Time to Split Dublin

[Zulu]

I don't think splitting Dublin is a solution to anything. Dublin are the most iconic team in the GAA, the one team everyone wants to beat, the one team that can bring a sense of occasion to games other than an All Ireland that matches anything else in the rest of the world. It would also be nigh on impossible to do in reality. I don't understand why people's first solutions are to split them or limit the spend on county teams or take some of Dublin's sponsorship money. Those are the solutions that try to bring exceptional teams back into the pack rather than solutions which encourage the pack to catch up.

Central funding could prioritise other counties (not everyone) at Dublin's expense for a few years, the GAA could explore whether grouping 3 or 4 neighbouring counties for sponsorship would be better. Serious time and money can be invested into club coaching from 6-14 to provide players with a better grounding. Inter county competition structures should be looked at so that minor and U21 county players are better prepared for senior football and clubs can get more games.

Dublin are providing the rest of us with a challenge but it is one that if some counties can rise to we will have a much better GAA. Rather than limiting the Dubs ability lets look at ways to maximise others.

[screenexile]

I don't think splitting Dublin is a solution to anything. Dublin are the most iconic team in the GAA, the one team everyone wants to beat, the one team that can bring a sense of occasion to games other than an All Ireland that matches anything else in the rest of the world. It would also be nigh on impossible to do in reality. I don't understand why people's first solutions are to split them or limit the spend on county teams or take some of Dublin's sponsorship money. Those are the solutions that try to bring exceptional teams back into the pack rather than solutions which encourage the pack to catch up.

Central funding could prioritise other counties (not everyone) at Dublin's expense for a few years, the GAA could explore whether grouping 3 or 4 neighbouring counties for sponsorship would be better. Serious time and money can be invested into club coaching from 6-14 to provide players with a better grounding. Inter county competition structures should be looked at so that minor and U21 county players are better prepared for senior football and clubs can get more games.

Dublin are providing the rest of us with a challenge but it is one that if some counties can rise to we will have a much better GAA. Rather than limiting the Dubs ability lets look at ways to maximise others.

I'd still say more Counties want to beat Tyrone... are we gong to talk about the unfair advantage they have with the inbreeding of all their half decent footballers? There'll be a second coming in about 20 years time maybe we can nip it in the bud from now!

[Canalman]

I don't think splitting Dublin is a solution to anything. Dublin are the most iconic team in the GAA, the one team everyone wants to beat, the one team that can bring a sense of occasion to games other than an All Ireland that matches anything else in the rest of the world. It would also be nigh on impossible to do in reality. I don't understand why people's first solutions are to split them or limit the spend on county teams or take some of Dublin's sponsorship money. Those are the solutions that try to bring exceptional teams back into the pack rather than solutions which encourage the pack to catch up.

Central funding could prioritise other counties (not everyone) at Dublin's expense for a few years, the GAA could explore whether grouping 3 or 4 neighbouring counties for sponsorship would be better. Serious time and money can be invested into club coaching from 6-14 to provide players with a better grounding. Inter county competition structures should be looked at so that minor and U21 county players are better prepared for senior football and clubs can get more games.

Dublin are providing the rest of us with a challenge but it is one that if some counties can rise to we will have a much better GAA. Rather than limiting the Dubs ability lets look at ways to maximise others.

I'd still say more Counties want to beat Tyrone... are we gong to talk about the unfair advantage they have with the inbreeding of all their half decent footballers? There'll be a second coming in about 20 years time maybe we can nip it in the bud from now!

Think beating Dublin would trump beating Tyrone for virtually every county in Ireland. Beating us or Kerry  in an AIF is like a "double AI" and I don't think I am being arrogant in saying that.

[AZOffaly]

You are . Beating Kerry is like a double All Ireland (so we have 5 instead of 3). However beating Dublin is still sweet because ye are, after all, the city slickers.

I don't like the idea of splitting Dublin. What I do like the idea of is either individual counties, or provinces, getting a much larger slice of the development funds pie, and reducing Dublin's slice. Let Dublin keep their own sponsorship deals etc, fair play to them for getting it because it means they are attractive to sponsors. But let teams with smaller populations and therefore less attractive to sponsors get proportionally a bigger slice of the coaching and games development funds.

