Time for a post-catholic Ireland

[Eamonnca1]

I always remember my Grandmother talking about this, the same people who contribute nothing to the Church contributions, are the same people complaining when the Priest can't find an available date for a wedding or a Christening. You don't want to christen children then don't. Its simples. But I will make the point that whenever something drastic happens in life 99% of the time the local Priest is called and he offers a sympathetic/guiding ear, so be careful what ye wish for.

I got married last week in a civil ceremony in a perfectly nice location. Our officiant was a mate of mine who got "ordained" in something like the "Universal Life Church" that meets the bare minimum legal standard to let people become ministers to perform civil ceremonies. You fill out a form, pay a small fee, send it off, and they send you a certificate saying you're a minister. So at our ceremony we had it set up exactly as we wanted and there was no mention of Jesus or God or any of that crew. He signed the paperwork and we filed it with the county. Job done. No need for a big elaborate mass or a church or any of that nonsense.

What's the story in Ireland for people that want civil ceremonies? Is there a limited number of places where you can go to host them?

[BennyCake]

Is being a catholic and not agreeing with everything the church does, not the same as being a GAA member and not agreeing with everything they do?

Actually, the church waiver a lot more of their own rules than the GAA do. Anyway, this is not a GAA/church thing, I'm just saying like.

There's a great deal more democratic control in the GAA than in the Catholic church. If you want change to happen in the GAA you state your case, you lobby for it, you convince people to adopt your ideas, they get voted on, and you achieve your goals if you do a good enough job of it.  How do you bring about change in the Catholic church? Wait for a more enlightened Pope to be appointed?

Until it gets to Congress, and your county board representative votes whichever way he feels like. Often ignoring the status quo.

In which case you should have lobbied your county board members harder.

Would it really matter? A county board rep could go agàinst 99% of that county's members, and not be held culpable. That's what the CPA were hoping to eradicate last time out. Until votes are shown, that will continue.

[Hardy]

Hardy, is it not the case that the cardinals, guided by God, appoint the Pope and so the appointment is actually made by God himself, indirectly?

I'm not sure why you're asking ME this, Esmarelda. I think you can anticipate my answer, which is no, since there is no God. As I understand it, the cardinals are locked up in a room until they agree on one of their number to be Pope. As you can imagine, it usually doesn't take too long.

[ONeill]

Yea you fcuked him up in 1996.

[Syferus]

I always remember my Grandmother talking about this, the same people who contribute nothing to the Church contributions, are the same people complaining when the Priest can't find an available date for a wedding or a Christening. You don't want to christen children then don't. Its simples. But I will make the point that whenever something drastic happens in life 99% of the time the local Priest is called and he offers a sympathetic/guiding ear, so be careful what ye wish for.

What is this nonsense? I want my friends and family around me when something's wrong, not a lad in a collar and a flash car.

[Hardy]

I always remember my Grandmother talking about this, the same people who contribute nothing to the Church contributions, are the same people complaining when the Priest can't find an available date for a wedding or a Christening. You don't want to christen children then don't. Its simples. But I will make the point that whenever something drastic happens in life 99% of the time the local Priest is called and he offers a sympathetic/guiding ear, so be careful what ye wish for.

I got married last week in a civil ceremony in a perfectly nice location. Our officiant was a mate of mine who got "ordained" in something like the "Universal Life Church" that meets the bare minimum legal standard to let people become ministers to perform civil ceremonies. You fill out a form, pay a small fee, send it off, and they send you a certificate saying you're a minister. So at our ceremony we had it set up exactly as we wanted and there was no mention of Jesus or God or any of that crew. He signed the paperwork and we filed it with the county. Job done. No need for a big elaborate mass or a church or any of that nonsense.

What's the story in Ireland for people that want civil ceremonies? Is there a limited number of places where you can go to host them?

Hey - congratulations.

I think you can have a civil ceremony anywhere. You go to the local authority registration office and register the marriage with the two witnesses, etc. After that, you can have any ceremony you want in the hotel.

[omaghjoe]

Catholic doctrine has formed the basis of Western morality and ethitics. It permeates the very fabric of society like it or not: law, values, etc.
Sure wasnt the great derider of Christianity Niche frustrated at that very thing.

