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my twitter feed full of reports that 50/100 drones launched from Iran!!

more reality

https://twitter.com/robdelaney/status/1776702659677835596?t=955tGZUWJID-afXeJd61fA&s=19

[it is not easier for a Palestinan in Gaza to go to a mosque in the west bank though. I would also point out that jewish cemeteries remained in Gaza and were only destroyed by Israelis in the last 6 months. there are also Jewish people in other Arab countries. there are Christians in Gaza and before 6 months ago over half were already refugees too.it reflects reality not fantasy and what ifs.. Palestinains are the occupied and Israelis the agressors and the occupier for 75 years.Palestinians, while having in y opinion justification to want a state on pre or even post 47 borders, they have negotiated and accepted in line with International law the 67 borders, Israel has never accepted this.Palestinians who can trace 9 generations of their families to Palestine cannot move freely but if you are Jewish from anywhere in the world you have more rights within Israel.]

Hamas has allowed Fatah protest and rallies in Gaza so what you suspect is wrong.

Fair enough, some protest have taken place.

Yes, I doubt very much they like Israelis and especially zionists after 75 years of occupation but that does lead to the points outlined in the graphic.

Let's say that it is easier to go to a mosque in Israel than to a synagogue in Gaza.

There is only one side committing a genocide, occupying, expanding settlements, creating an apartheid system and its not the Palestinians.

This reflects capacity more than attitude.

it is not easier for a Palestinan in Gaza to go to a mosque in the west bank though.

I would also point out that jewish cemeteries remained in Gaza and were only destroyed by Israelis in the last  6 months. there are also Jewish people in other Arab countries. there are Christians in Gaza and before 6 months ago over half were already refugees too.

it reflects reality not fantasy and what ifs.. Palestinains are the occupied and Israelis the agressors and the occupier for 75 years.

Palestinians, while having in y opinion justification to want a state on pre or even post 47 borders, they have negotiated and accepted in line with International law the 67 borders, Israel has never accepted this.

Palestinians who can trace  9 generations of their families to Palestine cannot move freely but if you are Jewish from anywhere in the world you have more rights within Israel.

you are one excusing Israel, the graphic has been shown to be a joke!

also my points are about your comment about weather the Israelis are the same, not the graphic.

the graphic says the palestinan but I  just looked at a few pieces from Hamas who you consider evil, in their charter state the following points

[1] Hamas rejects the persecution of any human being or the undermining of his or her rights on nationalist, religious or sectarian grounds. Hamas is of the view that the Jewish problem, anti-Semitism and the persecution of the Jews are phenomena fundamentally linked to European history and not to the history of the Arabs and the Muslims or to their heritage

2. Islam is a religion of peace and tolerance. It provides an umbrella for the followers of other creeds and religions who can practice their beliefs in security and safety.

3. Hamas affirms that its conflict is with the Zionist project not with the Jews because of their religion. Hamas does not wage a struggle against the Jews because they are Jewish but wages a struggle against the Zionists who occupy Palestine.

4. Hamas rejects any alternative to the full and complete liberation of Palestine, from the river to the sea. However, without compromising its rejection of the Zionist entity and without relinquishing any Palestinian rights, Hamas considers the establishment of a fully sovereign and independent Palestinian state, with Jerusalem as its capital along the lines of the 4th of June 1967, with the return of the refugees and the displaced to their homes from which they were expelled, to be a formula of national consensus.

5. Hamas believes in, and adheres to, managing its Palestinian relations on the basis of pluralism, democracy, national partnership, acceptance of the other and the adoption of dialogue. The aim is to bolster the unity of ranks and joint action for the purpose of accomplishing national goals and fulfilling the aspirations of the Palestinian people.

In 2015 they offered a 15 year ceasefire... Fatah would have similar opinions but work closely with the Israelis which only cements the unjust status quo.

That's a fair response, However, you have often pointed out that Israel say one thing and do another. Hamas says one thing, but their actions suggest otherwise. There are anti Netanyahu protests in Isreal at present, I suspect there never been possibility of an anti Hamas protest and since they took power there has been a notable lack of an election which might allow the population give a view on their performance. If they persecute Fatah voters in Gaza, one suspects that they might not be kind to Jewish people.

Hamas has allowed Fatah protest and rallies in Gaza so what you suspect is wrong.