I would favour it being controlled by a centralised body, because I wouldn't trust some muppets in county boards to spend it as well as Dublin have. The last thing you want is it being spent on some external manager's expenses.

[Syferus]

Prioritising commuter belt counties, which seems to be the implication by Zulu and others, just extends the disparity a few kilometres outside Dublin. Trying to focus on a county like Antrim (because of its big population) at the expense of other will not breed a healthier championship either.

All teams competing in the All-Ireland Senior Football Championship need to be competing on a similar budget. It really is that simple if you want to avoid mergers or splits. Anyone can see the amounts being spent by larger counties on preparation has been spiralling out of control for the last two decades. It's only going to hurt the grass-roots in those same counties if it isn't forcibly curtailed.

How we would go about that would take plenty of time and effort, of which there seems to be precious little going on and what little is happening is getting the usual objections from the vested interest counties.

[AZOffaly]

The problem is I don't think you can rely on county boards to spend central funds wisely. If the GAA has a central budget for games development, etc, I think they should appoint a body to monitor and dole out the money to each county for specific purposes. (€10k for meals, €10k for gear, €100k for coaches, whatever).

[Zulu]

That only encourages mediocrity, not to mention wholesale cheating to circumvent it. If you have a €100,000, for example, and you give every county an equal slice then nobody gets enough to make a difference. The GAA should, initially, focus on counties who have the population and a proper plan and invest in them. This is for two main reasons, one there is a better chance of a quick on-field return on that investment but also because a successful Kildare or Meath would generate more money which could then be filtered into the next group of counties.

Roscommon, due to their population, wouldn't need as much as Kildare for example but if you prioritised Kildare for 5 years while still helping Roscommon with lower level investment to get the foundation blocks in place for a greater investment 5 years down the line then that would be a sensible way to spend the money IMO. By the way I'm using counties as examples, I'm not saying Roscommon don't have good foundations or that Kildare are the best placed county for major investment.

The idea though, that you give everybody a small slice of the pie is nonsense IMO. You need to concentrate your resources in some counties, get them up to the next level and then move on to the next batch. Tell counties if you want this investment then get A, B and C in place and you'll get it the next time round. 

[Syferus]

The problem is I don't think you can rely on county boards to spend central funds wisely. If the GAA has a central budget for games development, etc, I think they should appoint a body to monitor and dole out the money to each county for specific purposes. (€10k for meals, €10k for gear, €100k for coaches, whatever).

Yip, oversight is key. Given the cowboy-style off-the-books craic you see at club and county level throughout the country it would take one hell of an effort to change the culture and put the real numbers out into the public spotlight.

That only encourages mediocrity, not to mention wholesale cheating to circumvent it. If you have a €100,000, for example, and you give every county an equal slice then nobody gets enough to make a difference. The GAA should, initially, focus on counties who have the population and a proper plan and invest in them. This is for two main reasons, one there is a better chance of a quick on-field return on that investment but also because a successful Kildare or Meath would generate more money which could then be filtered into the next group of counties.

Roscommon, due to their population, wouldn't need as much as Kildare for example but if you prioritised Kildare for 5 years while still helping Roscommon with lower level investment to get the foundation blocks in place for a greater investment 5 years down the line then that would be a sensible way to spend the money IMO. By the way I'm using counties as examples, I'm not saying Roscommon don't have good foundations or that Kildare are the best placed county for major investment.

The idea though, that you give everybody a small slice of the pie is nonsense IMO. You need to concentrate your resources in some counties, get them up to the next level and then move on to the next batch. Tell counties if you want this investment then get A, B and C in place and you'll get it the next time round.

It doesn't in any number of sports with budget caps. It makes for a more unpredictable, healthy and exciting sport.

You have to separate the ideas of county team preparation (all counties field the same number of those, apart from the half of the country that don't bother with the junior AI) and club level where there are varying numbers of players and teams. The latter is an entirely different beast but one that would also benefit from hard caps at county level.

