'Splitting into two groups of 16 is inevitable for football'

[Syferus]

Again, the blindingly obvious reason it wouldn't be a success is because supporters have no interest in these so-called merit-based tiers and will not trek half the country to see some random match-up of counties. The Quailifers and the league have shown us this in graphic detail.

The thing people who point to Senior/Inter/Junior in hurling and club never seem to point out is that there is little to no interest by the public in the lower tiers. They may be of interest to the players and a few dozen die-hards, but that's the extent of their impact or value towards the bottom line of the GAA. I'd say in the case of hurling at least it's clear most of the competitions run at a significant deficit.

When you're talking about a level where thousands follow their team even in smaller counties it's a very different matter. The GAA doesn't run on magic beans and it's the money-spinning senior football championship that by-and-large funds those other tiers in hurling and football.

[lenny]

Again, the blindingly obvious reason it wouldn't be a success is because supporters have no interest in these so-called merit-based tiers and will not trek half the country to see some random match-up of counties. The Quailifers and the league have shown us this in graphic detail.

The thing people who point to Senior/Inter/Junior in hurling and club never seem to point out is that there is little to no interest by the public in the lower tiers. They may be of interest to the players and a few dozen die-hards, but that's the extent of their impact or value towards the bottom line of the GAA. I'd say in the case of hurling at least it's clear most of the competitions run at a significant deficit.

When you're talking about a level where thousands follow their team even in smaller counties it's a very different matter. The GAA doesn't run on magic beans and it's the money-spinning senior football championship that by-and-large funds those other tiers in hurling and football.

With so many one sided games the interest is seriously waning at the moment. You say that in hurling there is very little interest in the lower tier competitions which is fair enough. You have to compare it though with what interest there was in those counties before the tiered competitions were set up. Counties like derry, tyrone, donegal don't get that many supporters to their matches in the ring/rackard but I would bet that the number has increased compared to the numbers who turned up to watch them before those competitions were set up.

[Zulu]

Jesus man, that's utter nonsense. There was about 20,000 at the Cavan Dublin league game and huge crowds at many other league games. You talk about the provincials like they are not dying on their feet when the evidence is they are.

Why are you talking about traveling half the country to see random match ups (whatever the blue blazes they are? Is the All Ireland final one of these random match ups?). Roscommon supporters could probably get to 10 non-Connacht counties in not much more time to get to some county grounds within the province. Offaly, Westmeath, Longford all boarder Roscommon. Meath, Cavan, Fermanagh, Laois, Tipp or Kildare not a million miles away. Other counties wold be even better set.

If Waterford had beaten Cork it would have been brilliant for them but an upset like that once every second generation isn't better than giving every Waterford footballer over an 80 year period a proper season. The provincial system means that most IC footballers in Ireland are just waiting for their season to end after the league. Linking the league to the championship would give every footballer a pathway to the bigtime and supporters more genuine contests.

Even supporters of the provincials acknowledge they would have no value if they weren't linked to the championship whereas the league is growing in strength as a stand alone competition so imagine the crowds and passion if played in April and May with all teams at full strength.

[Syferus]

Jesus man, that's utter nonsense. There was about 20,000 at the Cavan Dublin league game and huge crowds at many other league games. You talk about the provincials like they are not dying on their feet when the evidence is they are.

Why are you talking about traveling half the country to see random match ups (whatever the blue blazes they are? Is the All Ireland final one of these random match ups?). Roscommon supporters could probably get to 10 non-Connacht counties in not much more time to get to some county grounds within the province. Offaly, Westmeath, Longford all boarder Roscommon. Meath, Cavan, Fermanagh, Laois, Tipp or Kildare not a million miles away. Other counties wold be even better set.

If Waterford had beaten Cork it would have been brilliant for them but an upset like that once every second generation isn't better than giving every Waterford footballer over an 80 year period a proper season. The provincial system means that most IC footballers in Ireland are just waiting for their season to end after the league. Linking the league to the championship would give every footballer a pathway to the bigtime and supporters more genuine contests.

Even supporters of the provincials acknowledge they would have no value if they weren't linked to the championship whereas the league is growing in strength as a stand alone competition so imagine the crowds and passion if played in April and May with all teams at full strength.

I love how you immediately contradicted yourself by pointing to a Division 1 match, and one involving a county twice the size of the province of Connacht at that.

[Zulu]

You said this -

"Again, the blindingly obvious reason it wouldn't be a success is because supporters have no interest in these so-called merit-based tiers and will not trek half the country to see some random match-up of counties. The Quailifers and the league have shown us this in graphic detail."