There has also been a lack of elections in the west bank and the reason is not solely on Hamas or Fatah as Israel has also being an obstacle... Hamas won elections in 06 but only democracy that the US/Uk/Eu like gets recognoised, so they tried to get rid of them.

Yes, I doubt very much they like Israelis and especially zionists after 75 years of occupation but that does lead to the points outlined in the graphic.

There is only one side committing a genocide, occupying, expanding settlements, creating an apartheid system and its not the Palestinians.

regarding the anti Netanyahu protests, they are regularly broken up by the the police.

you are one excusing Israel, the graphic has been shown to be a joke!

also my points are about your comment about weather the Israelis are the same, not the graphic.

the graphic says the palestinan but I  just looked at a few pieces from Hamas who you consider evil, in their charter state the following points

[1] Hamas rejects the persecution of any human being or the undermining of his or her rights on nationalist, religious or sectarian grounds. Hamas is of the view that the Jewish problem, anti-Semitism and the persecution of the Jews are phenomena fundamentally linked to European history and not to the history of the Arabs and the Muslims or to their heritage

2. Islam is a religion of peace and tolerance. It provides an umbrella for the followers of other creeds and religions who can practice their beliefs in security and safety.

3. Hamas affirms that its conflict is with the Zionist project not with the Jews because of their religion. Hamas does not wage a struggle against the Jews because they are Jewish but wages a struggle against the Zionists who occupy Palestine.

4. Hamas rejects any alternative to the full and complete liberation of Palestine, from the river to the sea. However, without compromising its rejection of the Zionist entity and without relinquishing any Palestinian rights, Hamas considers the establishment of a fully sovereign and independent Palestinian state, with Jerusalem as its capital along the lines of the 4th of June 1967, with the return of the refugees and the displaced to their homes from which they were expelled, to be a formula of national consensus.

5. Hamas believes in, and adheres to, managing its Palestinian relations on the basis of pluralism, democracy, national partnership, acceptance of the other and the adoption of dialogue. The aim is to bolster the unity of ranks and joint action for the purpose of accomplishing national goals and fulfilling the aspirations of the Palestinian people.

In 2015 they offered a 15 year ceasefire... Fatah would have similar opinions but work closely with the Israelis which only cements the unjust status quo.

Good graphic posted on Slugger

only for the pig ignorant.

hardly surprising coming from a poster that recently said Hamas were evil but 'the question has been whether the Israelis are much the same'..

this despite to name a few,  the nakba where 750k were mass displaced and dispossessed and thousands killed never to return as per their legal right of return. Operation cast lead, protective edge, the thousand murdered and maimed on the great march, the thousands of illegal settlements, murders, displacements in the West Bank, Israel also enable Hamas to rise to split the palestinans...

the graphic is a piece of garbage.

The graphic is from The Onion

the graphic is a piece of garbage a joke!

Good graphic posted on Slugger

only for the pig ignorant.

hardly surprising coming from a poster that recently said Hamas were evil but 'the question has been whether the Israelis are much the same'..

this despite to name a few,  the nakba where 750k were mass displaced and dispossessed and thousands killed never to return as per their legal right of return. Operation cast lead, protective edge, the thousand murdered and maimed on the great march, the thousands of illegal settlements, murders, displacements in the West Bank, Israel also enable Hamas to rise to split the palestinans...

the graphic is a piece of garbage.

Congrats, the board was very different back in the earlier days.

Two threads spring to mind from back then related to marraige, and looking back (on your posts) you started one and had a few posts on the other. 

http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?topic=9764.msg397061#msg397061

http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?topic=9942.0

]No, they are not. Hamas are evil, the question has been whether the Israelis are much the same. [/b][/b]

Denies Hamas being held to a higher moral standard than Israel.

Next sentence.... holds Hamas to higher moral standard than Israel.

Looper.

From my perspective, I am holding them to the same standard and both fail. If you disagree, then you can point out where I am in error rather than calling me names.

you posted this today

No, they are not. Hamas are evil, the question has been whether the Israelis are much the same

I'm not absolving Israel,I'm not absolving Israel,I'm not blaming Hamas,I'm not blaming Hamas but but but but it's  Hamas fault, if Oct 7th didn't happen would 30 thousand plus people be still alive..

If Oct 7th didn't happen then almost all of those 30 thousand people would indeed still be alive.