[AZOffaly]

So what you are proposing is that you give counties that are already in a decent position more money to push them up to the top level, and let the weaker counties plod along until the top table are satisfied? Jesus Zulu, are you deliberately trying to kill the GAA in the weaker counties?

My thing is a socialist approach. Allocate X million for games development nationally. Assign a body to monitor and allocate the finances, to make sure it is spent correctly. A GDA for the country if you like, as opposed to individual county GDAs.

Ensure that every county is spending the money correctly, and on the correct thing.

Tiered funding for counties that are more likely to be successful quickly is a horrible, professional, approach in my opinion.

[Zulu]

No AZ. What I'm saying is you don't give everyone the same just so it's "fair". You ask counties to produce plans and you heavily support the best and most likely to produce quick results. If Offaly have one of the best then support them, if Offaly need to get a few things in place before you invest heavily then you support that but put greater resources in counties that are better placed to do so. The GAA doesn't die in unsuccessful counties AZ and great occasions and matches involving other counties can inspire kids across the country. Christ knows if my love of the GAA was based on the success of my county team as a kid then there wouldn't even have been mild affection.

Tiered funding for counties that are more likely to be successful quickly is a horrible, professional, approach in my opinion.

Key word is professional, as in how a professional body would do it. Professionalism isn't a dirty concept, especially when it's about helping counties improve. I'm not suggesting some counties get nothing but we see what investment in Dublin, along with good planning, has achieved. Take that and invest it in 3 other counties while maintaining investment levels elsewhere. When the fruits of your investment are coming out then look to the next batch. Focused investment is what I'm talking about not basically giving every county a few bob and telling them not to spend it all in the one shop. Spreading the wealth too widely only means nobody can do anything that makes a real difference.

[screenexile]

I don't think splitting Dublin is a solution to anything. Dublin are the most iconic team in the GAA, the one team everyone wants to beat, the one team that can bring a sense of occasion to games other than an All Ireland that matches anything else in the rest of the world. It would also be nigh on impossible to do in reality. I don't understand why people's first solutions are to split them or limit the spend on county teams or take some of Dublin's sponsorship money. Those are the solutions that try to bring exceptional teams back into the pack rather than solutions which encourage the pack to catch up.

Central funding could prioritise other counties (not everyone) at Dublin's expense for a few years, the GAA could explore whether grouping 3 or 4 neighbouring counties for sponsorship would be better. Serious time and money can be invested into club coaching from 6-14 to provide players with a better grounding. Inter county competition structures should be looked at so that minor and U21 county players are better prepared for senior football and clubs can get more games.

Dublin are providing the rest of us with a challenge but it is one that if some counties can rise to we will have a much better GAA. Rather than limiting the Dubs ability lets look at ways to maximise others.

I'd still say more Counties want to beat Tyrone... are we gong to talk about the unfair advantage they have with the inbreeding of all their half decent footballers? There'll be a second coming in about 20 years time maybe we can nip it in the bud from now!

Think beating Dublin would trump beating Tyrone for virtually every county in Ireland. Beating us or Kerry  in an AIF is like a "double AI" and I don't think I am being arrogant in saying that.

Derry, Armagh, Kerry would all rather beat Tyrone than the Dubs even if they are going shite!

[Jinxy]

Offaly would just spend all their money on sweets and fizzy drinks.

[Syferus]

I don't think splitting Dublin is a solution to anything. Dublin are the most iconic team in the GAA, the one team everyone wants to beat, the one team that can bring a sense of occasion to games other than an All Ireland that matches anything else in the rest of the world. It would also be nigh on impossible to do in reality. I don't understand why people's first solutions are to split them or limit the spend on county teams or take some of Dublin's sponsorship money. Those are the solutions that try to bring exceptional teams back into the pack rather than solutions which encourage the pack to catch up.

Central funding could prioritise other counties (not everyone) at Dublin's expense for a few years, the GAA could explore whether grouping 3 or 4 neighbouring counties for sponsorship would be better. Serious time and money can be invested into club coaching from 6-14 to provide players with a better grounding. Inter county competition structures should be looked at so that minor and U21 county players are better prepared for senior football and clubs can get more games.

