This happen to anyone else yet? Got the bad news on Friday last, disaster, no work in construction, looks like Dubai for me.
Sorry to hear that mate...Its a f**ker when it happens been there once or twice myself over the years.
Whats happening in Dubai? Is their Irish companies over there?
Sorry to hear Mayo4Sam.
In my line of business, I'm seeing a lot of people getting laid off and businesses folding.
Really sorry to hear that.
Just about keeping my head above water too :-\
take it as an opportunity to go and enjoy yourself!
Yeh tough one sorry..
Work for Jobseekers Allowance myself...
My jobs pretty safe!
just heard from my sister in law that shes been made redundant. in banking. not good. great salary and car all gone. building trades are getting hammered and all the firms that supply them are also letting people go or closing. engineering is still going strong but how long can it last. get into teaching lads its the only way :'(
Quoteengineering is still going strong but how long can it last.
Have a couple of friends in engineering. One got laid off there a couple of weeks back and the other survived but there were a brave few laid off in his firm so I wouldn't say its safe at all.
Most sectors are gonna be shaky with construction and it's peripheral industries as always bearing the brunt. As the problem is global a lot of the big multinationals with sites in Ireland may start to consolidate and pull their resource back home. I've been on the receiving end of that scenario before!
Teachers in the north will prob start getting laid off in the next few years when all these schools start to amalgamate. Maybe the threat of the axe might focus their attention a wee bit over the next while!
Quote from: TacadoirArdMhacha on October 16, 2008, 08:16:56 PM
Quoteengineering is still going strong but how long can it last.
Have a couple of friends in engineering. One got laid off there a couple of weeks back and the other survived but there were a brave few laid off in his firm so I wouldn't say its safe at all.
engineering firms that export goods seem to be ok. firms that are producing for the local market are getting it tight.
Looks as if this has a long way to go to bottom out. I have a few friends who are self employed, all have reported a drop in their work with one stating that he has two weeks work than thats that, Traditionally painters and decoraters do well at this time of year with people getting ready for Christmas, but this work seems to be drying up as well according to one.
Quote from: Square Ball on October 16, 2008, 08:27:48 PM
Looks as if this has a long way to go to bottom out. I have a few friends who are self employed, all have reported a drop in their work with one stating that he has two weeks work than thats that, Traditionally painters and decoraters do well at this time of year with people getting ready for Christmas, but this work seems to be drying up as well according to one.
True in some cases the work isn't there for self employed tradesmen,but in a lot of cases they are just sitting on their holes waiting for the phone to ring for their next job instead of going out and trying to get the work in
Quote from: The Real Laoislad on October 16, 2008, 08:30:45 PM
Quote from: Square Ball on October 16, 2008, 08:27:48 PM
Looks as if this has a long way to go to bottom out. I have a few friends who are self employed, all have reported a drop in their work with one stating that he has two weeks work than thats that, Traditionally painters and decoraters do well at this time of year with people getting ready for Christmas, but this work seems to be drying up as well according to one.
True in some cases the work isn't there for self employed tradesmen,but in a lot of cases they are just sitting on their holes waiting for the phone to ring for their next job instead of going out and trying to get the work in
Not fair.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on October 16, 2008, 08:31:44 PM
Quote from: The Real Laoislad on October 16, 2008, 08:30:45 PM
Quote from: Square Ball on October 16, 2008, 08:27:48 PM
Looks as if this has a long way to go to bottom out. I have a few friends who are self employed, all have reported a drop in their work with one stating that he has two weeks work than thats that, Traditionally painters and decoraters do well at this time of year with people getting ready for Christmas, but this work seems to be drying up as well according to one.
True in some cases the work isn't there for self employed tradesmen,but in a lot of cases they are just sitting on their holes waiting for the phone to ring for their next job instead of going out and trying to get the work in
Not fair.
Why
Because I know a lot struggling and none of them are like you describe.
I disagree as well LL. Most of them advertis in the local papers, do flyers and one has his own web site, which again he advertises, they are very pro active in getting out there and looking for work.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on October 16, 2008, 08:36:01 PM
Because I know a lot struggling and none of them are like you describe.
And I know plenty who do nothing but complain all day that they have no work etc,I would ask them then if they had rang any of their old customers,or advertise or ring old bosses to see if they would subcontract work out to them or anything that might throw up a job for them and all you hear is I couldn't be bothered I didn't ever have to do that ::)
Right fair enough maybe saying in a lot of cases was a bit unfair but I do know plenty who would rather complain about having no work than actually go do something about it
Quote
And I know plenty who do nothing but complain all day that they have no work etc,I would ask them then if they had rang any of their old customers,or advertise or ring old bosses to see if they would subcontract work out to them or anything that might throw up a job for them and all you hear is I couldn't be bothered I didn't ever have to do that
Well they're probably Dubs or Laois men.
Quote from: The Real Laoislad on October 16, 2008, 08:40:14 PM
but I do know plenty who would rather complain about having no work than actually go do something about it
Too true TRLL
Quote from: The Real Laoislad on October 16, 2008, 08:40:14 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on October 16, 2008, 08:36:01 PM
Because I know a lot struggling and none of them are like you describe.
And I know plenty who do nothing but complain all day that they have no work etc,I would ask them then if they had rang any of their old customers,or advertise or ring old bosses to see if they would subcontract work out to them or anything that might throw up a job for them and all you hear is I couldn't be bothered I didn't ever have to do that ::)
Right fair enough maybe saying in a lot of cases was a bit unfair but I do know plenty who would rather complain about having no work than actually go do something about it
I have no time either for lazy bollixes who sit on their holes and wait for a job to hit them up the face
QuoteI have no time either for lazy bollixes who sit on their holes and wait for a job to hit them up the face
and then the run away from it when it does come.
I offered a lad a job a few weeks back, told him we could "only" pay him €120 a day and he turned it down. Said he wouldnt get out of bed for it. I was talking to him yesterday, he is still not working and hasnt bothered to sign on.
Quote from: Down Gael on October 16, 2008, 08:51:59 PM
I offered a lad a job a few weeks back, told him we could "only" pay him €120 a day and he turned it down. Said he wouldnt get out of bed for it. I was talking to him yesterday, he is still not working and hasnt bothered to sign on.
What was the job?
Tough times at the minute certainly. Best of luck Mayo4Sam.
Have a couple of mates in construction who are fearing the chop tomorrow. All but likely. Both with houses, wemen and kids.
Although i dont have a big pile of sympathy for one of them.
He put an ad in the paper about 6 months ago (Newry Reporter) giving the home and mobile no of one of the boys who claimed he was looking for brickies.
He said he had about 30 calls between 6pm and 7pm on the evening the paper came out.
Had to turn off his mobile and disconnect his phone for a full week. It was the poor fellas thinking this was genuine and making the calls i felt sorry for.
Quote from: Down Gael on October 16, 2008, 08:51:59 PM
I offered a lad a job a few weeks back, told him we could "only" pay him €120 a day and he turned it down. Said he wouldnt get out of bed for it. I was talking to him yesterday, he is still not working and hasnt bothered to sign on.
