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Messages - clonadmad

#1
GAA Discussion / Re: GAA crowds
April 09, 2024, 11:59:51 AM
Quote from: seafoid on April 09, 2024, 11:26:35 AM
Quote from: clonadmad on April 09, 2024, 10:27:02 AM
Quote from: seafoid on April 09, 2024, 09:31:59 AM
Quote from: clonadmad on April 08, 2024, 10:38:12 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 08, 2024, 10:30:06 PM
Quote from: Armagh18 on April 08, 2024, 10:22:21 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 08, 2024, 09:38:57 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on April 08, 2024, 04:00:01 PM
Quote from: Londoner89 on April 08, 2024, 01:36:20 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on April 08, 2024, 12:28:30 PMGreat article/ piece with Jim Mcguinness in today's Irish News, a full throated defence of USFC & the provincial series. He made the point, that has been made here before, that counties trying to compete v Dublin and Kerry need financial support and development plans to make them competitive  again - as a better alternative to just scrapping them.

The provincial structure is broken and most people just want them moved to the start of the season. Most counties voted for a structure in 2021 which would see them be played first followed by a league based championship. Now we've ended up with a structure which tries to please everyone and is condensed into half the year despite having more games.

If most counties voted that it would have been seen with the vote The current structure we have was voted in by Congress and any change will have to be done via Congress again.
Anyone I have spoken to recently about this said that the system doesn't work. There is no objection to making time for clubs but they all say there are too many games in too short a time period. People hope Jarlath burns will put some smacht on things. 
Too many games doesn't wash. Nearly everyone thats ever played will say they'd far rather play more games rather than train for weeks on end behind games.
I predict a  grassroots movement for change at the next Congress.

Grassroots ?

Grassroots is the club's, son who are delighted with the defined split season

Not so happy are the paid shills and expensed intercounty managers who have had a bit of power taken away from them.

Oh and the prawn sandwich crew which live for the days in Premium in "Croker" and would struggle to find their nearest club grounds

Maybe the Club Players Association with its 25,000 members should come back into being to lobby every CLUB delegate before every county convention, should any motion to erode what has been hard won come before Congress

Everybody who follows county has a club and is grassroots. It is not one or the other. People are happy with more time for clubs but not with the state of the all Ireland- things like not playing in August and September, the rushed nature of things, the lack of joined up thinking.

The current all Ireland system is not a solution. And club vs county is not a culture war. Most people are both. They want an all Ireland system that works.

Go on then

Give us a system that "works"

Because all I'm seeing everywhere is a whole load of lads that are making money out of the game whinging

But not offering a lot of workable solutions
Have you ever come across Michael Foley's analysis? He did it in last Sunday's sunday times.
There are too many matches that don't mean anything. The league has been devalued.The championship has elements of the league. And there is no margin.  I think the club idea is fine. It's how the championship is run

This is what he said : 


"The GAA aren't quite there yet with running the provincial championship in early spring before stretching a league-based all Ireland championship from April to early august "

What would you think of that ?

Firstly that's Michael Foleys solution not your own

Do you have a solution that isn't anyone else's ?

Secondly

Foleys solution adds a week at most to the intercounty season which isn't what the vast majority of anti split season proponents in the media are looking for.

They want a return to all Irelands in September

Thirdly

It's highly improbable that the GAA will ditch their second most important national competition


Here's what I'd do and I'm speaking purely from a hurling viewpoint

1.Every County needs at least 2 hybrid pitchs and every province at least one dome

The weather is changing and infrastructure needs to be put in  to recognise this and also allow for greater numbers playing our games

A trip to Iceland might open lads eyes in terms of sporting infrastructure

2.Intercounty season goes from January to end July

Club August to December

3.Put a cap on intercounty training sessions and a cap on team spending

Both are an out of control industry at the minute

You had that football manager from Roscommon claiming they had done 75 sessions in 80 days like it was some sort of badge of honor when even anyone with basic cop on would know that rest and recovery are more important than training

