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I said he might have a point regarding the Provo 'campaign" in the 26....murders, bank robberies, kidnappings,extortion....
Now go away and gave a good sh1te for yourself.

I said he might have a point regarding the Provo 'campaign" in the 26....murders, bank robberies, kidnappings,extortion....
Now go away and gave a good sh1te for yourself.

As opposed to the Old IRA who never carried out murders or robberies etc etc.

Anyway, as I'm sure you well know, Micheal wasn't talking about the IRA activities in the 26. He was talking about the troubles in their entirety. Nor were his remarks down to the "cut and thrust of debate with Mary Lou" as you previously surmised, but in a one-to-one sit-down interview. He simply took exception to the interviewer noting that there were atrocities committed by both sides, and had the brass f**king neck to do so just seconds after accusing SF of trying to rewrite the history of the troubles. There is no excusing his absolutely shameful remarks no matter how hard you might try to obfuscate and misrepresent them.

This morning's postings are very interesting indeed.........

Some children can be harder to love than others.

Anyway, would you be happy to retract your suggestion that Tubberman was repsonsible for "one of the most sensible posts" when his post was in fact based around two absolutely massive false claims?

To clarify, I said (copy and paste):
"even among the 'nationalist' community, there seems to be a large element who aren't in favour of unity."

In response to one of your many posts, I pasted an Irish Times article on one of polls showing 43% of catholics either against unity or undecided.

Where is the "absolutely massive false" claim?

The bit where you said "even among the 'nationalist' community, there seems to be a large element who aren't in favour of unity."

You posted a link to a two year old study. Lucid Talk (by some way the most accurate polling company in the north), this year found that 95% of nationalists want a border poll within 20 years.

Once again, that wasn't me. Try to keep up there, like a good lad.

Kingsmill was awful, but again if you've any understanding of what was happening you'll know why it happened and why it had to be done. Doubt you'll find too many pitying the pedo Mountbatten...

There you go. Try and spin it whatever way you want.

I've absolutely no interest in spinning it. I already said that it would be a scummy comment to make if it were true. I merely asked for the link so that I could see it with my own eyes.

This morning's postings are very interesting indeed.........

Some children can be harder to love than others.

Anyway, would you be happy to retract your suggestion that Tubberman was repsonsible for "one of the most sensible posts" when his post was in fact based around two absolutely massive false claims?

Once again, that wasn't me. Try to keep up there, like a good lad.

Didn't get a lot of sleep last night 

As for the Kingsmill point, it was to serve the argument that maybe, just possibly maybe, someone from the 26 who gets called a blueshirt by someone on the record as thinking Kingsmill was necessary might not feel too much in common with them other than being born on the same island and that for them unity might just be more than the simple issue presented to them so frequently.

So just to confirm, you are focusing your entire argument upon the alleged comment on one poster? Any link to where he posted that remark?

Tubberman and Armaghniac with the 2 most sensible posts tonight.

Tubberman's entire argument is based around the idea than a large amount of natioanlists don't want a united Ireland and don't want a boder poll. Two completely fabricated claims which are both blown out of the water by the polling data. So how does that mean he's talking sense, Rossfan?

A lot of northern nationalists want a united Ireland in the same way I want to lose weight or Kildare want to win an All Ireland, i.e. they want it but are not willing to put in a bit of effort to get it.
A border poll without that effort will not work.

lol wtf is that supposed to mean? Are we supposed to breed even harder? Or are we supposed to try to A border poll not only happenining, but passing, is merely a matter of time. The demographics are going on direction. The Catholic/Nationalist population is growing, and the Protestant/unionist one is aging and shrinking, and the rate of those trends is increasing.

People in the south get labelled as traitors, west brits, blueshirts, free staters etc.

Only those for whom such labels fit.

Given you're pointing out untruths, this is categorically untrue. Only a couple of pages ago we had an Armagh dickhead throw out the blueshirt insult whilst simultaneously demonstrating a clear lack of understanding of what it actually means. Same poster had previous described Kingsmill as "needing to happen" so I guess, as you say, if the shoe fits...

You get touchy about terms like "blueshirt" and "free sateter" while throwing out the "nordie" insult multiple times per week, so forgive me if I take your pearl cluthing on that front with a large dollop of salt, but if you are trying to suggest that one "armagh dickhead" is representative of northern attitudes to the people in the 26, then you're not talking "facts", but rather, making sweeping generalisations based on one person. As for the alleged Kingsmill comment, I haven't seen it, and it would be a scummy comment if true, however I'm at a loss as to what that has to do with the topic being discussed.