Thats alot of the problem - a pile of these twentysomething cubs are too used to having too much cash. 120 a day is good money for a lad. I'd be well happy with it myself if I had nothing else!
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on October 16, 2008, 07:39:33 PM
This happen to anyone else yet? Got the bad news on Friday last, disaster, no work in construction, looks like Dubai for me.
Sorry to hear that chief, get away to Oz or Dubai and remind us what the sun looks like...
Jesus, sorry to hear that pal - plenty in the same boat from what I hear, dark times. Economy going to shite over here too but still plenty of construction going on, and the Euro is worth double the Aussie dollar. Sydney Airport is like Ellis Island back in the day apparently, Italians and Irish all queuing up
A big subbie went bust on our sote last week, he had 70 lads on our site alone so god know how many in total ( 200 easy). Of course he is gone with the cash but the lads on the ground are left short a week or 2 wages.
Quote from: stephenite on October 16, 2008, 10:46:04 PM
Jesus, sorry to hear that pal - plenty in the same boat from what I hear, dark times. Economy going to shite over here too but still plenty of construction going on, and the Euro is worth double the Aussie dollar. Sydney Airport is like Ellis Island back in the day apparently, Italians and Irish all queuing up
There is feck all construction work to be had in Sydney at the moment unless you have a trade. 2 mates of mine came over a few weeks ago and can't find any work as labourers. Brisbane & Perth seem to be the best bet for construction work at the moment.
I work in IT as a tester and my contract is up in 3 weeks and I'm struggling to line up any interviews, seems to be feck all work around. It looks like it will be back to sheering sheep for me fairly soon.
Quote from: Down Gael on October 16, 2008, 08:51:59 PM
I offered a lad a job a few weeks back, told him we could "only" pay him €120 a day and he turned it down. Said he wouldnt get out of bed for it. I was talking to him yesterday, he is still not working and hasnt bothered to sign on.
Gee - € 120 a day is good money - what sort of money was he on before ??
Its been on the cards now for a few months, we've been designing lots of jobs but none going to site, can see a lot of contractors going to the wall, without residential construction it leaves it tight for a lot of companies.
sorry to hear that mayo. i am in retail myself the money is just ok but at least i will have a job for life if i keep my nose clean
Have you thought about headin across the pond to London? There should be loads of jobs on the Olympic site?
Sorry to hear the bad news man. Lots of people taking a serious hosing at the moment. I was first made redundent during the dot con crash years back. Forced into contracting, so basically been self employed ever since. Had a couple of spells out of work in that time too, probably mounting up 6 months altogether. Depends on your family situation but it's a chance to make a change, or as suggested sit this one out somewhere else in the world with a good exchange rate. Saving that, do a course, but definitely keep on the move & active, redundancy can be very demoralising if you let it get into your head, and you can end up losing more than your job.
Sorry to hear that Mayo. Never a nice time to get that news. Unfortunately I fear it is news that a lot more are going to get in the next months. The place is fecked.
Quote from: Mentalman on October 17, 2008, 12:16:21 AM
Sorry to hear the bad news man. Lots of people taking a serious hosing at the moment. I was first made redundent during the dot con crash years back. Forced into contracting, so basically been self employed ever since. Had a couple of spells out of work in that time too, probably mounting up 6 months altogether. Depends on your family situation but it's a chance to make a change, or as suggested sit this one out somewhere else in the world with a good exchange rate. Saving that, do a course, but definitely keep on the move & active, redundancy can be very demoralising if you let it get into your head, and you can end up losing more than your job.
Very good advice mentalman.The main thing is to not start lying in bed all day and not getting up,Its the worse thing you could do.
Get up out of bed and even if a job isn't coming just stay active
Quote from: The Real Laoislad on October 17, 2008, 12:29:50 AM
Quote from: Mentalman on October 17, 2008, 12:16:21 AM
Sorry to hear the bad news man. Lots of people taking a serious hosing at the moment. I was first made redundent during the dot con crash years back. Forced into contracting, so basically been self employed ever since. Had a couple of spells out of work in that time too, probably mounting up 6 months altogether. Depends on your family situation but it's a chance to make a change, or as suggested sit this one out somewhere else in the world with a good exchange rate. Saving that, do a course, but definitely keep on the move & active, redundancy can be very demoralising if you let it get into your head, and you can end up losing more than your job.
Very good advice mentalman.The main thing is to not start lying in bed all day and not getting up,Its the worse thing you could do.
Get up out of bed and even if a job isn't coming just stay active
Unfortunately it's something I learned myself the hard way. But sure what doesn't kill you makes you stronger.
Quote from: The Real Laoislad on October 17, 2008, 12:01:49 AM
Have you thought about headin across the pond to London? There should be loads of jobs on the Olympic site?
Word is that the Poles have that sewn up, a few months ago some of the Birmingham lot were for heading down there and couldn't get a look in. Mind you they were probably looking too much money. They would be easier talked to now.
Sorry to hear that chief...A mate of mine is heading to Dubai as well so as he was offered a good post there as a QS to work with a large Irish team they have assembled for out there, i think he said he'll be there before Christmas...If you do decide to go give me a shout and i'll give you his contact details...
Quote from: maddog on October 17, 2008, 08:19:55 AM
Quote from: The Real Laoislad on October 17, 2008, 12:01:49 AM
Have you thought about headin across the pond to London? There should be loads of jobs on the Olympic site?
Word is that the Poles have that sewn up, a few months ago some of the Birmingham lot were for heading down there and couldn't get a look in. Mind you they were probably looking too much money. They would be easier talked to now.
Sorry to hear that mayo4sam . I'm pricing the plastering of the inside of a house at the moment and the prices i'm getting from some irish lads in unreal they don't seem to wnat to drop their prices at all maybe because their is so little work out there they are trying to make a kill on the houses that they do get.
If anyone who has no ties could do worse than heading to Alberta Canada. Huge labour shortages and salaries of st£100k for skilled workers.
Quote from: under the bar on October 17, 2008, 10:13:40 AM
If anyone who has no ties could do worse than heading to Alberta Canada. Huge labour shortages and salaries of st£100k for skilled workers.
Top country too, absolutely beautiful.
Quote from: under the bar on October 17, 2008, 10:13:40 AM
If anyone who has no ties could do worse than heading to Alberta Canada. Huge labour shortages and salaries of st£100k for skilled workers.
what's the situation regarding visa's etc?
Where did your thread apologising to Donagh go?
Quote from: donalmac99 on October 17, 2008, 11:23:57 AM
Quote from: under the bar on October 17, 2008, 10:13:40 AM
If anyone who has no ties could do worse than heading to Alberta Canada. Huge labour shortages and salaries of st£100k for skilled workers.
what's the situation regarding visa's etc?
Points based system similar to Australia - age, marital status, desirable skills and family connections all feed into an overall score.