Counties allowed to start training end of November at the minute

Ban that also

County Training starts January

Players needs at least December off if they aren't involved in club finals

Monitor Enforce and Fine heavily if it's being broken

4.Scrap all early season competitions

Scrap League Semi finals

Scrap preliminary championship quarter finals

The winner of the Joe Mc Donagh plays Liam McCarthy the following year but get rid of the farce of the Joe McDonagh finalists taking trimmings every year in the preliminary quarter finals

All this frees up a min of 2 months in a 6 month schedule

5.Market the Games

Lads claiming that All Irelands in September inspires kids

We have had 120 odd Hurling Finals in September and Hurling hasn't grown outside of its traditional base in all that time

GAA marketing is a laughable oxymoron

The only time it's been effective is when the likes of Guinness have ran campaigns

Headhunt and hire in people who have worked with the rugby,they know how to turn a sows ear into a silk purse in terms of visibility engagement and ticket sales
#2
GAA Discussion / Re: GAA crowds
April 09, 2024, 10:27:02 AM
Quote from: seafoid on April 09, 2024, 09:31:59 AM
Quote from: clonadmad on April 08, 2024, 10:38:12 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 08, 2024, 10:30:06 PM
Quote from: Armagh18 on April 08, 2024, 10:22:21 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 08, 2024, 09:38:57 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on April 08, 2024, 04:00:01 PM
Quote from: Londoner89 on April 08, 2024, 01:36:20 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on April 08, 2024, 12:28:30 PMGreat article/ piece with Jim Mcguinness in today's Irish News, a full throated defence of USFC & the provincial series. He made the point, that has been made here before, that counties trying to compete v Dublin and Kerry need financial support and development plans to make them competitive  again - as a better alternative to just scrapping them.

The provincial structure is broken and most people just want them moved to the start of the season. Most counties voted for a structure in 2021 which would see them be played first followed by a league based championship. Now we've ended up with a structure which tries to please everyone and is condensed into half the year despite having more games.

If most counties voted that it would have been seen with the vote The current structure we have was voted in by Congress and any change will have to be done via Congress again.
Anyone I have spoken to recently about this said that the system doesn't work. There is no objection to making time for clubs but they all say there are too many games in too short a time period. People hope Jarlath burns will put some smacht on things. 
Too many games doesn't wash. Nearly everyone thats ever played will say they'd far rather play more games rather than train for weeks on end behind games.
I predict a  grassroots movement for change at the next Congress.

Grassroots ?

Grassroots is the club's, son who are delighted with the defined split season

Not so happy are the paid shills and expensed intercounty managers who have had a bit of power taken away from them.

Oh and the prawn sandwich crew which live for the days in Premium in "Croker" and would struggle to find their nearest club grounds

Maybe the Club Players Association with its 25,000 members should come back into being to lobby every CLUB delegate before every county convention, should any motion to erode what has been hard won come before Congress

Everybody who follows county has a club and is grassroots. It is not one or the other. People are happy with more time for clubs but not with the state of the all Ireland- things like not playing in August and September, the rushed nature of things, the lack of joined up thinking.

The current all Ireland system is not a solution. And club vs county is not a culture war. Most people are both. They want an all Ireland system that works.

Go on then

Give us a system that "works"

Because all I'm seeing everywhere is a whole load of lads that are making money out of the game whinging

But not offering a lot of workable solutions
#3
GAA Discussion / Re: GAA crowds
April 08, 2024, 10:38:12 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 08, 2024, 10:30:06 PM
Quote from: Armagh18 on April 08, 2024, 10:22:21 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 08, 2024, 09:38:57 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on April 08, 2024, 04:00:01 PM
Quote from: Londoner89 on April 08, 2024, 01:36:20 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on April 08, 2024, 12:28:30 PMGreat article/ piece with Jim Mcguinness in today's Irish News, a full throated defence of USFC & the provincial series. He made the point, that has been made here before, that counties trying to compete v Dublin and Kerry need financial support and development plans to make them competitive  again - as a better alternative to just scrapping them.

The provincial structure is broken and most people just want them moved to the start of the season. Most counties voted for a structure in 2021 which would see them be played first followed by a league based championship. Now we've ended up with a structure which tries to please everyone and is condensed into half the year despite having more games.