Also, happy to retract your suggestion that Tubberman was repsonsible for "one of the most sensible posts" when his post was in fact based around two absolutely massive false claims?

Tubberman and Armaghniac with the 2 most sensible posts tonight.

Tubberman's entire argument is based around the idea than a large amount of natioanlists don't want a united Ireland and don't want a boder poll. Two completely fabricated claims which are both blown out of the water by the polling data. So how does that mean he's talking sense, Rossfan?

Obviously, you don't get the same overall results in the north, but even among the 'nationalist' community, there seems to be a large element who aren't in favour of unity.

I mean, that's just factaully untrue. The latest Lucid Talk poll oin the topic found that 87% of natioanlist voters would vote for a united Ireland if a poll was held within the next week. I'll let you take a guess at what that number might rise to if the question was about a border poll in the next decade.

People in the south get labelled as traitors, west brits, blueshirts, free staters etc.

Only those for whom such labels fit.

If you're wondering why there's not a greater clamour for a border poll, maybe start by looking at yourselves.

Again, factually untrue. Lucid Talks poll found that 95% of nationalists want a border poll within the next two decades.

I run down the Shinners but I'm not trying to unite with them.

Care to enlighten us as to who you voted for yourself, Rossfan?

Substandard, with regards your question on reunification and Micheal Martin, when Irelands Future held their major rally in the 3 Arena last year, Micheal was the only party leader in the 26 counties to decline the invitation to take part.

He has also described himself as subscribing to Seamus Mallons view when it came to a border poll. Mallon was a proponent of the parallel consent idea whereby a vote on unity would require a majority of unionists to vote in favour of it. In other words, an undemocratic, Anti-Good Friday agreement proposal designed to put as permanent a roadblock as possible on the road towards reunification. A reporter asked him some time ago if he regarded himself "a persuader for Urish unity". Micheal, the leader of the self titled "Republican Party", refused to say yes he was. Instead he waffled about sharing the island. As Martina Devlin said, his waffle about a "shared island" isn't code for Irish Unity, its code for co-living with the north. Nothing beyond what is in place right now. Continued partition.

Three years ago, a nationalist victims group hit out at him for his repeated refusal to even reply to their letters seeking a meeting. That's who he is.

This latest comment from him, albeit worse than anything else he has ever said in relation to the north, is nothing new from 26 County politicians. I recall a few years back on newstalk, Regina Doherty suggested than nationalists being killed in the conflict was something that was "all brought on by their own actions".

Who is suggesting SF won the election, Rossfan? Must have missed that post?

Absolutely. About two months ago it looked like they were completely finished and look what happened in that election. This board was just about how they were dropping and they were gone - that , for me , was a big result for them.

On Twitter maybe, and that's not the real world.

You seriously thought SF were finished over the head of an unknown former press officer being suspended by SF (rightly) & a Senator from the North being a creep ?

You may have had unionists up here creaming themselves, it was never going to move the needle with voters in the south

I don't know anyone who thought they were finished, but the conventional wisom was that the election couldn't have come at a worse time for them. I recall reading an Irish Times column which surmised that the election was called earlier than initially planned, purely to take advantage of SF's problems at the time. If you're suggesting that the abolute feeding frenzy on SF in the weeks before the election was entirely unrelated to said election, then I've a bridge to Scotland to sell you.

[They are going no-where and will NEVER be in government.]

The reality down south is Sinn Fein offered no opposition in the last Dail.
They are going no-where and will NEVER be in government.

Listened to a similar discussion on bbc Talkback yesterday but a selection of political "experts" from the 26 counties. The general consensus seemed to be that SFs support has absolutely evaporated, that they have no future and may as well just pack it all in. Sometimes it pays to step back and look at the bigger picture.

General Election 2007.
• Fianna Fáil - 78 seats
• Sinn Fein - 4 seats

General Election 2024.
• Fianna Fáil - 48 seats
• Sinn Fein - 39 seats

No. of seats for SF over the last 5 elections:
4 => 14 => 24 => 37 => 39

For those who prefer not to look at the bigger picture, consider how the prospects for SF looked about 6-8 weeks ago for this general election during the McMonagle/O'Donnghaille sagas. The percieved wisdom was that the election could not have come at a worse time for them, and that they were facing into disaster. Not too many on this board would have given them much cance of getting close to 39 seats. 'From the Bunker' you yourself posted an image of the Costa Concordia as a representation of the party when the election date was called. I'd take anyone's definitive long term predicions, for any party, with a big pinch of salt.