You could go back to many many dates and many many incidents carried out by Israel and almost all of those 30 thousand people would still be alive

Of course, it is part of an ongoing conflict and is not a simple matter.
However, Oct 7th made this an excessive response easier to organise as most of it was outright terrorism. I expect someone in Hamas expected things to turn out as they did, and believed that there was long term advantage in many deaths in Gaza.

Oct 7th was the fightback, there were plenty of Palestinians killed before that date;

The fightback is not in doubt, the manner of it can be criticised though, rock concerts are not legitimate targets.

The concert was not a target.

Well not a great month, up 2kgs, once I let the genie out of the bottle and started to eat some bread, crisps, etc. and then it snowballed.

Exercise wise, I am doing more but not enough.

April is a new month. Need to get the January disciple back (and weight lose).

Seems like the Israelis have just killed a number of international aid workers apparently including an Irish citizen.

I have seen British, Australian and Polish passports in twitter pictures but not an Irish Passport but widely reported there was an Irish person but might be due to cover of the UK of Britian and ireland passport.

I'm not absolving Israel,I'm not absolving Israel,I'm not blaming Hamas,I'm not blaming Hamas but but but but it's  Hamas fault, if Oct 7th didn't happen would 30 thousand plus people be still alive..

If Oct 7th didn't happen then almost all of those 30 thousand people would indeed still be alive.

You could go back to many many dates and many many incidents carried out by Israel and almost all of those 30 thousand people would still be alive

Of course, it is part of an ongoing conflict and is not a simple matter.
However, Oct 7th made this an excessive response easier to organise as most of it was outright terrorism. I expect someone in Hamas expected things to turn out as they did, and believed that there was long term advantage in many deaths in Gaza.

 Israel has never need an excuse to ethic cleanse or destroy and murder Palestinians, they do it on a daily basis and every now and again they 'mow the lawn' because they can, they have total control and responsibility for their actions.

To offer some sort of justification or that Hamas wanted Gaza to be destroyed is absolving Israel regardless of what you point you want to make. Again the Israeli response is 100% within their control infact the whole situation. as the occupier is their responsibility.

the scenes out of the al shifa hospital now, 6 months into a genocide shows how little Israel and the west care about needing an excuse... sickening.

So that's a no?

No point then in discussing it

I'm not absolving Israel,I'm not absolving Israel,I'm not blaming Hamas,I'm not blaming Hamas but but but but it's  Hamas fault, if Oct 7th didn't happen would 30 thousand plus people be still alive..

Jesus ! You are hard work.

There's nowhere that I've said Hamas killed 30 thousand, the timeline for these latest deaths happened after the Hamas attack.

I've not said they caused it. But you keep going 

both of these statements by you, clearer state that Hamas caused it... even if it is now not what you meant.


Remember if hamas never carried out that attack there would be a lot more people alive

It will be the ever extending death toll happening due to the initial attack by Hamas

That's correct, if hamas never carried out that attack, Gaza today would still be standing and over 30 thousand people would be alive, as Isreal wouldn't have had the backing initially in what they have done on the back of those attacks.

That's not taking away Hamas legitimacy in resisting Israel

Jesus ! You are hard work.

There's nowhere that I've said Hamas killed 30 thousand, the timeline for these latest deaths happened after the Hamas attack.

I've not said they caused it. But you keep going 

both of these statements by you, clearer state that Hamas caused it... even if it is now not what you meant.


Remember if hamas never carried out that attack there would be a lot more people alive

It will be the ever extending death toll happening due to the initial attack by Hamas

Ok, I'll ask it differently

And answer the question by itself

Don't add in other stuff please

Do you think, had the attacks not taken place that we'd be in the current situation with the death toll as high and Gaza the way it is?

I'm not absolving Israel or blaming Hamas, the attacks happened, that's real, what Israel did/doing is real.

If Israel didnt occupy Palestine, there wouldn't be a Hamas and 30 thousand would be alive. But you choose to start causation on Oct 7th... that is absolving Israel and blaming Hamas.

Israel and the west are to blame for all their actions on and after Oct 7, not Hamas.

To answer your question, the resistance is a natural reaction to a brutal occupation, it was only a matter of time. Peaceful means had failed time and time again as the west and Israel cemented the status quo of 2.2m caged in Gaza and settler expansion and violence in the west bank. The lack of humanity from the west and israelis and the death toll as high as it is, is a direct result of that inhumanity.