on Friday in a terrible state because of it.

I came in this week trying to think positive but there was something poisoning the atmosphere on the team. There's this girl who's a star performer but doesn't get along with the rest of us. I had a major blowout with her yesterday and honestly felt like quitting on the spot.

Well this morning I asked her if we could have a private chat, and she agreed. We found a small conference room, talked over where we were coming from, all the little misunderstandings, all the little things each of us did wrong. It only took 15 minutes but it was amazing how much pressure was lifted from both of our shoulders. I felt relieved and I could see she felt the same. We agreed to be friends again and hopefully we're back to the same positive vibe we had when she first started here.

The power of talking things out is amazing. Not behind backs, but directly and face to face with a frank but polite and professional attitude. I admitted my mistakes up front and asked how I could make it better. She soon opened up and started admitting her mistakes and we apologized to each other for where we went wrong, and acknowledged where we both needed to do better.

General discussion / Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« on: June 12, 2018, 07:05:01 PM »
Someone's going to have to explain to me why the Iran deal was a bad one and why this is a good one.

General discussion / Re: Depression
« on: June 12, 2018, 12:52:22 AM »
terrible news. I've lost a dear friend to suicide and it's a rough one to wrap your head around. At 11 years old its even worse (not that you can really rank a loss).

I do worry about tv shows like 13 reasons why (now on it's second season with a third in the works) that can glamorize suicide. I know there's never one straightforward answer as to why in every case - but I am concerned by shows like that.

Eamonn, thank you for sharing your story! Looking at 13 reasons why from your perspective does it help or could you see it pulling you further down in to your depression?

I'm not familiar with that show, Ice. What's it about?

So, what can we do on the discussion boards to check the validity of the Sunday Times story that O'Neills has been outsourcing some of its manufacturing to Bangladesh and to implore the GAA to do something about it if true?

I'm only seeing this post now.

Not sure if there's much that can or should be done about it. The way supply chains work these days it's not uncommon for different parts of a production process to be sent offshore if it's cheaper and better than doing it locally.

General discussion / Re: Time for a post-catholic Ireland
« on: June 02, 2018, 12:25:29 AM »
You know someone is just going to present the opposite argument and they've plenty of ammo in the last century alone.
Perhaps. But I don't think anyone can honestly stand up and say they haven't been a force for good in the world. And I can't stand by and watch while one side presents all their hate fueled arguments.

Fair play to you Iceman for having the time and patience to challenge the onslaught against the RC Church in the wake of the referendum. Given the abominations that some of the clerical hierarchy were responsible for it can be difficult to stand up for this church but the critics should remember that laypersons comprise the vast majority of church membership – their criticisms can be deeply offensive to people who have lived their lives as upstanding members of the community.

Maybe the critics would clarify whether their criticisms are aimed at the RC Church in particular or at Christian Churches in general. It is difficult to engage in any debate where there is a scattergun approach by one side.

As a conscientious No voter I have found it deeply uncomfortable since the Referendum result last week. There’s a certain element of open season on the RC Church in particular – this can be found online, in printed & social media and in general conversation.

Anyway Iceman, I would advise that you don’t waste time engaging with certain posters such as Sid Waddell. There are certain fellas that are posting here morning, noon and night and will always have the last word. I could be wrong but I would guess that some of them spend a lot of their time pontificating on here whilst they are paid to be working.

General discussion / Re: Time for a post-catholic Ireland
« on: June 02, 2018, 12:24:10 AM »
I hardly need to point out that the worst genocides in recent History have been carried out in the name of atheism, often against those who practise religion

The old Stalin / Hitler / Pol Pot trope. Standard rebuttal: Stalin was a paranoid lunatic who thought everyone was out to get him and came to power in a communist state that rewarded despotism.

Hitler was raised a Catholic, taught to hate Jews, and dabbled in the occult. His atrocities had many motivations (chiefly making Germany great again), but disproving the existence of God was not one of them.

Pol Pot's communism was so extreme even the Soviets were aghast. His regime opposed the existence of religion, minority groups, western-educated intellectuals, educated people, or anyone that had been touched by foreign influence. To describe his actions as being "in the name of atheism" is a gross oversimplification at best.

General discussion / Re: Time for a post-catholic Ireland
« on: June 01, 2018, 11:23:20 PM »
I don't know what elevating the church to a pedestal or vilifying it does at this stage. I think you're all missing the mark of the need for a post catholic Ireland or even a Neo Catholic Ireland.