If most counties voted that it would have been seen with the vote The current structure we have was voted in by Congress and any change will have to be done via Congress again.
Anyone I have spoken to recently about this said that the system doesn't work. There is no objection to making time for clubs but they all say there are too many games in too short a time period. People hope Jarlath burns will put some smacht on things. 
Too many games doesn't wash. Nearly everyone thats ever played will say they'd far rather play more games rather than train for weeks on end behind games.
I predict a  grassroots movement for change at the next Congress.

Grassroots ?

Grassroots is the club's, son who are delighted with the defined split season

Not so happy are the paid shills and expensed intercounty managers who have had a bit of power taken away from them.

Oh and the prawn sandwich crew which live for the days in Premium in "Croker" and would struggle to find their nearest club grounds

Maybe the Club Players Association with its 25,000 members should come back into being to lobby every CLUB delegate before every county convention, should any motion to erode what has been hard won come before Congress
#4
GAA Discussion / Re: GAA crowds
April 08, 2024, 10:27:08 PM
Cahair O'Kane rightly calls bullshit


AH, April, the GAA calendar's middle child.

Just sitting minding its business, not really bothering anyone but feeling as though it's to blame for everything.

On Sunday, Monaghan and Cavan met in Clones.

Just 8,324 people showed up.

Thanks to the explosion of commentary around the meek attendance, we've learned that this was the first GAA championship match ever to be played in middling weather.

Storm Kathleen blew straight down the field in Clones. It didn't really rain or anything, but damn you anyway April.

If only we'd waited another few weeks for our standard three months of summer sunshine to begin, then the people would have flocked. Flocked, I tell ye!

On Saturday week, Derry play Donegal in Celtic Park.

Same competition. Same month. Fair good chance it'll even lash the rain.

Club committees have been investing heavily in reinforced glass from behind which they can tell members that there just aren't enough tickets.

In Derry, clubs have been given 10 seated tickets, 50 for the main terrace and 50 more for behind the goal. Many have restricted their allocations to just one-per-person.

When those two counties met in the 1993 Ulster final, the Donegal Democrat's preview of the match began by recalling how not even 5,000 people had turned up when they'd met three years previous.

The game had clashed with Ireland's World Cup game against Egypt, just as the same two counties would clash with the 2002 penalty shootout against Spain.

On July 18, 1993, Clones was a mudbath. The rain didn't take time to fall out of the sky.

In the minor game, Cathal Scullion from Derry broke his leg.

Neither side has ever really deviated from the sentiment that the senior game should never have gone ahead.

It's nine months since Dublin and Kerry met in the 2023 All-Ireland final on the last day of July.

Every third head in the crowd was covered by a yellow mac bought on the streets outside Croke Park. It poured non-stop for two hours.

But April

Yeah, the old Club Month. Could we not go back to that utopia? Sure didn't the clubs have it great, they got their lads for a full month.

Except county training carried on, and naturally that's where they went.

And inter-county challenge games too.

And sure what odds about club games in April really? Best not to chance it in case you pick up a knock.

Who the hell would blame them for that? It was a total nonsense of an operation with no winners.

Some counties, particularly big dual counties, were so desperate for space in the calendar that they threw in two rounds of club championship in April.

By the end of game two, hundreds of young lads were off looking for their J1 visa, their footballing year over already.

Could we not go back to that though?

Because All-Ireland finals in July just don't hit the same, apparently.

Look at the thousands of empty seats in Croke Park last summer.

Of the 82,300 capacity for the All-Ireland football and hurling finals there were only... er... *checks notes*... 82,300 there.

That there were only 43,192 people at Derry's semi-final against Kerry was deemed worthy of note.

Must be because we're playing championship in April now.

2004 was the second-highest attended football championship in history, drawing in 1.157m spectators at the gates, second only to the previous year.

When Derry and Kerry met at the same stage in the stadium at The Proper Time For An All-Ireland Semi-Final, there were 35,457 at it.

Only five years ago, just 33,848 turned up for a Kerry-Tyrone semi-final in the middle of August.