Quote from: Mentalman on October 17, 2008, 11:26:36 AM
Quote from: donalmac99 on October 17, 2008, 11:23:57 AM
Quote from: under the bar on October 17, 2008, 10:13:40 AM
If anyone who has no ties could do worse than heading to Alberta Canada. Huge labour shortages and salaries of st£100k for skilled workers.
what's the situation regarding visa's etc?
Points based system similar to Australia - age, marital status, desirable skills and family connections all feed into an overall score.
cheers :)
Quote from: under the bar on October 17, 2008, 10:13:40 AM
If anyone who has no ties could do worse than heading to Alberta Canada. Huge labour shortages and salaries of st£100k for skilled workers.
That's money !
Ah well. That rules me out. I have a wardrobe full of ties, and about a dozen shirts as well! ;D
By the way, I'll be in Dubai myself on my Ulster Bank paid for jolly in November, if you (or anyone else) wants to hook up
Quote from: T Fearon on October 17, 2008, 04:47:22 PM
Ah well. That rules me out. I have a wardrobe full of ties, and about a dozen shirts as well! ;D
By the way, I'll be in Dubai myself on my Ulster Bank paid for jolly in November, if you (or anyone else) wants to hook up
Make sure you go to the right bar this time ;)
best of luck to mayo4sam and any of our other friends of the board who are having it tough at this time
tony, you might want some ideas of where to go etc in dubai..was there last month myself...
pm me your email address
Quote from: Diet Coke on October 16, 2008, 08:59:39 PM
Quote from: Down Gael on October 16, 2008, 08:51:59 PM
I offered a lad a job a few weeks back, told him we could "only" pay him €120 a day and he turned it down. Said he wouldnt get out of bed for it. I was talking to him yesterday, he is still not working and hasnt bothered to sign on.
What was the job?
Painter
Quote from: orangeman on October 16, 2008, 11:05:26 PM
Gee - € 120 a day is good money - what sort of money was he on before ??
Probably €150 - €180 a day. Thats into his hand.
That offer was made 6 weeks ago, he hasnt earned a penny since.
He probably thought you couldn't/wouldn't pay him.
If you have no money coming in surely anything at alls better than anything! I'd have to terminate his JSA claim for not actively seeking work.......
€120 per day jeez thats nothing to be laughed at, €600 a week is not bad in my book
The little bollix doesn't deserve a f**king job
Quote from: pintsofguinness on October 17, 2008, 07:39:50 PM
He probably thought you couldn't/wouldn't pay him.
He thinks he is worth more than €120 a day. €600 a week into the sky rocket isnt bad money, especially when you arent working and its getting close to Christmas. A lot of people seem to over value themselves. 3 years ago we were all on better money, but those days are gone. Brickies are the same. I know one team of brickies who wont accept less than top dollar for work. Granted they are good workers, but they arent earning at the minute. Thats ok until the savings run out. And I know in one case that day is very very close.
Sure that's nuts. No matter how good you are you'll only ever get what people are prepared to pay. At the minute clients have a lot of tradesmen by the short ones due to the jack of work.
Quote from: Down Gael on October 17, 2008, 10:22:32 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on October 17, 2008, 07:39:50 PM
He probably thought you couldn't/wouldn't pay him.
He thinks he is worth more than €120 a day. €600 a week into the sky rocket isnt bad money, especially when you arent working and its getting close to Christmas. A lot of people seem to over value themselves. 3 years ago we were all on better money, but those days are gone. Brickies are the same. I know one team of brickies who wont accept less than top dollar for work. Granted they are good workers, but they arent earning at the minute. Thats ok until the savings run out. And I know in one case that day is very very close.
€ 600 for 5 days into your pocket is damn good money - I'd say he'll be in touch before too long.
See Taggart Holdings has gone into administration. Maybe the fancy dan that runs it will have to cancel Lionel Richie for his xmas party and downsize to Malachi Cush!
Quote from: Tony Baloney on October 21, 2008, 10:06:34 PM
See Taggart Holdings has gone into administration. Maybe the fancy dan that runs it will have to cancel Lionel Richie for his xmas party and downsize to Malachi Cush!
That will be "muuurder" for them........
Quote from: under the bar on October 17, 2008, 10:13:40 AM
If anyone who has no ties could do worse than heading to Alberta Canada. Huge labour shortages and salaries of st£100k for skilled workers.
How long could you go for without a visa, or do you need one no matter what the lenght?
Quote from: Doire abú on October 21, 2008, 11:47:06 PM
Quote from: under the bar on October 17, 2008, 10:13:40 AM
If anyone who has no ties could do worse than heading to Alberta Canada. Huge labour shortages and salaries of st£100k for skilled workers.
How long could you go for without a visa, or do you need one no matter what the lenght?
Under the Bar, are the positions in the oil fields up there and are you working there?
Quote from: Tony Baloney on October 21, 2008, 10:06:34 PM
See Taggart Holdings has gone into administration. Maybe the fancy dan that runs it will have to cancel Lionel Richie for his xmas party and downsize to Malachi Cush!
Lionel Richie for his xmas party ??????????
You're taking the piss !
I see the Irish News are saying this morning that another 2 well known builders in the north will be going to the wall.....
Not good news....
Am Sorry to hear about Taggart Holdings, Michael Taggart was always a good man for a lift in the Olde Helicopter if you needed somewhere in a hurry
Taggart going into administration will mean tough times for a lot of tradesmen about mid-ulster and further afield - black friday could be very black for a lot of lads this Christmas. When will the helicopter be going up on eBay??
Quote from: Maroon Heaven on October 22, 2008, 10:32:17 AM
Michael Taggart was always a good man for a lift in the Olde Helicopter if you needed somewhere in a hurry
I never missed a day nor went on strike for better pay
For twenty years I served the best I could
Now with a handshake and a check it seems so easy to forget
Loyalty through the bad times and through good
The owner says he's sad to see that things have got so bad
But the captains of industry won't let him lose
He still drives a car and smokes his cigar
And still he takes his family on a cruise, he'll never lose
Quote from: Maroon Heaven on October 22, 2008, 10:32:17 AM
I see the Irish News are saying this morning that another 2 well known builders in the north will be going to the wall.....
Not good news....
Am Sorry to hear about Taggart Holdings, Michael Taggart was always a good man for a lift in the Olde Helicopter if you needed somewhere in a hurry
Any ideas on who they are ??
I've worked till the sweat near had me bet with Russian, Czech and Pole
On shuddering jams up in the hydro dams or underneath the Thames in a hole
I grafted hard and I've got me cards and many a gangers fist across me ears
If you pride your life, don't join, by Christ, with McAlpine's Fusiliers
Quote from: orangeman on October 22, 2008, 10:00:49 AM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on October 21, 2008, 10:06:34 PM
See Taggart Holdings has gone into administration. Maybe the fancy dan that runs it will have to cancel Lionel Richie for his xmas party and downsize to Malachi Cush!
Lionel Richie for his xmas party ??????????
You're taking the piss !