I pointed out that this is rubbish but you now say it's because it's a division one game? Of course the games involving the best teams will generate bigger crowds and the most populated counties will bring have bigger crowds but you claim people aren't interested in going to games if it's not down the road and against a local rival, that's clearly nonsense. Why is Roscommon v Leitrim better than Dublin v Mayo?

[Zulu]

A two tier championship will be the final nail in the coffin for the GAA in the counties in the 2nd tier. THEY ALREADY HAVE A LEAGUE BASED ON PERFORMANCES AND DO NOT WANT ANOTHER COMPETITION PLAYING THE SAME TEAMS. Is it that hard for people to grasp?
Every team sport in the world is dominated by 3/4 teams and everyone plays for pride.  The GAA is based on local rivalries and that pride is of even more significance.
We do not need more competitions - we need the league played in better weather, perhaps at the same time as the championship. Shorten the season, stop chasing money and restore the importance of club activity where county players can take meaningful part.
Provincial titles provide 4 opportunities to counties to win a significant competition; granted Leinster is under the cosh of Dublin but too may of the Leinster counties are accepting it as a fait accompli and are beaten before they start. You have to take you that off to Westmeath who have reached the last two finals and were competitive for first  35 minutes each year. Bigger counties like Meath and Kildare should be more capable of taking on the Dubs and if they did the Leinster Championship would be in pretty good health.

The Leinster championship is under the cosh of one county? What about Munster or Connacht? Even the Ulster championship is limited to two or three teams and has been for many years. There isn't a provincial championship worth watching anymore. The league is way better than the provincials and every year the evidence keeps piling up but some people keep trying to tell us that a once in a 100 years win for some county is reason enough to keep a format that is failing our sport.

[Champion The Wonder Horse]

12-12-8+ is how it should be.

No county has every club playing senior championship, so why should every county play for Sam.

[ONeill]

Get rid of the provincials. They mean fcuk all.

[armaghniac]

Get rid of the provincials. They mean fcuk all.

They are needed to fill new stadia in Cork and Belfast.

[Zulu]

Get rid of the provincials. They mean fcuk all.

They are needed to fill new stadia in Cork and Belfast.

No, they're not. You think Cork v Kerry will fill the new park at the moment? Or most Ulster championship games will fill a new Casement?

[Syferus]

Get rid of the provincials. They mean fcuk all.

They are needed to fill new stadia in Cork and Belfast.

No, they're not. You think Cork v Kerry will fill the new park at the moment? Or most Ulster championship games will fill a new Casement?

Time to go to bed, Paraic.

[seafoid]

A structured championship would give counties more than 2 matches over the summer. Say Roscommon were in the second tier. I am sure they would burst a gut to get to the top tier rather than roll over in front of Galway/Mayo again. They wouldn't have the same psychological weakness with Kildare or Derry.

[Zulu]

Get rid of the provincials. They mean fcuk all.

They are needed to fill new stadia in Cork and Belfast.

No, they're not. You think Cork v Kerry will fill the new park at the moment? Or most Ulster championship games will fill a new Casement?

Time to go to bed, Paraic.

Someday, as a self improvement strategy, try to go through a full 24 hours without talking complete bollocks.

[seafoid]

Again, the blindingly obvious reason it wouldn't be a success is because supporters have no interest in these so-called merit-based tiers and will not trek half the country to see some random match-up of counties. The Quailifers and the league have shown us this in graphic detail.

The thing people who point to Senior/Inter/Junior in hurling and club never seem to point out is that there is little to no interest by the public in the lower tiers. They may be of interest to the players and a few dozen die-hards, but that's the extent of their impact or value towards the bottom line of the GAA. I'd say in the case of hurling at least it's clear most of the competitions run at a significant deficit.

When you're talking about a level where thousands follow their team even in smaller counties it's a very different matter. The GAA doesn't run on magic beans and it's the money-spinning senior football championship that by-and-large funds those other tiers in hurling and football.

Syf, a very famous American journalist once onserved that nobody even went broke by underestimating the taste of the public. RTE's audience would watch 2 flies on a window if it was called sport and analysed at half time.
For a lot of people the GAA is the summer and they will go to matches as long as the standard is watchable and the prices are reasonable   

[mcklatchee]

To a degree the GAA and RTE both rely on the fact that as long as there are games called Gaelic football that there will sufficient gate and viewing public.

There is a real danger that the audience, especially younger folk won't buy into the product on display. Especially outside the top 5 counties.

The argument that the provincials are the cash cow that sits along the final 8 is falling away and that decline could accelerate quickly.

Anybody thinking that a USFC final would fill a stadium in Belfast at sitting prices is detached from the real world