I would savely say that the majority of Irish and Western people still adhere to the vast majority of the doctrine in how they act out their life.
Same as there are a la carte Catholics (which all Catholics are to some degree or another) you also have a la Carte anti-Catholics who say they are opposed to church teachings but actually their personal values and especially in the action we take are actually probably broadly in line with it.

[Eamonnca1]

Did I see someone gathering sticks on Sunday? Stone that man to death outside the gates of the city!

Earlier I saw someone calling his father a fool. He shall be put to death. And he who striketh his father shall surely be put to death! Leviticus says so, and that's the basis of western law!

[Esmarelda]

Catholic doctrine has formed the basis of Western morality and ethitics. It permeates the very fabric of society like it or not: law, values, etc.
Sure wasnt the great derider of Christianity Niche frustrated at that very thing.

I would savely say that the majority of Irish and Western people still adhere to the vast majority of the doctrine in how they act out their life.
Same as there are a la carte Catholics (which all Catholics are to some degree or another) you also have a la Carte anti-Catholics who say they are opposed to church teachings but actually their personal values and especially in the action we take are actually probably broadly in line with it.

Joe, are you being disingenuous?

If an atheist treats others how he/she would like to be treated, this has nothing, necessarily, to do with teachings of Catholocism. The test of an "anti-Catholic" as you put it surely isn't to disagree with all catholic teachings for the sake of it.

[Esmarelda]

Hardy, is it not the case that the cardinals, guided by God, appoint the Pope and so the appointment is actually made by God himself, indirectly?

I'm not sure why you're asking ME this, Esmarelda. I think you can anticipate my answer, which is no, since there is no God. As I understand it, the cardinals are locked up in a room until they agree on one of their number to be Pope. As you can imagine, it usually doesn't take too long.

I'm just pointing out that Catholics don't seem their hierarchy as being self-appointed. Perhaps you knew that.

[Rossfan]

Did I see someone gathering sticks on Sunday? Stone that man to death outside the gates of the city!

Earlier I saw someone calling his father a fool. He shall be put to death. And he who striketh his father shall surely be put to death! Leviticus says so, and that's the basis of western law!

Old Testament .
Christianity/Catholicism based on New Testament.
Would have expected a smart buck like you to know that.

[gallsman]

Ah yes, the old adage that Christianity invented the "don't be an awful ****" way of thinking about how one should live their lives.

[omaghjoe]

Catholic doctrine has formed the basis of Western morality and ethitics. It permeates the very fabric of society like it or not: law, values, etc.
Sure wasnt the great derider of Christianity Niche frustrated at that very thing.

I would savely say that the majority of Irish and Western people still adhere to the vast majority of the doctrine in how they act out their life.
Same as there are a la carte Catholics (which all Catholics are to some degree or another) you also have a la Carte anti-Catholics who say they are opposed to church teachings but actually their personal values and especially in the action we take are actually probably broadly in line with it.

Joe, are you being disingenuous?

If an atheist treats others how he/she would like to be treated, this has nothing, necessarily, to do with teachings of Catholocism. The test of an "anti-Catholic" as you put it surely isn't to disagree with all catholic teachings for the sake of it.

No... are you Esm?

A great many reckon they are anti-Catholic/christian/theist even tho they will adhere to societal norms that were instilled in society from Catholic theology.
And most if not all of these norms were instilled in society from some sort of theism or spirituality

[Hardy]

Niche?

[Hardy]

Hardy, is it not the case that the cardinals, guided by God, appoint the Pope and so the appointment is actually made by God himself, indirectly?

I'm not sure why you're asking ME this, Esmarelda. I think you can anticipate my answer, which is no, since there is no God. As I understand it, the cardinals are locked up in a room until they agree on one of their number to be Pope. As you can imagine, it usually doesn't take too long.

I'm just pointing out that Catholics don't seem their hierarchy as being self-appointed. Perhaps you knew that.

Oh - OK. Self appointed was loose terminology. I meant these characters got to direct people's lives for no other reason than being appointed by other characters like themselves who had been appointed by characters like themselves ....