Yes about the Xmas party, but he had Lionel and Van The Man playing at his wedding a couple of years back. I don't think he'll get much sympathy but I have a feeling the little man employed by him will feel the pinch at the end of it all rather than Mr. Taggart.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on October 22, 2008, 01:37:59 PM
Quote from: orangeman on October 22, 2008, 10:00:49 AM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on October 21, 2008, 10:06:34 PM
See Taggart Holdings has gone into administration. Maybe the fancy dan that runs it will have to cancel Lionel Richie for his xmas party and downsize to Malachi Cush!
Lionel Richie for his xmas party ??????????
You're taking the piss !
Yes about the Xmas party, but he had Lionel and Van The Man playing at his wedding a couple of years back. I don't think he'll get much sympathy but I have a feeling the little man employed by him will feel the pinch at the end of it all rather than Mr. Taggart.
How much would Lionel and Van the Man be for a wedding gig ?
£5k a piece ???
Add another 2 zeroes - I reckon half a mill might get you the pair.
QuoteI see the Irish News are saying this morning that another 2 well known builders in the north will be going to the wall.....
Taggart homes situation has been well known for most of a year now. Many more to follow in the next 6-12 months. I know of 6 who will be going into administration. Just think of the developers that were building houses at the fastest rate. All are teetering if not already over the brink.
Lionel and Van Morrison are a myth apparently. Cara Dillon may have been the only one.
No surprise that it's happened to Taggarts.
I think our corporate recovery dept are feeling a bit like ambulance chasers these days but if recovery specialists are called in early enough, it's sometimes enough to save them.
Quoteare the positions in the oil fields up there and are you working there?
The oil sands have lain dormant for decades as the price of oil did not make it economical to extract.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/01/20/60minutes/main1225184.shtml
Now they can't extract it fast enough with 100's of oil-workers arriving every week causing a huge shortage of houses, roads, schools etc in Northern Alberta. It's like the gold rush all over again. Many run of the mill businesses from all over Canada relocating there to take advantage of the situation.
I've relations in Fort McMurray who moved there from Ontario. They say that joiners, plasters and other construction industry workers are in very high demand and getting top dollar.
Taggarts & A House Deal With A Difference
Michael Taggart, like others in the property business, has an unassuming way.
He might have arrived in Belfast from Derry by helicopter for this meeting, but there's nothing flash or ostentatious about the North West-based businessman who heads up Taggart Holdings alongside his brother John.
He's also more open and forthcoming than some of his property counterparts about his business, his plans and how things work in the group he controls
Taggart Holdings might not be a household name....yet. But it made the headlines last summer when it clinched the biggest deal to hit the residential property land market here.
On the last business day of June, it completed the purchase of Fraser Estates Ltd from Fred Fraser and his family in a deal backed by Goodbody Stockbrokers and financed by Bank of Ireland in Belfast.
That meant that 87 acres of residential development land in Castlereagh Borough and in Coleraine changed hands at a stroke.
It's just the latest big deal for a company which has been growing rapidly in recent years.
Founded in 1989 by John & Michael Taggart, the company initially built houses in its native North West. Today it is active in Northern Ireland, in the Republic, in the UK (where it is based in Manchester) and overseas....the group has interests in Florida, Eastern Europe and as far afield as New Zealand.
And these days it can point to a turnover of some £120 million.
Taggart Holdings has been particularly active in the past year or so. Aside from the big Fraser Estates landbank deal, it acquired a home building firm in the North East of England earlier this year.
Cecil M Yuill, based in Hartlepool, employed 200 and building some 300 units a year, was snapped up for around £60 million.
It's also believed that Taggart Holdings was the key underbidder in one of the Republic's biggest property deals of recent years, the sale of the Jury's Ballsbridge site in Dublin in which the successful bidder was the Dublin-based developer Sean Dunne.
"We've been very focused on growth through acquisitions, and I think we will continue to be focused in that direction," says Michael Taggart. "We have split out business into the NI, ROI and Manchester operating regions, and they will be where we will concentrate.
"At the same time, we have three distinct dimensions to our wider business. The first, and the biggest, is house building which is our core and always has been. The second is land acquisition and processing...to feed the house building operation, of course. And the third is commercial property. We're becoming more and more involved in commercial investment and development."
The big Northern Ireland landbank deal had its roots, according to Michael Taggart, in a long-standing relationship he has had with Fred Fraser, the founder of the house building firm responsible for thousands of homes around Northern Ireland.
"I first dealt with Fred back in 1997 when we bought 50 acres in Derry's Waterside from him. He drives a hard bargain, he doesn't suffer fools lightly but we got on well. We kept in touch since then and I suppose we were always there or thereabouts when he decided to find a buyer."
But, friends or no friends, Taggarts still had to go through the formal bid process.
"We bid more than anyone else and we got the deal," says Michael Taggart in the sort of matter-of-fact style which typifies the man.
But Fred Fraser being Fred Fraser, there was a catch. He set a strict deadline for when he wanted the money in his bank account....allowing two weeks for all the fund raising, due diligence and legal work to be completed.
"It was a hell of a tall order, but I was amazed at how Bank of Ireland and the other team members managed to pull it off. It was very impressive," says Taggart.
Bank of Ireland, represented by Director Julie-Ann O'Hare, saw the deal through from beginning to end in a matter of four working days.....which is exceptional given the level of funding involved.
"It shows what can be done from Belfast and it shows what can be achieved by assembling a really professional team," says Julie-Ann. "As a bank, we believed in this deal right from the start, given our in house knowledge of the residential sector. We had confidence in the market and in Taggarts' ability to deliver."
"Mind you, we don't want all of our customers to come to us with the same timescales now that we've let the cat out of the bag!"
The other members of the Taggarts deal team were Dublin-based Goodbody Stockbrokers, KPMG's corporate finance team and a legal team from the Belfast office of solicitors Tughans. Mills Selig represented the vendors with Arthur Cox acting for the bank.
"We all had to work late nights – and through the night for some – to get the deal done. That's not unusual in deals of this scale, but the Fraser deadline did add a certain element of urgency, let's just say," adds Julie-Ann O'Hare.
"I think that this deal represented a big vote of confidence in Northern Ireland. The fact that it was driven by a Northern Ireland team made a difference. We were quicker on our feet and got our heads round the deal in record time."
Michael Taggart adds his own theory with a smile. "Fred Fraser wanted the money in his account on a Thursday evening rather than a Friday because he didn't want to lose a day's interest....."
Taggart is a man who doesn't exactly court publicity. But he isn't shy of it either. His group has a comprehensive and impressive website (www.taggartholdings.com) which includes some key financial information, and, in a move which goes against the publicity-shy grain of the property sector, he even held a press conference to announce his North-East of England acquisition earlier this year.
"We're not a PLC. We're still a private company but we're not afraid of inviting people in to take a look. We've always preferred the open and transparent approach."
His firm now has 87 acres in the Cairnshill & Saintfield Road areas of South Belfast; at Carryduff; in Dundonald and up in Coleraine to build on.
Despite the general suspicion that some house builders aren't rushing into development because of views over house price trends, Michael Taggart says that they will be building houses on the new land as soon as possible.