Ireland is no longer a Church run state, that much is clear. 2-4 more generations will cement that status. This is not a bad thing, frankly. Casual Catholicism is a very real thing - and the church will have to find a way to fit into Ireland now that Ireland no longer fits into the Church as easily as it did when the grip was vice like. The Church may decide not to pursue any changes in it's commentary on real life in 2018 and beyond, but I think it will and I think it will do so because it will not want to get left behind.

Those who deride Casual Catholicism can do so - but given the saints fall 7 times a day I doubt very much there's many folks around who haven't deviated from a teaching or behavior at times.
I challenge whether those who want to exclude the Church will give it any place at all in Ireland in the coming era? The aggressiveness shown on here alone would point to no.
It's an atheist Ireland where anything goes or bust?
Will you stand up and allow it to exist? Or is freedom of religion only reserved for non-christians? People on here have talked in their delight at the church's decline - I believe they won't be happy until it's done away with?

Of course it should still be allowed to exist. It's the church having an official role in state business that we're opposed to.

General discussion / Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« on: June 01, 2018, 06:19:50 PM »
I wouldn't vote conservative but I do respect the ideology. Conservative means keeping things steady and thinking about the future but maybe less about people.

Trump is no conservative. Neither is the GOP a conservative party.  Slashing taxes in the middle of a managed depression is economic vandalism.  Climate change denial is pure evil.

There is nobody for conservatives to vote for.

A typo? We're not in a depression. The criticism is that he's trying to stimulate the economy in a time of full employment, which leads to inflation, rising interest rates, and a recession not long after (probably when a Democrat has taken office and can get the blame for it). Certainly is economic vandalism.

General discussion / Re: Time for a post-catholic Ireland
« on: June 01, 2018, 06:17:17 PM »
Congratulations by the way, dont tell me your posting this on honeymoon Eammon?

Ha! Thanks. Honeymoon's done and dusted. Had a relaxing weekend up in Squaw Valley. It's a winter ski resort but it's beautiful up there in the summer too.

General discussion / Re: Time for a post-catholic Ireland
« on: June 01, 2018, 06:15:04 PM »
Here's a quick copy and paste fo what Catholicism has done in the world:

1. Light and the cosmos

The Opus Maius (1267) of the Franciscan Roger Bacon (d 1292), written at the request of Pope Clement IV, largely initiated the tradition of optics in the Latin world. The first spectacles were invented in Italy around 1300, an application of lenses that developed later into telescopes and microscopes.

While many people think of Galileo (d 1642) being persecuted, they tend to forget the peculiar circumstances of these events, or the fact that he died in his bed and his daughter became a nun.

The Gregorian Calendar (1582), now used worldwide, is a fruit of work by Catholic astronomers, as is the development of astrophysics by the spectroscopy of Fr Angelo Secchi (d 1878).

Most remarkably, the most important theory of modern cosmology, the Big Bang, was invented by a Catholic priest, Fr Georges Lemaître (d 1966, pictured), a historical fact that is almost never mentioned by the BBC or in popular science books.
2. Earth and nature

Catholic civilisation has made a remarkable contribution to the scientific investigation and mapping of the earth, producing great explorers such as Marco Polo (d 1324), Prince Henry the Navigator (d 1460), Bartolomeu Dias (d 1500), Christopher Columbus (d 1506) and Ferdinand Magellan
(d 1521). Far from believing that the world was flat (a black legend invented in the 19th century), the Catholic world produced the first modern scientific map: Diogo Ribeiro’s Padrón Real (1527). Fr Nicolas Steno (d 1686) was the founder of stratigraphy, the interpretation of rock strata which is one of the principles of geology.

Jean-Baptiste Lamarck (d 1829), a French Catholic, developed the first theory of evolution, including the notion of the transmutation of species and a genealogical tree. The Augustinian monk Gregor Mendel (d 1884, pictured) founded the science of genetics based on the meticulous study of the inherited characteristics of some 29,000 pea plants.

3. Philosophy and theology

Catholicism regards philosophy as intrinsically good and was largely responsible for founding theology, the application of reason to what has been revealed supernaturally. Great Catholic philosophers include St Augustine (d 430), St Thomas Aquinas (d 1274), St Anselm (d 1109), Blessed Duns Scotus (d 1308), Suárez (d 1617) and Blaise Pascal (d 1662). Recent figures include St Edith Stein (d 1942, pictured), Elizabeth Anscombe (d 2001) and Alasdair MacIntyre. On the basis that God is a God of reason and love, Catholics have defended the irreducibility of the human person to matter, the principle that created beings can be genuine causes of their own actions, free will, the role of the virtues in happiness, objective good and evil, natural law and the principle of non-contradiction. These principles have had an incalculable influence on intellectual life and culture.