But damn you April and your split season, go on out of the road with ye.
#5
GAA Discussion / Re: GAA crowds
April 08, 2024, 10:03:08 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 08, 2024, 09:38:57 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on April 08, 2024, 04:00:01 PM
Quote from: Londoner89 on April 08, 2024, 01:36:20 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on April 08, 2024, 12:28:30 PMGreat article/ piece with Jim Mcguinness in today's Irish News, a full throated defence of USFC & the provincial series. He made the point, that has been made here before, that counties trying to compete v Dublin and Kerry need financial support and development plans to make them competitive  again - as a better alternative to just scrapping them.

The provincial structure is broken and most people just want them moved to the start of the season. Most counties voted for a structure in 2021 which would see them be played first followed by a league based championship. Now we've ended up with a structure which tries to please everyone and is condensed into half the year despite having more games.

If most counties voted that it would have been seen with the vote The current structure we have was voted in by Congress and any change will have to be done via Congress again.
Anyone I have spoken to recently about this said that the system doesn't work. There is no objection to making time for clubs but they all say there are too many games in too short a time period. People hope Jarlath burns will put some smacht on things. 

You clearly don't know how things work expecting Burns to effect some sort of change in your hope that the clubs will be put back in their box

#7
Having read through the 11 pages of the actual report,it would be handed back to an Economics Undergraduate and He/She would be told to consider another career route

The Authors base their case for starters on an assumption that they know the amount of UK subvention into NI every Year,which is news to anyone versed in these matters as the UK government has never stated an exact total or given an exact breakdown

They then assume that a UI would need to match the current NI contribution to a UK defence Budget,(no thanks Lads,We wont be paying for Trident or Aircraft Carriers)or continue to pay a pro rata portion of UK Debt AFTER NI had left the UK or that the UK would reneage on pension contributions by NI workers paid into the UK pension pot when NI was part of the Uk.

Those 3 areas alone come to anywhere between £5 and £7 bn per annum.

it also assumes that growth rates and productivity are stuck to the floor over the next 20 years, takes no account of the savings or synergy brought about by an All Island Economy and takes no account of inputs from the likes of the EU or FDI going into the 6 counties at 26 counties levels.
#8
Laois / Re: Underage squads 2024
April 04, 2024, 03:32:35 PM
Quote from: Ogie on April 03, 2024, 09:00:06 PMWhy have we no county U19 development hurling team when offaly, dublin, Wexford & kilkenny do ??

Massive problem at club level too, no hurling for a huge amount of players at their own age until maybe October every year,
We need an U19 club competition to bring players through from minor the previous year, especially 'lesser lights' that won't make senior teams straight away.

Laois were asked but weren't either interested or couldn't get mentors

5 Munster counties plus Galway also playing an u19 competition

Winners of both groups to play each other in a Final
#9
Laois / Re: Underage squads 2024
March 28, 2024, 01:57:19 PM
Quote from: Blueforever on March 28, 2024, 01:03:42 PMWell maybe it's time to contact the Dep of Education and find out why the CBS refuse to promote our national game all these Schools are funded by the National Purse ie the taxpayer

I'm sure the Department of Education has more pressing issues than worrying about a school in Laois and their lack of interest in the GAA



#10
Laois / Re: Underage squads 2024
March 28, 2024, 10:35:24 AM
Quote from: Sanny on March 27, 2024, 11:10:52 PM
Quote from: Blueforever on March 27, 2024, 09:28:12 PMIf we needed to know the state of football and hurling underage in the country we got our answer tonight and last Saturday in Hawkfield.The scandal ofthe lack of promotion Gaelic games in Portlaoise and Mountmellick is disgraceful.if neither clubs is unable or unwilling to improve there lot the country board has a duty to intervene as it's their brief to promote Gaelic games in the country imagine the big schools in both towns playing in B and C competition and unless something is done Country footballers will be vying with Waterford and London to see who Ellie's can reach Division 3 and our hurlers will be competing with the likes of meath and Kerry for many years to come

Many other clubs represented in these schools other than Portlaoise & Mountmellick. Very unfair to suggest the clubs are unwilling to improve the standards in the school. The schools themselves have a responsibility too but must be aligned with proper structured support from the county board . This is not happening enough in the secondary schools in Laois. Portlaoise have a GDO going into the primary schools in the town but this is a massive job. I'm not sure about Mountmellick?

In order to improve the standards in all secondary schools in the county it needs buy in from the school staff , county board and clubs . This is not happening.