"OK, it might take us four or five years to complete the entire job, but we'll be starting soon and phasing the developments the way we always do."
Figures published just this month by Bank of Ireland show just how fast moving the housing marketplace has been. For the first time in memory, house prices hit in excess of 30% growth levels in the quarter immediately after the deal....a remarkable statistic by any measure.
Michael Taggart, meanwhile, is getting used to impressive statistics. He might be proud of the fact that he's pulled off the biggest residential land deal in Northern Ireland....but he's also pragmatic.
"If it's a record, it's a record which won't last too long. Mark my words....."
Business eye - December 2006.
Terrible news for all involved. The banks, the banks, the banks.......
Quote from: Over the Bar on October 22, 2008, 02:24:17 PMI've relations in Fort McMurray who moved there from Ontario. They say that joiners, plasters and other construction industry workers are in very high demand and getting top dollar.
There's no life up there though - these lads are working 12 hours a day, 7 days a week, 6 weeks on - 2 weeks off
Quote from: Gabriel_Hurl on October 22, 2008, 02:33:01 PM
There's no life up there though - these lads are working 12 hours a week, 6 weeks on - 2 weeks off
Sounds okay to me :P
damn you donagh
anyway - fixed now
Quote from: Gabriel_Hurl on October 22, 2008, 02:33:01 PM
Quote from: Over the Bar on October 22, 2008, 02:24:17 PMI've relations in Fort McMurray who moved there from Ontario. They say that joiners, plasters and other construction industry workers are in very high demand and getting top dollar.
There's no life up there though - these lads are working 12 hours a day, 7 days a week, 6 weeks on - 2 weeks off
sure youd stick it for a few months , just to get a few quid in the bank, pay the mortgage keep you ticking over until the jobs start again hopefully next year...
if I had to I would....
not everyone would or could though...
Quote from: Gabriel_Hurl on October 22, 2008, 02:37:31 PM
damn you donagh
anyway - fixed now
Gab - any work there for brickies?
if so any info on a hiring company ?
thanks
sounds a bit like the 70's and 80's when alot of workers went to shetland islands to work in the oil industry there. i think the shifts were something similar.
Quote from: lynchbhoy on October 22, 2008, 02:39:28 PMsure youd stick it for a few months , just to get a few quid in the bank, pay the mortgage keep you ticking over until the jobs start again hopefully next year...
if I had to I would...
it'd be tough in minus 30 degree weather
Quote from: Rois on October 22, 2008, 02:13:02 PM
Lionel and Van Morrison are a myth apparently. Cara Dillon may have been the only one.
No surprise that it's happened to Taggarts.
I think our corporate recovery dept are feeling a bit like ambulance chasers these days but if recovery specialists are called in early enough, it's sometimes enough to save them.
What would recovery specialists have done in this instance? They'd need to have been called in before taggarts went off on their quest for world domination, seriously, these guys had advice from solicitors, corporate finance teams, stockbrokers and the banks were happy to back them, who was really to blame for this?
Taggarts or the highly paid corporate bankers, brokers, advisers and bankers? I think all parties have to share some of the blame, but I don't believe that corporate recovery specialists could have waltzed in with their corporate speak and saved the world - call me a cynic, but the only thing they'd have done was ensure there was a little less left to be divied up amongst the creditors.
How can corporate recovery specialists help a business that purchases land worth £100 odd million (of which they only foot £6M themselves) only to discover that changed market conditions means there is no point in building the houses as they wouldn't even recoup their investment?
I don't like to see guys have a pop at the Taggart's. Big house on the Hill syndrome.
The Banks are pulling in all their debts and its not looking good. I had a friend who was £3million (small change) down with a bank and had 25 townhouses built but not sold... A certain Bank up north called him in and wanted the money.
He sold 2 of the townhouses to friends just before the bank made him bankrupt on a Friday. He immediately phoned the bank (10am on a Friday) and told them he would have the money to cover the interest payments. The bank made him bankrupt at 2pm and he was found hanging at 3.30pm.
Where was that at Maroon? Awful sad, too many of them kinds of things happening of late. People just keep finding themselves under more and more pressure. Such is modern life :-\
Quote from: SidelineKick on October 22, 2008, 05:53:47 PM
Where was that at Maroon? Awful sad, too many of them kinds of things happening of late. People just keep finding themselves under more and more pressure. Such is modern life :-\
I don't want to say much, I need to be careful even mentioning banks. But one certain banks seemed to have given money out left, right and centre and in a bad way. All I will say it was in County Antrim
I won't condone what he did... which was shocking, but the Banks need to look at the big picture and see that land prices will increase and offer better terms for companies sitting with massive short term loans. It was banks in the first place who decided to dish money out like candy thinking this bubble would not burst, yet 50% of the economists were forecasting a downturn.
Quote from: Gabriel_Hurl on October 22, 2008, 02:33:01 PM
Quote from: Over the Bar on October 22, 2008, 02:24:17 PMI've relations in Fort McMurray who moved there from Ontario. They say that joiners, plasters and other construction industry workers are in very high demand and getting top dollar.
There's no life up there though - these lads are working 12 hours a day, 7 days a week, 6 weeks on - 2 weeks off
Read an article that the cost of housing, food and such in that area wipes out the high wages you earn there. Said there are camping sites for trailers with monthly lot rent around 2,000 just to have a camper on it. Apartment and home rents are through the roof.
Here is a link for Fort McMurray jobs www.jobmonkey.com/oilindustry/html/fort_mcmurray.html
If anyone is thinking of heading to Canada here is a good link on Visa and Immigration
www.cic.gc.ca
Ah I didn't mean corporate recovery professionals could help in Taggart's case. He won a section of Entrepreneur of the Year this time last year so people like Denis O'Brien recognised something different in the man as an entrepreneur. Risk takers leave themselves open to this kind of thing but that's how they make it as well.
I was just referring to general conditions now. Our corporate restructuring department can't get enough staff at the minute.
Yes, you're a cynic Bogball, even if I wasn't referring to Taggarts. Recovery can involve restructuring, and in many instances can save a company. I worked on the administration of Norse Ferries when creditors were on the verge of arresting the ships. We were appointed administrators, sorted out banking arrangements, guaranteed port payments, basically traded the company on a day-to-day basis and managed their cash flows in our name ("our" being the administrators, partners in my firm). Few employees if any were made redundant. In that case, calling corporate recovery/restructuring experts in saved the company from going under.
Quote from: Maroon Heaven on October 22, 2008, 05:25:40 PM
I don't like to see guys have a pop at the Taggart's. Big house on the Hill syndrome.
The Banks are pulling in all their debts and its not looking good. I had a friend who was £3million (small change) down with a bank and had 25 townhouses built but not sold... A certain Bank up north called him in and wanted the money.
He sold 2 of the townhouses to friends just before the bank made him bankrupt on a Friday. He immediately phoned the bank (10am on a Friday) and told them he would have the money to cover the interest payments. The bank made him bankrupt at 2pm and he was found hanging at 3.30pm.