4. Education and the university system

Perhaps the greatest single contribution to education to emerge from Catholic civilisation was the development of the university system. Early Catholic universities include Bologna (1088); Paris (c 1150); Oxford (1167, pictured); Salerno (1173); Vicenza (1204); Cambridge (1209); Salamanca (1218-1219); Padua (1222); Naples (1224) and Vercelli (1228). By the middle of the 15th-century (more than 70 years before the Reformation), there were over 50 universities in Europe.

Many of these universities, such as Oxford, still show signs of their Catholic foundation, such as quadrangles modelled on monastic cloisters, gothic architecture and numerous chapels. Starting from the sixth-century Catholic Europe also developed what were later called grammar schools and, in the 15th century, produced the movable type printing press system, with incalculable benefits for education. Today, it has been estimated that Church schools educate more than 50 million students worldwide.

5. Art and architecture

Faith in the Incarnation, the Word made Flesh and the Sacrifice of the Mass have been the founding principles of extraordinary Catholic contributions to art and architecture. These contributions include: the great basilicas of ancient Rome; the work of Giotto (d 1337), who initiated a realism in painting the Franciscan Stations of the Cross, which helped to inspire three-dimensional art and drama; the invention of one-point linear perspective by Brunelleschi (d 1446) and the great works of the High Renaissance. The latter include the works of Blessed Fra Angelico (d 1455), today the patron saint of art, and the unrivalled work of Leonardo da Vinci (d 1519), Raphael (d 1520), Caravaggio (d 1610, pictured), Michelangelo (d 1564) and Bernini (d 1680). Many of the works of these artists, such as the Sistine Chapel ceiling, are considered among the greatest works of art of all time. Catholic civilisation also founded entire genres, such as Byzantine, Romanesque, Gothic, High Renaissance and Baroque architecture. The Cristo Redentor statue in Brazil and the Sagrada Familia basilica in Barcelona show that the faith continues to be an inspiration for highly original art and architecture.

6. Law and jurisprudence

The reforms of Pope Gregory VII (d 1085, pictured) gave impetus to forming the laws of the Church and states of Europe. The subsequent application of philosophy to law, together with the great works of monks like the 12th-century Gratian, produced the first complete, systematic bodies of law, in which all parts are viewed as interacting to form a whole. This revolution also led to the founding of law schools, starting in Bologna (1088), from which the legal profession emerged, and concepts such as “corporate personality”, the legal basis of a wide range of bodies today such as universities, corporations and trust funds. Legal principles such as “good faith”, reciprocity of rights, equality before the law, international law, trial by jury, habeas corpus and the obligation to prove an offence beyond a reasonable doubt are all fruits of Catholic civilisation and jurisprudence.

7. Language

The centrality of Greek and Latin to Catholicism has greatly facilitated popular literacy, since true alphabets are far easier to learn than the symbols of logographic languages, such as Chinese. Spread by Catholic missions and exploration, the Latin alphabet is now the most widely used alphabetic writing system in the world. Catholics also developed the Armenian, Georgian and Cyrillic alphabets and standard scripts, such as Carolingian minuscule from the ninth to 12th centuries, and Gothic miniscule (from the 12th). Catholicism also provided the cultural framework for the Divina Commedia (Divine Comedy), the Cantar de Mio Cid (“The Song of my Lord”) and La Chanson de Roland (The Song of Roland), vernacular works that greatly influenced the development of Italian, Spanish and French respectively. The Catholic Hymn of Cædmon in the seventh century is arguably the oldest extant text of Old English. Valentin Haüy (d 1822), brother of the Abbé Haüy (the priest who invented crystallography), founded the first school for the blind. The most famous student of this school, Louis Braille (d 1852), developed the worldwide system of writing for the blind that today bears his name.

8. Music

Catholic civilisation virtually invented the western musical tradition, drawing on Jewish antecedents in early liturgical music. Monophonic Gregorian chant developed from the sixth century. Methods for recording chant led to the invention of musical notion (staff notation), of incalculable benefit for the recording of music, and the ut-re-mi (“do-re-mi”) mnemonic device of Guido of Arezzo (d 1003). From the 10th century cathedral schools developed polyphonic music, extended later to as many as 40 voices (Tallis, Spem in Alium) and even 60 voices (Striggio, Missa Sopra Ecco).