Portlaoise CBS is one of the biggest boys schools in the country and has no interest in the promotion or development of Gaelic Games within the school.

You could blame the county board for a lot of things but not in this instance when all efforts at coaching assistance and supports have been rebuffed.

It was the only 1 of the 12 second level schools in the county not to engage in a Laois Schools initiative put in place by the Laois Coaching set up recently.
#11
Laois / Re: Underage squads 2024
March 16, 2024, 12:29:56 PM
Quote from: Hurling123 on March 15, 2024, 07:24:47 PMSeeing the minor hurling squad several times this year. I think I could count 15 of the this year u16s with them .
  I experienced them against Westmeath a couple of weeks ago .

Dreadful what happened that night.
Management alot to answer for

What was "dreadful" ?
#12
Laois / Re: Schools/Colleges Hurling and football
February 10, 2024, 05:38:45 PM
Quote from: burdizzo on February 05, 2024, 05:02:43 PMHard luck to Heywood, beaten 2-27 to 4-15 after extra time today. Should really have won it in normal time when they were awarded a late free, but it hit the post and went wide, unfortunately. In extra time there were three Heywood lads put off, and one from Banagher. Ref. seemed hard on Heywood, but you'd have to say Banagher were the slightly better team.
Eight lads from Abbeyleix, two from The Harps, two from Ballinakill, two from Ballyragget, and one from Clonad on the starting line-up for Heywood.

The Ref was far from hard on Heywood who had 2 lads getting reds for headbutts and an injured squad player who was acting as umpire getting sent off in the first 5/6 mins of the first half of extra time and another lad getting the line in the second half of extra time.

Couple that with the sendings off of the seniors the day before and it's a common theme of Laois hurling with indiscipline costing them hugely
#13
Quote from: seafoid on November 30, 2023, 08:24:38 AM
Quote from: twohands!!! on November 28, 2023, 11:45:35 AM
Quote from: blasmere on November 28, 2023, 09:20:34 AM
Quote from: didlyi on November 25, 2023, 06:58:42 PM
Quote from: Ciarrai_thuaidh on November 25, 2023, 12:09:24 PM
Quote from: didlyi on November 24, 2023, 09:33:42 PM
Quote from: Ciarrai_thuaidh on November 23, 2023, 10:44:33 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on November 22, 2023, 11:26:41 AM
Quote from: Ciarrai_thuaidh on November 22, 2023, 11:20:57 AMI must say I find it hilarious when hurling people get on their high horse about the state of hurling in Cavan and Fermanagh.

In Cork, Kilkenny, Limerick, Tipperary football has been treated like sh*t for years. Kilkenny don't even pretend to bother any more.

So I'll listen to arguments about what needs to be done for Cavan hurling when those counties treat football equally.

Did Tipp not play in an All Ireland semi final recently? Cork have won the All Ireland a good few times, Kilkenny compete in the lower end of football Junior I think, and have won it a few times, as for Limerick, they always had a decent team, maybe Waterford and Antrim would have been a better example of underperforming or underfunding ..

These things I wouldn't find hilarious, but each to their own

"Kilkenny compete in the Junior"..😂😂😂 Well - you really disproved my argument, I surrender.
In case you're not aware, that competition is for native born Americans and English players and is played semi-final/final on same weekend like some Féile blitz. That's the level of effort Kilkenny are putting into football. What about club football in Kilkenny? How is that organised pray tell?

I've lived in Tipperary and Cork. Both county boards completely dominated by hurling heads. Officials and coaches in both counties actively discourage dual players playing football. That's quite well known.

There are hardcore football clubs and people in both counties, especially in West Cork which is a heartland of football but the board has treated them like shit to varying degrees over the years. Cork should be a dominant football county but aren't. Why? I could fill a book with stories.
A few years ago at one state the Senior hurlers were training in a college gym in Cork city, paid for by board - while the footballers were forced to rent a warehouse in Fermoy and kit it out themselves. Look up how far Fermoy is from Castlehaven, Bantry or Rosscarbery where footballers were travelling from.
As soon as any talented dual player enters a Cork squad system they are told giving up football is one of the keys to progressing. The large traditional hurling Clubs like Midleton, Sars, Blackrock, Glen Rovers, Na Piarsaigh treat football with absolute spite. The irony being that the one true dual city club who don't - St Finbarrs - excel in both codes because of it.