I know this may seem heartless given the sad ending, but people have to take some blame for borrowing all of the money. Sure the banks are to blame for making the huge amounts of credit available, but people who are big enough to borrow the sort of money that would put them into trouble should be big enough to work out a few sensitivites on the money they were going to borrow.
Property prices could never be sustained at the level they were at - the only question was when the prices would fall.
If people couldn't make the payments the bank are entitled to repossess, why shouldn't they therefore repossess. The investors who took out the loans knew what would happen if they couldn't keep up the payments, the only problem was that they naievly thought that the prices would never fall.
So Maroon Heaven, whilst it was awful how your friend ended up I think it is harsh to blame the bank for calling in their debts. Everyone knew the rules when they signed up...............
Quote from: Rois on October 22, 2008, 08:23:46 PM
Ah I didn't mean corporate recovery professionals could help in Taggart's case. He won a section of Entrepreneur of the Year this time last year so people like Denis O'Brien recognised something different in the man as an entrepreneur. Risk takers leave themselves open to this kind of thing but that's how they make it as well.
I was just referring to general conditions now. Our corporate restructuring department can't get enough staff at the minute.
Yes, you're a cynic Bogball, even if I wasn't referring to Taggarts. Recovery can involve restructuring, and in many instances can save a company. I worked on the administration of Norse Ferries when creditors were on the verge of arresting the ships. We were appointed administrators, sorted out banking arrangements, guaranteed port payments, basically traded the company on a day-to-day basis and managed their cash flows in our name ("our" being the administrators, partners in my firm). Few employees if any were made redundant. In that case, calling corporate recovery/restructuring experts in saved the company from going under.
I know corporate recovery lads have their place (although personally i'd call in some of the smaller boutique firms) but in this instance Taggart was getting advice from KPMG Corporate Finance, you'd have to question their advice.
As for O'Brien etc awarding them with entrepreneur of the year, I think it was precisely because they embraced the corporate culture of takeovers and corporate finance, ironically if Taggart's had kept their operations scaled down to the size of their peers they would be sitting pretty now.
Taggart said last year that the downturn in property prices were simply a market adjustment to artificially inflated prices. Stevie Wonder could see that a recession was coming over the horizon so you have to question either the advice he was receiving or his own acumen. It's easy for these boys to be risk takers when it isn't their own money they are staking. If the market is up everyone is a winner, as it is currently there are only losers.
Quote from: Bogball XV on October 22, 2008, 09:00:08 PM
I know corporate recovery lads have their place (although personally i'd call in some of the smaller boutique firms) but in this instance Taggart was getting advice from KPMG Corporate Finance, you'd have to question their advice.
If you're at the mercy of a bank enforcing the restructuring process, you won't get a say in who is called in. If KPMG gave questionable "advice" (unlikely given the risk culture within the Big 4 these days), then they'll be held liable in the courts. Can you imagine trying to tell someone like Michael Taggart who has gotten it so right so often that his choices aren't right? You can point out what the risks are but management's decision is management's decision. And if the bank has agreed with it and provided funding, then that's their perogative.
Quote from: Rois on October 22, 2008, 09:28:08 PM
Quote from: Bogball XV on October 22, 2008, 09:00:08 PM
I know corporate recovery lads have their place (although personally i'd call in some of the smaller boutique firms) but in this instance Taggart was getting advice from KPMG Corporate Finance, you'd have to question their advice.
If you're at the mercy of a bank enforcing the restructuring process, you won't get a say in who is called in. If KPMG gave questionable "advice" (unlikely given the risk culture within the Big 4 these days), then they'll be held liable in the courts. Can you imagine trying to tell someone like Michael Taggart who has gotten it so right so often that his choices aren't right? You can point out what the risks are but management's decision is management's decision. And if the bank has agreed with it and provided funding, then that's their perogative.
Down here the use of smaller firms seems to fairly common and they make a pretty good living out of it (as you'd imagine), presumably they're appointed because Big 4 have their greasy paws involved somewhere and can't be impartial.
What I'm saying re KPMG was that whilst they may not be able to be held accountable for their lack of advice in the past (in my experience disclaimers and caveats abound when dealing with these guys), perhaps someone who was advising them could have taken Taggarts aside and told them to slow down a little, that the possibility of a down turn was a real one, that when the 2 biggest deals went through, the bubble was already burst in the states and so on, it didn't have to be formal. Of course to do that might have meant that bonuses wouldn't have been as high, likewise for the bankers (who I feel from reading that article seemed to do the deal in order to show Dublin that they can do big deals too), truth is, you're probably right, we'd all have taken the money and maybe issued a few feeble protestations, but....
Had Taggart actually got that much right up to that point? I don't know all the ins and outs, but was there much behind the meteoric rise beyond a few acquisitions that have been shown to have been at the top of the market? From what I know, up until that point they had a successful business much like most builders/developers we all know, they decided to leave the comfort zone and it backfired very badly, but much as there was bad luck at the end, there was a pile of good luck at the start. I hope this doesn't sound like bitterness on my part as from what I know of them the Taggarts are nice guys.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on October 22, 2008, 01:37:59 PM
Quote from: orangeman on October 22, 2008, 10:00:49 AM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on October 21, 2008, 10:06:34 PM
See Taggart Holdings has gone into administration. Maybe the fancy dan that runs it will have to cancel Lionel Richie for his xmas party and downsize to Malachi Cush!
Lionel Richie for his xmas party ??????????
You're taking the piss !
Yes about the Xmas party, but he had Lionel and Van The Man playing at his wedding a couple of years back. I don't think he'll get much sympathy but I have a feeling the little man employed by him will feel the pinch at the end of it all rather than Mr. Taggart.
A good friend of mine worked in Taggrts office and went 11 weeks without getting paid, luckily he managed to get another job a couple of weeks ago
Im with hs on this one
2 points:
1. Why would anyone work so long without getting paid?
and
2. How can anyone go so long without getting paid?
Why is there so much sneering done when someone goes out of business or out of work?
It is the irish way-same thing happens when someone goes far.
Fred Fraser is shrood.
Quote from: bcarrier on October 23, 2008, 09:01:38 PM
Fred Fraser is shrood.
Now we know the reason for the tight deadline lol
Quote from: full back on October 23, 2008, 04:40:31 PM
Im with hs on this one
2 points:
1. Why would anyone work so long without getting paid?
and
2. How can anyone go so long without getting paid?
I cant really answer either questions to be honest, they were continually being told that money would be coming available through selling off some non essential assets ,and salaries would be paid, It never happened as each week brought a new excuse as to why these sales did not go through
QuoteIm with hs on this one
2 points:
1. Why would anyone work so long without getting paid?
and
2. How can anyone go so long without getting paid?
Out youself in the shoes of someone with kids and a mortgage. The boss says, "I'm sorry for this but we have £x thousand coming in a few weeks and I assure you will all be paid in full. Anyone who leaves however will not get any back-pay owed".
As much as they may have been looking around for something else, when theres no alternative jobs available they have little choice but to believe whats said.