Musical genres that largely or wholly originated with Catholic civilisation include the hymn, the oratorio and the opera. Haydn (d 1809), a devout Catholic, strongly shaped the development of the symphony and string quartet. Church patronage and liturgical forms shaped many works by Monteverdi (d 1643), Vivaldi (d 1741), Mozart (d 1791, pictured) and Beethoven (d 1827). The great Symphony No 8 of Mahler (d 1911) takes as its principal theme the ancient hymn of Pentecost, Veni creator spiritus.

9. The status of women

Contrary to popular prejudice, extraordinary and influential women have been one of the hallmarks of Catholic civilisation. The faith has honoured many women saints, including recent Doctors of the Church, and nurtured great nuns, such as St Hilda (d 680, pictured) (after whom St Hilda’s College, Oxford, is named) and Blessed Hildegard von Bingen (d 1179), abbess and polymath. Pioneering Catholic women in political life include Empress Matilda (d 1167), Eleanor of Aquitaine (d 1204) and the first Queen of England, Mary Tudor (d 1558).

Catholic civilisation also produced many of the first women scientists and professors: Trotula of Salerno in the 11th century, Dorotea Bucca (d 1436), who held a chair in medicine at the University of Bologna, Elena Lucrezia Piscopia (d 1684), the first woman to receive a Doctor of Philosophy degree (1678) and Maria Agnesi (d 1799), the first woman to become professor of mathematics, who was appointed by Pope Benedict XIV as early as 1750.

The Galileo episode is probably one of the most misunderstood, and the catholic church was a bit maligned for it IMHO. They didn't object to his findings, they believed him. What they objected to was him going public with them without going through them first, they figured that the public needed time to adjust to the idea and the church was in a better position to handle it.

And yes, the church did set up a lot of scientific research later on. To this day the Catholic church deserves credit as being a Christian denomination that doesn't fight against the science of evolutionary biology, they accept evolution.

General discussion / Re: Time for a post-catholic Ireland
« on: June 01, 2018, 04:18:55 AM »
I always get a good laugh at people claiming that the law of the land is based on biblical legends. Take the Ten Commandments, which some eejits in America think are significant enough that they deserve to be put on display in big sheets of granite in the courthouse where they probably think they're being enforced:

  • "I am the Lord your God, you shall have no other gods before me" - Not enshrined in civil or criminal law
  • "You shall not make for yourself an idol" - Perfectly legal to make an idol
  • "You shall not make wrongful use of the name of your God" - Perfectly legal to swear the bit out
  • "Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy" - Not many laws in place enforcing this in a lot of western countries now
  • "Honor your Father and Mother" - Not enshrined in law
  • "You shall not kill/murder*" - Enshrined in law, flouted in a dwindling number of death penalty countries most of which are outside western "Christendom"
  • "You shall not commit adultery" - Not enshrined in law in western countries
  • "You shall not steal" - Enshrined in law
  • "You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor" - Enshrined in law if you're under oath, but slander and libel are civil matters where the penalties are financial
  • "You shall not covet your neighbor's house" - Perfectly legal, we don't have thought-crime laws
  • "You shall not covet your neighbor's wife" - Perfectly legal, we don't have thought-crime laws

General discussion / Re: Time for a post-catholic Ireland
« on: June 01, 2018, 04:08:12 AM »
Did I see someone gathering sticks on Sunday? Stone that man to death outside the gates of the city!

Earlier I saw someone calling his father a fool. He shall be put to death. And he who striketh his father shall surely be put to death! Leviticus says so, and that's the basis of western law!
Old Testament .
Christianity/Catholicism based on New Testament.
Would have expected a smart buck like you to know that.

Oh I've heard people cherry-pick from Old and New Testaments to suit whatever ideology they're pushing. I'm quite familiar with the "ah but the OT doesn't apply to me, guv" excuse.

General discussion / Re: Time for a post-catholic Ireland
« on: May 31, 2018, 10:45:47 PM »
Did I see someone gathering sticks on Sunday? Stone that man to death outside the gates of the city!

Earlier I saw someone calling his father a fool. He shall be put to death. And he who striketh his father shall surely be put to death! Leviticus says so, and that's the basis of western law!

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