Dublin are providing the rest of us with a challenge but it is one that if some counties can rise to we will have a much better GAA. Rather than limiting the Dubs ability lets look at ways to maximise others.

I'd still say more Counties want to beat Tyrone... are we gong to talk about the unfair advantage they have with the inbreeding of all their half decent footballers? There'll be a second coming in about 20 years time maybe we can nip it in the bud from now!

Think beating Dublin would trump beating Tyrone for virtually every county in Ireland. Beating us or Kerry  in an AIF is like a "double AI" and I don't think I am being arrogant in saying that.

Derry, Armagh, Kerry would all rather beat Tyrone than the Dubs even if they are going shite!

Not a chance.

[Bensars]

I don't think splitting Dublin is a solution to anything. Dublin are the most iconic team in the GAA, the one team everyone wants to beat, the one team that can bring a sense of occasion to games other than an All Ireland that matches anything else in the rest of the world. It would also be nigh on impossible to do in reality. I don't understand why people's first solutions are to split them or limit the spend on county teams or take some of Dublin's sponsorship money. Those are the solutions that try to bring exceptional teams back into the pack rather than solutions which encourage the pack to catch up.

Central funding could prioritise other counties (not everyone) at Dublin's expense for a few years, the GAA could explore whether grouping 3 or 4 neighbouring counties for sponsorship would be better. Serious time and money can be invested into club coaching from 6-14 to provide players with a better grounding. Inter county competition structures should be looked at so that minor and U21 county players are better prepared for senior football and clubs can get more games.

Dublin are providing the rest of us with a challenge but it is one that if some counties can rise to we will have a much better GAA. Rather than limiting the Dubs ability lets look at ways to maximise others.

I'd still say more Counties want to beat Tyrone... are we gong to talk about the unfair advantage they have with the inbreeding of all their half decent footballers? There'll be a second coming in about 20 years time maybe we can nip it in the bud from now!

Think beating Dublin would trump beating Tyrone for virtually every county in Ireland. Beating us or Kerry  in an AIF is like a "double AI" and I don't think I am being arrogant in saying that.

Derry, Armagh, Kerry would all rather beat Tyrone than the Dubs even if they are going shite!

Just goes to show the ambition within Derry. They would rather beat a crowd of youngsters than testing themselves against the best in the country.  Possibly more indicitive of their inferiority complex than anything else.

No suprise really

[J OGorman]

I don't think splitting Dublin is a solution to anything. Dublin are the most iconic team in the GAA, the one team everyone wants to beat, the one team that can bring a sense of occasion to games other than an All Ireland that matches anything else in the rest of the world. It would also be nigh on impossible to do in reality. I don't understand why people's first solutions are to split them or limit the spend on county teams or take some of Dublin's sponsorship money. Those are the solutions that try to bring exceptional teams back into the pack rather than solutions which encourage the pack to catch up.

Central funding could prioritise other counties (not everyone) at Dublin's expense for a few years, the GAA could explore whether grouping 3 or 4 neighbouring counties for sponsorship would be better. Serious time and money can be invested into club coaching from 6-14 to provide players with a better grounding. Inter county competition structures should be looked at so that minor and U21 county players are better prepared for senior football and clubs can get more games.

Dublin are providing the rest of us with a challenge but it is one that if some counties can rise to we will have a much better GAA. Rather than limiting the Dubs ability lets look at ways to maximise others.

I'd still say more Counties want to beat Tyrone... are we gong to talk about the unfair advantage they have with the inbreeding of all their half decent footballers? There'll be a second coming in about 20 years time maybe we can nip it in the bud from now!

Think beating Dublin would trump beating Tyrone for virtually every county in Ireland. Beating us or Kerry  in an AIF is like a "double AI" and I don't think I am being arrogant in saying that.

Derry, Armagh, Kerry would all rather beat Tyrone than the Dubs even if they are going shite!

Just goes to show the ambition within Derry. They would rather beat a crowd of youngsters than testing themselves against the best in the country.  Possibly more indicitive of their inferiority complex than anything else.

No suprise really

indeed, one Derry man speaks for the whole county