Tell ya what lads i'm starting to panic a bit here as the work is slack and i've not much to do but my boss assured me about 6 weeks ago that he had plenty of work but i've been running around all week looking for things to do...
I don't think i'd be out of work for to long as i've plenty of good contacts but still i have a cushy number 0.5 miles from the house which pays well so i wouldn't wanna part with that...
In the office we are prob in unusual situation at present, small accountancy firm with growing client mix across a range of sectors. At minute and for last 6 months we have taken on new cleints (lot of once off tax stuff such as estates, CGT,etc) as well as the usual new business. We can't get any new staff with any experience.
Have advertised for qualified or near qualified staff and never got any replies. Not a one. Maybe people aren't willing to take the leap in the current climate and move job.
The place I work has a few Polish lads in it. Some of them have handed in their notice, and are heading home, even though there jobs here are fairly safe!
Apparently things are brighter around Poland these days in comparison.
How's everyone getting on?
You get sorted mayo4sam?
Got bad news this morning on the work front, unless there's a miracle I'll be out of work by Christmas :-\
Just gutted.
Quote from: bingobus on October 24, 2008, 12:29:52 PM
In the office we are prob in unusual situation at present, small accountancy firm with growing client mix across a range of sectors. At minute and for last 6 months we have taken on new cleints (lot of once off tax stuff such as estates, CGT,etc) as well as the usual new business. We can't get any new staff with any experience.
Have advertised for qualified or near qualified staff and never got any replies. Not a one. Maybe people aren't willing to take the leap in the current climate and move job.
DoireNaRaithe would be your man.
Legal industry and furniture have also been badly hit by the down turn in the housing market. You dont realise until it starts happening what kind of a knock on effect that sort of thing can have. Was listening to five live one day recently and they were saying the chocolate is sky rocketing at the minute and thorntons profits are up over 105% in the last year.
Quote from: pintsofguinness on November 07, 2008, 04:25:57 PM
How's everyone getting on?
You get sorted mayo4sam?
Got bad news this morning on the work front, unless there's a miracle I'll be out of work by Christmas :-\
Just gutted.
You'd be gutted surely..... what do you work as?
Quote from: thebandit on November 07, 2008, 05:05:31 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on November 07, 2008, 04:25:57 PM
How's everyone getting on?
You get sorted mayo4sam?
Got bad news this morning on the work front, unless there's a miracle I'll be out of work by Christmas :-\
Just gutted.
You'd be gutted surely..... what do you work as?
selling poopy's ;D ;D no buisness for it in England, booming over here though around sept through to christmas
Quote from: pintsofguinness on November 07, 2008, 04:25:57 PM
How's everyone getting on?
You get sorted mayo4sam?
Got bad news this morning on the work front, unless there's a miracle I'll be out of work by Christmas :-\
Just gutted.
Sorry to hear it man, it's a sorry blow. Same happened to me a few Christmas' back, literally two weeks before hand. Have to say it was a life altering event, and not in a good way. Keep your head together, keep yourself busy, and work that friends network, for support and also for work leads.
Quote from: David McKeown on November 07, 2008, 05:00:16 PM
Legal industry and furniture have also been badly hit by the down turn in the housing market. You dont realise until it starts happening what kind of a knock on effect that sort of thing can have. Was listening to five live one day recently and they were saying the chocolate is sky rocketing at the minute and thorntons profits are up over 105% in the last year.
legal industry as in the conveyencing solicitors
however, sadly, the rest of the legal business has never been busier !
Quote from: pintsofguinness on November 07, 2008, 04:25:57 PM
How's everyone getting on?
You get sorted mayo4sam?
Got bad news this morning on the work front, unless there's a miracle I'll be out of work by Christmas :-\
Just gutted.
Sorry tohear that pints
hope it works out for you , and for the rest of the lads who are laid off...
Quote from: milltown row on November 07, 2008, 05:12:54 PM
Quote from: thebandit on November 07, 2008, 05:05:31 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on November 07, 2008, 04:25:57 PM
How's everyone getting on?
You get sorted mayo4sam?
Got bad news this morning on the work front, unless there's a miracle I'll be out of work by Christmas :-\
Just gutted.
You'd be gutted surely..... what do you work as?
selling poopy's ;D ;D no buisness for it in England, booming over here though around sept through to christmas
Poopy's??? Wouldn't have thought there was much money in that anywhere... :P
sorry to hear that pints.....
Good mate of mine got laid off recently and his wedding is tomorrow, great timing eh... Luckily the family business is doing well and they were asking him to come on board so at least he's got something to keep the banks at bay for a while anyway. Don't envy anyone looking for a job in this climate, best of luck lads...
thanks everyone. (very good on the poppies milltown)
life has a habit of knocking you down when you think things are going well.
you'll be grand, i've changed that many jobs over the years i've forgotten some of the jobs i've done in the past. i've been very lucky . was paid off twice, both times in Harland and Wolff!! i'm in a great job now, but i always look for new jobs and different types of work for a challenge.
That's rough pints. What direction are you going to head? Will you come homewards at all?
It is seriously getting tough. I was talking to a friend who is in the finance industry and he and has partner have had a massive downturn in mortgage applicants, so much so they have had to let 3 people go. He was saying that he was talking to a bank manager last week. One of the workers in this bank was belly aching as she hadn't received any increase in wages in her annual review. She did get a slightly larger performance bonus promise though. He turned round to her and said, "How much were you paid last month?" and she told him, and he asked how much will you get next month? and she told him. he told her that he had jsut signed papers for a local contractor who had just taken a bridging loan out against his property to cover his employees wages until they could see christmas out and then he was going to have to let half go. He has work, but no cash flow as no one is paying and as a result he has to lay off men. She pulled her horns in very fast.
I am in the furniture business myself. self employed too made 41 calls in person this week to shops i supply,got 4 order 23 just where honest and said they cant afford to buy and 14 closing down. I have let all my staff go bank wont help me have mortgage and 4 kids worried f**king sick i can tell you. But am not starving is the main thing i suppose.
QuoteThat's rough pints. What direction are you going to head? Will you come homewards at all?
I don't know BC, just settled here and the rug pulled out from under my feet. If I go home it'll be out of necessity and not choice, I'd go further afield if there was work, not much point if there's not though.
I have been laid off for 2 weeks now! I had work for 4 days from another crowd but they told me then that there was not enough work! I am going crazy here. Added pressure is the fact that I have 3 small kids as well. Thank God my wife is working though. I don't have the option of going abroad to be honest! I am seriously contemplating taking the original company to an employment tribunal. There is another person doing what I was doing, she is on less money than I was! Makes my blood boil! Have to remain optimistic though, otherwise all hell breaks out!
Edit: Sorry, i qouted the wrong thing:
Meant to quote
QuoteI am seriously contemplating taking the original company to an employment tribunal.
out of interest, on what grounds?
My woman's out of work as she left her job to move with me though at least we dont have the added worry of kids.