So to be perfectly honest laughter is all I offer when I hear hurling heads bleating about Leitrim or Cavan hurling. If Hurling snobs ran the GAA and got their wish, football would be banned.
Hurling is a good sport and anyone who wants to play it should be given the opportunity to do so but what hurling people don't seem to get or want to admit though is that
north of the Dublin-Galway line - as Martin Fogarty outlined in many interviews since quitting his role with GAA - there is very little interest in hurling. Hurling is strong in the rich farming counties mainly. There are well documented historical reasons for this.


Not sure how you can draw a comparison between Tipp and Cork and Cavan and Louth. Tipp and Cork like most of the hurling counties have a healthy respect for football and the numbers participating is testament to that. Just because its not the holy grail as it is in Kerry should be no reason to have a cut at them. We all know the same is not true of Cavan and Louth where hurling is almost non existent. Maybe its just a Kerry thing, hurling somehow undermines their superiority complex.

The bolded bit is absolute nonsense. I've lived in Cork for a long time and been involved in GAA at club level.
As I outlined in previous posts, Football is looked on with disdain by the hurling dominated board in Cork (and Tipp) and any meagre success is in spite of this and down to a handful of hardcore football people largely from West or Northwest of Cork or other isolated pockets like Nemo Rangers in the city.

Anyone prepared to discuss how football is treated in Kilkenny? I won't hold my breath.
I wont disagree with you but honestly is their respect for football any worse than Kerrys respect for hurling?

You mentioned Kilkenny, appreciate only in relation to the other post, but that's why I mentioned it, there is literally no comparison between the two in this instance, maybe other football dominant counties with teams at the very bottom of the hurling levels, even though I appreciate that there's hurling mad people in those counties, they maybe don't get the backing they should, certainly not by the GAA, judging by the recent proposal.

Yeah with very little inside knowledge of how hurling is treated in Kerry - Kerry are a fairly well-established top-half intercounty hurling county and would seem to have a healthy club hurling scene with hurling seeming to growing (albeit slowly) in the county from what I've read/heard.  Obviously hurling would be 2nd in terms of priorities but I would have said no real comparison with how Kilkenny treat football.
The Kerry hurling enclave is similar to the ones in Down and Antrim. It is too small to launch an all Ireland team. Clare and Offaly would be the next smallest in terms of hurling footprint. 

Jesus Wept

Yet another example of you not have a clue of what your talking about

the Hurling Area in Clare is bigger than the actual Size of Offaly itself

Clare would have not far off double the number of registered Hurling Players Offaly would have
#14
Laois / Re: Laois SHC 2023
September 02, 2023, 02:22:40 AM
The reality is that we have 3 top level senior teams and then a gap

We had 4 for a few years with Borris

The question is to how to make it a competitive championship so that we don't have the spectacle of dead rubbers in round 3

My suggestion

10 teams
2 groups of 5
Previous years finalists seeded and drawn into the 2 groups

4 game round robin series and take the games out of O'Moore Park

Everyone gets 2 home games

Group Winner goes to a semi final

Grouo Second plays opposite group third in 2 semifinals with the second team in each group having home advantage

Group Fourth plays opposite group fifth in 2 relegation semis ditto 4th placed teams having home advantage

Relegation final

One goes down,one comes up

It's immaterial whether you call it premier intermediate or intermediate

It's the second level and the winner plays in the provincial intermediate championship.
#15
Laois / Re: Laois SHC 2023
September 02, 2023, 02:11:49 AM
Quote from: Keyser Söze on September 01, 2023, 04:44:15 PM
Quote from: Laois man on August 31, 2023, 10:23:13 PM
Who is your 9s team?

Camross
Clough Ballacolla
Rathdowney Errill
Abbeyleix
Rosenallis
The Harps
Clonaslee
Colt Shanahoe
Mountmellick

So you'd promote Clonaslee and Mountmellick who are currently intermediate,into the senior championship over every team in the Premier Intermediate Championship?

Jesus wept