Quote from: aroundincircles on November 07, 2008, 06:30:03 PM
I am in the furniture business myself. self employed too made 41 calls in person this week to shops i supply,got 4 order 23 just where honest and said they cant afford to buy and 14 closing down. I have let all my staff go bank wont help me have mortgage and 4 kids worried f**king sick i can tell you. But am not starving is the main thing i suppose.
My best friend is in a similar situation, a thriving business reduced to nothing, left with bad debts and a couple of houses bought speculatively, three kids - don't know how he does it. A stronger man than me no doubt.
Quote from: cicfada on November 07, 2008, 06:40:11 PM
I have been laid off for 2 weeks now! I had work for 4 days from another crowd but they told me then that there was not enough work! I am going crazy here. Added pressure is the fact that I have 3 small kids as well. Thank God my wife is working though. I don't have the option of going abroad to be honest! I am seriously contemplating taking the original company to an employment tribunal. There is another person doing what I was doing, she is on less money than I was! Makes my blood boil! Have to remain optimistic though, otherwise all hell breaks out!
That's rough man. Just don't feck the whole job up though, ended up costing me a 7+ year relationship into the bargain. Back working since, earning more money than ever, but I'll never be able to replace that. I guess, and it's hard to do it at the time, it's all about keeping things in perspective and knowing what's truely valuable.
How can the government bail out banks and leave familys with 2,3, or 4 kids with nothing on the verge of banlruptcy i cant see any light at all in this case. Not on my own all the same is still no consulation. Feel sorry for the kids, will be a miserable christmas unless i can sell loads between now and then which is possible but unlikely.
I believe you can't be let go and replaced by someone on less wages. the job still exists so I should have not be let go! I still need to confirm this though!
Quote from: cicfada on November 07, 2008, 07:01:49 PM
I believe you can't be let go and replaced by someone on less wages. the job still exists so I should have not be let go! I still need to confirm this though!
Oh. Sounds like you might be on to something there alright.
i have just moved home because of the down turn of things.... i never thought 'di be back living with parents but its a big help... thankfully i have just myself to worry about but my heart goes out to those with families.... I'd say there will have to be a lot of understanding children this christmas and have to ask santa for a surprise.... though i do know families that in the past few years presents and money were no object but now they are fretting but their children expect the best and know no different!
My kids are too young to understand will not be too bad, Would hate to have teenagers,
To be honest, I've so much money I don't know what to do with it.
Quote from: ONeill on November 07, 2008, 07:34:30 PM
To be honest, I've so much money I don't know what to do with it.
(http://img.coxnewsweb.com/B/06/87/66/image_2366876.jpg)
you can buy some Poppy's O'Neill and wear them into thon school ya work at ;)
Quote from: milltown row on November 07, 2008, 07:38:14 PM
you can buy some Poppy's O'Neill and wear them into thon school ya work at ;)
Well, with an apostrophe like thon, don't be looking for a job with us!
Ba-Boom!!
Quote from: ONeill on November 07, 2008, 07:40:33 PM
Quote from: milltown row on November 07, 2008, 07:38:14 PM
you can buy some Poppy's O'Neill and wear them into thon school ya work at ;)
Well, with an apostrophe like thon, don't be looking for a job with us!
Ba-Boom!!
thanks but i'd rather have my eyes poked out than work in your school, classy
Oneill you are in a luck position i can tell you.
Theres alot of us in the same boat here it seems.....i work in the financial services sector and have been told I have til the end of the month at best. Mortgage on my own, probable negative equity. And job prospects not hectic....no one hiring. Needless to say, lifes been better.
I was walking down O'Connell Steet yesterday on way to a recruitment consultants office when i looked at the main thoroughfare in the country and saw something that made me realise why the country is in the shits.....a 60ft high artificial xmas tree. A French one. Worth €350,000. Turned down the free one offered by the Norwegian Embassy as a token of their thanks. So the country is in the financial shits with unemployment rising at rates not seen in 20 years and we are getting the frogs to make and erect a €350000 montrosity. A "beacon of hope amid the recession" they call it.......I call it a kick in the teeth for everyone that is struggling because we have a shower of clowns in charge of the country.
€350k would vaccinate alot of young girls against cervical cancer.........
Quote from: cicfada on November 07, 2008, 07:01:49 PM
I believe you can't be let go and replaced by someone on less wages. the job still exists so I should have not be let go! I still need to confirm this though!
Think you might be right - think there is something like a 6 month wait before someone can be brought in to do the same job.
Quote from: cicfada on November 07, 2008, 07:01:49 PM
I believe you can't be let go and replaced by someone on less wages. the job still exists so I should have not be let go! I still need to confirm this though!
absolutely illegal
cant think of who you should contact - unions possibly
get onto the citizens advice bureau, solicitor etc to see who you should talk to
they cannot replace you , the job has to be made redundant not the person
Quote from: nifan on November 07, 2008, 07:52:41 PM
Quote from: cicfada on November 07, 2008, 07:01:49 PM
I believe you can't be let go and replaced by someone on less wages. the job still exists so I should have not be let go! I still need to confirm this though!
Think you might be right - think there is something like a 6 month wait before someone can be brought in to do the same job.
Clearcut constructive dismissal if those are the circumstances. As Lynchbhoy says, CAB are probably your best first port of call.
Just thought i'd do some shameless plugging
Since being laid off i've tried to get some work for myself, work in the energy sector, one of the first questions i'm always asked is "Oh you do those energy ratings"
so as and from next week, yes i'll be able to do those energy ratings, for those who dont know from Jan 1st anyone leasing or selling a house will need a Building Energy Rating, so if any of the board members need one of these done u can give me a shout, i'll do a board member discount!
Good to hear u got sorted, how much does a BER survey cost???
Going rate is €350-400, i'd be alot cheaper than that!
Work getting alot harder to come by here in Oz, every week I get a text, e-mail, phonecall or bebo/facebook that another lad from the football team, someone I used work with, one of the lads from home or a mate from college is over for the holiday working visa or some other work visa. The work is drying up over here. I read something like a a 36% rise in Irish over here in the last few months alone. Thinking of staying out of the country for a few years myself. Have to say it but fck those cronies that have been runing this country to ruin for the last 15 years, they washed a free boom down the jacks, bet they hid enough money for themselves over the last few years. Always disliked them but never though that I would end up an exile from Ireland thanks to FF^@kr5. WOuld throw a shoe at them
Son of sam,
is aussie really slipping or are you in a bad spot over there?
I hear from friends at home that a lot more are planning to go there next year.
Quote from: mannix on December 16, 2008, 09:28:57 AM
Son of sam,
is aussie really slipping or are you in a bad spot over there?
I hear from friends at home that a lot more are planning to go there next year.
It's drying up here in Sydney anyway, especially in the last few months. I'm in IT contracting over here and my contract expires at end of January and won't be renewed. Where I am there are a few permanents being let go as well. Construction industry is bolloxed here as well. I know a civil engineer from Galway who can't get work and another fella in IT as well. Half thinking of pissing off home but won't be able to get a job there either I'd say.